Awareness Watching Awareness - Discussion
Awareness Watching Awareness
Moment , modificat fa 11 anys at 03/03/13 16:36
Created 11 anys ago at 03/03/13 16:22
Awareness Watching Awareness
Apunts: 2 Data d'incorporació: 22/01/13 Publicacions recents
Hello!
[sorry for the grammar mistakes, english is not my native]
I'm a total beginner in meditation, I'm also total fail at persistence and regularity.
I started to meditate probably around 7 years ago (now I'm 24), but still it's hard for me to sit still for 20 minutes a day, despite a long periods of free time. I'm successful maybe 2 times per month. Most of the times I don't even start.
I probably have self-diagnosed 'light' ADHD-I , but the doctor says I'm ok.
My mind wanders constantly, as I wrote here Truth Strike forums and I got banned for that post.
Sooo... that was my introduction, and now the main subject of this thread - Awareness Watching Awareness technique
- are you familiar with it?
instruction:
http://albigen.com/uarelove/most_rapid/chapter07.aspx
and here's full site
http://albigen.com/uarelove/
Here are my 'colorized' and for sure immature reflections about it:
Generally speaking, this simple RECURSIVE techique can do magic with your consciousness, literally widening field of your awareness.
The room you're in right now is part of your awareness. You must to have a map of it in your mind to know which way is the toilet. But most of the time you are unconcious of the fact that the room, the surroundings are mapped in your awareness.
The same with senses, feelings, pain, pleasure. It's all encoded in the spectrum of your awareness. But the curious thing is that this awareness is not really yours. 'Belong' is just a concept.
Awareness 'can' be aware (nope, it can't be aware. awareness just is. I just 'personified' the awareness because it's easier to explain like that) and 'must' be aware simply of everything this mind is experiencing, and among all those 'things' is your person, persona, psyche, character, ego, self, soul, you.
You can experience yourself, but only INDIRECTLY. You cannot directly experience yourself, it's impossible.
You can experience yourself only through the agency of the awareness. Actually, that's not true also.
'You' exist as a part of the full spectrum of an actual experience. And on the surface of awareness you are a tool. Tool. Function. Important one, of course. But only a tool. Flesh, bones and electric current.
But I've lost my train of thought.
Anyway, the technique can be called a form of meditation in which you're focusing on being aware of being aware.
As you practise, your gonna be more and more conscious of the things you are aware of.
The first goal is to get enlightened (and getting 'enlightened' for me is to really notice the 'characteristic' of out reality called 'Anatta').
I suppose 1 year of daily 30min practice is enough, hopefully.
Correct me if I'm wrong in all of this, because I obviously may be
I'm totally tangled with my thoughts, I would appreciate any help.
[sorry for the grammar mistakes, english is not my native]
I'm a total beginner in meditation, I'm also total fail at persistence and regularity.
I started to meditate probably around 7 years ago (now I'm 24), but still it's hard for me to sit still for 20 minutes a day, despite a long periods of free time. I'm successful maybe 2 times per month. Most of the times I don't even start.
I probably have self-diagnosed 'light' ADHD-I , but the doctor says I'm ok.
My mind wanders constantly, as I wrote here Truth Strike forums and I got banned for that post.
Sooo... that was my introduction, and now the main subject of this thread - Awareness Watching Awareness technique
- are you familiar with it?
instruction:
http://albigen.com/uarelove/most_rapid/chapter07.aspx
and here's full site
http://albigen.com/uarelove/
Here are my 'colorized' and for sure immature reflections about it:
Generally speaking, this simple RECURSIVE techique can do magic with your consciousness, literally widening field of your awareness.
The room you're in right now is part of your awareness. You must to have a map of it in your mind to know which way is the toilet. But most of the time you are unconcious of the fact that the room, the surroundings are mapped in your awareness.
