Brandon's Practice Log

Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 1/22/20 11:31 AM
Dissolution of Craving Brandon Dayton 1/24/20 12:10 PM
Metta and Concentration Brandon Dayton 1/27/20 2:25 PM
Discovering the POI Brandon Dayton 2/5/20 1:03 PM
Back to Basics Brandon Dayton 2/7/20 9:26 AM
RE: Back to Basics Che Guebuddha 2/7/20 10:02 AM
RE: Back to Basics Brandon Dayton 2/8/20 10:04 AM
RE: Back to Basics Che Guebuddha 2/8/20 10:21 AM
RE: Back to Basics Brandon Dayton 2/8/20 10:34 AM
RE: Back to Basics Brandon Dayton 2/9/20 10:18 AM
RE: Back to Basics Brandon Dayton 2/10/20 11:01 AM
experiencing piti? Brandon Dayton 2/16/20 12:56 PM
RE: experiencing piti? Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 2/16/20 1:08 PM
Just Concentration Brandon Dayton 2/24/20 10:31 AM
The Grind Brandon Dayton 2/25/20 9:14 AM
Vipassana Time Brandon Dayton 2/26/20 9:38 AM
RE: Vipassana Time Brandon Dayton 2/29/20 10:30 AM
RE: Vipassana Time Brandon Dayton 3/1/20 4:24 PM
Was that First Jhana? Brandon Dayton 3/2/20 10:38 AM
RE: Was that First Jhana? J W 3/2/20 10:56 AM
RE: Was that First Jhana? Brandon Dayton 3/2/20 11:20 AM
RE: Was that First Jhana? J W 3/2/20 2:32 PM
Flirting with First Jhana Brandon Dayton 3/5/20 10:06 AM
Playing ping-pong with Practice Brandon Dayton 3/30/20 10:13 AM
Making Adjustments Brandon Dayton 4/5/20 10:36 AM
Boring Boringness Brandon Dayton 4/6/20 12:51 PM
Ok, something is happening Brandon Dayton 4/7/20 9:46 AM
RE: Ok, something is happening Papa Che Dusko 4/9/20 9:46 AM
RE: Ok, something is happening Brandon Dayton 4/9/20 10:06 AM
RE: Ok, something is happening Papa Che Dusko 4/9/20 1:05 PM
RE: Ok, something is happening Brandon Dayton 4/9/20 6:35 PM
meh Brandon Dayton 4/9/20 6:34 PM
Jhana Comes A Callin' Brandon Dayton 5/4/20 2:41 PM
RE: Jhana Comes A Callin' Papa Che Dusko 4/10/20 10:30 AM
RE: Jhana Comes A Callin' Tim Farrington 4/10/20 12:44 PM
RE: Jhana Comes A Callin' Brandon Dayton 4/10/20 1:02 PM
RE: Jhana Comes A Callin' Chris M 4/10/20 1:08 PM
RE: Jhana Comes A Callin' Tim Farrington 4/10/20 1:12 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 4/13/20 3:19 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 4/13/20 4:24 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 4/16/20 10:00 AM
Feelin' Groovy Brandon Dayton 4/16/20 10:41 AM
RE: Feelin' Groovy Tim Farrington 4/16/20 10:43 AM
Aversion to Fear Brandon Dayton 4/25/20 1:59 PM
Lost in the Wilderness (but at least its a pleasant journey) Brandon Dayton 4/25/20 2:00 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 4/27/20 9:29 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 4/27/20 9:47 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 4/28/20 10:12 AM
Yup Brandon Dayton 4/29/20 9:02 AM
RE: Yup Papa Che Dusko 4/29/20 2:36 PM
RE: Yup Chris M 4/29/20 2:47 PM
RE: Yup Papa Che Dusko 4/29/20 4:28 PM
RE: Yup Brandon Dayton 4/29/20 3:44 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/7/20 10:30 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 5/7/20 12:08 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/10/20 9:39 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log J W 5/7/20 12:24 PM
Things feel good Brandon Dayton 5/10/20 10:06 PM
RE: Things feel good Tim Farrington 5/11/20 2:54 AM
RE: Things feel good Brandon Dayton 5/11/20 9:17 AM
RE: Things feel good Brandon Dayton 5/17/20 10:50 AM
RE: Things feel good Tim Farrington 5/17/20 10:57 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/17/20 7:57 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 5/18/20 3:52 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Olivier S 5/18/20 1:24 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/18/20 5:03 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 5/19/20 2:30 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/18/20 4:22 PM
The Last Two Days Brandon Dayton 5/12/20 3:07 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/12/20 10:37 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 5/13/20 3:31 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 5/14/20 7:36 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 5/14/20 8:47 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/14/20 9:59 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 5/27/20 4:23 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 5/14/20 8:50 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/14/20 10:10 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 5/14/20 10:26 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/14/20 10:29 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 5/13/20 3:02 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/13/20 10:31 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 5/14/20 3:40 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/14/20 10:15 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 5/16/20 5:49 AM
A pattern? Brandon Dayton 5/23/20 3:04 PM
RE: A pattern? J W 5/20/20 11:17 AM
RE: A pattern? Brandon Dayton 5/20/20 11:27 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/21/20 8:58 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 5/21/20 12:45 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/23/20 2:53 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/23/20 3:03 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 5/23/20 4:02 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/23/20 8:20 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/24/20 10:15 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 5/24/20 12:19 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/24/20 9:38 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 5/25/20 8:32 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/25/20 9:41 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/25/20 9:59 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 5/25/20 4:07 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/25/20 6:06 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 5/24/20 10:23 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 5/24/20 10:46 AM
Practice Continues Brandon Dayton 6/5/20 2:24 PM
RE: Practice Continues Sam Gentile 6/5/20 2:36 PM
RE: Practice Continues Brandon Dayton 6/5/20 3:05 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/5/20 8:15 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 6/6/20 2:12 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Sam Gentile 6/6/20 11:17 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 6/6/20 4:59 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/6/20 6:02 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Sam Gentile 6/7/20 9:10 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Steph S 6/9/20 7:39 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/9/20 7:55 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Steph S 6/9/20 8:01 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/10/20 6:39 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/10/20 1:08 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 6/10/20 1:10 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 6/10/20 6:46 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/10/20 8:17 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 6/10/20 9:08 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/10/20 9:37 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Steph S 6/10/20 9:49 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/10/20 12:08 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Steph S 6/10/20 12:11 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 6/10/20 1:16 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Steph S 6/10/20 9:46 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Freeling 6/19/20 4:35 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Sam Gentile 6/20/20 11:17 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/7/20 5:26 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 6/7/20 7:38 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Siavash ' 6/7/20 8:51 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/7/20 8:57 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Siavash ' 6/7/20 9:00 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/7/20 10:48 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/7/20 10:50 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/8/20 10:59 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Siavash ' 6/7/20 11:24 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/8/20 11:02 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/8/20 11:10 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/8/20 11:25 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/8/20 11:26 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/8/20 11:56 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/8/20 12:16 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/8/20 12:24 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/8/20 2:00 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 6/8/20 1:33 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/8/20 1:58 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/8/20 3:03 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 6/8/20 3:28 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/8/20 4:25 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/8/20 4:26 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/9/20 7:19 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/9/20 7:39 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 6/9/20 10:39 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/9/20 3:41 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 6/9/20 3:54 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/9/20 4:05 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/10/20 12:00 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/10/20 6:27 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/10/20 6:44 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/10/20 12:02 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/7/20 9:18 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/7/20 9:22 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/6/20 1:16 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 6/7/20 5:26 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/7/20 8:45 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/10/20 12:32 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Chris M 6/10/20 12:40 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 6/10/20 1:33 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/10/20 6:03 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/10/20 11:04 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/11/20 8:28 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/19/20 4:59 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/19/20 4:30 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/19/20 10:46 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/20/20 2:35 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/20/20 2:47 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/20/20 2:59 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Siavash ' 6/20/20 3:19 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/20/20 4:34 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Siavash ' 6/20/20 12:11 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/21/20 12:27 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/19/20 8:19 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/20/20 2:54 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/24/20 4:09 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 6/24/20 4:32 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/25/20 3:04 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 6/25/20 3:47 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/26/20 10:49 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Sam Gentile 6/26/20 11:59 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 6/26/20 1:47 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 6/29/20 3:07 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 7/9/20 10:02 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 7/9/20 10:13 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Sam Gentile 7/9/20 11:40 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 7/10/20 10:48 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 7/24/20 1:32 PM
Shhh Brandon Dayton 7/24/20 1:47 PM
RE: Shhh Chris M 7/24/20 4:58 PM
RE: Shhh Tim Farrington 7/25/20 7:28 AM
Be Careful What You Ask For Brandon Dayton 9/2/20 8:58 PM
RE: Be Careful What You Ask For Papa Che Dusko 9/4/20 2:29 AM
RE: Be Careful What You Ask For Brandon Dayton 9/4/20 5:42 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 9/6/20 10:23 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Sam Gentile 9/6/20 11:56 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 9/7/20 9:45 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 9/7/20 9:47 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 9/12/20 5:40 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 9/13/20 11:54 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 9/14/20 1:12 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 9/14/20 7:54 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 9/14/20 7:56 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 9/17/20 4:59 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 9/17/20 1:09 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 9/17/20 4:26 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/1/20 12:08 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 10/1/20 2:49 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/2/20 9:18 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 10/3/20 2:42 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/3/20 4:20 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 10/3/20 4:44 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 10/3/20 11:27 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Niels Lyngsø 10/2/20 2:57 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 10/2/20 3:11 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/4/20 2:33 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 10/5/20 12:23 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/4/20 2:50 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 10/5/20 11:48 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/5/20 3:55 PM
Hello ñanas my old friends Brandon Dayton 10/8/20 2:17 PM
RE: Hello ñanas my old friends Papa Che Dusko 10/8/20 4:25 PM
RE: Hello ñanas my old friends Tim Farrington 10/11/20 3:26 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/16/20 10:42 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/16/20 10:40 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/17/20 1:55 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/18/20 9:54 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 10/19/20 2:41 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/19/20 3:21 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/19/20 9:40 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/24/20 11:39 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 10/25/20 11:03 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 11/2/20 9:05 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 11/8/20 9:55 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 11/9/20 9:20 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/11/20 12:13 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Niels Lyngsø 12/11/20 12:31 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/14/20 10:08 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log George S 12/15/20 8:17 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/15/20 9:51 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/14/20 10:14 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Pepe · 12/14/20 3:58 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/15/20 9:49 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/15/20 9:52 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/17/20 9:35 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/20/20 11:51 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 12/20/20 1:59 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/20/20 2:12 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 12/20/20 4:48 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/21/20 10:37 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 12/22/20 5:42 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/22/20 10:58 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Sam Gentile 12/22/20 12:24 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/22/20 1:11 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Tim Farrington 1/1/21 2:53 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 1/1/21 8:24 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Papa Che Dusko 1/1/21 9:59 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 1/1/21 12:16 PM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 12/22/20 11:04 AM
RE: Brandon's Practice Log Brandon Dayton 1/1/21 8:08 AM
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 1/22/20 11:31 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 1/22/20 11:31 AM

Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I've been considering starting a practice log for awhile. I've decided to make it a mix of posts on this forum that go into a bit more phenomenology that Dhoers will appreciate, and links to my personal blog where I am going to writing about my experiences for a broader audience. Although I'm trying to exercise restratint, you'll notice a certain evangelical tone in the writing.

To start I wanted to share my account of my A&P experience, and how it has seemed to alleviate most of my symptoms of depression. In a future post I'll talk about how the experience led me to discover MCTB, the POI and DhO.

https://brandondayton.com/blog/2020/1/22/crossing-the-threshold
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 1/24/20 12:10 PM
Created 4 Years ago at 1/24/20 12:06 PM

Dissolution of Craving

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I experienced for the first time what appeared to be the dissolution of a craving or compulsion. I was putting my son to bed, and I usually sit on the floor as he is falling asleep and do some noting. I had been playing a video game on his 2DS for the past few weeks and it had become a bit of a compulsion. A common pattern for me is to have a compulsion, to know it's not a good idea to follow it and to either resist it succesfully or to just accept that I am going to give in to it. The third alternative that I had experienced through meditation was to sit with a compulsion until it just eventually faded way. That night, however, I had basically accepted that I would give into the compulsion. 

As I was sitting, I paid attention to what I felt in my body as the compulsion arose. I felt a tightness and ache in my chest. The more closely I paid attention to it, the more it felt like a deep, aching sadness. I started to well with emotion, and just as the tears were about to flow I could feel this aching sadness break apart and dissolve. After that, the compulsion was gone and I just went to bed.

It's the first time I've felt anything like this. It felt very much like the metaphor I've heard before of suffering being like a hot coal that you're holding on to, but as soon as you recognize that, you just drop it. It has also given me some insight into how seemingly harmless activities can have suffering at their core. Even when you are doing something that is "not hurting anybody else" you can still be hurting yourself in subtle but problematic ways.

It's also started to make me much more interested and aware of emotions arising in my body. That's something that is very new to me. I've become very familiar with gross body sensations, and I'm starting to gain some skill with picking apart thoughts, but I am little by little starting to become aware of the manifestations of my emotional world. The heart area seems to be the center of lots of activity lately. Mostly a feeling of tightness or aching. This is interesting to me, since the heart area is where all the fireworks were happening during my A&P experience and my meditation teacher afterwards admonished me to pay attention to where I felt it. I honestly had not given that area of my body much attention since then, but I'm starting to see more and more happening there.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 1/27/20 2:25 PM
Created 4 Years ago at 1/27/20 2:25 PM

Metta and Concentration

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
For the most part my practice of late has been less focused, more restless and in general more difficult. Post A&P, I was getting up at 5:30 almost every morning for an hour of practice. I'm still committed to an hour a day, but it has been bumpier. From what the maps say and what others have observed, it seems like I'm squarely within dissolution. If the length of my A&P window is any indicator, its likely to last quite a while, unless I've dropped down to a pre A&P state. That's still a part of the maps I don't understand. Clearly, it is common to cycle up the POI, miss Stream Entry and fall back down, but I haven't found good information on the details of how and when "dropping down" happens (a good question for a dedicated thread). Nonetheless, practice is what it is. Sometimes it feels focused and energetic, other times it doesn't. I can work on equanimity either way.

On advice of the teacher at the last weekend retreat I did, I'm trying to integrate more metta into my practice to keep my insight practice from being too dry. At first I was gung-ho about metta, and I was feeling some really powerful, warm feelings at first, but I've noticed the feelings lately aren't as strong, metta feels more like a chore, and its harder to keep my focus. Perhaps just part of a maturing metta practice. I did pick up Salzberg's Loving-Kindness as a reference. Hopefully that will be a helpful guide.

I'm also adding in more concetration work, just working on breath. This morning's session was all concentration and it felt like the right place to be. I'm thinking I'll spend the rest of this week with a bit of metta to start, followed by concentration. Many sources here and elsewhere have recommended concentration and metta as a good fit for the DN. I guess its time to start taking that advice seriously.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 2/5/20 1:03 PM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/5/20 1:03 PM

Discovering the POI

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
My account of discovering MCTB and the POI. 

https://brandondayton.com/blog/2020/2/5/wtf-just-happened
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 2/7/20 9:26 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/7/20 9:26 AM

Back to Basics

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Just spent a week on vacation with family. It ended up being the biggest stretch of time I've gone without meditation in the last 6 months. I was a bit frustrated by that. I wish I had made more effort to do some everyday, even if it was a little bit. It leaves me feeling a bit concerned about keeping a steady commitment.

Now trying to get practice back up and going again. Did an hour of concentration practice this morning that began with some metta. Maybe its the time off the cushion by my concentration felt soft. Lots of getting lost in thought. It feels a bit like being a beginner again, although clearly the ability to sit for an hour whether with good concentration or not shows I haven't lost as much ability as I thought. Nonetheless, the beginner feeling is kind of fun. I feel a bit like I'm in meditation lab and testing the practice again. Let's see how it goes to start from a place of weak concentration and work back up to something stronger. 

I'm thinking of spending a few weeks to a month on concentration, maybe with additional noting sessions here and there, and then flip the balance back to an emphasis on noting. 

I'm still making my way through Salzberg's Loving-Kindness and doing a little bit of work every day on metta. I've had a really good experience with mudita practice and need to remember to tie that in to my daily metta practice.
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Che Guebuddha, modified 4 Years ago at 2/7/20 10:02 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/7/20 10:02 AM

RE: Back to Basics

Posts: 65 Join Date: 8/19/11 Recent Posts
Have you ever considered to find a technique to practice off the cushion? A non formal practice you do instead of sitting on the computer or at least 10 minutes before you go into the computer (or TV time). 

yes getting lost in meditation is a common thing if one has not found a way to keep at it non-stop easier. 
I used to get lost into narratives when doing concentration practice or even more so in simple Calm abiding Shamata. 

ive found that Noting Aloud worked really good in destroying hindrances and keeping me 99-100% in the present moment , noting sensation after sensation without breaking the noticing stream of awareness or what ever you wanna call it. 

looking in an honest way it is likely that we are actually mindful during a sitting formal practice only 10-50% and lost the rest of the time. And this 10-50% might be chopped up into small portions of actual determined mindfulness. This like trying to dig a water whole 10 meters deep but we dug 10 holes 1 meter deep and yet we haven't reached the water. 

maybe of more benefit to keep a steady stream of awareness for 10 minutes but actually being mindful of all the sensations arising and passing. 
Noting Aloud seems to do exactly this for me. 

such 10 minutes invested will be more fruitful than 60 minutes of on and off being lost and distracted or even just resting in certain experiences. 
sitting on a chair in front of the computer is as good of a place as any. 

this is my experience of course. Just sharing a possibility. 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 2/8/20 10:04 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/8/20 10:04 AM

RE: Back to Basics

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Thanks for the ideas. I try to do as much informal practice throughout the day as I can, and my success varies from day to day. My general approach is to ask myself throughout the day if what I am doing requires me to actively think, or if I can use that mental bandwidth to do some noting instead.

I've also done a bit of vocal noting, per instructions from Shinzen Young's See Hear Feel, but that is something I could really do more of. I certainly feel like I am in a phase of practice that requires more commitment, and in general it seems like I need to bring in more energy to make that happen. Some vocal noting could be a good fit. Today is a Saturday too, so a good opportunity to do some informal practice with all the household chores!
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Che Guebuddha, modified 4 Years ago at 2/8/20 10:21 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/8/20 10:18 AM

RE: Back to Basics

Posts: 65 Join Date: 8/19/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Thanks for the ideas. I try to do as much informal practice throughout the day as I can, and my success varies from day to day. My general approach is to ask myself throughout the day if what I am doing requires me to actively think, or if I can use that mental bandwidth to do some noting instead.

