Hi John!
John Coetze:
Hi Jake,
The "glimpses" have revealed what feels like a natural state or birthright, but apparently it takes disciplined, systematic work to dissolve the layers of obscurity.
Exactly! :-) For what it's worth, and this is a gross generalization (hahaha!), but it seems to me that those who start with this view seem to get more out of SE than those who have little connection to the natural state. For example, there are many yogis who have attained DhO 3rd path but who still obsess about things like a centerpoint of perception, a self-sense, and so on, in a way that I find hard to relate to as it seems transparently suffering producing rather than reducing (disclaimer-- also entirely possible that in addition to generalizing I am locked in my way of experiencing things). A common feature here seems to be that, even when they describe accessing "non-dual" states, I find it difficult to recognize what I would call the natural state or nonduality in those descriptions, but rather oneness or unity, which seems very very different to me. Anyways that's neither here nor there: just mean to say, it seems like those with a strong connection to the natural state pre-path get more out of path as they can use the greater pliancy of experience post-path to raise the baseline appreciation of wholeness, clarity and purity on a day to day level, and practice and life are more profoundly connected.
John Coetze:
You said you "would heartily recommend approaching formal, committed developmental practice with that timeless/effortless view in mind". I'm glad to hear that, because I am naturally inclined that way. I'd like to practise in a way that emulates the open clarity of the "glimpses" as much as possible, even while traversing a linear map through the stages of insight. Mainly I want to systematically investigate what makes the "normal" state so opaque and dense compared with those "glimpses"... all the while understanding that those "glimpses" are what's already here, now, always.
Yes, that's exactly what i'd recommend: emulating the natural state. There is an infinite spectrum of appreciation for the natural state between oblivion to it and complete selfless uncovering of it. Move in that direction by investigating what *seems* to obscure it. Use your best emulation of it to conduct the investigation, as the vantage point of investigating. This creates a feedback loop that reveals better emulations which in turn disclose subtler hang-ups or illusions.
John Coetze:
When you started your formal practice, was there a particular set of teachings and practices you found most helpful?
Yeah, I like radical dzogchen, by which I mean dzogchen which is not mixed with tantra, but which may encompass tantric methods. Namkai Norbu is a good source for this, as are the Aro Lamas. I would avoid the form of dzogchen that relies heavily on a tantric framework. You can tell the difference because radical dzogchen teachers offer all three series of dzogchen teachings, including Semde, which is very important as it includes a form of calm-abiding and insight training within that View.
Another version of these Semde teachings, or something closely related, are some forms of Mahamudra. I like Dakpo Tashi Namgyal's Clarifying the Natural State.
I also like vipassana, and think it's great for SE. By which I mean just noticing whatever arises moment to moment until more and more of the total field of experience shows itself in each moment as simply part of a holistic sensate field. Some folks also like to mentally or even out-loud "note" in addition to noticing but I never had any interest in that myself.
Those three.
It seems that the more dry one's insight practice the more rough it can be, before and after SE. On the other hand, focusing more on calm abiding in the way that Mahamudra or Dzogchen Semde function will also lead IMO to SE (and beyond) but in a gentler way, and by no means slower either. Check out the Aro Lama Ng'gakpa Chogyam's excellent book "Roaring Silence" for a really useful meditation manual on Dzogchen Semde. Chan and Zen also have a lot to offer in the way of view and pointers.
Sorry to derail this thread Eran!
Actually it kind of ties in as this issue of life and practice is so close to me, and I think it's related to this issue of whether one does dry insight or brings in more calm-abiding, since the latter seems to enact a path which is much more integrated between life and formal practice.