The same with senses, feelings, pain, pleasure. It's all encoded in the spectrum of your awareness. But the curious thing is that this awareness is not really yours. 'Belong' is just a concept.
Awareness 'can' be aware (nope, it can't be aware. awareness just is. I just 'personified' the awareness because it's easier to explain like that) and 'must' be aware simply of everything this mind is experiencing, and among all those 'things' is your person, persona, psyche, character, ego, self, soul, you.
You can experience yourself, but only INDIRECTLY. You cannot directly experience yourself, it's impossible.
You can experience yourself only through the agency of the awareness. Actually, that's not true also.
'You' exist as a part of the full spectrum of an actual experience. And on the surface of awareness you are a tool. Tool. Function. Important one, of course. But only a tool. Flesh, bones and electric current.
But I've lost my train of thought.
Anyway, the technique can be called a form of meditation in which you're focusing on being aware of being aware.
As you practise, your gonna be more and more conscious of the things you are aware of.
The first goal is to get enlightened (and getting 'enlightened' for me is to really notice the 'characteristic' of out reality called 'Anatta').
I suppose 1 year of daily 30min practice is enough, hopefully.
Correct me if I'm wrong in all of this, because I obviously may be
I'm totally tangled with my thoughts, I would appreciate any help.
Adam , modificat fa 11 anys at 03/03/13 16:42
Created 11 anys ago at 03/03/13 16:42
RE: Awareness Watching Awareness
Apunts: 613 Data d'incorporació: 20/03/12 Publicacions recents
So many ideas about all this, they won't do you any good. I promise! I know just where you are coming from. I think what you really have to do is practice with a huge emphasis on seeing thought - particularly doubt - as thought. Just note "doubt" "thinking" "speculating" whenever these things pull you away from whatever technique you do. If I had to recommend a technique i'd say breath or body awareness.
I think maybe you want people to tell you you've got a problem or something, you don't have any intrinsic problems and you know this to be the case, you just have to train your mind. If you are really sincere then just get serious and practice.
I think maybe you want people to tell you you've got a problem or something, you don't have any intrinsic problems and you know this to be the case, you just have to train your mind. If you are really sincere then just get serious and practice.
Richard Zen, modificat fa 11 anys at 03/03/13 23:16
Created 11 anys ago at 03/03/13 23:12
RE: Awareness Watching Awareness
Apunts: 1665 Data d'incorporació: 18/05/10 Publicacions recents
The best students who want to develop concentration (mind watching mind or just watching the breath) will refrain from bashing themselves for having poor concentration. As soon as your mind wanders (it will and that's okay) just acknowledge with a "Yes" or "Un-huh" that your mind has wandered and without any analysis or self-bashing just get back to the breath ASAP. I cannot stress this enough. The students who do best at concentration of any kind go back to the object ASAP. You'll also get more out of your sits because your mind will wander through less of the time period. I started out counting the breath when my concentration was poor (and it was really poor ), and I would count "just" for the in breath, and "one" for the out breath, "just, two", etc, and keep counting up to 10 and then go backwards back to one. If I lost my place and counted 11, 12, 13 I would start again without commentary or self-bashing. If I lost my place before 10 I would start over again. As you get better the counting will only be needed a short time before you can just stay with the bare sensate experience of the breath. You have to let go of expectations and let the practice improve naturally over the months from repeated good practice. Make sure before you start you relax your facial muscles and body muscles. Make sure you don't manipulate your breath (it's hard at first). If the breath is long or short that's okay, whatever it is. The goal is to see what actually happens instead of being caught up in content or self-narratives.
I did this practice and used the instructions you posted, (considered second gear by KFD), and it works well. Good luck!
EDIT: Also try and create an organization method for your day. If you have too many chores or responsbilities that are left undone because of practice it will interfere with your practice. Put responsbiliites behind you so the meditation has a better chance of succeeding.
I did this practice and used the instructions you posted, (considered second gear by KFD), and it works well. Good luck!