I've also done a bit of vocal noting, per instructions from Shinzen Young's See Hear Feel, but that is something I could really do more of. I certainly feel like I am in a phase of practice that requires more commitment, and in general it seems like I need to bring in more energy to make that happen. Some vocal noting could be a good fit. Today is a Saturday too, so a good opportunity to do some informal practice with all the household chores!
Yeah that sounds fantastic. You seem to have a very clear sense of dirrection and some fine practice for it all. I like you mentioning that "mental bandwidth" emoticon so true. Good stuff! 

Im now trying to look at that "energy" we need to invest the same as what I need to get up my lazy ars and start that hoover to clean up our home emoticon I mean to get up and take into my hands and keep at it for the duration of the entire cleaning. Seems to give good results. So determination and resolve will inevitably get some energy fired up. I find that energy comes out of actually doing Noting. At some stage its on Fire how much energy there is but thats to the cycles Dissolution will come about with its cooling effect , ahhhhhhh lovely emoticon 

My opinion is that you are onto somthing of benefit here. Maybe others might add more to this thread in case Im gone astray as some might have more clarity about this than I. The only reason I responded to your thread is that there were so many views and no one replied. I wish someone with more wisdom would chime in.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 2/8/20 10:34 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/8/20 10:34 AM

RE: Back to Basics

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I appreciate the response. That's the main reason I am blogging about my practice and keeping a log here -- to gain support from others in my practice (if it can help others too, that's cool). Being a lone practicioner can only take you so far, and I find great benefit from support of the Sangha in whatever form it takes. I've got a local group I meet with weekly, they are a fantastic group, but they are a more standard IMS/Spirit Rock type of group, so not so much nitty gritty discussion about practice. I actually shared a segment from Deconstructing Yourself at our last sit where Kenneth Folk and Michael Taft were talking about mindfulness with the group and there were some strong negative reactions (although they were all very gracious to me about it.). So this forum plays an important role for me as a place where I can really get into the details of practice with a group that is on board with the POI model of things.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 2/9/20 10:18 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/9/20 10:18 AM

RE: Back to Basics

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
More metta followed by concentration practice this morning, with a bit of a diversion mid-practice to pay attention to the sensations in my chest. Been paying much more attention to the heart center lately. Listened to John Prendergast on Deconstructing Yourself talking about doing heart work. Much of it was over my head, but I feel a strong pull to pay attention to this area.

I had another moment of awareness of the connection between complulsion and the heart center. I was getting ready to do some dishes and was about to turn on some music. I felt a tightness and ache that was very similar to what I felt working with my video game compulsion. There was something that just felt painful in my heart about listening to music, and I ended up listening to a podcast instead. It don't really understand what was going on, but it is becoming an increasingly compelling area of investigation.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 2/10/20 11:01 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/10/20 11:01 AM

RE: Back to Basics

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Practice feels very ordinary lately. The feeling of being a beginner seems to persist. I listened to the Guru Viking interview with Stephen Snyder yesterday and he talked about how the arc of practice has a quality of expansion and contraction. He likened it to an accordion. It's interesting to think of how that concept jives with the POI. I'm certainly feeling a contraction of late. Much more aversion to practice and a much stronger feeling of dukkha off the cushion -- just more uneasy, tense, skin crawly feelings, which of course I'm feeling in the heart area as well.

I'm trying to use it as an opportunity, and thinking of it as if I was lifting weights at the gym. The difficulty is just like an increase in the weight. I'm practicing staying calm and relaxing through restlessness. Fortunately the challenge is not too large, and the increase in difficulty seems manageable. Still doing a solid hour of practice per day, plus opportunistic practice throughout the day -- primarily as I'm sitting in my son's room waiting for him to fall asleep.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 2/16/20 12:56 PM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/16/20 12:56 PM

experiencing piti?

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I've been listening to dharma talks from Tina Rasumussen and Stephen Snyder lately. It's a good fit since I am working on the Brahmaviharas and concentration and most of their talks are on the Brahmaviharas and Jhanas. This week I've adopted their metta phrases in my practice, and I've just been working on directing the metta to myself. The general phrasing they use is:

May I be safe
May I be healthy
May I be happy
May my mind be at ease
May I be liberated

As they describe it, this order follows up the chakras, which I really like. Before hearing their dharma talk on the topic, I found myself stumbling on to this pattern a bit naturally. I was ending my metta with "may I be safe" and in a moment of mind blip I switched it to "may I be free" and it just felt better. After finding their phrase order, it clicked why ending with "may I be free" felt better.

I started my meditation this morning with metta, based on this pattern, and found myself getting into a very deeply concentrated and pleasant state. I was wondering if I had veered out of metta territory into mantra. Not sure if that's a diversion or not.

After some time with the metta, I switched to concentration on the breath.  Rasmussen and Snyder recommend doing a strict anapanasati where you focus on the area under the nose. Snyder has described the practice as not focusing on the sensations on the skin, but on the movement of the breath through the area, as if you are a toll collector on a road. I don't think I quite understand how to do this, as I felt like I had a hard time finding what to focus on. Finally, I just directed my focus to the sensations of the breathing that I could clearly perceive, and again found myself getting into a deeply pleasent and concentrated state. I'm wondering if what I am feeling is piti. I found it to be very pleasent and energizing, which sounds similar to how I've heard it described. The concentration actually lingered for about 10 minutes after the sit, and even now I find it fairly easy to drop into.

Maybe all this metta and concentration practice is paying off.

Also discussing commitment on another thread:

https://www.dharmaoverground.org/discussion/-/message_boards/message/18771890

I think it's time to make a new resolve to practice, based on suggestions from the thread. This is the form my resolve will take:

I will resolve to practice a mimimum of 30 minutes per day, but will schedule my practice in such a way that I will have the option to do an hour or more at one time. If I do not practice in the morning, I will practice in the evening as I put my children to bed. There is never a good reason to skip practice.

When not on the cushion, I will find as many activities during the day where I can practice noting -- dishes, laundry, cooking, exercise, showering ect. Throughout the day I will ask myself, "What is happening right now?" I will pay attention to what is happening, I will notice any resistance and surrender to whatever is happening in the moment.

I will keep a log of my practice and attend weekly meditation sessions with my local sangha.
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Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö, modified 4 Years ago at 2/16/20 1:08 PM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/16/20 1:08 PM

RE: experiencing piti?

Posts: 7134 Join Date: 12/8/18 Recent Posts
Sounds great. I look forward to reading you log. 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 2/24/20 10:31 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/24/20 7:52 AM

Just Concentration

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Just worked on concentration yesterday. No Metta. Was able to do almost a full hour. Concentration was pretty good. Did quite a bit of counting the breaths and there were micro mind wanderings, but not for more than a breath or two. Over the last few days I've noticed that mind-wandering gets more frequent the longer I'm sitting. I guess this has to do with the exhaustion of sitting. It's been interesting to work on bringing my focus back towards the end of the session. I conceptualize this like doing those last couple of reps at the gym, except without the striving effort. I wonder if it works in a similar way -- the work done in the second half of my sit, when concentration is harder, does more to improve my concentration than the easy stuff I do at the beginning.

I also just finished Braun's The Birth of Insight which traces the origins of modern Insight practice back to the innovations of Ledi Sayadaw. The first 3/4 of the book or more is about his scholarly work and his translations of the Abbidhamma for the laity that preceded his later emphasis on lay meditation. The book is pretty dry and scholarly itself, but gets most interesting when it gets into meditation territory and starts to explore the tradtition of meditation among the monastics and how Ledi began to decouple concentration practice from insight, which was later continued by Mahasi Sayadaw and has continued in contemporary approaches. Oddly enough, it ended up being a nice confirmation of the work I'm doing with concentration. I'd been wondering exactly how to interface concentration practice with vipassana and I felt like the descriptions of the practices he taught were helpful. He also recommded 3-4 hours of practice today. Not sure I'll be able to fit that in any time soon.

It also made me curious to delve a bit into the abbidhamma, as the practices he recommended were very deeply rooted in the Abbidhamma. In particular he used the basis of the four elements for vipassana practice where he noted the quality of fire (temperature), wind (movement), earth (direct contact) and water (integrity) in every sensation. I played with this a bit in my evening vipassana sit. I wonder if there are any contemporary practicioners that use a similar method. I see the value in the simplification of the Mahasi method and the even further simplification of Shizen's method, but I like having the tools to get more granular and specific. It seems that even in noting, the language used can determine what you are able to perceive and how your perceive.

I'm gonna continue with concentration and metta for a bit more, but I'm excited to start focusing more on vipassana again. I'll have to think through how to keep a finger on concentration and metta once I make that transition.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 2/25/20 9:14 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/25/20 9:14 AM

The Grind

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Sat for an hour last night during my daughter's ballet class and another hour this morning. Both sits felt like a grind. I know that's not the best terminology to use to describe meditation, but that's how they felt -- they were tough. The sit last night was tough. Just focused on concentration and had to relax through a lot of bodily discomfort. This may have to do with the fact that I was doing my sit in an unusual spot -- an alcove bench in the corner of a university building. At the very least, I felt proud of being able to sit calmly through all of it. Well, almost. I finallly fidgeted with about four minutes to go. Had some moments of good concentration here and there, but I was very happy to be done.

