<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?> <rss xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/" version="2.0"> <channel> <title>Physical Practices</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_category?p_l_id=&amp;mbCategoryId=77344</link> <description>The place for all meditation based on physical practices, such as yoga, prostrations, etc.</description> <pubDate>Sun, 19 Oct 2014 02:21:13 GMT</pubDate> <dc:date>2014-10-19T02:21:13Z</dc:date> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5600827</link> <description>re Piers M (10/6/14 10:48 AM as a reply to Jason Snyder.)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: #0000ff"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="color: #0000ff"&gt;&amp;#034;Think of your current or most recent sexual partner. Now imagine them aged 80 or 90. Would you still want to engage with them sexually?…&amp;#034;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Check out the oft reported, s/t &amp;#039;scandalous&amp;#039; goings-on in retirement communities. &lt;strong&gt;You&lt;/strong&gt; (in your relative youth) might not want to engage with them (when they&amp;#039;re older) sexually, but that may not apply to 80-90 y/o&amp;#039;s &lt;strong&gt;among themselves&lt;/strong&gt;.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I had a patient once, ca. 90 y/o, resident of one such modern &amp;#039;old-folks home&amp;#039;. He was quite a &amp;#039;lady&amp;#039;s man.&amp;#039; Died a year or so later -- heart attack -- but what the hell, he lived longer than most of us will.</description> <pubDate>Wed, 08 Oct 2014 01:14:35 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5600827</guid> <dc:creator>Chris J Macie</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-08T01:14:35Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5600824</link> <description>re Dan Cooney (1/25/13 9:04 AM as a reply to Jesse Cooper Levy.)&lt;span style="color: #0000ff"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: #0000ff"&gt;&amp;#034;BK&amp;#039;s [Bruce Frantzis] Taoist sexual meditation book is out, its pretty interesting and addresses some of these questions.&amp;#034;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Frantzi, ManTak Chia, Dr. Stephen Chang, etc. -- many different flavors of interpretation and teaching are, have been out there English for at least half a century. One form is known as something like &amp;#039;iron pants&amp;#039; and relates to martial arts (I learned a version of this once from one Wu, BaoLin, of Santa Monica, originally BeiJing, White Cloud Monastery.) &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In general, the Taoist approach has to do with preserving and optimally utilizing the &amp;#039;jing&amp;#039; or the constitutional &amp;#039;essence&amp;#039; that governs human life, particularly life-span. &amp;#039;Jing&amp;#039; bears some relation to, but is not reducable to notions like DNA, as it can be affected by environment and individual development (c.f. EVO-DEVO scientific theory). As to &amp;#039;enlightenment&amp;#039;, Taoist internal alchemy has related notions, depending on how one understands &amp;#039;enlightenment&amp;#039;. (The external alchemy related more to the life-span issue, i.e. the quest for immortality.)  &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;It also relates to Confucian emphasis on family life &amp;#x2013; having lots of healthy children, especially boys, who will take care of you when you&amp;#039;re old. Note, the Chinese people have virtually always been the most populous on the planet, so this stuff works in that regard.  &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If one is interested, all modern texts on this go back to Volume 25 of the &amp;#039;I Shim Po&amp;#039; &amp;#x2013; a huge compendium of Chinese medical texts preserved in Japanese copy, from some time in the middle ages, many of which, including Vol 25, are preseved only there. The sexual positions (which are perhaps the most popular feature nowadays) are portrayed as quasi-medical healing or preventative techniques (similar to early DaoYin aka &amp;#039;qigong&amp;#039;). Actually, come to think of it, the MaWangDui collection of texts (buried 286BCE, discovered 1972CE) also included material on sexual practices, but no where near as extensive.  &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;There was an excellent English translation of IshimPo Vol 25 in print (a copy of which I have somewhere in a boxed library) &amp;#x2013; a straightforward scholarly translation, with historical and textual background, footnotes, etc. I.e. NOT an interpretative or teaching oriented one as in the books of modern popularizers. The MaWangDui collection is also available in English translation &amp;#x2013; a thick, expensive book; it cost ca. $260 when it first came out (when I bought it), but later was reduced to ca $100.</description> <pubDate>Wed, 08 Oct 2014 01:10:13 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5600824</guid> <dc:creator>Chris J Macie</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-08T01:10:13Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5600720</link> <description>Agreed. I feel Giordano Bruno had it right - the obstructions and challenges of life are erotic frictions. They impel creation. And he means this literally not metaphorically. The world is, indeed, one huge fuck-fest. &lt;span style="font-size: 16px"&gt;I myself, have had insights whereby the entire world, both writ large and in all it&amp;#039;s moving becoming details, is nothing other than sexual congress. Felt right to me. The devil, naturally, is in the details, and with just how much attachement and aversion we enact in this unceasing congress. (and wisdom)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</description> <pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2014 20:09:39 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5600720</guid> <dc:creator>Plne</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-07T20:09:39Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5600541</link> <description>Yeah...I&amp;#039;m not a Buddhist so appeals to scripture or traditional beliefs don&amp;#039;t do much for me. You seem to be categorizing all sex as lust and therefore bad. I am arguing that it all depends on ones relationship to the act. That seems to be the end of the discussion. </description> <pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2014 14:09:22 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5600541</guid> <dc:creator>Jason Snyder</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-07T14:09:22Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5600440</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;&lt;strong&gt;cont.. P.83 second paragraph half way down:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;He said that it is rãgatanhã which &lt;br /&gt;dictates the passionate urges of men, women, and all the animals, &lt;br /&gt;facilitating the pleasure they find in each others company &amp;#x2013; this is a &lt;br /&gt;principle of nature. &lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Unfortunately, having problems copying and pasting rest of the quote (you can continue reading in the link I posted above on P.83 of the book  (or 107/108 on the side scroll bar).&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;~Piers</description> <pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2014 10:36:00 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5600440</guid> <dc:creator>Piers M</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-07T10:36:00Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5600428</link> <description>Hi Jason,&lt;br /&gt;I do not for a minute expect you to change your cherished views/beliefs from reading the following (likewise, I am unlikely to change my cherished views/beliefs in any great hurry from reading a paragraph or two posted on DhO).&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;However, I offer this up for your wise reflection:&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;[This is an excerpt from a book about the life of Acariya Mun (if you haven&amp;#039;t heard of him, he is considered one of the greatest Thai monks of the last century (coming from the forest traditions - I hope that doesn&amp;#039;t put you off that he did meditate in caves and secluded places. He did also mix with ordinary worldings and teach the Dhamma to simple villagers, city dwellers and monks/nuns and others (deities). It is a fascinating read and the author who only died recently (couple of years ago aged in his late 90s), was a disciple of his an also considered to be an arahant.]&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt; I actually start with a note from the main text which follows.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If you are interested the book can be read online &lt;u&gt;&lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;luangta&amp;#x2e;eu&amp;#x2f;site&amp;#x2f;books&amp;#x2f;book8_biomun&amp;#x2f;BioMunAll&amp;#x2e;pdf"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/u&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;&lt;strong&gt;P. 477-478 Note 19 (Ragatanha):&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;br /&gt;the belief that the body is oneself and that happiness can be achieved for oneself &lt;br /&gt;through bodily sensations, rãgatanhã is the desire, even craving, to seek pleasure and &lt;br /&gt;self-gratification by means of the physical body. With this mental defilement as the &lt;br /&gt;driving force, most people attempt to overcome discontent and find fulfillment using &lt;br /&gt;physical stimulation as the primary means. If such craving is allowed a free rein, it &lt;br /&gt;&lt;strong&gt;&lt;/strong&gt;easily becomes a preoccupation which gives rise to even more craving, leaving the heart forever hungry and disatisfied. For lust is a hunger that no amount of gluttony can satiate. The harder one tries to find satisfaction in this way, the more one suffers the consequences. This deep rooted sexual drive is the main fetter binding living beings to the Sensuous World (Kama-loka).&lt;br /&gt;But as Acariya Mun points out here, Ragatanha has a more sinister side, for passionate intentions can easily become aggresive and violent. Thus, united in a passion for physical stimulation the kilesas of greed and aversion join forces in the guise of ragatanha, which strives to assuage its insatiable hunger by dominating and exploiting others. In this way, passion for sex and lust for power are two aspects of the same fundamental craving. The thirst for war and murder, the thirst for torture and all forms of abuse, all have their roots in ragatanha. As such ragatanha is a primary factor governing birth in sub-human realms (demons, ghosts, animals and hells).&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;&lt;strong&gt;P.81-84 (notes 17, 18, 19 in bold although I have only inserted note 19 (above which I feel relevent to this thread).&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;To the question &lt;strong&gt;“Where do human beings come from?”&lt;/strong&gt; Ãcariya Mun’s &lt;br /&gt;reply was:&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;“All human beings have a mother and father who gave birth to them. &lt;br /&gt;Even you yourself were not born miraculously from a hollow tree. We &lt;br /&gt;all obviously have parents who gave birth to us and raised us, so this &lt;br /&gt;question is hardly an appropriate one. Were I to say that human beings &lt;br /&gt;are born of ignorance and craving, this would cause more confusion &lt;br /&gt;and misunderstanding than if I gave no answer at all. People have no &lt;br /&gt;knowledge whatsoever of what ignorance and craving are, although they &lt;br /&gt;are present there in everyone &amp;#x2013; except, of course, in the Arahants. The &lt;br /&gt;trouble is people are not interested enough to make the necessary effort &lt;br /&gt;for understanding these things, so that leaves the obvious answer: we &lt;br /&gt;are born of our parents. This then opens me up to the criticism that &lt;br /&gt;I’ve answered too briefly. But it is hard to give a reply which goes to the &lt;br /&gt;truth of the matter, when the one asking the question is not really much &lt;br /&gt;interested in the truth to begin with. The Lord Buddha taught that both &lt;br /&gt;people and animals are born of avijjã paccaya sankhãra… samudayo hoti.&lt;strong&gt;17&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The ceasing of birth, which is the cessation of all dukkha, stems from &lt;br /&gt;avijjãya tveva asesavirãga nirodhã sankhãrã nirodho … nirodho hoti.&lt;strong&gt;18&lt;/strong&gt; This &lt;br /&gt;condition is inherent within the heart of each and every person who has &lt;br /&gt;kilesas. Once the truth has been accepted, it becomes clear that it’s just &lt;br /&gt;this which leads to birth as a human being or an animal until the world &lt;br /&gt;becomes so crowded one can hardly find a place to live. The primary &lt;br /&gt;cause is just this ignorance and insatiable craving. Though we haven’t &lt;br /&gt;even died yet, we are already searching for a place to be born into where &lt;br /&gt;we can carry on living &amp;#x2013; an attitude of mind that leads human beings &lt;br /&gt;and animals all over the world to birth and constant suffering. Anyone &lt;br /&gt;wishing to know the truth should take a look at the citta that’s full of &lt;br /&gt;the kind of kilesas which are frantically looking to affirm birth and life &lt;br /&gt;at all times. That person will undoubtedly find what he’s looking for &lt;br /&gt;without having to ask anyone else. Such questions merely display a level &lt;br /&gt;of ignorance that indicates the inquirer is still spiritually inadequate. &lt;br /&gt;The citta tends to be the most unruly, conceited thing in the world. If &lt;br /&gt;no interest is taken in reigning it in, we will never become aware of &lt;br /&gt;how really stubborn it is, and all our noble hopes and aspirations will &lt;br /&gt;come to nothing.”&lt;br /&gt;&lt;strong&gt;What is it that causes the sexual attraction between men and women and &lt;br /&gt;animals of the same species, since they’ve never been taught this?&lt;/strong&gt; Ãcariya &lt;br /&gt;Mun replied:&lt;br /&gt;“&lt;strong&gt;&lt;u&gt;Rãgatanhã&lt;/u&gt;19&lt;/strong&gt; is not to be found in any book, nor is it learned in school &lt;br /&gt;from a teacher. Rather, rãgataõhã is a stubbornly shameless condition &lt;br /&gt;that arises and exists in the hearts of men and women, causing those who &lt;br /&gt;have this vulgar condition to come under its spell and become vulgar &lt;br /&gt;themselves without ever realizing what’s happening. Rãgataõhã makes &lt;br /&gt;no distinction between man, woman, or animal, nationality, social status &lt;br /&gt;or age group. If it is strong it can easily cause disaster in the world. If &lt;br /&gt;there is insufficient presence of mind to restrain it and keep it within &lt;br /&gt;acceptable limits, sexual craving will become like runaway floodwater, &lt;br /&gt;overflowing the banks of the heart and spreading out to flood towns and &lt;br /&gt;cities, leaving ruin everywhere in its wake. Such a condition has always&lt;br /&gt;been able to thrive within the hearts of all living beings precisely because &lt;br /&gt;it receives constant nourishment and support &amp;#x2013; things which give it &lt;br /&gt;the strength to assert its suffocating influence continuously, sowing &lt;br /&gt;havoc and causing misery around the world.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;We hear only about&lt;br /&gt;floods occurring in towns and cities, and how they cause destruction to &lt;br /&gt;people and their belongings. No one is interested in noticing the flood &lt;br /&gt;of rãgatanhã engulfing the hearts of people who are quite content to let &lt;br /&gt;themselves and their belongings be ravaged by those surging floodwaters &lt;br /&gt;all year round. Consequently, no one understands the real reason for the &lt;br /&gt;on-going deterioration of world affairs because each and every person &lt;br /&gt;is contributing to and encouraging this situation by failing to recognize &lt;br /&gt;that rãgataõhã is directly responsible for the worsening situation. If we &lt;br /&gt;do not focus our attention on the real cause, it will be impossible for us &lt;br /&gt;to find any genuine sense of contentment.”&lt;br /&gt;The original question asked only about that aspect of rãgataõhã&lt;br /&gt;concerning the attraction between people, completely ignoring the &lt;br /&gt;destruction instigated by rãgataõhã through hatred and anger. But in &lt;br /&gt;his explanation Ãcariya Mun touched on the full range of detrimental &lt;br /&gt;results stemming from rãgataõhã. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;cont.... in next post</description> <pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2014 10:22:10 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5600428</guid> <dc:creator>Piers M</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-07T10:22:10Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5599857</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Piers M:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;I think we&amp;#039;ll have to agree to disagree on this one.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I have not tried Asubha practices much (relfecting on the loathsomeness of the body and its constituent parts). However, I can see the value of it, particularly for a mind consumed with lust (which is most of the world). [NB This has got nothing at all to do with self loathing or the loathing of others because of a characteristic in their form you don&amp;#039;t happen to like]&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The body is inherently a gross structure. It is made up of many elements. Blood, pus, faeces, urine, sweat, bones, organs etc Anything attractive about that? It&amp;#039;s not that different from food in many respects. See a nice plate of food. Take a mouthful and chew it well but don&amp;#039;t swallow. Instead spit it back out on your spoon. Now look at it. Doesn&amp;#039;t look so appetising now does it? Why? It&amp;#039;s the same food only chewed up.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Think of your current or most recent sexual partner. Now imagine them aged 80 or 90. Would you still want to engage with them sexually? If not why not? If so, why so?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Supposing you admire your partners hair or nails or teeth. A tooth falls out. He/She gives it to you? Are you going to wear it as a pendant or throw it away?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Can you see the impermanence of the entire human body? So, what&amp;#039;s to lust after?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The bench mark as always.....if any practice leads you all the way to the end of suffering, without remainder. Then, good, continue with it...&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;IMO, understanding impermanence is not about denying life and the world, i.e. not about nihilism (although asubha practices can be useful for understanding impermanence and attachment). It is instead about ones relationship to life. It is about being fully engaged and alive in the present moment, but without being attached - i.e., craving for things in the future, wishing for things in the past, or clinging to what is passing right now. For example, if I see a beautiful flower, I am not going to avoid enjoying it because it is impermanent. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Do you ever enjoy food? Put sugar or salt in anything? Do you enjoy Jhanas? Sports? How about sunsets, oceans, mountains, leaves in autumn? Do you enjoy spending time with anybody? How about hanging out on this forum? It&amp;#039;s all impermanent. how is any of that different from enjoying sex? &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Again, IMO, the surest way to end suffering is not to disegage with the impermanent world, but instead to engage and integrate that with a practice (any practice that helps one see the 3C&amp;#039;s in their relationship with arising phenomenon - sexual practices not excluded). It seems like people spending years in caves or monestaries would have less of a sense of whether they are attached to anything, because that detachment is never really tested in the rough and tumble of the modern everyday life. </description> <pubDate>Mon, 06 Oct 2014 17:13:12 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5599857</guid> <dc:creator>Jason Snyder</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-06T17:13:12Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5599815</link> <description>I think we&amp;#039;ll have to agree to disagree on this one.