EDIT: Also try and create an organization method for your day. If you have too many chores or responsbilities that are left undone because of practice it will interfere with your practice. Put responsbiliites behind you so the meditation has a better chance of succeeding.
An Eternal Now, modificat fa 11 anys at 04/03/13 08:33
Created 11 anys ago at 04/03/13 08:30
RE: Awareness Watching Awareness
Apunts: 638 Data d'incorporació: 15/09/09 Publicacions recents
Actually, Moment ., the instructions is about experiencing Yourself Directly, as Pure Awareness itself.
You have intellectualized it too much. Drop your concepts, drop your thinking, don't go chasing after the stream of thinking and objects but just turn the radiance around and be aware of what is being aware, i.e. awareness itself, awareness aware of itself.
This is not Buddhism, this is Advaita, but it does work and lead to spiritual experience and realization.
You have intellectualized it too much. Drop your concepts, drop your thinking, don't go chasing after the stream of thinking and objects but just turn the radiance around and be aware of what is being aware, i.e. awareness itself, awareness aware of itself.
This is not Buddhism, this is Advaita, but it does work and lead to spiritual experience and realization.
Ian And, modificat fa 11 anys at 04/03/13 09:45
Created 11 anys ago at 04/03/13 09:45
RE: Awareness Watching Awareness
Apunts: 785 Data d'incorporació: 22/08/09 Publicacions recentsRichard Zen:
As soon as your mind wanders (it will and that's okay) just acknowledge with a "Yes" or "Un-huh" that your mind has wandered and without any analysis or self-bashing just get back to the breath ASAP. I cannot stress this enough. The students who do best at concentration of any kind go back to the object ASAP.
Moment:
[sorry for the grammar mistakes, english is not my native]
Hey guys, give this guy a break. Just in case he's unaware, don't use acronyms without explaining their meaning:
ASAP = as soon as possible
Daniel M Ingram, modificat fa 11 anys at 04/03/13 22:40
Created 11 anys ago at 04/03/13 22:40
RE: Awareness Watching Awareness
Apunts: 3286 Data d'incorporació: 20/04/09 Publicacions recents
Some thoughts on this:
Be aware of the tangle of thoughts and related physical sensations as they happen also, as they are also objects to get better at incorporating into the widening field of integrating awakening, of space, of place, of volume, of whole, of everything. Thoughts are an experience, and while they seem to occur in their own space or be somehow separate from the rest, they are a part of this field like everything else and the more we practice noticing them as experiences, the more we wake up to their true nature directly.
As to one year of daily 30 minute practice: the mind is plastic and will wire itself according to conditioning. If you are awake in the conventional sense for, say, 16 hours/day, and for 1/2 of an hour (1/32 of your waking time, about 3%) you really practice being strongly aware, that is not the sort of momentum that for most people will result in major brain changes, though it very well might result in some minor ones.
If you are looking for large changes, major rewiring, devote large percentages of your waking time to awakening, meaning: try practicing being aware of the field of experience, of sensations, of thoughts, of the experience of living, of presence, of mindfulness, of awareness (and any sensations that seem to make up awareness) for as many waking hours as you possibly can while doing everything you ordinarily do.
This being the advice of a confirmed awareness junkie who has through trial and error realized that heavy-duty commitment to this sort of thing brings heavy-duty rewards if done well enough for long enough, and while sometimes we must be patient and struggle through some periods that feel like deserts, yet there are oases and then lakes, then rivers, then oceans and then galactic convergence.
Be aware of the tangle of thoughts and related physical sensations as they happen also, as they are also objects to get better at incorporating into the widening field of integrating awakening, of space, of place, of volume, of whole, of everything. Thoughts are an experience, and while they seem to occur in their own space or be somehow separate from the rest, they are a part of this field like everything else and the more we practice noticing them as experiences, the more we wake up to their true nature directly.