This morning, I might have just been sleepy, but I felt like I had big lapses in concentration. I started with metta and transitioned into concentration. I feel almost like my body is pulling me to vipassana. Maybe its time to switch back, or to let my mind meditate itself more. I was listening to a dharma talk the other day where Joseph Goldstein recommends flowing back and forth between concentration on breath and broader noting practice as you feel inclined in a single practice. Maybe there is too much effort in my practice and I need to ease up and let it be what it wants to be.

Where am I on the Progress of Insight, by the way? I have no idea.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 2/26/20 9:38 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/26/20 9:38 AM

Vipassana Time

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Did the same drill this morning: metta then concentration. Practice was erratic. Lots of mind wandering. With 22 minutes do go I decided to switch to vipassana and only did that for another 10 minutes before I got so restless I quit.

Kind of grumpy and irritable afterwards. I'm feeling like my diversion into metta and concentration has come to an end for now and I'm feeling drawn back to having a bigger focus on vipassana. Maybe I'll find time for another sit for today.

Reading through Travis's log right now https://www.dharmaoverground.org/discussion/-/message_boards/message/14271890

I
'm finding it inspiring and encouraging to return to vipassana. Practice has been erratic and difficult for quite a while now and I am continually focusing on relaxing into what it is, but I have to admit that it is challenging. 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 2/29/20 10:30 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 2/29/20 10:30 AM

RE: Vipassana Time

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I keep saying I'm gonna switch back to noting practice, but I've been sticking with concentration for the last couple of days. I picked up Leigh Braisington's Right Concentration book and I've realized that my concentration is actually making good progress. While its not totally consistent I have frequent sessions where my concetration matches his description of Access Concentration. I've had a least a couple of sessions where I've had a strong upwelling of piti, but I'm not sure if I would call it First Jhana. I think I need to keep my attention with the piti a bit longer to get there.

This morning was an hour with probably the first 10 minutes dedicated to metta and the rest on concentration. Concentration seems to be a much more fragile practice and requires a different approach than noting. This morning I was very comfortable and relaxed and the practice seemed to come much easier.

I still want to find some time for noting. I'll see if I can fit an hour in this afternoon. There should be plenty of opportunity for informal practice today as well.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 3/1/20 4:24 PM
Created 4 Years ago at 3/1/20 4:24 PM

RE: Vipassana Time

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I keep saying I'm gonna switch back to noting, but the concentration practice is starting to get stronger and stronger. I had a restless night of sleep last night and ended up waking up around 4am, and finally decided to get out of bed around 5:30. I sat, but my mind was racing and I was restless. I was trying to do concentration, but kept losing my focus.

I experimented with switching between noting and metta, to see if one of them was a better fit for my mind-set. The restlessness was still there. Finally, I thought I'd try doing a Do Nothing sit. I just dropped everything, and suddenly got super relaxed and alert. I stayed there for awhile, but found my attention naturally sliding to the breath. It made me realize that there was a tension to my focus before that was making me restless. It's one of those things where I had heard others describe the idea of tightness around a thought, or tightness in the concentration itself, but this is the first time I think I really could feel that. As soon as I was able to relax my mind and my focus everything got much easier and my concentration became very tranquil and continuous. As I noticed distractions arising in my mind, I could sense a tightness around them and could consciously let them go by relaxing the space around the thoughts and impressions. It felt like I discovered a new little trick to concentration.

A very interesting discovery. More and more I am finding my practice in a place where the right approach is to not try and make the practice something but to relax and let the practice emerge. Very fun to start to gain these subtle insights into the mind as well.

I've been reading quite a few logs lately, and it's interesting to read the more advanced logs and how bizarre they can sound, but then to also read others at an earlier stage working through many of the same issues I am. I can start to see how the two ends connect. How, little by little small insights into the nature of the mind can lead to dramatic perceptual changes.

Honestly, all the bizarre stuff sounds pretty cool. The idea that I can increasingly have access to those types of experiences is one of the things that keeps me motivated. Reading all the very regular stuff is also a great motivator. It's encouraging to see that there are others working their way through the path.

  
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 3/2/20 10:38 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 3/2/20 10:30 AM

Was that First Jhana?

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Doing concentration practice today. Concentration was okay, not amazing, but I was def. feeling some pleasent feelings in the midst of it. I was thinking about the instructions from Right Concentration on turning the attention to the piti to get to First Jhana. I was holding off because I kept telling myself my concentration wasn't strong enough yet, but for whatever reason I felt confidence in swithching to the piti and finally made the jump. 

I felt like I was able to stick with it pretty well and I could feel the piti slowly surging as I kept the concentration. At one point, I think I realized that I was mostly focusing on the sukkha (the happy feeling) and tried to and tried to narrow in on the giddiness of the piti. As I did so I could feel it really swell and I had a giant grin break out on my face, which was actually broke my concentration a bit. I was also getting sexually aroused, which was distracting because of the physical senstations but also the confusion about whether or not that should be happenning.

The piti died down and a returned to my breath. When I switch to piti, the breath always feels very soft and pleasent afterwards and my concentration is stronger. So maybe making these jumps to piti is not a bad way to reinforce the concentration. I did a bit of back and forth from breath to piti to wrap up the session. 

Somehow I was able to maintain the concentration while my cat was scratching at the door, but I got up super mindfully, let her in and decided to do a bit of walking meditation with noting.

As promised, the high level of concentration made the vipassana work very clear and sharp. Faces almost seemed to pop out of the the wood grain, and visually everything seemed very crisp, almost like I was on a micro-dose of mushrooms. I slowly walked down to my basement, all of my perceptions feeling super sensitive. I crossed the floor of my basement and on the opposite side of the room. I felt the piti welling again. I returned my attention to the piti and this time it was explosive. I got a huge surge of euphoria that felt orgasmic. In my mind, I'm like "This is it! This is it! First Jhana baby! It was super energetic and I felt my breathing get fast and shallow and the sexual arousal again. It peaked and then dissipated.

I think the noveltly of it and being distracted by all of the sensations might have made me lose my concentration, but I was mostly just super excited about it.

Now I'm left kind of concerned that the intensity of the experience will lead to too much craving or expectation, but maybe it'll also just be a good motivator to get back on the cushion.
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J W, modified 4 Years ago at 3/2/20 10:56 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 3/2/20 10:56 AM

RE: Was that First Jhana?

Posts: 671 Join Date: 2/11/20 Recent Posts
Hey Brandon enjoyed reading some of your logs. Sounds like we're going through some similar experiences. I too have notice the ebb and flow or cycling between periods of increased concentration/positive feeling vs. distraction/unpleasant feeling. For me it seems that these cycle every 1-2 weeks.  
Something I am trying this go-round is to be less concerned with the highs (the blissful states etc), letting them happen but not get too sucked into them (even though it can be fun as hell!).  I think this might help get through the negative states and make real progress vs. continued cycling.

To me what you describe here sounds like more of an A&P event, I think of 1st Jhana as being a calm concentration state where it's just easier to focus on an object.  I could be wrong there.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 3/2/20 11:20 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 3/2/20 11:20 AM

RE: Was that First Jhana?

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Thanks John,

I suspected A&P too, since it was so unstable. Hitting a second A&P would a be a good sign as it would mean I am not stuck in some endless dissolution, as I suspected before, but hopefully can get moving through more frequent cycles and getting a better sense of the territory. Also, it does feel good, which is nice relief.

At the same time, it was the result of following the specific instructions that are suppossed to lead you to First Jhana. Leigh Braisingtion does describe it as being a euphoric and intense feeling, sometimes so intense that it can be uncomfortable. His description of it actually has a lot of overlap with descritptions of the A&P. That's what makes me wonder. 
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J W, modified 4 Years ago at 3/2/20 2:32 PM
Created 4 Years ago at 3/2/20 2:32 PM

RE: Was that First Jhana?

Posts: 671 Join Date: 2/11/20 Recent Posts
Ah, nice... I'll have to check out that book. I did have an experience like that a couple of weeks ago and I thought it was A&P since it was intense and unstable.
I've been thinking 1st Jhana is a much more subtle state that you can access more predictably but may also have undertones of euphoria and calm. A&P being more of the "yes, this is it!" type feeling. But again I might be way off-base.
I think they can be overlapping sometimes which makes it even more confusing. If it's anything like what I experienced I felt pretty subdued for the next few days after that...
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Years ago at 3/5/20 10:06 AM
Created 4 Years ago at 3/5/20 10:06 AM

Flirting with First Jhana

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
My sits that last couple of days have been very similar -- concentration on breath, I start sensing piti, then I move my attention on to the piti.

Oddly enough, it seems like jumping to piti early and then coming back to the breath really supercharges my concentration. I find the second half of my sits to mostly be jumping back and forth from piti to breath and trying to sort out the varying senstations, and how I relate to them effects their quality. Mostly just trying to relax and keep my concentration on the piti, but it's not always a stable sensation, and I'm not always sure if I'm concentrating on the right thing or not. Is it that pleasent tingling in my face, or the subtle sense of giddiness attached to the tingling? Trying to see if I can be aware of the sukha in all of this too.

Can't say I've really hit First Jhana in the last few sessions, but it seems inevitable.