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I have not tried Asubha practices much (relfecting on the loathsomeness of the body and its constituent parts). However, I can see the value of it, particularly for a mind consumed with lust (which is most of the world). [NB This has got nothing at all to do with self loathing or the loathing of others because of a characteristic in their form you don&amp;#039;t happen to like]&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The body is inherently a gross structure. It is made up of many elements. Blood, pus, faeces, urine, sweat, bones, organs etc Anything attractive about that? It&amp;#039;s not that different from food in many respects. See a nice plate of food. Take a mouthful and chew it well but don&amp;#039;t swallow. Instead spit it back out on your spoon. Now look at it. Doesn&amp;#039;t look so appetising now does it? Why? It&amp;#039;s the same food only chewed up.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Think of your current or most recent sexual partner. Now imagine them aged 80 or 90. Would you still want to engage with them sexually? If not why not? If so, why so?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Supposing you admire your partners hair or nails or teeth. A tooth falls out. He/She gives it to you? Are you going to wear it as a pendant or throw it away?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Can you see the impermanence of the entire human body? So, what&amp;#039;s to lust after?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The bench mark as always.....if any practice leads you all the way to the end of suffering, without remainder. Then, good, continue with it...</description> <pubDate>Mon, 06 Oct 2014 15:48:03 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5599815</guid> <dc:creator>Piers M</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-06T15:48:03Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5599409</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Piers M:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Why do you think the Buddha (or rather the Buddha to be) fled the marital home, spent six years practicing hard as a celibate ascetic before achieving enlightenment and then setting up a celibate monastic order?&lt;br /&gt;Sex is obviously a form of lust which is in turn a form of greed?&lt;br /&gt;So, your friend, whilst sounding like he&amp;#039;s having a &amp;#034;good&amp;#034; time, is I would suggest, deluded.&lt;br /&gt;What do you think?&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Sidarta did as Sidarta does. He wasn&amp;#039;t God, its not like he had the monopoly on enlightenment. I think celibacy is overrated - fine for people who are into it. How can the very drive that brings forth life be delusion? Sure, it can become a problem if one does it just to fill an endless void, but that is true with everything in life, everything comes down to whether you are present or not, mindful or not. Mindful sex is one of the most amazing things on this earth - completely losing yourself with another person.  Sex, relationships, and allowing yourself to be vulnerable with others, IMO, can be a very effective way of breaking down barriers that contribute to the false sense of self.  Now I think that he is kind of over-zealous, like when he tries to convince me that a commitment to monogomy just creates limiting boundaries or that the path of &amp;#034;orgasm&amp;#034; is superior (or even fundamentally different) than Vipassana meditation, but I think he is also on to something that is seriously lacking in much spiritual practice.  </description> <pubDate>Sun, 05 Oct 2014 22:58:06 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5599409</guid> <dc:creator>Jason Snyder</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-05T22:58:06Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5599371</link> <description>Why do you think the Buddha (or rather the Buddha to be) fled the marital home, spent six years practicing hard as a celibate ascetic before achieving enlightenment and then setting up a celibate monastic order?&lt;br /&gt;Sex is obviously a form of lust which is in turn a form of greed?&lt;br /&gt;So, your friend, whilst sounding like he&amp;#039;s having a &amp;#034;good&amp;#034; time, is I would suggest, deluded.&lt;br /&gt;What do you think?</description> <pubDate>Sun, 05 Oct 2014 22:05:58 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5599371</guid> <dc:creator>Piers M</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-05T22:05:58Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5598455</link> <description>My friend recently got into OM (orgasmic meditation). The central practice involves the male masterbating the female for 15 minutes under very controlled conditions, but more generally it involes a lot of practices &amp;#034;harnessing orgasm&amp;#034; (and wearing shirts that say &amp;#034;powered by orgasm&amp;#034;). He is always describing his multiple sexual partners and how he is breaking down emotional barriers through intimacy. He is pretty zealous about it and insists it is quickest and most direct path to enlightenment. </description> <pubDate>Sun, 05 Oct 2014 04:27:42 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5598455</guid> <dc:creator>Jason Snyder</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-05T04:27:42Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5598407</link> <description>Hi!&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Has any one tried the meditations in this book?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;http://www.holybooks.com/great-bliss-tantric-sex-and-the-path-to-inner-awakening/&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Keep it up&lt;br /&gt;Gunnar</description> <pubDate>Sun, 05 Oct 2014 02:04:28 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5598407</guid> <dc:creator>Gunnar Johansson</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-05T02:04:28Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Sexual Practices?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5595170</link> <description>here you go :&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvkzMhVTsmE</description> <pubDate>Wed, 01 Oct 2014 02:24:47 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5595170</guid> <dc:creator>SeTyR ZeN</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-10-01T02:24:47Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Vipassana mixed with Tai Chi or other practices</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5584290</link> <description>Hello Isabel,&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I didn&amp;#039;t have time to go through the previous replies but I&amp;#039;ll punch in a few lines, anyway, in case no one mentioned these aspects to your question.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;With a history of 12 years of full time spiritual/meditation practice together with quite intense physical/yoga/martial arts practice, I&amp;#039;d say that there is no problem with combining any sitting practices with physical practices. However, I&amp;#039;ve seen some people be confused about this because sometimes people read or are told that by doing this series of physical yoga or that tech of qi gong they will get to some lofty spiritual state. But this is confusing the meaning of the practices in different forms. Sitting practices are to work primarily with mental and emotional phenomena (shamatha-vipashyana). Physical practices are to work primarily with the phys body but not excluding the psychology and concentration. The physical practice, in my exp and understanding, does have the same principles of shamatha and vipashyana as sitting does in various forms (classic or tantric application). So, you should understand that tai chi, running or something like that does not interfere or create confusion to your sitting practice, when you know what it is and what it does. I do not know Goenka nor his method but it seems to me that his advice is a bit harsh and misleading.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Here&amp;#039;s a short text I&amp;#039;ve written on the topic some time ago. I did edit it a bit as my view has developed since (but I don&amp;#039;t have time now to go through it in detail to tweak some further points). Perhaps it helps: http://guruslight.blogspot.fi/2013/07/shamatha-and-vipashyana.html&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Cheers,&lt;br /&gt;Baba</description> <pubDate>Mon, 15 Sep 2014 15:19:02 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5584290</guid> <dc:creator>Kim Katami</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-09-15T15:19:02Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Vipassana mixed with Tai Chi or other practices</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5583378</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Isabel Smith:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Does anyone have anything to say about their experiences of combining Vipassana with other practices - or just have any useful information/opinions to share about doing that? I ask because I am committed to Vipassana, and really want to continue doing it regularly, but I find that I also really want to explore martial arts -- specifically Tai Chi (at least for the internal side of martial arts).&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;span style="color: #000000"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 10px"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 16px"&gt;Goenka seems to co-opt the meaning of &amp;#039;vipasanna&amp;#039;.  He says Vipasanna practice means equanimous awareness of present moment events *at the 6 sense doors in the context of socially isolated body scanning*.  I did one 10-day, found the practice very interesting and impactful.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: #000000"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 10px"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 16px"&gt;That said, after reading MTCB and steeping here in Dho, I believe that the real helpful part of the Goenka technique is the fact that it gives you experience in non-permanence, non-satisfaction, non-duality, AKA the &amp;#039;Three Characteristics&amp;#039; in MTCB lingo.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: #000000"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 10px"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 16px"&gt;So, when we talk about combining Vipasanna with other practices, we have to define what Vipassana is: is it the body scanning with attendant &amp;#039;sankara release&amp;#039;, or is it simply experiencing the 3 C?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I do believe that experience of the 3C in any context is helpful, which brings me to my own answer to your question.  Over the last 10 years I&amp;#039;ve been working on a physical/emotional/cognitive/social practice.  Long story short, a small group stands in a circle, we hit a ball around to each other, like beach ball, we just try to keep the ball aloft, this is the physical part.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: #000000"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 10px"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 16px"&gt;Cognitive part: we use *very* simple rules to regulate speech while the ball is flying around.  The point of the rule is to require awareness of what is said when the ball gets hit to you, and to require you to verbalize in response, cognizant of the rule.  If you are not listening, you &amp;#039;drop the (cognitive) ball&amp;#039;; feedback of non-awareness is immediate.  For example if someone hits the ball and says &amp;#039;Monday&amp;#039;, the receiver should reply with &amp;#039;Tuesday&amp;#039;, the next person should reply with &amp;#039;Wednesday&amp;#039;.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: #000000"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 10px"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 16px"&gt;Emotional part: we watch for ever-more detailed awareness of the physical/emotive content of the person that is hitting the ball and respond to that content by mirroring it when we field the ball.  As skill advances, we expand our awareness (mindfulness) to our own reaction to the transmission, and express that when we send the ball to another person.  In a sense, this is *kind* of like Mahasi-style noting.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: #000000"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 10px"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 16px"&gt;I developed the practice to help me become a better improvisational actor.  Improvisers will recognize the games from the classes that actors and improvisers do, however, I take the &amp;#039;games&amp;#039; to a kind of gymnastic/marathon level. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;img alt="emoticon" src="http://www.dharmaoverground.org/dho-theme/images/emoticons/happy.gif" &gt;&lt;span style="color: #000000"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 10px"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 16px"&gt;  I just wanted to become more perceptive/expressive/responsive on the improv stage, and on the stage of real life.  After teaching this practice for hundreds of hours, in any context I could, I was pleasantly surprise to notice a dramatic reduction of situations, in real life, where I partook in unhelpful reactive behavior.  I mean, life had become much better for me! &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;img alt="emoticon" src="http://www.dharmaoverground.org/dho-theme/images/emoticons/happy.gif" &gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This unexpected upgrade of my life experience led me to try to figure out why spending time hitting a ball around in the county jail,would help so much out in real life: while dodging careless auto drivers; while getting penned in by inconsiderate shoppers in the super market; while fielding questions while hosting a party; while having my view blocked by dancers at a concert; when getting hit in the face by careless or malicious beach-ball players; when being surprised by dishes clattering onto the kitchen floor behined me; when an aggressive drunk on the street lunges towards me, etc etc.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: #000000"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 10px"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 16px"&gt;My research led me to a bunch of reading, to a Goenka retreat, then here to Dho and MCTB, and a whole lot more sitting. I think that the ball game did help, and it&amp;#039;s because the ball game consisted of a hell of a lot of paying attention to present moment events, and a continuous stream of examples/experiences of impermanence and non-satisfaction, and having to let go of the idea that interactions are manageable/controllable/successful without being permeable/inclusive/non-controlling of what is happening inside/outside of me.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: #000000"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 10px"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size: 16px"&gt;Over the years, I&amp;#039;ve done a lot of other things that required present-moment-awareness and equanimous attendance: Aikido, swing dance, chorus singing, improv acting classes.  I think they all help in the same 3-C way, but the question is, where do we put the bar?  How hard to we have to listen, see, feel?  How quickly do we get feedback/notice when we are wandering?  How do we train ourselves to respond to wandering?  Some activities require lots of awareness, lots of focused re-engagement when we wander into la-la land.  Others don&amp;#039;t really require as much attention or correction to wandering.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I also wonder about how easily the training transfers to &amp;#039;off-the-cushion&amp;#039; (out-of-the-classroom) environments?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I hope that my experience is responsive to your question, and I&amp;#039;d love to hear more conversation about the subject.</description> <pubDate>Sun, 14 Sep 2014 05:06:32 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5583378</guid> <dc:creator>the real matt</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-09-14T05:06:32Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5558673</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;J H:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Generally I am a tightly wound person. Recently I tried meditating where you inhale and tense, hold it, exhale and release a few times over to start the meditation. I meditated for 15 minutes on Saturday and then 15 minutes on Sunday morning. On Saturday evening I started feeling my left shoulder get tense. By Sunday evening I was in a lot of pain. In the middle of the night I woke up literally crying in pain and it continued into the morning. Even breathing in hurt my body. It was excruciating, frightening pain and I hadnt exercised or done anything strenuous. Its been a few days and its still tight. Could this be a result of meditiation? Perhaps repressed trauma, etc? It was my left shoulder and Ive never had any major accidents but I have had many surgeries on that hand from a birth defect.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Hi J H,&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I had spasms too but they were kind of mild and not painful. And they were more like what&amp;#039;s called Kriyas (i.e. involuntary movements mainly of my facial and upper body musculature). At first I thought this was a Kundalini awakening. Maybe it is but it also turns out to be some repressed traumatic stuff that is finally beginning to surface. So I would not rule that out. I&amp;#039;m currently reading a book on child abuse and neglect. There&amp;#039;s the case of a lady being hospitalized with muscle spasms. Later during the psychotherapeutic process these movements and cramps began to take form and look like acted childhood scenes. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;First of all I would check back with your doctor to rule out any serious health issues. If that is done, then whatever it is (pure kundalini stuff, trauma, both, etc.) try to see it as a good sign and as the beginning of a journey to wholeness and integration. If there are body movements let the happen and try to stay mindful. Enjoy the ride, so to speak. &lt;br /&gt;It helps a lot to read about experiences of other people and see that it can be a quite interesting and fascinating journey - no matter if it is kundalini, trauma or both. If you expect it to be related to trauma I would hight recommend doing psychotherapy. It can greatly help to integrate this stuff and make the ride less bumpy. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;BTW, there&amp;#039;s a thing called TRE (Trauma Release Exercises). It seems to help a lot of people with your kind of spasms/cramps and traumatic experiences. Google it and see if it can help. If you are interested I would either purchase David Bercelis book or DVD by the same name (the DVD contains a more thorough and the book a more concise exercise explanation).&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;All the best,&lt;br /&gt;Andreas</description> <pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2014 08:20:44 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5558673</guid> <dc:creator>Andreas Thef</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-07-20T08:20:44Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Vipassana mixed with Tai Chi or other practices</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5553186</link> <description>Hi Isabel,&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I agree. I&amp;#039;m no master of either but I find that Tai Chi and Vipassana go hand in hand. I came to Vipassana after my Tai Chi studies but I found that through the martial arts (and the internal styles especially) I had a pretty good head start with mind/body awareness. Adding Vipassana to my studies has improved my ability to focus at the Tai Chi school, and Tai Chi has improved my awareness on the cushion. All in all a beneficial relationship. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Would be interesting to see what more advanced people have to say.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If you&amp;#039;re interested, I&amp;#039;d recommend checking out wustyle.com for your Tai Chi needs.</description> <pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2014 02:22:59 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5553186</guid> <dc:creator>Newt</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-07-05T02:22:59Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>Yoga Poses That Help Seated Meditation</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5534299</link> <description>&lt;a href="https&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;youtube&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;watch&amp;#x3f;v&amp;#x3d;lvcVqsujrJE"&gt;Yoga &lt;/a&gt;poses that help seated meditation.