Some things I've found helpful lately - Discussion
Some things I've found helpful lately
Drew Miller, modificat fa 10 anys at 05/02/14 18:35
Created 10 anys ago at 05/02/14 12:41
Some things I've found helpful lately
Apunts: 61 Data d'incorporació: 22/11/13 Publicacions recents
Hello,
First some background on my practice. I have had a formal meditation practice for the past 10 years. I started in the Goenka (Saya Gyi U Ba Khin) tradition and have done a handful of Goenka vipassana retreats. Over the past 4 years I have been practicing a combination of noting practice and body scanning practices after having read Daniel Ingram's book. I have noticed significant progress since incorporating noting practices and in 2011 may have reached stream entry, although this is uncertain. Since that time I have noticed a significant shift in my awareness (e.g. noticing impermanence in the experiencial, sensate field, is effortless; cycling through A & P; Dark Night; Equanimity, increased ease of practice in general, decrease sense of solid observer, etc.) although have not noticed repeated fruitions which makes me question if I have reached stream entry or if prior supposed fruitions (2 previous) were actually A & P phenomena. I'm not terribly concerned with where I am at on the maps, just going to keep practicing because its useful.
The other day I realized that I have not been attending to sensations of "ease" and "effortlessness" and have been intentionally attending to these sensations which has significantly increased concentration/calm which I think I was neglecting in my practice before (perhaps not understanding the importance of these sensations and awareness of them being synonymous with calm/concentration) and felt like I floundered in Dark Night and general unpleasantness frequently. I have noticed that even during times when struggle, pain, or other unpleasant sensations are present, that there is a falling away of these sensations and there is always "ease" "effortlessness" and general peace as these unpleasant sensations fall away at a rapid frequency. This has been very helpful for my practice and life in general. Below are the thoughts I wrote down after the formal practice in which I realized this for myself, which seemed significant to me, but I'm curious about other's thoughts on this.
"So, its amazing how easy it is when you attend to how easy and effortless everything is all the time. Trusting the natural process. Concentration is really just surrender and is also loving kindness. It is the practice that liberates. I dont know that any other practice is needed at this point. The breath is a useful object because it is naturally effortless. Love is effortless and easy. The breath has the love quality in it."
Anyway, just thought I'd share. If you have thoughts that may help to expand on these or guide me that would be great.
Metta,
Drew
First some background on my practice. I have had a formal meditation practice for the past 10 years. I started in the Goenka (Saya Gyi U Ba Khin) tradition and have done a handful of Goenka vipassana retreats. Over the past 4 years I have been practicing a combination of noting practice and body scanning practices after having read Daniel Ingram's book. I have noticed significant progress since incorporating noting practices and in 2011 may have reached stream entry, although this is uncertain. Since that time I have noticed a significant shift in my awareness (e.g. noticing impermanence in the experiencial, sensate field, is effortless; cycling through A & P; Dark Night; Equanimity, increased ease of practice in general, decrease sense of solid observer, etc.) although have not noticed repeated fruitions which makes me question if I have reached stream entry or if prior supposed fruitions (2 previous) were actually A & P phenomena. I'm not terribly concerned with where I am at on the maps, just going to keep practicing because its useful.
The other day I realized that I have not been attending to sensations of "ease" and "effortlessness" and have been intentionally attending to these sensations which has significantly increased concentration/calm which I think I was neglecting in my practice before (perhaps not understanding the importance of these sensations and awareness of them being synonymous with calm/concentration) and felt like I floundered in Dark Night and general unpleasantness frequently. I have noticed that even during times when struggle, pain, or other unpleasant sensations are present, that there is a falling away of these sensations and there is always "ease" "effortlessness" and general peace as these unpleasant sensations fall away at a rapid frequency. This has been very helpful for my practice and life in general. Below are the thoughts I wrote down after the formal practice in which I realized this for myself, which seemed significant to me, but I'm curious about other's thoughts on this.
"So, its amazing how easy it is when you attend to how easy and effortless everything is all the time. Trusting the natural process. Concentration is really just surrender and is also loving kindness. It is the practice that liberates. I dont know that any other practice is needed at this point. The breath is a useful object because it is naturally effortless. Love is effortless and easy. The breath has the love quality in it."
Anyway, just thought I'd share. If you have thoughts that may help to expand on these or guide me that would be great.
Metta,
Drew
tom moylan, modificat fa 10 anys at 06/02/14 05:15
Created 10 anys ago at 06/02/14 05:15
RE: Some things I've found helpful lately
Apunts: 896 Data d'incorporació: 07/03/11 Publicacions recents
Hi Drew,
I too have been at this for some time now and do not claim even stream entry as defined by "obvious cessation" followed by "automatic cycling".
I have spent much time in the DN but cannot definitively say that I have broken throught the equanimity stages to fruition. Its possible that I have but I still feel that my 'self' is too strong and apparent according to the classic descriptions.
That said, your description of finding the ease and calmness is something I have noticed in my consistent practice in the last several months. I have felt this before but it seems more solid this time and more reliable. I believe it to be equanimity due to the tingly, effervescent nature of my sits. It is also very pleasant most of the time and I can climb up to this point very quickly when I sit down to practice.