As to one year of daily 30 minute practice: the mind is plastic and will wire itself according to conditioning. If you are awake in the conventional sense for, say, 16 hours/day, and for 1/2 of an hour (1/32 of your waking time, about 3%) you really practice being strongly aware, that is not the sort of momentum that for most people will result in major brain changes, though it very well might result in some minor ones.
If you are looking for large changes, major rewiring, devote large percentages of your waking time to awakening, meaning: try practicing being aware of the field of experience, of sensations, of thoughts, of the experience of living, of presence, of mindfulness, of awareness (and any sensations that seem to make up awareness) for as many waking hours as you possibly can while doing everything you ordinarily do.
This being the advice of a confirmed awareness junkie who has through trial and error realized that heavy-duty commitment to this sort of thing brings heavy-duty rewards if done well enough for long enough, and while sometimes we must be patient and struggle through some periods that feel like deserts, yet there are oases and then lakes, then rivers, then oceans and then galactic convergence.
Moment , modificat fa 11 anys at 07/03/13 15:45
Created 11 anys ago at 07/03/13 15:04
RE: Awareness Watching Awareness
Apunts: 2 Data d'incorporació: 22/01/13 Publicacions recents
Thank you all for the answers!
I started to changing myself - a little bit jogging, and long walks are definitely helping to concentrate.
Still - when I'm doing walking meditation - I can only count to three and then my mind wonders and sometimes when I'm on about 12, I'm waking up and starting from beginning. I got discouraged very quickly and I'm simply forgetting to even start counting my breaths.
My personal achievement is - "mindfully counted to seven" with help of noting technique. but it was only once.
Every other time my record was max. '3'. And I walked with meditative intentions minimum 8 hours.
My attention span is so low It's mindblowing. But sad,
Plus I started to really worry about having a cancer! Gonna see doc ASAP!
As to one year of daily 30 minute practice: the mind is plastic and will wire itself according to conditioning. If you are awake in the conventional sense for, say, 16 hours/day, and for 1/2 of an hour (1/32 of your waking time, about 3%) you really practice being strongly aware, that is not the sort of momentum that for most people will result in major brain changes, though it very well might result in some minor ones.
But my aim is getting 'anatta' or maybe it's not really anatta. I'm talking about seeing 'no self'.
Maybe it's just 'an illusion of seeing no-self'. Whatever.
Some people are claiming that meditation is not needed for that (including LU admins)
Just direct pointing and voila! ...
I stupidly believe that this will help me greately. Just honest investigation with help of some other 'enlightened' character.
Like here:
liberation dialogue
And I am heavy-duty commited to expanding my mind, and in my opinion I suffered enough. Now is the time for holidays.
Don't get me wrong - I want and hopefully I will be 'mindful' most of my waking life soon. But wanting to be mindful, and struggling with all that spiritual garbage made me really mad.
I surrender.
or maybe I just need some good psychedelics
PS.
I was reading one of D.O. topics when there's the question DO HEAVEN AND HELL EXISTZZZZ?
and that came to my mind:
from Letting go of God
What an irony. Crucifixion of Jesus Christ should push people beliefs towards nonexistence of the merciful God, and it's totally upside down.
and here's proof of God:
I started to changing myself - a little bit jogging, and long walks are definitely helping to concentrate.
Still - when I'm doing walking meditation - I can only count to three and then my mind wonders and sometimes when I'm on about 12, I'm waking up and starting from beginning. I got discouraged very quickly and I'm simply forgetting to even start counting my breaths.
My personal achievement is - "mindfully counted to seven" with help of noting technique. but it was only once.
Every other time my record was max. '3'. And I walked with meditative intentions minimum 8 hours.
My attention span is so low It's mindblowing. But sad,
Plus I started to really worry about having a cancer! Gonna see doc ASAP!