</description> <pubDate>Fri, 16 May 2014 19:20:59 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5534299</guid> <dc:creator>Change A.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-05-16T19:20:59Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Vipassana mixed with Tai Chi or other practices</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5326892</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Isabel Smith:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Does anyone have anything to say about their experiences of combining Vipassana with other practices - or just have any useful information/opinions to share about doing that? &lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Hi Isabel,&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I have practiced Chi Gong along with Tai Chi and a bit of Taekwondo thrown in for 20 years or so. Several years into that sort of practice I ended up doing a 10 day goenka retreat. &amp;#034;Worrrk, Worrrk, Worrrrk&amp;#034; - yes, I can still here his words.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I only did one goenka retreat. The style didn&amp;#039;t really fit well with the Taoist in me. Still, it did help me see much better into pain. As far as I could tell, the main focus was to get you to the point of feeling the energy in the body though maybe they think of it as impermanence - can&amp;#039;t remember. But that seemed to be the initial goal which then allows you to keep your awareness there. Chi Gong also uses lots of sweeping practices - you can do them in any position. Great way to go to sleep at night.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;You might try looking into what is often called &amp;#034;medical Chi Gong&amp;#034; these days - same old Chi Gong just with a name more appealing to westerners I think - Tai Chi is generally considered a form of Chi Gong. Find a teacher with formal training and they will help you open up the channels and get well grounded. This would help with goenka style body-scanning and your Tai Chi - plus it feels great. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Both Goenka body-scanning and Chi Gong are going to break-up blockages in the body (what may seem like dead or numb areas) if you do them right. The two methodologies might be compared to how you can break-up ice by repeatedly shaving away at it (Goenka) or by slowly dissolving with water (Chi Gong). Just to explain that a bit more: the goenka technique has you sit without moving (which usually creates tension) and scan methodically through the body part by part looking for any sensation and doing that over and over. Chi Gong techniqes usually have you relax the body and then sweep awareness through and wherever sensation is found you encourage that to flow and expand.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If you enjoy the goenka body scanning then do go for it. Enjoying a practice helps tremendously.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;As for &amp;#034;just practice my method and don&amp;#039;t do anything else&amp;#034; - I doubt that many students really comply with such requests. But it is understandable. As Drew points out - they want you to give the technique a chance to work without mixing in other methods. But I do think that any body-oriented awareness practice is going to not only be compatable but also supportive.</description> <pubDate>Thu, 20 Mar 2014 01:31:51 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5326892</guid> <dc:creator>Chuck Kasmire</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-03-20T01:31:51Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Vipassana mixed with Tai Chi or other practices</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5326701</link> <description>Hello Isabel, &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I have also attended Goenka (Saya Gyi U Ba Khin ) vipassana retreats in the past and have a personal opinion about the warning given to not combine techniques. My perception of this warning is that it is for simplification and maintaining purity of the teachings as they are handed down through the generations. The more techniques you add, similar to the more chemicals you add to a solution, the less predictable the end result will be. I think the warning is to help control for variables as much as possible to achieve the desired result, similar to a scientific experiment That being said, I have also experienced mixing different techniques and to say that the different vipassana techniques are really fundamentally that different is debatable, in my opinion. As you scan the body, you are noticing physical sensations. The noticing is similar to noting, in the Mahasi tradition, which is considered a different technique, but fundamentally I wonder if they are really that different. To follow this line of thinking and to address your question of combining other physical activities in your spiritual practice, I have also experienced benefit from combining yoga, running, hiking, and Tai Chi and using a vipassana perspective during these activities has been a useful practice at deepening my insight. Similar to the walking meditation during Goenka courses, any physical activity can be part of the practice. Attend to the impermanence, pervasive disatisfactoriness, and no-separate independent selfness (e.g. the three characteristics) of the sensations as you are doing the practice. These physical practices have both been useful for me to attend to impermanence of sensation as they tend to increase the energy flowing through the body. That being said, as the energy increases concentration tends to decrease and seeing clearly the three characteristics of phenomena becomes more difficult . For me, the goal is to bring the formal meditation practice into all areas of my life and all activity becomes the vipassana practice. It is all meditation from this perspective. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I have been wanting to ask about other&amp;#039;s experiences with physical practices as well, particularly running. I have experimented with doing running meditation during solo retreats in the past and have found it useful but wondered about other&amp;#039;s perspectives and/or experiences with this? &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;metta,&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Drew</description> <pubDate>Wed, 19 Mar 2014 23:54:03 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5326701</guid> <dc:creator>Drew Miller</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-03-19T23:54:03Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>Vipassana mixed with Tai Chi or other practices</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5326659</link> <description>Hi there,&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Back in February I finished my first 10-Day Vipassana retreat in Kaufman, TX under the guidance of Goenka (videos/recordings). Several times throughout the course, Goenkaji warns (somewhat strongly I think) against combining Vipassana with other certain practices. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Does anyone have anything to say about their experiences of combining Vipassana with other practices - or just have any useful information/opinions to share about doing that? I ask because I am committed to Vipassana, and really want to continue doing it regularly, but I find that I also really want to explore martial arts -- specifically Tai Chi (at least for the internal side of martial arts).&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;So does anyone have anything to say about their experience with combining Vipassana with Tai Chi or some other more of a &amp;#034;physically active&amp;#034; spiritual practice? &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;(Note: My motivation for trying out Tai Chi is because I want to work on grounding myself and getting to know my body. I tend to really be stuck up in the &amp;#034;top chakras&amp;#034; and totally not grounded. Always have been that way and it has caused some no longer needed struggles, I think. The reason I prefer a martial art as a way to try being grounded (as opposed to say, working with chakra meditations), is that I used to practice Taekwondo and I loved it. Just found it to be really fun! And it&amp;#039;s a great way to stay physically active.)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;EDIT/ADD: My thoughts on this question: &lt;br /&gt; One sort of &amp;#034;issue&amp;#034; I could see with combining Tai Chi and Vipassana, is that from what I understand, each employs a sort of &amp;#034;scanning&amp;#034; method of the body, but coming from different intentional points. With Vipassana, you scan part by part, objectively--not trying to relax anything or to manipulative anything. With Tai Chi, however, I *believe* that from the very beginning with standing, your intention is to stand and move with the greatest ease--with the greatest &amp;#034;efficiency.&amp;#034; The idea is to release all tension by discovering all present tensions in the body, and to eventually let the Earth move sort of &amp;#034;for you&amp;#034;. I think that these two motivations could be distracting when trying to practice one or the other. For example, if I am sitting I may find myself relaxing every muscle which could distract from observing the &amp;#034;impermanence&amp;#034;, &amp;#034;unsatisfactoriness&amp;#034;, etc. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Actually, I wonder if that if you were to practice Vipassana long enough, your body wouldn&amp;#039;t eventually release itself of muscle tension anyway, however. So maybe they are ultimately working in through the same vein anyway. Please tell me what you think!&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Thanks and I look forward to your replies! &lt;img alt="emoticon" src="http://www.dharmaoverground.org/dho-theme/images/emoticons/happy.gif" &gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Isabel</description> <pubDate>Wed, 19 Mar 2014 23:23:43 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5326659</guid> <dc:creator>Isabel Smith</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-03-19T23:23:43Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Want to find out about yoga retreats</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5124948</link> <description>Awesome. Let me know.</description> <pubDate>Mon, 13 Jan 2014 03:01:13 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5124948</guid> <dc:creator>Brian K.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-01-13T03:01:13Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Want to find out about yoga retreats</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5117038</link> <description>Hey Brian,&lt;br /&gt;i like yoga. i got a start with a great teacher and practice it on my own which is great. i did the same with meditation, went on a couple of goenka retreats, not free, but dana (donation based) and then practiced on my own.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;that&amp;#039;s the good thing about these non-team sports, you can do it on your own. that goes for retreats too. of course its great to have a teacher around to give you pointers but in the end you are the one in downward dog.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;i&amp;#039;ve heard of one donation based yoga retreat around darjeeling in india and will look for a link. it is supposed to be über excellent.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;tom</description> <pubDate>Fri, 10 Jan 2014 06:48:29 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5117038</guid> <dc:creator>tom moylan</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-01-10T06:48:29Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>Want to find out about yoga retreats</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5100862</link> <description>So, I&amp;#039;ve been practicing yoga lately in lieu of sitting meditation. I really like it, and am definitely seeing some positive effects on my mind and person. I want to know about taking a yoga retreat. For instance, for Buddhists we can go on retreats that are essentially free. I&amp;#039;ve been on goenka retreats as well as to Pa-Auk and Panditarama in Myanmar. Just go, tell them you&amp;#039;re there, and start mediating. That was literally my experience with Pa-Auk haha. Now, I&amp;#039;d like to find something like that to practice Yoga. I am willing (and even would prefer) to go to somewhere like Asia, though i currently live in New Jersey. I&amp;#039;m a student and really don&amp;#039;t have thousands of dollars to spend on expensive yoga retreats. I&amp;#039;d like to go somewhere like an ashram or yoga center in asia and be able to stay there for a few months, depending. Anyone know anything about this? It would be greatly appreciated, thanks!</description> <pubDate>Thu, 02 Jan 2014 17:48:26 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5100862</guid> <dc:creator>Brian K.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-01-02T17:48:26Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>Handstand Yoga</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5099399</link> <description>Handstand yoga has helped me with the tension that used to be in my shoulders, neck and head region. I keep breathing the same way as in meditation which was quite difficult in the beginning but it helped a lot afterwards.</description> <pubDate>Thu, 02 Jan 2014 01:11:28 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5099399</guid> <dc:creator>Change A.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-01-02T01:11:28Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>Attention on Ankles</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5098353</link> <description>I think that placing attention on ankle region of the feet is important. The way I do it is to alternate the attention on the ankles while having weight on them and then not having weight on them. Doing it this way leads me to find out the muscles which hold tension which is not required for balancing and then focusing on them can gradually lead to lessening of that tension. This can result in better left and right side balance.</description> <pubDate>Wed, 01 Jan 2014 18:15:40 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=5098353</guid> <dc:creator>Change A.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2014-01-01T18:15:40Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4978769</link> <description>Thanks TomTom. I can get my head around (intepret into my frameworks) most of what you are saying. In my perspective, talking about energy versus brain function are two ways or levels of description about aspects of the same thing, so what is more or less concrete depends on how concreteness is defined relative to those levels of description (i.e. it is hard to say one is more concrete than another, as each has a claim to being &amp;#034;concrete&amp;#034;.). &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;While I can understand terms like activation and attention in your framework, I still am struggling to understand what is meant by blockage - which would relate to the &amp;#034;holding&amp;#034; of energy. One way to think about it is using the terminology of nonlinear dynamic systems (which is a good way to think about neural dynamics), in which stable states (e.g., jhanas) are &amp;#034;attractors&amp;#034;. So in this sense, maybe you could see a blockage as being stuck in a particular attractor, and that part of the process of &amp;#034;enlightenment&amp;#034; is learning how to skillfully enter and exit these attractors (and not get stuck in them).</description> <pubDate>Thu, 05 Dec 2013 10:50:46 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4978769</guid> <dc:creator>sawfoot _</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-12-05T10:50:46Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4977008</link> <description>Sawfoot:&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;And TomTom, I would be interested to hear what your understanding of energy imbalances? Again it is something you hear about but I am curious to know what that means in your own experience, particularly due to your knowledge of manic depression - do you see depression and mania a form of energy imbalance?&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Simon T:&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;My opinion is that talking about stress, muscles tension, spasms, etc, is much more concrete than the more fancy language used to describe experiences in the world of meditation. Lets take &amp;#034;energy imbalance&amp;#034;. What does that mean? There is actual energy that circulate in the form of electricity in our body. It&amp;#039;s the nervous system. Are we talking about that? &amp;#034;Energy imbalance&amp;#034; is somewhat of a pleonasm. Energy is either stored, then a form of potentiality, or circulating. Either way, it mean you have more at one place than at the other. I&amp;#039;m not doing this practice to achieve complete entropy. Life is a fight against entropy anyway.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;We could talk about energy for more esotheric ideas but I think we should use a different word then, when we get beyond the world that science can see so far. There is many unexplained phenomenons in the world of meditation and language that underline the unknown nature of those phenomenon appears to me as useful. Still, each time we have the opportunity to map a phenomenon with something very concrete that everyone can understand, we should be grateful of that opportunity. The less obscure those practices are, the better everyone will be.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt; &amp;#034;Controlling&amp;#034;/holding and manipulating the breath can be useful in some meditative systems such as kundalini yoga. However, it can be dangerous to practice similar to this &lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;dharmaoverground&amp;#x2e;org&amp;#x2f;web&amp;#x2f;guest&amp;#x2f;discussion&amp;#x2f;-&amp;#x2f;message_boards&amp;#x2f;message&amp;#x2f;4429676&amp;#x3f;_19_threadView&amp;#x3d;tree"&gt;thread&lt;/a&gt; where the person was engaging in tantric sex without proper guidance. The difference here is the person was practicing holding seminal fluid rather than the breath. To say that these patterns of sensation and their relation to the particular nexus points (chakras) is map-able to brain or nerve function is not always correct as people with various meditative problems often are checked out by doctors who, after extensive testing, say there is nothing physically wrong with them. Therefore we are talking about patterns in direct sensate/phenomenological experience (at all 6 doors) and not patterns arising from concepts inferred from sensations such as the body&amp;#039;s nervous or electric systems. In this manner meditative energy is actually even more concrete than talking about nerve/brain/electrical function.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;It cannot be denied that there are particular nexus points in the body (which become increasingly subdued/tamed/irrelevant as one approaches completion of all paths or &amp;#034;full enlightenment&amp;#034; or completely eliminated in the absence of attention - &amp;#034;PCEs&amp;#034;) generally referred to in Indian yogic systems as &amp;#034;chakras.&amp;#034; The scientific use of the term energy (the ability to do work) and the meditative term &amp;#034;energy&amp;#034; (patterns extrapolated from the bodymind&amp;#039;s direct sensate experience at all 6 doors) are not completely synonymous. The meditative process can also be described in terms of chakra activation and energy flow though this approach is generally not done in Theravada Buddhism as the focus is to emphasize jhanas instead of chakras (though jhanas and chakras arise from the activities of attention with the stable jhanas being certain areas of resting attention at chakra areas).&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This is usually described as certain vibrations in certain body parts such as describing vibrations in the lower spine, the groin, the chest area, third eye, top of the head, etc. However, it is important to note that the body parts are being inferred from sensate experience and not the other way around. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Mental illness definitely involves some sort of extreme activation or blockage at/to certain chakra areas. However, I cannot say that this phenomenon alone is responsible for mental illness, but rather it is a response that can be observed to occur during episodes of mental illness. For example, &amp;#034;sexual energy&amp;#034; which is being conceptually inferred from strong sensations in the groin area is present in some types of mania/A&amp;amp;P activity as well as pathologically strong sensations which would be attributed to the third eye area and the crown area in states of hallucinatory activity. Remember the &amp;#034;third eye&amp;#034; and the &amp;#034;crown&amp;#034; are mere concepts that are being inferred from strong sensate activity in these regions (generally labeled as &amp;#034;chakras&amp;#034;). However, I cannot say that this kind of activity occurs in all states of hallucination or mania.</description> <pubDate>Wed, 04 Dec 2013 21:41:06 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4977008</guid> <dc:creator>Tom Tom</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-12-04T21:41:06Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4976657</link> <description>Dear JH,&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;To answer your question directly: yes, meditation can cause muscles to spasm. It doesn&amp;#039;t mean you&amp;#039;re doing something wrong, it&amp;#039;s just one of the many possible manifestations of mentation in the sense fields.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The best academic research on the negative side effect of meditation that I know of is Dr. Willoughby Britton of Brown University. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Here is an &lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;buddhistgeeks&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;2011&amp;#x2f;09&amp;#x2f;bg-232-the-dark-night-project&amp;#x2f;"&gt;interview with her&lt;/a&gt; on Buddhist Geeks where she talks about musculoskeletal and involuntary muscle contractions as possible side effects of meditation (among others). &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In my own practice, I&amp;#039;ve had lots of muscle pain from meditation, and not just from sitting for a long time but from involuntary contractions and releases. The plus side is that in the long run I&amp;#039;ve become much less restricted in my range of motion, and much more fluid in my movements as well. It has helped with a lot of long standing chronic pain issues as well. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;One thing you can try to lie on a soft mattress and just let your whole body shake for as long as it needs to. This really tends to reduce the built up tension (however, if you&amp;#039;re already feeling like your muscle is injured/strained then taking a pain killer might be a better option). You could also try resolving in meditation to transfer the mental agitation that is expressing itself through your muscles into another sense field, such as the visual field. Here&amp;#039;s a &lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;dharmaoverground&amp;#x2e;org&amp;#x2f;web&amp;#x2f;guest&amp;#x2f;discussion&amp;#x2f;-&amp;#x2f;message_boards&amp;#x2f;message&amp;#x2f;4892719&amp;#x23;_19_message_4896016"&gt;detailed post&lt;/a&gt; about how to do that.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Best of luck and let us know how it turns out.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Avi&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;avicraimer&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;meditation-teaching&amp;#x2f;"&gt;Meditation Teaching&lt;/a&gt;</description> <pubDate>Wed, 04 Dec 2013 19:50:00 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4976657</guid> <dc:creator>Avi Craimer</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-12-04T19:50:00Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4976577</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Simon T.:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;sawfoot _:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Simon T.:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;All those years of accumulated stress as to be released someway. Sometimes, you can just gently focus on the tension and let it do it&amp;#039;s thing.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Your hear that a lot as an explanation for &amp;#034;kriyas&amp;#034; but I have always being sceptical - in your own experience do you think that is true? So if weren&amp;#039;t given that as a theory of why it was happening, do you think you have come to a similar view?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;And TomTom, I would be interested to hear what your understanding of energy imbalances? Again it is something you hear about but I am curious to know what that means in your own experience, particularly due to your knowledge of manic depression - do you see depression and mania a form of energy imbalance?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;thanks&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;My opinion is that talking about stress, muscles tension, spasms, etc, is much more concrete than the more fancy language used to describe experiences in the world of meditation. Lets take &amp;#034;energy imbalance&amp;#034;. What does that mean? There is actual energy that circulate in the form of electricity in our body. It&amp;#039;s the nervous system. Are we talking about that? &amp;#034;Energy imbalance&amp;#034; is somewhat of a pleonasm. Energy is either stored, then a form of potentiality, or circulating. Either way, it mean you have more at one place than at the other. I&amp;#039;m not doing this practice to achieve complete entropy. Life is a fight against entropy anyway.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;We could talk about energy for more esotheric ideas but I think we should use a different word then, when we get beyond the world that science can see so far. There is many unexplained phenomenons in the world of meditation and language that underline the unknown nature of those phenomenon appears to me as useful. Still, each time we have the opportunity to map a phenomenon with something very concrete that everyone can understand, we should be grateful of that opportunity. The less obscure those practices are, the better everyone will be.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Scientists studying enlightenment focus quite a bit on the brain. I&amp;#039;m not very advanced on this path but it&amp;#039;s my belief that if we were able to scan the body of enligthened people and compared is to other people, we would find knots of tension in the general population that cannot be found in elightened people. By this, I mean actual muscles that are contracted. It would be interesting to have people at 3th path and beyond comment on this.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Another belief that I have, for which I have absolutely no proof, is that the nervous connection between the lower motor neuron (at the base of the spinal cord) and the brain is of high importance in enlightement. Energy flow (actual nerve connection) between those could results in some of the mystical experiences. There would be an actual physical relaxation necessary for this to happen. It&amp;#039;s appear that for the A&amp;amp;P, not so much relaxation is required, as concentration is really the key for it. Still, the spams people experience at this stage suggest some relaxation is required. For moving from one path to another, my belief is that the degree of relaxation needed is much higher, hence the dark night, hence, equanimity. This process of relaxation starts with at the periphery (limbs) and the last stand is along the spine.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Thanks Simon.&lt;br /&gt; &lt;br /&gt;As a scientifically minded sceptical sort, I tend to think that there is unlikely to be any form of physical stuff that can interact with &amp;#034;us&amp;#034; (i.e. our brains and the conscious experience caused by our brains) that we haven&amp;#039;t so far measured. So the utility of the term energy here is a description of mental phenomenon, which ultimately is going to relate to physical stuff that we can measure happening in our brains.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The thing about talking about muscle spasms and tension and is that it can suggest that this is something happening or caused in the muscles, when it seems to me (and this partly due to my own experience) that it all comes to down to stuff happening in the brains. So, for example, when people start shaking around A&amp;amp;P it seems to be due to over excitability of the motor cortex. And when you have crazy stuff happening around your 3rd eye, it isn&amp;#039;t happening at the 3rd eye, but rather in the brain&amp;#039;s representation of that part of the body. So in my opinion, this may be a way of relating what &amp;#034;energy&amp;#034; is - just abnormal levels of neurotransmitters causing your brain to go a bit haywire. Though seeing it this way doesn&amp;#039;t help to explain some of the systematicity we see (say, stuff happening around your 3rd eye, or limbs to spine shifts)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;So lots of meditation teachers also claim that enlightenment is linked to energy flow along the lines of your intuition. Kenneth Folk, for example, talks about psycho-energtic awakening. The fact that so many people talk about it such a way suggests that they are onto something, but I never really get the impression that they what they are talking about, partly due to inadequacies in the frameworks they are using. Which is why I am interested in people&amp;#039;s perspective on this. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I am willing to believe that 4th pather etc.. may have measurably less muscular tension. But I think this is another way of saying that 4th pathers are more relaxed - their nervous systems are less fight and flighty, and hence less prepared for action, and hence less tense. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;But I like your point about different levels of the path involving a transitioning or increased management of the holding and release of muscular tension. Muscular tension (and your awareness of it) is a big thing in some Western Zen teachers, for example.</description> <pubDate>Wed, 04 Dec 2013 19:20:14 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4976577</guid> <dc:creator>sawfoot _</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-12-04T19:20:14Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4976231</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;sawfoot _:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Simon T.:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;All those years of accumulated stress as to be released someway. Sometimes, you can just gently focus on the tension and let it do it&amp;#039;s thing.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Your hear that a lot as an explanation for &amp;#034;kriyas&amp;#034; but I have always being sceptical - in your own experience do you think that is true? So if weren&amp;#039;t given that as a theory of why it was happening, do you think you have come to a similar view?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;And TomTom, I would be interested to hear what your understanding of energy imbalances? Again it is something you hear about but I am curious to know what that means in your own experience, particularly due to your knowledge of manic depression - do you see depression and mania a form of energy imbalance?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;thanks&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;My opinion is that talking about stress, muscles tension, spasms, etc, is much more concrete than the more fancy language used to describe experiences in the world of meditation. Lets take &amp;#034;energy imbalance&amp;#034;. What does that mean? There is actual energy that circulate in the form of electricity in our body. It&amp;#039;s the nervous system. Are we talking about that? &amp;#034;Energy imbalance&amp;#034; is somewhat of a pleonasm. Energy is either stored, then a form of potentiality, or circulating. Either way, it mean you have more at one place than at the other. I&amp;#039;m not doing this practice to achieve complete entropy. Life is a fight against entropy anyway.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;We could talk about energy for more esotheric ideas but I think we should use a different word then, when we get beyond the world that science can see so far. There is many unexplained phenomenons in the world of meditation and language that underline the unknown nature of those phenomenon appears to me as useful. Still, each time we have the opportunity to map a phenomenon with something very concrete that everyone can understand, we should be grateful of that opportunity. The less obscure those practices are, the better everyone will be.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Scientists studying enlightenment focus quite a bit on the brain. I&amp;#039;m not very advanced on this path but it&amp;#039;s my belief that if we were able to scan the body of enligthened people and compared is to other people, we would find knots of tension in the general population that cannot be found in elightened people. By this, I mean actual muscles that are contracted. It would be interesting to have people at 3th path and beyond comment on this.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Another belief that I have, for which I have absolutely no proof, is that the nervous connection between the lower motor neuron (at the base of the spinal cord) and the brain is of high importance in enlightement. Energy flow (actual nerve connection) between those could results in some of the mystical experiences. There would be an actual physical relaxation necessary for this to happen. It&amp;#039;s appear that for the A&amp;amp;P, not so much relaxation is required, as concentration is really the key for it. Still, the spams people experience at this stage suggest some relaxation is required. For moving from one path to another, my belief is that the degree of relaxation needed is much higher, hence the dark night, hence, equanimity. This process of relaxation starts with at the periphery (limbs) and the last stand is along the spine.</description> <pubDate>Wed, 04 Dec 2013 16:34:55 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4976231</guid> <dc:creator>Simon T.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-12-04T16:34:55Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4974809</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Simon T.:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;All those years of accumulated stress as to be released someway. Sometimes, you can just gently focus on the tension and let it do it&amp;#039;s thing.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Your hear that a lot as an explanation for &amp;#034;kriyas&amp;#034; but I have always being sceptical - in your own experience do you think that is true? So if weren&amp;#039;t given that as a theory of why it was happening, do you think you have come to a similar view?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;And TomTom, I would be interested to hear what your understanding of energy imbalances? Again it is something you hear about but I am curious to know what that means in your own experience, particularly due to your knowledge of manic depression - do you see depression and mania a form of energy imbalance?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;thanks</description> <pubDate>Wed, 04 Dec 2013 08:55:00 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4974809</guid> <dc:creator>sawfoot _</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-12-04T08:55:00Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4970348</link> <description>I experienced my share of muscles spams on this path so far. Sometimes my legs would start spasming incontrollably at work. I had spasms in my shoulders, my belly, etc. Once on a retreat when I was pushing really hard, I started to have violent spasms while falling asleep that almost hurt my back. All those years of accumulated stress as to be released someway. Sometimes, you can just gently focus on the tension and let it do it&amp;#039;s thing.</description> <pubDate>Tue, 03 Dec 2013 16:48:02 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4970348</guid> <dc:creator>Simon T.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-12-03T16:48:02Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4969484</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt; Recently I tried meditating where you inhale and tense, hold it, exhale and release a few times over to start the meditation. &lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Don&amp;#039;t meditate like this. Allow the inhalation and exhalation to occur naturally without effort or input in the same way you would breathe if you&amp;#039;re not thinking about breathing.. Don&amp;#039;t hold your breath for any reason. All kinds of weird energy imbalances could occur from doing this.</description> <pubDate>Tue, 03 Dec 2013 07:23:39 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4969484</guid> <dc:creator>Tom Tom</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-12-03T07:23:39Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4968742</link> <description>Your pain may or may not be related to the meditation in more ways than one. Sometimes, certain phases of insight may be associated with muscle spasms (I&amp;#039;m thinking 3 characteristics phase) which you can read about in Daniel Ingram&amp;#039;s book MTCB. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Other times muscle spasms can be due to prolonged seated postures, especially if you are not in proper alignment while sitting. Another scenario may be that you had a preexisting problem there that just happened to present itself while meditating and it is not directly related. Sometimes there may be problems in our bodies where someone may not initially have symptoms.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The first scenario will work itself out with more meditation. The second 2 scenarios are ones where you should probably seek treatment. At the very least I think it wouldn&amp;#039;t hurt to see a professional that you trust to rule out anything more serious and see if it indeed requires treatment.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Hope this was in some way helpful to you.</description> <pubDate>Mon, 02 Dec 2013 21:21:04 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4968742</guid> <dc:creator>Michael A Speesler</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-12-02T21:21:04Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4812702</link> <description>Take a painkiller? Have a massage? Do some stretching? &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Stop meditating? Meditate more? Meditate differently?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If it is meditation related, then sitting through the pain isn&amp;#039;t likely do any damage, and it should, fingers crossed, eventually pass. So Dr. CCC&amp;#039;s advice isn&amp;#039;t half bad. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If you are talking about it possibly being &amp;#034;repressed trauma&amp;#034; then you probably have your own ideas about it. Some people do actually believe that.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;What does the internet say?!&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=meditation+spasm</description> <pubDate>Thu, 17 Oct 2013 12:19:01 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4812702</guid> <dc:creator>sawfoot _</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-10-17T12:19:01Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4812636</link> <description>This is a non-issue.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If you tense your muscles as tight as you can as part of your pre-meditation routine, there&amp;#039;s a chance you might get cramp developing later on. Cramp can be painful. I don&amp;#039;t know what to suggest. Open a window and get some fresh air and toughen up a bit.</description> <pubDate>Thu, 17 Oct 2013 10:38:30 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4812636</guid> <dc:creator>C C C</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-10-17T10:38:30Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>Can you get a muscle spasm from meditation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4811432</link> <description>Generally I am a tightly wound person. Recently I tried meditating where you inhale and tense, hold it, exhale and release a few times over to start the meditation. I meditated for 15 minutes on Saturday and then 15 minutes on Sunday morning. On Saturday evening I started feeling my left shoulder get tense. By Sunday evening I was in a lot of pain. In the middle of the night I woke up literally crying in pain and it continued into the morning. Even breathing in hurt my body. It was excruciating, frightening pain and I hadnt exercised or done anything strenuous. Its been a few days and its still tight. Could this be a result of meditiation? Perhaps repressed trauma, etc? It was my left shoulder and Ive never had any major accidents but I have had many surgeries on that hand from a birth defect.