My sits are also going much longer. I can do an hour plus with ease.

I'm interested in my motivations at this point. I was struggling with noting, frustrated by trying to see what, if any progress was happenning, and now I've turned my attention to concentration where, after a month's time, I'm seeing results. I'm really enjoying the practice and the fun of the concentration and piti is winning out on noting right now. Maybe I'll naturally return to noting when the time is right. I still try to find time to note off the cushion, but it really isn't the same.

Am I avoiding opening up to all the hard stuff that you have to face with noting? Not sure. Learning to acceptance an equanimity is a big part of what I want from meditation, but I'm curious to see the role that Jhana might play in all of this.

On a side note, a spot opened to do some coaching with Michael Taft and I'm wondering if this would be a good time to check in with a teacher.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 3/30/20 10:13 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 3/30/20 9:54 AM

Playing ping-pong with Practice

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
A bit longer of a log as the change in routine has been a bit disruptive. Hope to get back to more regular entries.

I've been happy with the decision to focus on concentration for the past two months. I'm finding the benefits as advertised:

A. Concentration just feels really good, and really good in lots of different ways. Still dont' know if I've landed any Jhanas, but just gaining some familiarity with piti and learning how to cultivate it is fun and sustainable.

I'm also discovering another state that I think is Jhana related. I have one state in particular that I landed in the past week, but that I know I've landed 5 or 6 times in the past (but didn't have the Jhana terminology at the time to recognize it). While concentrating on breath, the breath suddenly gets very quiet and perceptually "small". Things get very tranquil and my visual field opens up and fills my attention. My body and breath are still there but they feel like they drop down underneath my attention space. It's maybe almost like I'm floating a bit above the sensations of my body. It feels fairly easy to just hang out in this state for awhile until it seems to naturally unwind.

B. I feel more confidence as I return to noting practice. Not that the practice even feels that great. I had quite a bit of discomfort last night as I was noting, but I feel like the concentration I bring to the practice allows me to sit through it with greater calm and openess. Oddly, after doing some noting, when I switch back to concentration mid-practice, it feels like getting shot out of cannon -- my concentration surges back and is very smooth, strong and pleasant. If find myself increasingly switching back and forth mid practice and playing with what happens.

Other interesting notes from recent practice:

I'm playing more and more with a trick that becomes helpful when I'm getting lost in thought. There is a specific type of getting-lost-in-thought that happens as I try to count breaths. I get very concentrated on the breath, almost in a way that is too tight, and it leads to restlessness and mind wandering. I find if I stop trying to follow the breath and just do a Do Nothing sit for a bit that my concentration relaxes, my attention opens up and after a few minutes I can ease back into the breath. I think it helps because of how it helps me to keep my concentration broader and more relaxed. If I can take in the periphery and gently follow the breath in the center of it all, things seem to go better.

I recently found Kenneth Folk's book-in-progress due to the recommendations of others on DhO and started digging into it. Reading Kenneth's life story was a particularly good reminder of the path I have taken -- that they end goal is awakening, and in my particular phase the proximate goal is Stream Entry. I've been a bit pouty over the last few months that as a married guy with kids that I don't have the bandwidth to do the retreat time I would like to but something about reading Kenneth's story emboldened me that I can do it. I have to remember people like Dipa Ma that demonstrated that you could make progress in the midst of regular life, but it does take dedication and commitment. This is the path I'm on. The second I crossed the A&P it was a fata compli. Part of walking the path is accepting the path as it presents itself in my life and embracing it for what it is. Along those lines I've decided to try and start doing two 45 minute sessions a day and work from there. The morning session would be a concentration session and the evening would be noting, but I would allow for fluidity and experimentation.

I'm starting to think that I've been mapping my noting practice wrong. I had a big glorious A&P that was luxuriously and generously long, and it put me in the mind state of thinking that I would then have these long drawn-out nanas in succession. I've been frustrated watching my practice and not seeing the  Dissolution and Fear I expected after the A&P. I now think that what is really happenning is that I am returning to 0 with every sit and working my way up the ladder. Last night I sat down, was having fun with noting and then things got painful and restless. I've realized that I've experienced a lot of this pain in my noting over the last several months and that it might actually be the 3C's stage of things. With the practice I've put into concentration I feel like I was able to relax much more into the pain that I have in the past. After a while the pain started to dissipate and things startred to feel good again, I felt like it was potentially building up to another A&P. My timer went off, and I ended up lying on floor doing concentration for a few few minutes.

It's now my working theory (holding it lightly) that I might be seeing the beginnings of cycles with each sit. I'm going to use this as my working model and see how it matches up to things as I keep moving forward. A review of Contemplative Fitness and MCTB on the first 3 might be good at this point. 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/5/20 10:36 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/5/20 10:36 AM

Making Adjustments

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Well, the 45/45 thing didn't really work this past week. I just ended up sitting less than normal. I've decided for this week to do my regular hour sits in the morning and then try and find another time during the day that can be any length, but I do want to keep track of how much time 2nd sit is.

Did noting practice this morning. I can tell that concentration practice has helped me with relaxing into my noting practice and keeping things smooth and loving. I'm much more gentle when I get lost in thought. Otherwise fairly uneventful, just noting lots of things happening.

The uneventulness did make a doubt emerge. I have already been doing noting for several months without a sense of any change or "progress". It has basically felt the same most of the time. I've gotten better at sitting through unpleasent stuff, but other than that I don't get a sense of progressing through any of the ñanas. Maybe its just a matter of putting in more time and having some patience, but there is the lingering doubt that maybe there is a better approach that I could be taking. 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/6/20 12:51 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/6/20 12:51 PM

Boring Boringness

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
An hour of noting this morning. Did some noting aloud and I feel like I got a sense for how to make that work. I did find that with noting aloud I miss some of the granularity of what is going on. I would switch back and forth, noting aloud when attention wavered and switching back to silent when concentration increased.

Concentration and tranquility are pretty good. There is a sense of "Is this it?" There isn't the same easy pay-off as there is with pure concentration. It feels pretty boring and uneventful.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/7/20 9:46 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/7/20 9:44 AM

Ok, something is happening

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Did an additional 45 minutes after dinner last night and probably 10 to 15 minutes while putting my son to bed. For whatever reason, my motivation has increased. Maybe it's the benefits of concentration and metta. I feel much more capable of relaxing and concentrating. It could also be reading Contemplative Fitness and Saints and Psychopaths. There is matter-of-fact quality to their descriptions of awakening that is emboldening.

Did another hour this morning. I had a sense again of an imminent coming-up of some sort. As soon as I noticed it it kind of dissipated. Maybe an A&P  on the horizon. Dunno.

Noting is certainly more taxing than pure concentration. I have to be intentional about relaxing and opening up to keep from getting too tense or rattled by the exhaustion. As advertised, the noting out-loud has also proven to be good at working through the defilements. I like to go to it when I’m getting too spacey, drowsy, restless or confused.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 4/9/20 9:46 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/9/20 9:46 AM

RE: Ok, something is happening

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Yes, Noting is more taxing only because you are more Gaining. emoticon 

Btw, in my experience strong samadhi arises at times during noting. Noting Aloud also acts as a Mantra really. Using calm voice , as Shinzen is suggesting can help get into a more calm and concentrated state but at time this will not happen no matter what you do emoticon In that case there is only Note fast and Acceptance of what is. That too shall pass (unless I cling to it with aversion or desire). 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/9/20 10:06 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/9/20 10:06 AM

RE: Ok, something is happening

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Do you change the pace of your noting or do you keep a pretty steady pace as you go? Sometimes I notice I get aware of a rush of quick sensations, and I start noting them all quickly in succession, and then kind of lose the thread.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 4/9/20 1:05 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/9/20 11:42 AM

RE: Ok, something is happening

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
"Anicca never takes a day off and has no lunch break" is a good reminder to have emoticon seriously all is changing. I never try to control the pace, I just do it and also Note this very intention I might have to start with. 

You will see that in the start there will always be some C&E in form of a jerky interplay between Intention and Object/s. This is usually the stage of trying to find a "proper" pace emoticon You cant. Just keep noting all that jerkiness and its utter unpleasantness. You are not in control any way. You are here to watch a teatre show!

That being said, NOTING PACE will change and get either very fast or maybe even very slow. Now, interesting is that when Noting Aloud is very slow and calm there is much more silent noticing going on inbetween the Aloud Noting. Or if there is fast noting aloud then the voice becomes more of a Fast Mantra-like and can be more of a whisper aloud noting even during the inbreath (try it this is possible when you whisper while breathing in. I find this to take place in A&P and then suddenly drops down into slow and chilled out Dissolution. Here you relax again and Noting pace gets slower.

I see our job to be in the very present. If there is expectation about certain stuff then NOTE "EXPECTATION" as this is PRESENT. "should I keep a same pace?" Note either "uncertainty" or "doubt" even if that is the case.

When thigs get WAY TOO confusing ALWAYS re-start the practice by returning back to the Body Sensations. Stop, take a deep breath and ask "Am I mindful right now? Let me see ... " and Noting goes on again; coolness, heat, itching, vibrations ...