As to one year of daily 30 minute practice: the mind is plastic and will wire itself according to conditioning. If you are awake in the conventional sense for, say, 16 hours/day, and for 1/2 of an hour (1/32 of your waking time, about 3%) you really practice being strongly aware, that is not the sort of momentum that for most people will result in major brain changes, though it very well might result in some minor ones.
But my aim is getting 'anatta' or maybe it's not really anatta. I'm talking about seeing 'no self'.
Maybe it's just 'an illusion of seeing no-self'. Whatever.
Some people are claiming that meditation is not needed for that (including LU admins)
Just direct pointing and voila! ...
I stupidly believe that this will help me greately. Just honest investigation with help of some other 'enlightened' character.
Like here:
liberation dialogue
And I am heavy-duty commited to expanding my mind, and in my opinion I suffered enough. Now is the time for holidays.
Don't get me wrong - I want and hopefully I will be 'mindful' most of my waking life soon. But wanting to be mindful, and struggling with all that spiritual garbage made me really mad.
I surrender.
or maybe I just need some good psychedelics
PS.
I was reading one of D.O. topics when there's the question DO HEAVEN AND HELL EXISTZZZZ?
and that came to my mind:
when I looked at Jesus as just a guy, just a human, just this impassioned young idealist who lost his temper a lot, but who could also wax on teary eyed about loving your neighbor and helping the poor, and because his ideas were so outspoken it threatened those in power, who ordered him to be tortured and killed.... And then reading how Jesus died, astonished and heartbroken that his own God abandoned him, his story became so tragic.
from Letting go of God
What an irony. Crucifixion of Jesus Christ should push people beliefs towards nonexistence of the merciful God, and it's totally upside down.
and here's proof of God:
Jack Hatfield, modificat fa 11 anys at 10/03/13 12:52
Created 11 anys ago at 10/03/13 12:52
RE: Awareness Watching Awareness
Apunts: 98 Data d'incorporació: 05/07/10 Publicacions recents
Have you tried a 4 Foundation noting practice? Especially try noting out loud when concentration is lax. If you can keep talking, you are noting. Then when concentration gets stronger, you can drop the talking.
I think some people find this type of concentration easier than trying to concentrate on one object.
I think some people find this type of concentration easier than trying to concentrate on one object.
Dean P, modificat fa 10 anys at 20/03/14 18:17
Created 10 anys ago at 20/03/14 18:17
RE: Awareness Watching Awareness
Apunts: 10 Data d'incorporació: 20/03/14 Publicacions recents
The OP was about a year ago.. how did you go with the AWA practice?
I've been doing this for a few years, and it's a pet of mine.. sometimes I'll leave it and return as well. It really does work, though needs to be done (as others have indicated) for more than just 20-30 mins per day. Even the author of it (in the "Bliss" book) advises to do the practice for as many hours as possible, and to clear away as much unnecessary time commitments as possible.
Bear in mind also, that the actual descriptions for the AWA exercises are pointers themselves. I've often come across people taking the pointers as theological/philosophical truths, which they are not. We know on an ultimate level there is no "you" attempting to 'watch your awareness', likewise nobody owns their little 'awarenesses'.. however, when the descriptions are read in every day context and simply applied, they work in directing the mind onto awareness only, while dis-identifying with thought, feeling, body, etc.
I've been doing this for a few years, and it's a pet of mine.. sometimes I'll leave it and return as well. It really does work, though needs to be done (as others have indicated) for more than just 20-30 mins per day. Even the author of it (in the "Bliss" book) advises to do the practice for as many hours as possible, and to clear away as much unnecessary time commitments as possible.
Bear in mind also, that the actual descriptions for the AWA exercises are pointers themselves. I've often come across people taking the pointers as theological/philosophical truths, which they are not. We know on an ultimate level there is no "you" attempting to 'watch your awareness', likewise nobody owns their little 'awarenesses'.. however, when the descriptions are read in every day context and simply applied, they work in directing the mind onto awareness only, while dis-identifying with thought, feeling, body, etc.