</description> <pubDate>Wed, 16 Oct 2013 23:31:21 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4811432</guid> <dc:creator>J H</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-10-16T23:31:21Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: reverse engineering "yoga nidra"</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4725532</link> <description>I have similar expereiences of what must be the alpha stages of yoga nira. Not sure though, it sounds like you jnow a bit more about the practice. Hope your situation improves though! I am not going to pry.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;also, I realized my original post was sort of attacking a strawman (what I saw as mainstream yoga nidra). This was somewhat unnecessary since there are some resources that are much clearer about learning this as a skill over time.</description> <pubDate>Sat, 21 Sep 2013 13:10:50 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4725532</guid> <dc:creator>Mike H.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-21T13:10:50Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: reverse engineering "yoga nidra"</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4725493</link> <description>Ok... about me:&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;my first experience with yoga nidra was a few years before starting meditating; I had to study a lot, and Ifound these relaxation exercises that were meant to get you to alpha&amp;amp;eventually deeper state; did them regularly, 7 minutes were enought to make me feel very refreshed; at the beginning it was a recording, after awhile I learnt to do it by myself.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;When I begun meditating, observing the breath for the first times, likely because of that past conditioning, I would quiteoften end up in what nowI recognize as a very well known state during the progress in yoga nidra, where the trance was quite deep and a lot of random, mental activity was going on; in particular, I am not a visualthinker, but in those statesI would have all sorts of beautiful visions; if someone would call me I&amp;#039;d stand up immediatly, feeling completely refreshed and lucid, while half second before that I wasin this relatively deep kind of trance. &lt;br /&gt;Btw, you know when you are falling asleep and your thoughts get disconnected and quite nonsensical? If you keep awareness going, that&amp;#039;s pretty much the place you end up into.&lt;br /&gt;However, at one point I talked to a monkwho told me that that state was too much torpor-oriented and not conducive to good meditation, so I stopped doing that immediatly, though I was really enjoying that. This wastwo years ago.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In these days, when I happen to do something like that, the procedure is much less structured, and it&amp;#039;s like &amp;#034;Lie down, tuning into a sense of heaviness, making the breath go up&amp;amp;down throught the body, tuning into whatever feels like a deeper state of trance&amp;#034;.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;No still awareness, quite a lot of sensations of heaviness moving throught the body, sometimes with the breath, changing intensity, shape&amp;amp;so forth; no particular mental images going on in this period, and this way of experiencing the process of falling asleep is for sure hightly conditioned by a lot of time spent training in vipassana and energy practices. I have no doubt that if I would focus on thoughts, I&amp;#039;d end up having visions again.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I also noticed that the activity of noticing things, (knowing what&amp;#039;s going on) is very much related to the third eye* ), while when you are falling asleep energies tend to slip into to the heart**, the third eye gets deactivated, so there is this place where you are somehow still experiencing things but not really knowing what is happening and, according to my observations, that seems to be obviously the reason you don&amp;#039;t know when you are falling asleep just before losing awareness, because the third eye is shutting down, so the activity of knowing what is happening doesn&amp;#039;t have energy to function. So, if you are interested in these things, a tip would probably be to put attention to the heart when you want to go deeper,and putting attention to the third eye when you are deep and you don&amp;#039;t want to lose consciousness. Or, you can do that by being intuitively aware of the sensations that are going on throught the body (or your mind), like if you wanted to note them Mahasi-way, but you keep sistematically doing the mental act of knowing what&amp;#039;s going on without creating the label (that si because the label activates the throath, while you are trying not to fall asleep you want to constantly knowing what is going on in order to keep a steady flow of energy to the third eye)...this for me is working very nicely when I try to keep awareness going when I&amp;#039;m falling asleep, wich I don&amp;#039;t do a lot because I&amp;#039;m having very paniful stuff going on in this period, and if I menage to just get asleep that&amp;#039;s basically all I want right now.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Also, there is a place where the energy body seems to be loosening his connection with the physical body, so I end up experiencing falling, rotating, and stuff like that, and this happens expecially if you go with the heaviness flowing throught the body (if yougo with the thoughts you end up having visions), and that&amp;#039;s, according to what I red on the subject, the state where you want to be in in order to begin the process of coming out of the body, thought I never really tried that.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;That&amp;#039;s pretty much all that comes to mind... good luck!&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;*wich, btw, explains very nicely why the Buddha was saying all the time &amp;#034;the monk, having established sati in his forefront...&amp;#034;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;**wich I think is related to why the orgasm tend to knock you out, because after that there is a massive heart activity, and possibly is also related to why the old texts say that the one who practice metta sleeps well</description> <pubDate>Sat, 21 Sep 2013 12:47:10 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4725493</guid> <dc:creator>Mario Nistri</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-21T12:47:10Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: reverse engineering "yoga nidra"</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4723625</link> <description>Mario, thanks for the link. Could you expand on your experience? Did you have a sense of still awareness, was there awareness of the body etc? I should probably learn a bit more.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The link you gave definitely is helpful. It addresses a number of my questions/thoughts - like yoga nidra is not music, verbal affirmations, etc.</description> <pubDate>Fri, 20 Sep 2013 19:16:26 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4723625</guid> <dc:creator>Mike H.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-20T19:16:26Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: reverse engineering "yoga nidra"</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4723562</link> <description>Practiced it for a while; I agree that you can see it as a skill; the most impressive thing is probably that, after a short session, you can wake up and feel refreshed in a way that a night of sleep just don&amp;#039;t, at least for me.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;However, those guys repeat a lot that yoga nidra actually is is a state of mind where you are awake during deep sleep, and what most people call yoga nidra are just techniques that are used to get there. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Still, you can use the techniques to take some fast and deep rest.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;swamij&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;yoga-nidra&amp;#x2e;htm&amp;#x23;recedes"&gt;Link with tons of more info&lt;/a&gt;</description> <pubDate>Fri, 20 Sep 2013 18:56:54 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4723562</guid> <dc:creator>Mario Nistri</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-20T18:56:54Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: reverse engineering "yoga nidra"</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4723543</link> <description>Well, again . . . no expert here, but I had listened to some yoga nidra tracks that are available on spotify. It is basically lying in corpse pose, completely still, and frequently using sort of body scanning, like you might find in MBSR programs. Except, a little unlike MBSR that I&amp;#039;ve seen, you are given cues to sort of fall into a deeper, nearly sleep like rest state. My impression though is that, &amp;#039;done correctly&amp;#039; you end up being in a slightly different state than just being &amp;#034;near sleep.&amp;#034; So you come out of a yoga nidra session very relaxed, but also alert, generally, unlike regular sleep. The physical body felt like it did sleep, almost.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I only do yoga nidra type practices periodically, and not every day. But I feel that practice with meditation has allowed me to do yoga nidra fairly well just on my own, without guidance. It is just like falling into the right mind-state, repeating where I was during guided sessions. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Why do this? As a sleep deprived parent, it seems like a good way to get a potentially-superior form of rest during my kid&amp;#039;s brief nap. Regular napping just makes me more tired, and I may only have 1/2 an hour which is not enough time to actually fall asleep. And there are times when I am simply too tired to stay awake meditating. These are all just my suppositions though, and it is sort of an experiment over time.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I will say, with some certainty though, that &lt;em&gt;yoga nidra is not just doing a bad job of meditating while lying down &lt;/em&gt;(i.e. fallling asleep). It seems to be a different brain-state. A restful state, but it might not bring insight in the sense of the three characteristics. I think some pragmatic dharma practitioners might be interested in it as sort of a supplemental practice, if they tried it.</description> <pubDate>Fri, 20 Sep 2013 18:38:49 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4723543</guid> <dc:creator>Mike H.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-20T18:38:49Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: reverse engineering "yoga nidra"</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4723389</link> <description>Would love to know more about the method(s) you use, what you get from it, etc.</description> <pubDate>Fri, 20 Sep 2013 17:09:38 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4723389</guid> <dc:creator>Bruno Loff</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-20T17:09:38Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>reverse engineering "yoga nidra"</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4723340</link> <description>Hello,&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I have listened to a couple &amp;#034;yoga nidra&amp;#034; tracks over the last few months, and read a bit about it, and I&amp;#039;ve been thinking about that practice. I don&amp;#039;t necessarily think it ties in directly to attaining insight, but I still think it is interesting and not really in conflict at all with buddhist meditation. As a busy, working person, it can be a helpful practice to use at times to physically/mentally rest.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I will try to phrase this in a way that does not criticize the common yoga nidra practice, as I am not an expert. This is just my sort of working hypothesis.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Basically, many people practice &amp;#039;yoga nidra&amp;#039; at yoga studios or by listening to guided meditation/tracks. In my limited experience, these all seem to involve music, and various verbal cues. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;u&gt;Taking a more pragmatic-meditator view, it really seems to me that yoga nidra is simply a skill that one can learn to do without any music or external cues.&lt;/u&gt; It is really just training oneself to be in a state of physical stillness and rest, just short of sleep, where the mind is still aware. Music is not necessary. And many of the verbal cues are not necessary, only some are, in the tracks I&amp;#039;ve listened to. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;To me, the process of learning this skill is like learning to fall into 1st jhana as described by Ayya Khema or Leigh Brasington. Although a bit easier. (edit - I only mean &amp;#039;easier&amp;#039; in a limited sense. I don&amp;#039;t suggest I&amp;#039;ve fully grasped this practice)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Respectfully then, it seems that yoga nidra really it is a skill of working with consciousness, like meditation, and can be practiced quite simply on ones own, without purchasing anything. I would suppose that &lt;em&gt;traditionally&lt;/em&gt; yoga nidra must have been thought of as a solo practice, without external cues, but the modern American version of it seems to simply &lt;em&gt;emphasize&lt;/em&gt; being guided. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Interested in others&amp;#039; thoughts. Perhaps I have a wrong take, though. &lt;u&gt;I am simply trying to convey that this practice seems like a skill to me, which can be easily separated from the common presentation of it.&lt;/u&gt;</description> <pubDate>Fri, 20 Sep 2013 16:27:08 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4723340</guid> <dc:creator>Mike H.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-20T16:27:08Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Walking Meditation</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4685431</link> <description>Standing feet at shoulder width, extend in a circular way your arms forward at hips height. Then, bring your arms back to your lower belly. Very similar to &lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;youtube&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;watch&amp;#x3f;v&amp;#x3d;-5X5pBx8nUE"&gt;this at 2:13&lt;/a&gt; but with hands facing to the ground. At first, the full circle should be done at that speed, in order to connect your arms muscles and fascia with those of the torso. When extending the arms you&amp;#039;ll feel the lumbar region stretching. When bringing them back, you&amp;#039;ll feel some contraction in the lower abdomen. Soon you&amp;#039;ll notice the out-breath matches with the arms expansion and the in-breath with the contraction. Once you&amp;#039;re comfortable with it, slow down the speed gradually to around 20 seconds per full cycle. Eventually you&amp;#039;ll notice chi-energy-vibrations on your arms, and the extending to the torso and fully body. These vibrations will grow and the air where your arms display will be felt thicker. You can make use of intention to broaden that sensation to all your surroundings. Then, if you focus inside, your body will be felt empty. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Please, keep your knees slightly bent and let your weight rock slightly forward and backward at the soles of the feel. All by itself, the lower abdomen will go forward when the arms go backwards, and vice versa. Much like rowing. Eventually the whole movement happens by itself, your&amp;#039;re kind of watching what&amp;#039;s happening. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;A nice variation is doing the arms cycles in sequence. That is, your right arm doing an anti-clock circle with a 1/4 to 1/3 delay from your left arm (doing a clock circle). In this exercise, slightly shift weight from leg to leg, following the circles. Here you can notice the soles of the feet doing the eights I mentioned before. The arms circles may be done with different sizes. If you do them small and closer (and slow), you&amp;#039;ll notice how one arm pull-push the other. This sensation will grow to the whole torso.</description> <pubDate>Mon, 09 Sep 2013 13:58:22 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4685431</guid> <dc:creator>Pablo . P</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-09T13:58:22Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Walking Meditation</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4665271</link> <description>Sure, I&amp;#039;m interested.</description> <pubDate>Fri, 06 Sep 2013 02:58:56 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4665271</guid> <dc:creator>Change A.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-06T02:58:56Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Walking Meditation</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4653233</link> <description>Regarding intention, you can have that too in body works. There&amp;#039;s an exercise where you blend with the space surrounding you, feeling it dense like water while you can actually sense the vacuum of your body. If you&amp;#039;re interested I may try to explain in detail here.</description> <pubDate>Wed, 04 Sep 2013 14:49:42 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4653233</guid> <dc:creator>Pablo . P</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-04T14:49:42Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Walking Meditation</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4648203</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Change A.:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt; By shifting your weight, do you mean by moving the pelvic region? I tried doing that and found it to be quite useful, better so than just walking. I also shifted my weight clockwise and counter-clockwise.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;You can do it either starting to move from the pelvic region (more restful practice), or from the soles of the feet (which shows more clearly the ascending &amp;amp; descending spirals, at the expense of some tension). In Taichi you actually need to practice both ways and then blend them. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Once you&amp;#039;re comfortable with feet parallel, you may try (&lt;u&gt;edit&lt;/u&gt;: just as a variation) one foot 10 inches forward, like a small step, and rock back an forth doing the eights, but carefully putting 100% of the weight in one foot before going back to the other.</description> <pubDate>Tue, 03 Sep 2013 02:48:06 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4648203</guid> <dc:creator>Pablo . P</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-03T02:48:06Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Walking Meditation</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4648180</link> <description>Ok, I got it what you mean. I used to do that but that is not for me. Grounding in the body works better for me.</description> <pubDate>Tue, 03 Sep 2013 02:11:49 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4648180</guid> <dc:creator>Change A.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-03T02:11:49Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Walking Meditation</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4647737</link> <description>Intention is easy to get a hold of, but it goes deep. It&amp;#039;s most conspicuous when you are about to reach the end of the lane* and turn around. It&amp;#039;s even more obvious when you hit 2nd ñana, and you get that ratcheting back and forth between intention and movement. As intentions become more clear in the 3rd ñana, there&amp;#039;s no obvious sense of self to be had in them. One is aware of the intention to move, and one is aware of the muscle fibers contracting, though each happens exactly where it happens and disappears with no obvious connection to be found between them that isn&amp;#039;t itself happening right where it happens and disappearing, etc. This all gets so much more complex after you cross the A&amp;amp;P...&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;*It could literally be a lane if you do it in the basement of IMS.