Sorry if Im rubbling too much. Hope I've answered your question.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/9/20 6:35 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/9/20 6:35 PM

RE: Ok, something is happening

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
That's helpful. Starting to see more and more ways that I'm over-thinking it and lots of subtle stuff going on that I wasn't aware of. Trying to settle in to paying attention to what's there, whatever it is.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/9/20 6:34 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/9/20 10:42 AM

meh

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Did an hour in the afternoon yesterday. Afternoons are usually a guarantee of lots of drowsiness and spaciness, this time was no different, but it felt different. I noted the drowsiness and spaciness, and let it runs its course without fighting it. I felt like I was falling into some hypnogogic states but I was able to stay aware and concentrated through all of it.


Another hour this morning. Switching back and forth between noting aloud and noting silently. I feel like noting aloud makes me more aware of the stream-of-consciousness succession of sensations, and tends to be broader and coarser while with silent noting my attention gets more granular and I can see more details. Lots of getting spacey during both modes. Starting to note the spaciness along with things like boredom, urges (particularly to check the clock or quit), doubts, frustration ect. That stuff is much more subtle. I am aware it's there, but its so fleeting that I can't really perceive many details such as location in my body or shape before it's gone.

Gonna try and get in another session this afternoon. Maybe 45 minutes or so.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/4/20 2:41 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/10/20 9:54 AM

Jhana Comes A Callin'

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Hour-long noting sesh this morning, but sat down with an energetic feeling of faith to start. I thinik that's mostly from reading through Chris Marti's logs yesterday. Nothing like reading an account of Stream Entry to 4th path in the course of eight months to make the path feel very real and wide open.

Doing mostly verbal noting. Switching between eyes closed, eyes open and testing out silent noting v. verbal. About twenty minutes in I start to feel a sense of rest, quiet and tranquility between sensations. I start noting the tranquility and after a few notes in sequence the feeling expands to fill my awareness.

I don't have enough experiences with Jhanas to know this definitively, but this feels like a Jhana. My body is suffused with quiet and peace and there is a sense of open tranquil space expanding in front of me in my field of view.

This is a state I've experienced now maybe 7 times in the last 8 months. I had it happen four or five times the 2 months after my A&P experience, and it's happened now a few times since I started working on concentration, but this is the first time I've had it happen while noting.

I continued to note, although the sensations were very fuzzy and vague -- not much detail.

As I focused on the pleasent pressure sensations in my face, I could feel a welling of pleasure in the face and through the body. It's funny how the sensations in my face can feel so heavy and intense, but still pleasurable. It reminds me of the pressure and intensity I felt when I had an ear infection, but with a pleasant tone rather than the raw aversive tone from the infection. I cycled between pleasure and tranquility through the rest of the session. I kept waiting for a come-down but the tranquility was stable. Even as I'm sitting writing this now, it is still permeating everything. I'm looking out the window and it looks God-damn beautiful outside. 

I mostly kept with the noting but did take some detours and just watched the breath or settled into the tranquility. In the last 10 minutes or so I just chilled out in the good vibes. A little built of guilt that I should be noting when I was Jhanaing, but I spent the lion share of the experience noting, so not too much guilt.

Interesting note was being aware of the attachment, wanting and disatisfaction throughout the whole experience. It was subtle, but there was an urge for more -- to turn up the dial -- to become totally immersed in the feeling and to hold on to it. 

Feeling good vibes is great, but it feels like a victory to see the dukkha there too.

I like to think that there is a little magic when you read the accounts of others walking the path. I think about what I've been reading over the past few months and how I can trace the transmission of the dharma through the different accounts. Ledi to Mahasi to Hamilton to Folk/Ingram to Chris (recognizing that its not totally linear like that). I feel like I am opening a conduit to the awakening of others and feeling the flow of the dharma into my own practice. Maybe there is some truth to the Guru concept and the idea of Shaktipat in that sense. I think Chris even mentions somethings along those lines in his log.

Dunno if I will advance as far as others in this lifetime, but I feel the pull nonetheless. It feels like something I can place faith in. I don't need to try so hard. I can open up and let it unfold.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 4/10/20 10:30 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/10/20 10:30 AM

RE: Jhana Comes A Callin'

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
"Feeling good vibes is great, but it feels like a victory to see the dukkha there too."

yes emoticon being Awake really is liberating no matter what the experience is. And there is this rush from realizing this. Hence being Awake to This-ness becomes the home run! All else is just self-validating garbage that also is This-ness. All is equal under the hat of Noting.  

Nice one sais I emoticon 

 Btw, don't be disappointed if you don't awaken as Chris in 8 month time! You could awaken suddenly instead emoticon 


(I hope Chris doesn't notice me using smileys) 
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 4/10/20 12:44 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/10/20 12:43 PM

RE: Jhana Comes A Callin'

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Hour-long noting sesh this morning, but sat down with an energetic feeling of faith to start. I thinik that's mostly from reading through Chris Marti's logs yesterday. . . . 

I like to think that there is a little magic when you read the accounts of others walking the path. I think about what I've been reading over the past few months and how I can trace the transmission of the dharma through the different accounts. Ledi to Mahasi to Hamilton to Folk/Ingram to Chris (recognizing that its not totally linear like that). I feel like I am opening a conduit to the awakening of others and feeling the flow of the dharma into my own practice. Maybe there is some truth to the Guru concept and the idea of Shaktipat in that sense. I think Chris even mentions somethings along those lines in his log.

Dunno if I will advance as far others in this lifetime, but I feel the pull nonetheless. It feels like something I can place faith in. I don't need to try so hard. I can open up and let it unfold.

I spent time in a Siddha Yoga Dham in the early 80s, and shakipat from the guru was big-time there, like pentecostal-level bop-them-on-the-forehead-with-a-peacock-feather-and-they- be-gate-gate-gate. You grew up in that that LSD cult in Utah, you said, Brandon, so you know the power of set and setting in altered states, it's mama's milk to you and the whole Joe Smith bunch out there, and all their wives too. (My first wife, whom I married twice, was a Mormon, and I lived in Logan, Utah for a number of years.) I think faith is where you find it, and that, as advertsied, a mustard-seed-sized dose will do for practice, but like you say, the occasional recognizable wave of inspiration is truly sweet. The fact that whatever Mama Shakti gave you, and however it was transmitted, moved you to feel that much more deeply that your practice is trustworthy, and that you can relax a degree or two, open up, and let it unfold---- that speaks for itself.

You were talking about pace up higher there, and for what it's worth, I have found that pace in the iteration of your technique can make a huge difference, and that it is often counterintuitive--- i.e., when it is most overwhelming and the obvious move is pedal to the metal, it sometimes happens that easing off on the gas is what does the trick. Like music, too, the tempo can change the song in qualitative ways, same notes, different beat.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/10/20 1:02 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/10/20 1:02 PM

RE: Jhana Comes A Callin'

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
(My first wife, whom I married twice, was a Mormon, and I lived in Logan, Utah for a number of years.) 

Lol, it's all connected. Is there an X-file emoji?

Thanks for the thought on pace. I've noticed it kind of shifts naturally, but I'll play a bit with making intentional adjustments and see how it goes.
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 4/10/20 1:08 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/10/20 1:08 PM

RE: Jhana Comes A Callin'

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
(My first wife, whom I married twice, was a Mormon, and I lived in Logan, Utah for a number of years.) 

Damnit, this is unsettling.

Logan, UT is a beautiful place. I lived in Brigham City, a very small, desert-y little town west of Logan (and not in the mountains) that has one major claim to fame: it's close to the Golden Spike Monument, where the east met the west, railroad style.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 4/10/20 1:12 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/10/20 1:12 PM

RE: Jhana Comes A Callin'

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:


Thanks for the thought on pace. I've noticed it kind of shifts naturally, but I'll play a bit with making intentional adjustments and see how it goes.

The pace thing has meant the most to me in the dukha nanas, and most especially when i am close to panic and inclined to flood the engine with gas. It is especially good the worse it gets, and in Disgust it leads to the kind of thing you were noticing, of being more at peace with the goddamned practice's learning curve slope going obviously beyond one lifetime. If it's going to take eons, somehow, even mythologically speaking, there is no real sense in hurrying. I mean, an eon here, an eon there, pretty soon it starts to add up to some real long time. The practice of this moment, this iteration of the technique, this bit of reinvested faith in the 1-2-3 of your state of the art, body, breath, word/logos/ algorithm fractaling into uncountable time, sure, but also, this, and only this mustard seed of iteration. With that, you're already at Desire for Liberation, for that iteration, and often EQ comes like the next breath, so quiet that you may not even notice it for a while. And EQ is foot off the gas all the way.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/13/20 3:19 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/13/20 3:19 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
An hour of noting practice before lunch. 

Trying to hunt down the subtle things more and more. Trying to pay attention to my attitudes about practice and things like urges. Starting to catch the urge to open my eyes or to check the time. Interesting to follow the connection from the pain in my back to the urge to get up.

Got drowsy and spacy for a bit. About 45 minutes in I got a little tired with the noting and just dropped it all. Focused on the pleasant sensation of drowsiness which ended up escalating into a surging pleasureable experience. I grabbed on to that poured on the gas and it seemed to surge upwards into my forehead creating kind of a painful pressure until it subsided.

Felt like I was trying to replicate the tranquility that emerged the other day, like I was actively searching between sensations to find it. Didn't really catch it but I did get another surge of pleasure putting pressure on the forehead like before. Jhana? A&P? Not sure, but at the very least I noted the mapping, analyzing and confusion.

