“Bootstrapped” Kasina - Discussion
“Bootstrapped” Kasina
“Bootstrapped” Kasina | Ont Endo | 3/22/19 4:19 PM |
RE: “Bootstrapped” Kasina | Jason Massie | 3/23/19 12:34 AM |
RE: “Bootstrapped” Kasina | Anna L | 3/25/19 6:17 AM |
Ont Endo, modified 5 Years ago at 3/22/19 4:19 PM
Created 5 Years ago at 3/22/19 4:01 PM
“Bootstrapped” Kasina
Post: 1 Join Date: 3/21/19 Recent Posts
Within Chapter 29 - Kasina Practice of Part 3 of MCTB2, I became interested in a particular statement regarding the section on choosing a Kasina:
“For those who see colors, even subtle ones, when they close their eyes or are in the dark, you can even bootstrap a kasina off those with enough careful attention to the colors and to cultivating and organizing them, a skill that takes merely practice to learn.”
Would anyone experienced with Kasina practice expound more deeply into this aspect of choosing a Kasina and the resulting technique? Particularly,
MCTB2 goes on to state that the “...first point about navigating in the murk is that dark colors, such as black and grey, are totally valid kasina objects you can play with and pay attention to.” As such, could one choose the “murk” (or aspects of it) as the object of concentration from the start without necessarily requiring an external kasina? Are there any warnings or suggestions to those pursuing this technique?
My sincere thanks for your attention!
“For those who see colors, even subtle ones, when they close their eyes or are in the dark, you can even bootstrap a kasina off those with enough careful attention to the colors and to cultivating and organizing them, a skill that takes merely practice to learn.”
Would anyone experienced with Kasina practice expound more deeply into this aspect of choosing a Kasina and the resulting technique? Particularly,
- How specifically would one choose/develop this “bootstrapped” kasina?
- What would the Kasina be like and what are the characteristics of the downstream Nimitha?
- How would one go about this technique systematically given no inherent cycles of opening and closing the eyes?
- Could one still describe the resultant Nimitha as “clean, clear, [and of] interesting organization and brilliance” that is described with the traditional method of practice?
- Has anyone tried this method and what have been their experiences?
MCTB2 goes on to state that the “...first point about navigating in the murk is that dark colors, such as black and grey, are totally valid kasina objects you can play with and pay attention to.” As such, could one choose the “murk” (or aspects of it) as the object of concentration from the start without necessarily requiring an external kasina? Are there any warnings or suggestions to those pursuing this technique?
My sincere thanks for your attention!
Jason Massie, modified 5 Years ago at 3/23/19 12:34 AM
Created 5 Years ago at 3/22/19 10:41 PM
RE: “Bootstrapped” Kasina
Posts: 124 Join Date: 10/18/16 Recent Posts
I cant answer much of what you are looking for but here is my experience which might help. After doing a lot of fire kasina practice, I can boot strap it pretty easy. Before that practice, I barely noticed the visual field.
I look for anything remotely resembling a dot and pay attention to the detail very closely. Use as loose of a definition of a dot as you can. Look for impermanence in the center especially spinning or rotation. Maybe it is lighter in the middle. If you dont see anything wait patiently with fascination paying close attention to the detail. A gentle intention and imagination might help. If you can see the beginnings of a nimitta, look for spinning, color, pixels, rotation. Stay with the detail.
I have not tried this outside of just daily sits. The nimitta is not very mature.
I was told that there is no cheating with this practice. If it holds your fascination, it is fair game.
I look for anything remotely resembling a dot and pay attention to the detail very closely. Use as loose of a definition of a dot as you can. Look for impermanence in the center especially spinning or rotation. Maybe it is lighter in the middle. If you dont see anything wait patiently with fascination paying close attention to the detail. A gentle intention and imagination might help. If you can see the beginnings of a nimitta, look for spinning, color, pixels, rotation. Stay with the detail.
I have not tried this outside of just daily sits. The nimitta is not very mature.
I was told that there is no cheating with this practice. If it holds your fascination, it is fair game.
Anna L, modified 5 Years ago at 3/25/19 6:17 AM
Created 5 Years ago at 3/25/19 6:11 AM
RE: “Bootstrapped” Kasina
Posts: 232 Join Date: 1/21/17 Recent Posts
Hi Avi
Happy practice
- How specifically would one choose/develop this “bootstrapped” kasina?
- What would the Kasina be like and what are the characteristics of the downstream Nimitha?
- How would one go about this technique systematically given no inherent cycles of opening and closing the eyes?
- Could one still describe the resultant Nimitha as “clean, clear, [and of] interesting organization and brilliance” that is described with the traditional method of practice?
- Has anyone tried this method and what have been their experiences?
- As such, could one choose the “murk” (or aspects of it) as the object of concentration from the start without necessarily requiring an external kasina?
- Are there any warnings or suggestions to those pursuing this technique?
Happy practice