</description> <pubDate>Mon, 02 Sep 2013 23:34:40 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4647737</guid> <dc:creator>Fitter Stoke</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-02T23:34:40Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Walking Meditation</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4647633</link> <description>@Fitter Stroke and Daniel: I&amp;#039;m not clear about intention. While doing walking meditation, if something bubbles up in the mind, it is easy for me to know the cause of it and it just goes away and I can keep my attention on the body (especially in the muscles where I&amp;#039;m holding tension). As that tension gets released, there is invariably some activity in the mind which I know where that will lead to and what kind of story it will weave and that it is of no use and that brings an end to it. The kind of muscle tension I&amp;#039;m talking about is long held kind, probably since childhood. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;@Pablo: By shifting your weight, do you mean by moving the pelvic region? I tried doing that and found it to be quite useful, better so than just walking. I also shifted my weight clockwise and counter-clockwise.</description> <pubDate>Mon, 02 Sep 2013 22:52:41 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4647633</guid> <dc:creator>Change A.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-02T22:52:41Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Walking Meditation</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4647593</link> <description>If it rains, it&amp;#039;s cold or too hot outside or you&amp;#039;re bored with the walking meditation, you may try this Taichi exercise: stand shoulder width, bare feet, feet parallel, and draw eights with your soles by shifting your weight. If relaxed, soon you&amp;#039;ll notice how this actives the muscles of the thighs, in a spiral sense. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;You may also note the activation of the &amp;#034;bubbling wells&amp;#034; in the middle of the feet, just 1-2 centimeters towards the toes. Also, through the thighs, the muscles and tendons pulling the dantian.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In order to get the eights, you may first try balancing forward/backward, left/right, and in circles.</description> <pubDate>Mon, 02 Sep 2013 22:24:48 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4647593</guid> <dc:creator>Pablo . P</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-02T22:24:48Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Walking Meditation</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4647579</link> <description>I totally agree about intention, and am a big fan of walking practice in general.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Also, as things progress, could add the whole feeling of the body moving in space, the sensations of balance shifting, the shifting perspective of the room, and finally take in the whole moving, fluxing, shifting, mix of analog and digital 3D field when you get better at it.</description> <pubDate>Mon, 02 Sep 2013 22:12:01 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4647579</guid> <dc:creator>Daniel M. Ingram</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-02T22:12:01Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Walking Meditation</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4647269</link> <description>I agree. Though I also add in intentions.</description> <pubDate>Mon, 02 Sep 2013 20:30:02 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4647269</guid> <dc:creator>Fitter Stoke</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-02T20:30:02Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>Walking Meditation</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4646482</link> <description>I have found that (at least in my case) with walking meditation, it is better to be aware of the sensations in the muscles of the thighs than the sole of the feet. Also, I think it is a better strategy to be aware of the sensations in the muscles of the body than just sensations on the skin.</description> <pubDate>Mon, 02 Sep 2013 18:44:41 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4646482</guid> <dc:creator>Change A.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-09-02T18:44:41Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>Using a foam roller to ease tight muscular and emotional stuff</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4488898</link> <description>I have found, like many people, that insight practice brings up a lot of emotional and muscular stuff. The quickest solution I have discovered for easing this pain is some kind of body work. Like a deep tissue or shiatsu massage. Although great, it can be quite expensive to get a massage a couple of times a week. The next best thing is a foam roller, which you can pick up for around £15.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;It really does help release tight muscles, making it easier to practice when I get back on the cushion. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This site here has comprehensive visual and written instructions - http://www.bodywindow.com/foam-rolling.html#sthash.N3CPz25s.dpbs (although, it is a little new agey for my liking&lt;img alt="emoticon" src="http://www.dharmaoverground.org/dho-theme/images/emoticons/closed_eyes.gif" &gt;)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;metta&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;richard</description> <pubDate>Sun, 21 Jul 2013 22:48:51 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4488898</guid> <dc:creator>richard blank</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-07-21T22:48:51Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Question about relaxed diaphragm during seated postures</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4472931</link> <description>well, I should state that I am not at this time trying to combine MCO with Vipassana.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;What causes the dissonance is that my abdomen is really &amp;#039;pooched out&amp;#039; and thus seems to create tension that restricts the diaphragm from being allowed to move fully. I am a little attached to letting as much of my musculature relax as possible, but I am wondering if I should just go ahead and self-regulate the diaphragm and some of my inner abs to allow more space to move. I simply like not having to pay so much attention to muscle holding patterns, so that I can spend more focus-energy on my meditation object. I suppose that if I kept it up, it would probably become second nature and I wouldnt have to spend any attention on holding the musculature right. I am thinking that I should just do this...</description> <pubDate>Sat, 13 Jul 2013 22:28:31 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4472931</guid> <dc:creator>Songtsan Crazyfox-Tiger Ali</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-07-13T22:28:31Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Question about relaxed diaphragm during seated postures</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4472117</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Songtsan Crazyfox-Tiger Ali:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;I experience some cognitive dissonance because of this, and my focus falters. Any advice?&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;What causes cognitive dissonance?</description> <pubDate>Sat, 13 Jul 2013 14:22:33 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4472117</guid> <dc:creator>Change A.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-07-13T14:22:33Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>Question about relaxed diaphragm during seated postures</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4470697</link> <description>When I sit, I try to relax my stomach wall, and diaphragm. This results in me having Buddha belly. Also what it does is cause my breathing to become rather shallow, and unforced. I know that since I am not moving and I am becoming very relaxed, I don&amp;#039;t need as much oxygen, so this is fine by me. What I also notice though is that if I try to do Vipassana style breath meditation there isn&amp;#039;t much to focus on, as there eventually exists little movement. Air circulation becomes soft and hard to sense..I can sit there for a long time apparently not breathing. Yet if I use breath as an object, what then? I have left the breath for a while because of this. I now focus on dantien/MCO..but I would still like to incorporate breath, yet I don&amp;#039;t like to maintain a fabricated breathing system. I experience some cognitive dissonance because of this, and my focus falters. Any advice?</description> <pubDate>Sat, 13 Jul 2013 02:47:14 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4470697</guid> <dc:creator>Songtsan Crazyfox-Tiger Ali</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-07-13T02:47:14Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4424215</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Rob Wynge:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;For some reason, most Buddhist teachings, which the exception of some Tibetan practices, say that one should not manipulate the breath but to observe it just as it is. I find pranayama to be excellent way to setlle the mind for meditation. In fact, I find that pranayama can lead to deeper meditation for me while I am doing than, say, regular breath awareness, because my active participation helpes me focus.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;That depends on the buddhist. Here is from Thanissaro Bhikkhu&amp;#039;s &amp;#034;&lt;a href="www&amp;#x2e;dhammatalks&amp;#x2e;org&amp;#x2f;ebook_index&amp;#x2e;html"&gt;With each and every breath: A guide to meditation&lt;/a&gt;.&amp;#034;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Thanissaro Bhikkhu:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The breath is one of the few processes in the body over which you can exert conscious control. An important part of breath meditation is learning how to make skillful use of this fact. You can learn which ways of breathing foster pleasant sensations in the body, and which ones foster unpleasant ones. You learn a sense of time and place: when and how to change the breath to make it more comfortable, and when to leave it alone. As you develop this knowledge, you can use it as an aid in developing skillful qualities of mind.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This sort of knowledge comes from experimenting with the breath and learning to observe the effects of different kinds of breathing on the body and mind. You can call this sort of experimentation working with the breath, for you’ve got an ardent purpose: the training of the mind. But you can also call it playing with the breath, for it requires that you use your imagination and ingenuity in thinking of different ways to breathe and to picture the breath energy to yourself. At the same time, it can be a lot of fun as you learn to explore and discover things about your body on your own.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;There are many ways in which working and playing with the breath can help foster the quality of ardency in your meditation. For instance, when you learn how to breathe in ways that feel comfortable&amp;#x2014;to energize the body when you feel tired, or to relax the body when you feel tense&amp;#x2014;you make it easier to settle into the present moment and to stay there with a sense of well-being. You learn to view the meditation not as a chore, but as an opportunity to develop an immediate sense of well-being. This gives energy to your desire to stick with the meditation over the long term.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description> <pubDate>Mon, 24 Jun 2013 15:34:41 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4424215</guid> <dc:creator>Bruno Loff</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-24T15:34:41Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4421308</link> <description>These few days, I&amp;#039;ve been doing the Diaphragmatic breathing fast, over 30 breaths per minute, for 10 minutes. Today, I did it for 15 minutes, and there were some differences. On and off, in the first few minutes, there were warmth spreading in many parts of the body, plus the (usual) expanding/contracting energy in some places, mainly the back.That is, an energy field surrounding the body that is expanding/contracting. Seems like on of Shinzen Young&amp;#039;s meditation methods. For the last 3 minutes or so, vibrations settled in, in the torso and mouth. Didn&amp;#039;t do it longer just to play safe. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;When I stopped these breathing, I didn&amp;#039;t need breath for around a minute. As there weren&amp;#039;t jhanic territory to explore like in previous sessions, I just watched my torso to see how the first new breaths would be. The first one was very short and from the dantien (4 fingers below the navel). The second (30 seconds later) was above the navel and the third (~30 secs too) was deep and involved more surface. Then, during the 50 minutes sit and for around 30 minutes off cushion, the diaphragm kept relaxed, really relaxed. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Regarding the first breathing, it reminded me some old experiments I did with taoist reverse breathing, contracting the lower belly while in-breathing. Despite there&amp;#039;s always some (subtle) tension in the torso even after out-breathing, if you just wait enough, the body will inhale contracting that way. Try this: sit in your couch with your legs/crotch open, resting above a coffee table or chair. Be sure that you are at an angle, so that your tailbone is tuck in. While resting comfortably there for a while (maybe watching TV), you&amp;#039;ll see that right before the inhale there&amp;#039;s a gently pull in of the abdomen in the lower belly.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Perhaps I should add in the future the Bhastrika breathing.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;u&gt;Added:&lt;/u&gt; &lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;swamij&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;diaphragmatic-breathing&amp;#x2e;htm"&gt;diaphragmatic breathing &lt;/a&gt;</description> <pubDate>Sun, 23 Jun 2013 00:37:33 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4421308</guid> <dc:creator>Pablo . P</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-23T00:37:33Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4419439</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Change A.:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Check this &lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;youtube&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;watch&amp;#x3f;v&amp;#x3d;amkJraCgIng"&gt;video&lt;/a&gt; and see if it helps.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Ramdev is quite a character, but that is a very good video. I will point out that his alternate nostril breathing, Anulom Vilom, is far more forceful than anything I have seen anywhere else. Most people teach that it should be gentle, or perhaps using Ujjayi at most. He almost does a Bhastrika while doing it. That is not to say there may not be some benefit of combining an energizing breath with a balancing technique, rather than a relaxing breath with a balancing technique. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;His Bahya pranayama is pretty incredible.</description> <pubDate>Sat, 22 Jun 2013 12:53:30 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4419439</guid> <dc:creator>Rob Wynge</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-22T12:53:30Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4418577</link> <description>Check this &lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;youtube&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;watch&amp;#x3f;v&amp;#x3d;amkJraCgIng"&gt;video&lt;/a&gt; and see if it helps.</description> <pubDate>Sat, 22 Jun 2013 03:22:45 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4418577</guid> <dc:creator>Change A.</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-22T03:22:45Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4416795</link> <description>I have practiced pranayama off and on over the years, currently very much on for the past 6 months. I like that AYP site, but their focus is more oriented to Kriya Yoga and yogic meditation, so they don&amp;#039;t discuss many of the classic pranayamas. For a more general discussion with a lot of background, I like this book: &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;http://www.amazon.com/Prana-Pranayama-Swami-Niranjanananda-Saraswati/dp/8186336796/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&amp;amp;qid=1371832935&amp;amp;sr=8-1&amp;amp;keywords=prana+pranayama&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;However, you can go to the internet magazine site for the same group (the Bihar school) and search their archives and you can usually dig up material that is similar to what is in their books:&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;http://www.yogamag.net/&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I will mention that Bhastrika and Kapalbhati are considered energizing pranayamas which have actually been scientifically proven to speed up your metabolism (can help with weight loss if that is an issue for you). However, most people avoid these or only do in small doses because they can lead to hyperventilation syndrome and, more generally, because most people turn to pranayama to chill out, not heat up. I would suggest experimenting with the relaxing or balancing pranayamas yourself and avoid the engergizing ones unless you are the type of meditator that really struggles with sleepiness during your sits. Then the energizing pranayamas could certainly provde useful.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;A relaxing pranayama would be &amp;#034;Dirgha&amp;#034; or deep yogic breathing, also known as the 3-part yogic breath (beath slowly into the stomach, then chest, the uppper chest). Also good is what some call &amp;#034;ratio breathing&amp;#034;, which involves exhaling 2x the length of the inhale (there are more advanced ratios and combinations). This has been shown to increase parasympathetic activity. A &amp;#034;balancing&amp;#034; pranayama would be alternate nostril breathing, or Nadi Shodhana. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In classical yoga practice, pranayama is considered a prepartion for meditation, and many yogis do pranayama before meditation as part of their daily practice. I personally usually do some alternate nostril breathing followed by 3-part yogic breathing for 15-20 minutes in total before continuing on to meditation. For some reason, most Buddhist teachings, which the exception of some Tibetan practices, say that one should not manipulate the breath but to observe it just as it is. I find pranayama to be excellent way to setlle the mind for meditation. In fact, I find that pranayama can lead to deeper meditation for me while I am doing than, say, regular breath awareness, because my active participation helpes me focus. Beyond that, I find it has more carry over into daily life in terms of relaxing me and keeping me grounded. Dark night yogis should seriously consider grounding with some relaxing or balancing pranayama.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Lastly, I would mention that the AYP site&amp;#039;s main focus is on a simplified adaptation of Kriya yoga, the main practice of which is spinal breathing (like Chinese microcosmic orbit work but up and down the spine only). This may or may not be of interest to you, but the focus here is on smoothing out the energy of your system and preparing your body for kundalini awakening. Bruno Leoff has written about this practice if you do a search.</description> <pubDate>Fri, 21 Jun 2013 17:09:50 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4416795</guid> <dc:creator>Rob Wynge</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-21T17:09:50Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4415430</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Also, the crown should be avoided; according to the AYP founder, going there is the most rapid way to get kundalini-horror-stories going.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The advice I was given by someone experienced with tantric stuff was to direct it towards the naval, despite its tendency to go upwards...&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Here are the practical instructions...&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;tsoknyirinpoche&amp;#x2e;org&amp;#x2f;1439&amp;#x2f;a-very-human-condition-part-two-of-two&amp;#x2f;"&gt;http://www.tsoknyirinpoche.org/1439/a-very-human-condition-part-two-of-two/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;But the individual isn&amp;#039;t experienced with noting. I think the upward moving energetic stuff is what causes cessations (which I no longer experience).