Finished off by chilling out with the breath then returned to noting.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 4/13/20 4:24 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/13/20 4:22 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Nice one!

Yeah that urge to check the timer emoticon and how noting cuts it down in its roots only to leave behind the Imagining of the timer in the mind. I place my phone a bit behind me so Im not able to see it as I practice with eyes open. At times there is this urge to check "how much" time and usually is accompanied with some preassure in the solar plexus and an image in my mind of the phone. So it goes quick, preassue in plexus, urge, unpleasant, imagining, and then attention moves to something else like itch or coolness or what ever. Practice goes on without the hindrance called restlessness. Works same with Ill will, Doubt and Sleepiness etc ... Noting really is a Plow for plowing through the hindrances emoticon Love this stuff!

And then the feeling of joy that comes up from realising that this shit works if one is on top it, tap, tap, tap, one after the other they arise and pass away ay ay ayyy emoticon 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/16/20 10:00 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/16/20 10:00 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
At times there is this urge to check "how much" time and usually is accompanied with some preassure in the solar plexus and an image in my mind of the phone.

That pretty much describes it. I'm pretty amazed by all the emotional stuff happening at the heart center. It seems to always ping or tighten any time there is something difficult, and to soften when good stuff happens.

Sometimes it's also just gas.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/16/20 10:41 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/16/20 10:39 AM

Feelin' Groovy

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Practice over the last few days has been solid. Some persistent themes:

1. Practice has been feeling easy and sustainable. I went into my sit on Monday deciding to act as if I was in equanimity and practice accordingly. Mostly sat quietly, doing nothing with some very slow and gentle and occasional noting.

2. I have no idea where I am on the maps, and I feel okay about that. I analyze or wonder when I practice, then I note it and move one.

3. I’m feeling more “space” in my life. I am more frequently seeing a gap between when I feel something and when I react. I’m able to watch the urges and decide what to do from there. I mostly just watch without doing anything. Last night I made a resolution to arise early to meditate even though I had stayed up a bit later. The resolution was very gentle and soft, much in contrast to “plans” I had made in the past that were always wrapped with tension, doubt and anxiety. I basically made the resolution with a “let’s see what happens.” attitude. I rose early as intended.

4. I can reliably drop into altered states. If I sit still I can quickly and intentionally open up to states of tranquility and pleasure and am able to turn the dial between the two. Not sure if that is jhana or what, but it’s there.

5. I am hopeful and enthusiastic about practice. I feel like I can see my mind changing. I still feel very normal and have up and down days, but I can see subtle differences throughout all of it.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 4/16/20 10:43 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/16/20 10:43 AM

RE: Feelin' Groovy

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Practice over the last few days has been solid. Some persistent themes:

1. Practice has been feeling easy and sustainable. I went into my sit on Monday deciding to act as if I was in equanimity and practice accordingly. Mostly sat quietly, doing nothing with some very slow and gentle and occasional noting.

2. I have no idea where I am on the maps, and I feel okay about that. I analyze or wonder when I practice, then I note it and move one.

3. I’m feeling more “space” in my life. I am more frequently seeing a gap between when I feel something and when I react. I’m able to watch the urges and decide what to do from there. I mostly just watch without doing anything. Last night I made a resolution to arise early to meditate even though I had stayed up a bit later. The resolution was very gentle and soft, much in contrast to “plans” I had made in the past that were always wrapped with tension, doubt and anxiety. I basically made the resolution with a “let’s see what happens.” attitude. I rose early as intended.

4. I can reliably drop into altered states. If I sit still I can quickly and intentionally open up to states of tranquility and pleasure and am able to turn the dial between the two. Not sure if that is jhana or what, but it’s there.

5. I am hopeful and enthusiastic about practice. I feel like I can see my mind changing. I still feel very normal and have up and down days, but I can see subtle differences throughout all of it.


Wow!
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/25/20 1:59 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/22/20 12:17 PM

Aversion to Fear

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Have done a couple of sessions while putting the kids to bed over the last few days. The first night I was feeling lots of pain/pressure on the ridge of my nose and center of my eyebrows. That discomfort made me start to wonder if I was in the 3 characteristics phase, so I thought I'd focus on the 3 characteristics. I seemed to check things off pretty quicklly -- yup, that's impermanence, yup that's dukkha, yup that's not meeeeewhooaaaaaaaAAAAAAAAAAA!

Things started dissolving and getting very creepy and energetic. had a few surges of terror as things dissolved and images began emerging in my field of view. One of the things that I have been dreading has been the scary aspect of practice. I am heavily aversive to fear and am concerned about how I will navigate that particular challenge. Not suprisingly, it was tough to sit still with. I sat with it for a bit but finally tapped out at around 30 minutes and had a horrible night's sleep.

Same thing the next night. I was able to sit more calmly through some of the creepy sensations but eventually decided to call it a night. 

I did quite a bit of practice earlier in the day on the second day and had no issue with it, so I'm wondering if it's just me dipping into 3 characteristics within the context of meditating in a dark room at night. It could also be entering into the Fear phase of the POI (duh). Who the fuck knows? I see evidence of both things. I'll need more time and experience with this stuff to discern things better.

Lots of mixed feelings. Worrying about the fear. Excited about learning equanimity in the midst of fear. Excited about the scary stuff as a sign of progress. Feeling like crap 'cause I haven't slept well in the last 3 nights and I feel like garbage.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/25/20 2:00 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/25/20 1:58 PM

Lost in the Wilderness (but at least its a pleasant journey)

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Still haven't hit any landmarks that would indicate a difinitive place on the POI. Generally feeling like I could be somewhere pre A&P again or still slooooowly sliding through dissolution. 3C's and dissolution sound the most accurate. In contrast I don't think I've experienced anything yet that would fit the description of any of the dukka ñanas. Don't know where I am, but it certainlly still feels like I am progressing. It's rare for me to have a session where something interesting doesn't happen.

Practice today was very chill and sustainable. Taking a cue from Contemplative Fitness I tried a pre-A&P practice where I investigaged a single spot. I ended up observing the sensations on and around the bridge of my nose for about 30 minutes. Lots of flux and shifting between sensations of pressure and pulling. Some subtle pinching, pulsing, folding, and dissolving. Ocassionally I would feel smaller sensations of rattling or shivering. Just seeing it for what it is and trying not to force a particular perception.

As practice progressed I got more and more tranquil and focusing on the nose area got harder. I felt like I could have sat for a very long time. My visual field started to get much more active. This is becoming more and more common in my practice. It is still mostly the dark screen you would associate with closed eyes, but I'm seeing a lot of motion and depth within the subtle variations of dark. I get the impression of complex forms, like you would get the impression of a body part while meditating. Nothing in full folor or defined contrast, but the forms nonetheless are fascinating and complex. As an artist I feel I could easily make a representation of them. They are organic and phantasmagoric -- faces and anatomies that are constantly shifting and recombining. Practicing in the middle of the day, there is nothing scary about them, but there is certainly a part of me that is wary of how things will unfold as practice gets darker.

The last 30 minutes was just open noting. After I was done I found myself in a very tranquil state with pleasant sensations accompanying the breath. I decided to hang out with that for about 10 minutes and just stay with the breath. I wouldn't have expected it, but it seems like an hour of vipassana makes my concentration stronger.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/27/20 9:29 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/27/20 9:29 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
It seems like I was going through a period for awhile where something interesting was happening every time I sat down. Lately, it has felt very uneventful. Lots of dozing off which leads to standing up or walking meditation. Generally very lethargic in the rest of life too.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 4/27/20 9:47 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/27/20 9:47 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
It seems like I was going through a period for awhile where something interesting was happening every time I sat down. Lately, it has felt very uneventful. Lots of dozing off which leads to standing up or walking meditation. Generally very lethargic in the rest of life too.


That's the ticket!
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/28/20 10:12 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/28/20 10:12 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
That's the ticket!

It probably wouldn't be much of a sign of progress if practice was always one thing or another. 

More of the same today. Drowsiness, spaciness, fogginess.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/29/20 9:02 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/29/20 9:02 AM

Yup

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Okay. More of the same. Drowsiness, spaciness, restlessness. Mind wandering. wanting to get up. I thought it might be that I was not sleeping well, but I've now been having similar sessions regardless of sleep or time of day. I've practiced in the evening, in the afternoon and the morning and it seems like anything less than Papa Che recommended noting-aloud-with-eyes-open is the only thing that will keep me on track. 

This is all starting to feel very similar to how my practice was a going a few months ago. I was quite discouraged at the time, but seeing this return to such familiar attributes feels like this is a natural part of the process. I don't regret the diversion I took into concentration, but it does seem like I kinda started from 0 and worked my way back up to this.

Did I hit another A&P again, just something much less energetic then the first time? My practice previous to this was feeling pretty pleasurable and effortless, but the I can't say the phenomenology matches what MCTB or Contemplative Fitness describe. I'm not perceiving sensations breaking up into tiny little pieces or getting any sense of a literal arising and passing of things. It continues to be mostly just a lava lamp like flow of sensations.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 4/29/20 2:36 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/29/20 2:36 PM

RE: Yup

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Dont worry about the Mapping. Kenneth Folk told me when I worked with him on my practice that he found it difficult to map me but even thats ok and one should not worry much about the maps as the maps are not the terrain. The only thing I ever needed from the Maps is the heads up on the possibility of the Dark Night after having some nice concentrated blissful meditation thinking thats all to it and that bliss is the goal. Before the knowledge of the Maps I had no idea what this practice can lead into. Its so much easier to practice and cntinue to do so when you know shit can really hit the fan at some stage emoticon and that, that too, will pass away if you really keep at it.