Recently I have been working on the "release" aspect of things. There are sensations within my skull which I tend to feel as pleasant but which, if followed (grasped onto) lead to 'dead ends' of pressure. When I notice these I "release" them, averting my attention from them. This leads quickly to a deepening of calm and tranquillity and concentration.
Everything seems just fine at that point and one feels the tendency to linger there but it is probably better to look for subtler things.
I've also been practising releasing my tendency to analyse everything but I really can't say if this is productive or not at this point.
Best to you.
tom
I too have been at this for some time now and do not claim even stream entry as defined by "obvious cessation" followed by "automatic cycling".
I have spent much time in the DN but cannot definitively say that I have broken throught the equanimity stages to fruition. Its possible that I have but I still feel that my 'self' is too strong and apparent according to the classic descriptions.
That said, your description of finding the ease and calmness is something I have noticed in my consistent practice in the last several months. I have felt this before but it seems more solid this time and more reliable. I believe it to be equanimity due to the tingly, effervescent nature of my sits. It is also very pleasant most of the time and I can climb up to this point very quickly when I sit down to practice.
Recently I have been working on the "release" aspect of things. There are sensations within my skull which I tend to feel as pleasant but which, if followed (grasped onto) lead to 'dead ends' of pressure. When I notice these I "release" them, averting my attention from them. This leads quickly to a deepening of calm and tranquillity and concentration.
Everything seems just fine at that point and one feels the tendency to linger there but it is probably better to look for subtler things.
I've also been practising releasing my tendency to analyse everything but I really can't say if this is productive or not at this point.
Best to you.
tom
Nick Green, modificat fa 10 anys at 06/02/14 11:32
Created 10 anys ago at 06/02/14 11:32
RE: Some things I've found helpful lately
Apunts: 55 Data d'incorporació: 08/12/10 Publicacions recents
Thanks Drew for starting this post and Tom for his reply. I can echo much of what you write. Whilst I believe I experienced fruition last year, clear cycling ended after a week followed by four months or so of strong DN. There was a noticeable shift again in November when things seemed to ‘open up’ and ‘do what they needed to’. However, whilst something appears to be playing out (accompanied by internal ‘shifts’ and ‘pulses’) I can’t definitely say that I experience repeat fruitions.
This has bothered me at times and attempts to push things along with noting practice seem to lead to constriction and deeper angst at the moment. Alternatively, when I relax and sit more in bare attention (or practice metta bhavana) experience tends to effortlessly open up again and expand. I’ve also found direct pointing exercises (particularly using Douglas Harding’s ‘On having no head’) have a similar effect.
Attending to sensations of ‘ease’ and ‘effortlessness’ sounds a good way to go, which I’ll (gently) explore further…
Cheers,
Nick
This has bothered me at times and attempts to push things along with noting practice seem to lead to constriction and deeper angst at the moment. Alternatively, when I relax and sit more in bare attention (or practice metta bhavana) experience tends to effortlessly open up again and expand. I’ve also found direct pointing exercises (particularly using Douglas Harding’s ‘On having no head’) have a similar effect.
Attending to sensations of ‘ease’ and ‘effortlessness’ sounds a good way to go, which I’ll (gently) explore further…
Cheers,
Nick
Dream Walker, modificat fa 10 anys at 06/02/14 13:18
Created 10 anys ago at 06/02/14 13:18
RE: Some things I've found helpful lately
Apunts: 1770 Data d'incorporació: 18/01/12 Publicacions recentsDrew Miller:
I'm curious about other's thoughts on this.
"So, its amazing how easy it is when you attend to how easy and effortless everything is all the time. Trusting the natural process. Concentration is really just surrender and is also loving kindness. It is the practice that liberates. I dont know that any other practice is needed at this point. The breath is a useful object because it is naturally effortless. Love is effortless and easy. The breath has the love quality in it."
Anyway, just thought I'd share. If you have thoughts that may help to expand on these or guide me that would be great.
"So, its amazing how easy it is when you attend to how easy and effortless everything is all the time. Trusting the natural process. Concentration is really just surrender and is also loving kindness. It is the practice that liberates. I dont know that any other practice is needed at this point. The breath is a useful object because it is naturally effortless. Love is effortless and easy. The breath has the love quality in it."
Anyway, just thought I'd share. If you have thoughts that may help to expand on these or guide me that would be great.
Sounds like good stuff to work on in Equanimity. There is a definite letting go quality that is helpful in progressing thru the EQ phases. I would still gently observe the sensations closely and the thoughts too. It is not the content that is important but the observing/noting/noticing/attention of the phenomenon related to the content. See each phenomenon arise and pass away and apply the 3 characteristics in a very gentle way. There are no sensations that are unworthy of investigation. See how it applies to effortlessness, surrender, loving kindness, breath etc.
Good luck,
~D
Drew Miller, modificat fa 10 anys at 07/02/14 12:11
Created 10 anys ago at 07/02/14 12:11
RE: Some things I've found helpful lately
Apunts: 61 Data d'incorporació: 22/11/13 Publicacions recents
Thank you all for your thoughts. I have taken them to heart and they have already begun to inform my practice.
Metta,
Drew
Metta,
Drew