&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I don&amp;#039;t have any energy blockages in the head region any more. But do have some annoying ones in the body.</description> <pubDate>Fri, 21 Jun 2013 03:24:58 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4415430</guid> <dc:creator>(D Z) Dhru Val</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-21T03:24:58Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4414467</link> <description>Mario, thanks for sharing.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Mario Nistri:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Also, the crown should be avoided; according to the AYP founder, going there is the most rapid way to get kundalini-horror-stories going.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I can confirm that examining that region has lead me to a lot of unpleasant experiences in the rest of my body, though perhaps not anymore now that I&amp;#039;ve paid a lot of attention to it and stuck through the unpleasant experiences (unsure). It did (ultimately) make a big positive impact for me.</description> <pubDate>Thu, 20 Jun 2013 20:37:32 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4414467</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-20T20:37:32Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4412881</link> <description>Mmm... just a little bit...&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;So,basically, the whole thing is about removing energy blockages.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;As i define it,an energy blockage is something like this: you make your attention move throught your spine,and eventually you&amp;#039;ll find a place where it seems to stop, to get stuck; there is an energy blockage there. As far as I cantell, they canbe found everywhere around the body,but in the mid-line in particoular.&lt;br /&gt;As far as I can tell, energy blockages are places where energy is encapsulated.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;How to release them? &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I see basically 3 ways:&lt;br /&gt;1)You poke around with it: if it seems to move in a direction you accentuate that moviment, or you send pulses of attention there,or you stay at the edges of it, or doing whatever you want; eventually, energy will be released from it, it will look like it exploded and, when the energy discharge is over, that part of the body will be open for attention to travel throught.&lt;br /&gt;2)You send some energy flow (derived from the breath, or from moviments of the body) throught it, like if you want to wipe it out; after a while doing that, that part of the body will be free from it. The energy leak will still happen, but it might go un-noticed.&lt;br /&gt;3)You ignore it and move to surrounding blockages; with 1 or 2; by doing that, the energy stored in the first one will begin to leak out.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The energy leak seems to move in some directions, mostly parallel or perpendicoular to the midline, seemingly following &amp;#034;paths&amp;#034; (channels?). &lt;br /&gt;As far as I can tell, the main channels are parallel to the chakra spots and from buttoks to shoulders, front and back, and obviously the mid-line, front and back.&lt;br /&gt;However there are many of them, and the more I do this the more paths I end up seeing, up to the point that most of my body looks like a mosquito-net of tiny little channels.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In order for this to be done safely, is important for the energy leak to flow throught thoose paths: the more channels are involved in the discharging process, the more the whole thing will be safe.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Also, the crown should be avoided; according to the AYP founder, going there is the most rapid way to get kundalini-horror-stories going.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;So... that&amp;#039;s it; hope it was useful to something...bye!</description> <pubDate>Thu, 20 Jun 2013 13:23:01 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4412881</guid> <dc:creator>Mario Nistri</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-20T13:23:01Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407856</link> <description>Would you be interested in sharing what you&amp;#039;ve been doing?</description> <pubDate>Wed, 19 Jun 2013 17:24:20 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407856</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-19T17:24:20Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407709</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;End in Sight:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Any specific suggestions?&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;No, not really... lol&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;My story is something like this: I&amp;#039;m having various shakings, and psychiatry is not helpful at all. Also, at one point I begun to feel alla sorts of stuff inside&amp;amp;outside me that seemed to fit the classical descriptions of prana/qi, meridians and whatever; also, I saw that there is an obvious relationship between my shakings and what seems to be energies, so I begun to manipulate them in various ways in order to cure myself from shakings, and the experiment seems to be working nicely.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;However, I have no teacher and I have no conceptual background of any kind, I&amp;#039;m just doing a lot of exploration for myself; I don&amp;#039;t even know if what I call &amp;#034;energies&amp;#034; and &amp;#034;enegy blockages&amp;#034; are the same thing that other traditions talk about when they are using theese terms... I know nothing basically, except for the fact that what I&amp;#039;ve been doing is quite beneficial to my health, so... no, I don&amp;#039;t feel like I&amp;#039;m in a position to give any specific suggestion about anything...&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Bye!</description> <pubDate>Wed, 19 Jun 2013 16:01:04 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407709</guid> <dc:creator>Mario Nistri</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-19T16:01:04Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407671</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Mario Nistri:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;If you have not done it yet, you might try to take a look at the &lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;aypsite&amp;#x2e;org&amp;#x2f;MainDirectory&amp;#x2e;html"&gt;AYP site&lt;/a&gt;, you can find quite a lot of useful information there...&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Cool, thanks.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;aypsite:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Kapalbhati means shining forehead. It is also interpreted to mean luminous face. It is a pranayama (breathing) technique, which involves taking a series of relaxed normal inhalations followed by sudden bellows-like exhalations...Kapalbhati can be repeated for a series of 10-20 cycles of relaxed inhalation and sudden exhalation. Be careful not to overdo this practice. A good time to practice kapalbhati is after yoga asanas and right before twice-daily sitting practices, which includes spinal breathing pranayama and deep meditation. &lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;aypsite:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Now we will introduce a powerful new pranayama practice called spinal bastrika. &amp;#034;Bastrika&amp;#034; means &amp;#034;bellows.&amp;#034; It is rapid breathing, like a dog panting, done with the diaphragm only (abdominal breathing), preferably through the nose...[some spinal nerve visualization stuff]... [[EDIT: Missed this the first time I read it.] Continue with siddhasana, sambhavi, mulabandha, kechari, etc.] Some uddiyana (slightly pulling in of the abdomen) can be done also during spinal bastrika...With comfort established for two minutes of practice, after a week or two, spinal bastrika can be taken to three minutes, and eventually to five minutes, if desired. Spinal bastrika is very powerful in longer doses, so keep that (and the delayed effect) in mind as your experience advances. &lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;It seems that what I&amp;#039;m doing is more like b(h?)astrika, without the visualization. But, there is still this subtlety: it&amp;#039;s possible to exhale forcefully and inhale gently-but-fast, or exhale forcefully and inhale forcefully. To me the former is more bellows-like but I&amp;#039;m not sure which is intended, or whether they&amp;#039;re the same. I think I do the former most of the time due to ease, but my technique is a little sloppy and there&amp;#039;s some shifting around.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;EDIT&lt;br /&gt;However, as far as I understand theese practices, they develop a lot of energies, and they are effective if you can use theese energies for some purpose, i.e. removing some particoular energy blockage; so, if you know why you want to do theese things, you can also do some targeted stuff like deciding what kind of bhanda to use, where and how to put you attention, and stuff like that.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Any specific suggestions?</description> <pubDate>Wed, 19 Jun 2013 15:01:29 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407671</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-19T15:01:29Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407520</link> <description>2 minutes, not more than 3 (I&amp;#039;m just a beginner who has tapped jhanic territory only through energy practices). After that, I tried once again the hyperventilation but for a couple of minutes only, and effect was weaker.</description> <pubDate>Wed, 19 Jun 2013 14:08:28 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407520</guid> <dc:creator>Pablo . P</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-19T14:08:28Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407482</link> <description>About pranayama, I&amp;#039;ve red something by Van Lysebeth that, basically, said that if you really are doing thinghs wrong you are going to feel really bad for 1-2 days, but it will get together quickly after the fact with no further side-effects.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If you have not done it yet, you might try to take a look at the &lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;aypsite&amp;#x2e;org&amp;#x2f;MainDirectory&amp;#x2e;html"&gt;AYP site&lt;/a&gt;, you can find quite a lot of useful information there...&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Bye!&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;EDIT&lt;br /&gt;However, as far as I understand theese practices, they develop a lot of energies, and they are effective if you can use theese energies for some purpose, i.e. removing some particoular energy blockage; so, if you know why you want to do theese things, you can also do some targeted stuff like deciding what kind of bhanda to use, where and how to put you attention, and stuff like that.</description> <pubDate>Wed, 19 Jun 2013 13:44:56 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407482</guid> <dc:creator>Mario Nistri</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-19T13:44:56Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407470</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;Pablo . P:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt; When I stopped, there was no need of breathing &lt;strong&gt;for a long time, and I entered into a kind of jhanic state.&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;How many minutes after stopping did this effect continue for?</description> <pubDate>Wed, 19 Jun 2013 13:24:11 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407470</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-19T13:24:11Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>pranayama questions</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407465</link> <description>So I have recently been experimenting with hyperventilation to see if it has any beneficial effects. It seems to be quite relaxing after-the-fact. And the more I practice it, the less side effects (choking sensations etc.) I get, and the quicker they go away.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I see that there are perhaps three pranayama techniques which are similar to what I&amp;#039;m doing, namely Kapalbhati, Bhastrika, and Breath of Fire (or maybe the latter is one of the former two?). I don&amp;#039;t understand what the difference between these are so I&amp;#039;m not sure which of them I&amp;#039;m actually performing. Also, I&amp;#039;m not sure for how long they should be performed or whether there are any real contraindications or anything like that. And more generally, I don&amp;#039;t know anything about whether they can be modified in any way via physical postures for good purposes (for example, today I tried contracting the muscles around my perineum while hypeventilating, and the effect was different, with more mental silence, but I haven&amp;#039;t seen any references to doing this online).&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Any knowledgeable people here? Or does anyone have a good, thorough, practical guide to pranayama practices that they could recommend? (Too bad Omega Point isn&amp;#039;t around, he seems like he could help.)</description> <pubDate>Wed, 19 Jun 2013 13:19:54 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407465</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-19T13:19:54Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407462</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;End in Sight:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;I recently discovered that about 5 minutes of hyperventilation (on the order of 30 breaths / min) will cause some kind of indistinct change in consciousness along with a sense of choking while hyperventilating, and then a significant relaxation that lasts for at least an hour once normal breathing restarts. The relaxation is significant enough that, while sitting still, I catch myself simply not needing to breath for an interval here or there---presumably this is from relaxation leading to a hypometabolic state and not from a lack of CO2 because it happens long after normal breathing has restarted (say, after 20 minutes or more). This relaxation seems very useful for meditation.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Am I rediscovering some kind of pranayama technique? Are there more nuanced approaches to this that have been studied in the worlds of yoga or Tibetan Buddhism or wherever? Anyone tried this?&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I tried the hyperventilation for around 10 minutes at the end of my hour long sit. Did fast and shallow breathings, about 60 per minute. Never felt a sense of choking and the mild discomfort vanished in a couple of minutes. Later on I felt the (paradoxical) relaxation of the diaphragm and upper abs. When I stopped, there was no need of breathing for a long time, and I entered into a kind of jhanic state. The relaxation didn&amp;#039;t last long off cushion though. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I&amp;#039;ll add this to my practice, as tension in that area has been a major problem for me. I&amp;#039;ll post any results.</description> <pubDate>Wed, 19 Jun 2013 13:18:50 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4407462</guid> <dc:creator>Pablo . P</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-19T13:18:50Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4400508</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;A D R:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Saw a clip of this movie once...the guy starting at about 39:45 does some pretty interesting stuff with breathing&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;youtube&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;watch&amp;#x3f;v&amp;#x3d;dOk0tZHwCs4"&gt;The Yogis of Tibet (2002)&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;At the beginning I asked myself, &amp;#034;what are those mats for?&amp;#034; &lt;img alt="emoticon" src="http://www.dharmaoverground.org/dho-theme/images/emoticons/big_grin.gif" &gt;</description> <pubDate>Mon, 17 Jun 2013 12:33:39 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4400508</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-17T12:33:39Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4399551</link> <description>Seems similar to the technique used to set breath holding records. (look around the 6:50 mark)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="https&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;youtube&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;watch&amp;#x3f;v&amp;#x3d;XFnGhrC_3Gs&amp;#x26;feature&amp;#x3d;youtube_gdata"&gt;https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFnGhrC_3Gs&amp;amp;feature=youtube_gdata&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;As for how this relates to enlightenment, breathing is used in tantra practice to manipulate the prana / rlung. Which allows for more subtle forms of mental activity to be dissolved than is possible with Vipassana.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I am not so sure how effective hyper ventilating is for that purpose thought.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Here is a good article contrasting, Vipassana, Mahamudra and Dzogchen...&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;berzinarchives&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;web&amp;#x2f;en&amp;#x2f;archives&amp;#x2f;advanced&amp;#x2f;dzogchen&amp;#x2f;basic_points&amp;#x2f;introduction_dzogchen&amp;#x2e;html"&gt;http://www.berzinarchives.com/web/en/archives/advanced/dzogchen/basic_points/introduction_dzogchen.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;From the article...&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Both mahamudra and dzogchen deal with the subtlest level of mental activity, mahamudra accesses it by dissolving the energy-winds and the grosser levels of mental activity, whereas dzogchen accesses it by recognizing it within the grosser levels, namely sem.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;An example of rlung problem is the center line chakra disturbances can become very unsubtle after enlightenment for many people. Some very simple breathing exercises can dissolve that quite a bit in my experience..&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Also some of the esoteric practices can be quite physically dangerous from what I have heard, and should be conducted with the guidance of qualified master. Then again I am just a novice at this stuff, so take what I say with a grain of salt.</description> <pubDate>Mon, 17 Jun 2013 04:18:53 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4399551</guid> <dc:creator>(D Z) Dhru Val</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-17T04:18:53Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4399112</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;A D R:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Saw a clip of this movie once...the guy starting at about 39:45 does some pretty interesting stuff with breathing&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;youtube&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;watch&amp;#x3f;v&amp;#x3d;dOk0tZHwCs4"&gt;The Yogis of Tibet (2002)&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I just watched the whole clip, my idea of hardcore Dharma has been revised. That breathing technique was interesting.</description> <pubDate>Mon, 17 Jun 2013 02:01:56 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4399112</guid> <dc:creator>C P M</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-17T02:01:56Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4398960</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;. Jake .:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;End in Sight:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Jake, in your experiences with HB, for how long did you need to hyperventilate for a significant altered state to ensue?&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Hmm good question. The first time it took a few minutes. Subsequently it was pretty quick. I h a ve to say though like psychedelics Holotropic can induce an unpredicable variety of experiences fr o m enhanced &amp;#034;normal&amp;#034; clairity to far out stuff. When i&amp;#039;m on a regular computer again i&amp;#039;ll give a more detailed account.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Looking forward to reading it!</description> <pubDate>Mon, 17 Jun 2013 01:22:01 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4398960</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-17T01:22:01Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4398956</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;A D R:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;End in Sight:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Jake, in your experiences with HB, for how long did you need to hyperventilate for a significant altered state to ensue?&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Why are you trying to get into altered states? Just thought I would ask.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I did hyperventilation for 15 minutes and nothing particularly striking happened mentally, so I wondered if I should expect something different if I extend it to 30 minutes or an hour, or if it would be more of the same. I&amp;#039;m mostly curious about different experiences with hyperventilation, since I just discovered it and don&amp;#039;t really know what might be expected to happen if I practice it, or what kinds of experiences other people have with it.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Having said that, if hyperventilation could lead to a significant altered state, it could be useful for something, depending on what kind of altered state it was. So I&amp;#039;d be interested in seeing it.</description> <pubDate>Mon, 17 Jun 2013 01:18:48 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4398956</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-17T01:18:48Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4398283</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;End in Sight:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Jake, in your experiences with HB, for how long did you need to hyperventilate for a significant altered state to ensue?&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Hmm good question. The first time it took a few minutes. Subsequently it was pretty quick. I h a ve to say though like psychedelics Holotropic can induce an unpredicable variety of experiences fr o m enhanced &amp;#034;normal&amp;#034; clairity to far out stuff. When i&amp;#039;m on a regular computer again i&amp;#039;ll give a more detailed account.</description> <pubDate>Sun, 16 Jun 2013 22:57:29 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4398283</guid> <dc:creator>. Jake .</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-16T22:57:29Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4397999</link> <description>Saw a clip of this movie once...the guy starting at about 39:45 does some pretty interesting stuff with breathing&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;youtube&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;watch&amp;#x3f;v&amp;#x3d;dOk0tZHwCs4"&gt;The Yogis of Tibet (2002)&lt;/a&gt;</description> <pubDate>Sun, 16 Jun 2013 21:14:23 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4397999</guid> <dc:creator>Adam Dietrich Ringle</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-16T21:14:23Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4397937</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;End in Sight:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Pablo, why don&amp;#039;t you practice it anymore, and what did you get out of it when you did?&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;IMO, the short answer is that these practices leads to a &amp;#034;fake enlightenment&amp;#034;, with a high standard of concentration, health and even siddhis in daily life ***, but that fades gradually once you stop doing the exercises. I read that from at least two long time practitioners. Of course, this might not be the case if you&amp;#039;re already enlightened before trying them. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Otherwise, it would be interesting to know how these tummo/kundalini practices could be placed in the insight/samatha map. One wild speculation is that they are a clever method to lengthen and strengthen the A&amp;amp;P peak. Other, that with the energy pipes cleaning up through breath retention, you can skip DN and jump to EQ. As an anecdote, if you&amp;#039;re standing up in a fetal position and you inhale expanding your lower-back and hold your breath, all thoughts vanish completely until you exhale.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;*** I did that qigong for a few months and so had little results, my experience cannot be taken as relevant</description> <pubDate>Sun, 16 Jun 2013 21:05:43 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4397937</guid> <dc:creator>Pablo . P</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-16T21:05:43Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4397934</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;End in Sight:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Jake, in your experiences with HB, for how long did you need to hyperventilate for a significant altered state to ensue?&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Why are you trying to get into altered states? Just thought I would ask.</description> <pubDate>Sun, 16 Jun 2013 21:04:13 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4397934</guid> <dc:creator>Adam Dietrich Ringle</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-16T21:04:13Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4397406</link> <description>Jake, in your experiences with HB, for how long did you need to hyperventilate for a significant altered state to ensue?</description> <pubDate>Sun, 16 Jun 2013 16:59:15 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4397406</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-16T16:59:15Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4397135</link> <description>EIS you might look into holotropic breathwork. The technique is to simply pump as much air through your system as possible as fast as possible. There are other aspects to it having to do with set and setting. Stan Grof, a psychiatrist who studied psychedelics while that was legal, developed holotropic breathwork as a substitue for those substances when they no longer were. In my experience the effect is comparable to psychedelics in many ways.</description> <pubDate>Sun, 16 Jun 2013 15:26:48 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4397135</guid> <dc:creator>. Jake .</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-16T15:26:48Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4396954</link> <description>I realized that I was previously doing ~50 breaths / minute, not 30. And by &amp;#034;breaths&amp;#034; I mean full inhale-exhale cycles.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Just now I tried to do kundalini fire-breathing, but my abdomen muscles couldn&amp;#039;t keep up the pumping for more than 2 minutes, so I basically did 120 shallow breaths / minute for 15 minutes. After 5 minutes the choking sensation and the desire to stop seemed to go away and I was left in an indistinct altered state, but somewhat relaxed. After the exercise ended (right now), I am really relaxed. No heat effects that I could notice except that now that I&amp;#039;ve stopped, I&amp;#039;m feeling colder.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I might make up a little morning pranayama routine like this:&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;n minutes hyperventilation&lt;br /&gt;15 minutes ujjayi breathing&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;where n is TBD based on further experiments. So far the relaxation after hyperventilation has been really strong and it lasts a long time. I said &amp;#034;at least an hour&amp;#034; but I thought about it further and would have to update that to &amp;#034;at least five hours&amp;#034;. Maybe even longer!</description> <pubDate>Sun, 16 Jun 2013 12:05:31 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4396954</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-16T12:05:31Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395596</link> <description>Well, Omega Point has written alot about these things. If you trust me to summarize without providing quotes I will do that to save myself some time... the quotes which i am pretty sure would back up my summary are spread out and hidden in a lot of wordy writing.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Heat yoga (of which kundalini fire breathing is a variety) develops one&amp;#039;s mastery over &amp;#034;fabrications.&amp;#034; Which seems to refer to both willed experiences, and interpretational overlays on top of reality (though maybe these are the same thing according to some of his writings). He has also suggested that heat yoga is of a different category of practice than non-meditation which he says is the way to the end of suffering. Heat yoga and other practices which develop mastery over fabrication can go above and beyond the personal end of suffering...&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;So i guess kundalini fire breathing will help you develop your capacity to interpret/will experiences into being however you see fit, and will contribute to the end of your personal suffering by helping you develop a capacity not to interpret reality as suffering.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;As for standing alone he suggests one practice non-meditation when not formally doing this practice, and that either you can just do this formally or do other yogas as well. As for what will happen if you do it for 30 minutes i dont know. He did talk about practicing heat yoga for long periods in some places so I think it is intended that you do it for more than 5 minutes.</description> <pubDate>Sat, 15 Jun 2013 23:08:19 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395596</guid> <dc:creator>Adam . .</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-15T23:08:19Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395477</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;End in Sight:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Am I rediscovering some kind of pranayama technique? Are there more nuanced approaches to this that have been studied in the worlds of yoga or Tibetan Buddhism or wherever? Anyone tried this?&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;You may be interested in &lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;www&amp;#x2e;dharmaoverground&amp;#x2e;org&amp;#x2f;web&amp;#x2f;guest&amp;#x2f;discussion&amp;#x2f;-&amp;#x2f;message_boards&amp;#x2f;message&amp;#x2f;2297855"&gt;bamboo breathing&lt;/a&gt;. It&amp;#039;s been almost 25 years since I tried it, and it wasn&amp;#039;t very effective for me then, but it seems like a related technique.</description> <pubDate>Sat, 15 Jun 2013 22:32:41 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395477</guid> <dc:creator>fivebells .</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-15T22:32:41Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395398</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;End in Sight:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Why wouldn&amp;#039;t you recommend it in terms of formal practice? Is there some downside that you noticed?&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I guess it doesn&amp;#039;t seem ideal? Maybe that is a bad reason. It has always been kind of a last resort type thing for me in my toolbox because I am not sure how healthy it is. Usually when I did it I wouldn&amp;#039;t do it for just a few seconds and realize that I was holding on to something, pushing something away, etc.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;There have also been times where I did this technique where I feel I was misusing it. So idk. But it has helped, don&amp;#039;t get me wrong.</description> <pubDate>Sat, 15 Jun 2013 22:14:23 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395398</guid> <dc:creator>Adam Dietrich Ringle</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-15T22:14:23Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395316</link> <description>Pablo, why don&amp;#039;t you practice it anymore, and what did you get out of it when you did?</description> <pubDate>Sat, 15 Jun 2013 22:02:17 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395316</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-15T22:02:17Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395313</link> <description>Why wouldn&amp;#039;t you recommend it in terms of formal practice? Is there some downside that you noticed?</description> <pubDate>Sat, 15 Jun 2013 22:01:50 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395313</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-15T22:01:50Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395268</link> <description>I have done this quite a bit actually, usually in the context of freaking out about death and my lack of knowledge of the subject. I would just lock into a fast, shallow pant until I felt my body processes slowly down and I could get back into a flow where my breath was really feint. Its not something I would recommend in terms of formal practice, just something I stumbled upon that helped me get through hard times. This may not be what you are talking about though.</description> <pubDate>Sat, 15 Jun 2013 21:48:34 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395268</guid> <dc:creator>Adam Dietrich Ringle</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-15T21:48:34Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395234</link> <description>This isn&amp;#039;t actually hyperventilation, but a related practice, where for example you inhale 100% then exhale 50%, inhale 100% exhale 30%, inhale 100% exhale 10%, inhale 100% exhale 100%. Its a taoist soft version of tummo, called &lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;thetaobums&amp;#x2e;com&amp;#x2f;topic&amp;#x2f;12639-flying-phoenix-chi-kung&amp;#x2f;page-9"&gt;Flying Phoenix Qigong&lt;/a&gt;. In the link (post # 138) you&amp;#039;ll see the description of the inhale/exhale patterns but not the body movements. I can lend you the DVDs if you want to try it out. I no longer practice this qigong.</description> <pubDate>Sat, 15 Jun 2013 21:34:41 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395234</guid> <dc:creator>Pablo . P</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-15T21:34:41Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395095</link> <description>Interesting, thanks. When I tried hyperventilation, it was with deep inhales &amp;amp; exhales; I&amp;#039;ll try Omega Point&amp;#039;s shallow way and see what the difference is.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I couldn&amp;#039;t find any explanation of what that technique is for, except perhaps as something to alternate with breath-holding. Did I miss something? Is it supposed to stand alone? I have questions like: what would happen if I did it for 30 minutes?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;BTW, I read that hyperventilation may cause panic attacks in some people. So it might not be a benign technique for everyone.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote-title"&gt;http://www.psy-journal.com/article/S0165-1781%2801%2900335-3/abstract:&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Our aim was to determine whether panic disorder (PD) patients, major depressive patients without panic attacks (MD) and major depressive patients with panic attacks (MDP) respond similarly to hyperventilation challenge tests. We randomly selected 35 PD patients, 33 MDP patients, 27 MD patients and 30 normal volunteers with no family history of anxiety or mood disorder. The patients had not been treated with psychotropic drugs for at least 1 week. They were induced to hyperventilate (30 breaths/min) for 4 min, and anxiety was assessed before and after the test. &lt;strong&gt;A total of 16 (45.7%) PD patients, 12 (36.4%) MDP patients, four (11.1%) MD patients, and two (6.7%) normal volunteers had a panic attack after hyperventilating.&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description> <pubDate>Sat, 15 Jun 2013 21:03:40 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4395095</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-15T21:03:40Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4394961</link> <description>Omega point mentioned this in his thread &lt;a href="http&amp;#x3a;&amp;#x2f;&amp;#x2f;dharmaoverground&amp;#x2e;org&amp;#x2f;web&amp;#x2f;guest&amp;#x2f;discussion&amp;#x2f;-&amp;#x2f;message_boards&amp;#x2f;message&amp;#x2f;4200127"&gt;http://dharmaoverground.org/web/guest/discussion/-/message_boards/message/4200127&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;Example(kundalini fire-breathing): Rapidly breathe in and out in an extremely shallow manner. Bellowing the belly with each breath. Occasionally bring your focus to the sensory related to the breath going in and out of the nostrils. (Fabricating the sensory as if the breath were going in and out of the nostrils manipulates the flow of the breath.) There are many minor, unique, and irrelevant aspects to this specific posture.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description> <pubDate>Sat, 15 Jun 2013 20:45:45 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4394961</guid> <dc:creator>Adam . .</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-15T20:45:45Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>benefits of hyperventilation?</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4394917</link> <description>I recently discovered that about 5 minutes of hyperventilation (on the order of 30 breaths / min) will cause some kind of indistinct change in consciousness along with a sense of choking while hyperventilating, and then a significant relaxation that lasts for at least an hour once normal breathing restarts. The relaxation is significant enough that, while sitting still, I catch myself simply not needing to breath for an interval here or there---presumably this is from relaxation leading to a hypometabolic state and not from a lack of CO2 because it happens long after normal breathing has restarted (say, after 20 minutes or more). This relaxation seems very useful for meditation.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Am I rediscovering some kind of pranayama technique? Are there more nuanced approaches to this that have been studied in the worlds of yoga or Tibetan Buddhism or wherever? Anyone tried this?</description> <pubDate>Sat, 15 Jun 2013 20:42:23 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4394917</guid> <dc:creator>End in Sight</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-06-15T20:42:23Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Yoga and Vipassana</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4323090</link> <description>(You had a post in the winter to Cedric (in his menstrual cycle thread) that spoke to me and still does: broad/unconditional high regard, enjoying social loads (not your words exactly) versus formerly being exhausted by social stuff, a bit about how this affects your family life. Belated thanks to you, too, Ona. )</description> <pubDate>Mon, 20 May 2013 02:28:54 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4323090</guid> <dc:creator>katy steger</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-05-20T02:28:54Z</dc:date> </item> <item> <title>RE: Yoga and Vipassana</title> <link>http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4322502</link> <description>&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;According to Goenkaji, the natural breath penetrates at the deepest level of the subconscious mind. This is why our moods/emotions are reflected in our breath pattern. When we control our breath, we are creating an artificial mental state on the surface level while ignoring the problem at the root level. &lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt; I love this comment. It is so instructive to me to see if I can bring the mind to the breath without manipulation and without sluggishness. I cannot think of a simpler, more comprehensive, more soothing mental practice. If I can time this exercise significantly after and before meals at the end and beginning of the day, a hugely practical aid has been performed.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div class="quote"&gt;&lt;div class="quote-content"&gt;This is why I&amp;#039;m looking at Yoga. I feel that the slightly mood stimulating effect of Yoga will keep me hooked.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;Yeah, I&amp;#039;m hooked, too, love that it&amp;#039;s become so mainstream in the west: great stretching (and mitigation of tension) and great strengthening and great sati (smriti, mindfulness, dristi/ditthi). Again, if I can time the exercise significantly after and before meals at the end and beginning of the day, a hugely practical aid has been performed.</description> <pubDate>Sun, 19 May 2013 22:13:41 GMT</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dharmaoverground.org/c/message_boards/find_message?p_l_id=&amp;messageId=4322502</guid> <dc:creator>katy steger</dc:creator> <dc:date>2013-05-19T22:13:41Z</dc:date> </item> </channel> </rss> 