Keep noting that feeling tone you experience and mind states like Unpleasant, Misery, Sadness, Boredom, Restlessness, Doubt, Urge, Preassures in the body etc ... its ok if these get repetitive a lot and you think you should maybe change the words by looking at something else. Do that as well but NOTE that as well, note as Escaping, Desire, Aversion, ... and return to what is there even if that be repetitive leading into some Miserable state.

Its all food for the practice! 

Im in a very much similar state at the moment with some mixture of Jhana absorption leading me into a more laid back state and Noting Vipassana. Off the cushion (right now while writing this) I feel sadness (tearing sensation around the eys), emotional irritation which feels unpleasant, high pitch in the ears (neutral), pulsating in the head and heat (pleasant), vibrations in the hands and feet (pleasant), slight stiffness in the neck (slightly unpleasant), eye sight slightly defocused, a bit hard to follow what people tell me (need to ask them to repeat what they said). 

Practice keeps on even when its a blistering snow storm inside emoticon " Its always darkest before the dawn"
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 4/29/20 2:47 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/29/20 2:47 PM

RE: Yup

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
Kenneth Folk told me...

Four words for the ages.

emoticon
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 4/29/20 4:28 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/29/20 4:28 PM

RE: Yup

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Chris Marti:
Kenneth Folk told me...

Four words for the ages.

emoticon

It could have been "Chris Marti told me ..." but you didnt advertise yourself that well mate! To be honest I was looking far and wide for a teacher I could work with and it fell down on Kenneth who kindly excepted to be of help.
If I knew last year that you existed and that you will do it then I would certainly try as I guess you would do it for free emoticon 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 4/29/20 3:44 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 4/29/20 3:44 PM

RE: Yup

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Thanks for the reminder. There is always this nagging thought that there might be some subtle change to my practice that would clear the way forward if I only I could clearly identify where I was on the map.

Honestly, I don't think mapping gets too much in the way of my practice. I mostly just keep noting. I could try and fit some more sessions in during the day, but other than that...
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/7/20 10:30 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/7/20 10:30 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I had a moment two nights ago where I was making myself a snack before bed time. I was thinking about Buddhist cosmology (as I understand it) and how it can be seen as a permanent end of any type of experience. There was a part of me that thought, "Yeah, but even extinction is impermanent. It's a cycle and it'll all happen again and again off into infinity."

Thinking that way suddenly brought up this feeling of terror that I have had regularly throughout my life anytime I thought about the idea of infinite experience. It was a common thing I would feel as a child anytime I was being taught about "families being together forever" as taught in LDS Mormonism. I would have this image of hanging out on some heavenly grassy lawn all dressed in white with my family, and then what? It goes on forever and ever and ever and ever. And there is this horror of being trapped in the crushing fact of neverending existence. 

I guess it's a realization of samsara, but anyway, I had this feeling the other night, and it came on really strong, like panic attack level with my heart racing. In the midst of it I had the impression to accept it in some way, but by that time the feeling had passed and I just sat there, bracing myself agains the kitchen counter as my breathing came back to normal. There was a part of me that was like, "Let's feel that again! I can take it" It's always been a feeling that I have just wanted to avoid at all costs and now suddenly I am seeing it as this thing I can look at directly and learn to accept. I can't remember who said it, but someone compared insight to jumping out of an airplane and realizing you have no parachute. It's terrifying, until you realize that there is also no ground. This felt similar.

I can't remember when, but at some point between then and the next morning there was a moment, some type of opening where I had a glimpse of something. It was so brief, so my abilities at descriptive phenomenology seem totally incompetent. It was a sense of some sort of detachment or space, or sense of emptiness. Not a cessastion, as I was looking out the window when it happened (I think, mabye it was a dream).

The next morning just felt deeply tranquil and optimistic. I got up to meditate and sat effortlessly for an hour. I did some noting without labels, some noting with internal labels, noting out-loud with eyes open and some half assed attempts at concentration. At the end of it, I felt like I could have gone much longer. I did another half an hour while I was sitting on the couch later in the day. I am also starting to notice an occasional strobing in my visual field. 

There is a strong sense of optimism and I find myself fantisizing about Stream Entry. It's a reocurring fantasy that pops up as I am practicing. it's mostly just, "what if it happens right now?" I am trying not to take that too seriously and just note it, but I am feeling confident about practice. I've been through some ups and downs (nothing too epic, yet) and my practice has stayed consistent. I am getting a clear sense that my way of perceiving is changing bit by bit through the process. 

I was reading through the Shargol compilation last night and was feeling emboldened. Urges, craving, emotion are coming more clearly. Thoughts I can pick out, but I have a sense that there is more subtle stuff going on too. The acceptance and equanimity part seem like the place to get more practice. Also Shargol's affirmation that progress comes through consistent, ordinary practice.

We'll see how today goes.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 5/7/20 12:08 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/7/20 12:08 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
I will say something which might be of help or not. 

If we choose to believe that I have attained to SE then let me share one Maybe important aspect of my last years journey;

I NEVER , not even for a second assumed that out of that practice of mine SE will happen. Maybe because I believed such "serious" attainment might need decades of practice and many months of serious retreat time or even many lives of returning back to practice and then Maybe somewhere down the line in some other life that might happen. 

So. My only motivation was End of that DN Suffering. I've had enough of it and I knew deep into my bones that there was no way back and I must plow on forwards even if this makes me explode. 
From the old fall from EQ to Re-observation I knew I'm not to cling to the EQ if I ever get there again
But I Never, not even for a tiny second considered what this might lead to emoticon I was way too focused on that Suffering and not to fall back into it by clinging to EQ. This recipe somehow was the Key to enter SE. It happened when I least expected. Actually I did not even expect it. I guess I was stupid. Truth. 

What I'm trying to say emoticon is , maybe it's good to shift the focus from (as it is your mind after all) SE as it will happen in some other lives who knows when, and instead focus on not clinging to EQ but accepting all it has to offer and look at it until EQ becomes unsatisfactory (boring status-quo like). 

This is of course only if we choose to believe that this really was the case of SE for me and not some delusional stuff emoticon 

Any way, I think you are doing great by Noting those mind states connected to the desire to attain SE (or anything else) as that urge really is behind most (if not all) of Becoming. 

Im at the moment in a really Confusing state of mind, nothing much is clear, stiff neck, jaw is kind of clenching, ear frequency is high pitch, emotional irritation, hard to see where attention is ... but there is still this Awareness of all that I've just written above (I mean the confusion, non-clarity, stiff neck, jaw issues etc) Noting and Acceptance of this aspect will help see and let pass the mentioned nasties. It's not pleasant holding this Acceptance but it really brings fruits of purification. 

Ok I probably wrote too much already emoticon In case I missed the Mark feel free to ignore my rumbling emoticon 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/10/20 9:39 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/10/20 9:39 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
What I'm trying to say emoticon is , maybe it's good to shift the focus from (as it is your mind after all) SE as it will happen in some other lives who knows when, and instead focus on not clinging to EQ but accepting all it has to offer and look at it until EQ becomes unsatisfactory (boring status-quo like). 

I appreciate this direction. Trying to stay gentle and open about practice. I'd love to stick the landing on the first go, but at the end of the day I have to process what I have to process to awaken. If it means a few cycles, so be it. Whatever happens, this journey has been far superior to how I was experienceing life before. 

“Eternity has nothing to do with time. Time is what shuts you out from eternity. Eternity is now. It is the transcendent dimension of the now to which myth refers.” -Joseph Campbell

Thanks for the thought John. The trick now is to move a truth like this from the conceptual realm to the perceptual. Back to work!

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J W, modified 3 Years ago at 5/7/20 12:24 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/7/20 12:23 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 671 Join Date: 2/11/20 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
I had a moment two nights ago where I was making myself a snack before bed time. I was thinking about Buddhist cosmology (as I understand it) and how it can be seen as a permanent end of any type of experience. There was a part of me that thought, "Yeah, but even extinction is impermanent. It's a cycle and it'll all happen again and again off into infinity."

Thinking that way suddenly brought up this feeling of terror that I have had regularly throughout my life anytime I thought about the idea of infinite experience. It was a common thing I would feel as a child anytime I was being taught about "families being together forever" as taught in LDS Mormonism. I would have this image of hanging out on some heavenly grassy lawn all dressed in white with my family, and then what? It goes on forever and ever and ever and ever. And there is this horror of being trapped in the crushing fact of neverending existence. 
This quote has helped me when faced with these thoughts.  Also my wife deals with similar anxiety related to this concept. We generally think about eternity as a concept of time, but really, what is time?  It doesn't really exist, at least not the way we think it does.  It's really more of a human measurement, meant to measure human things. Infinity, on the other hand, is outside of our human concepts of time, and outside of existence and outside of reality itself, at least as we understand it.

“Eternity has nothing to do with time. Time is what shuts you out from eternity. Eternity is now. It is the transcendent dimension of the now to which myth refers.” -Joseph Campbell

Hope it helps...
Cheers,
John
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/10/20 10:06 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/10/20 10:06 PM

Things feel good

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I remember Daniel saying on another thread that traversing the terrain of the POI is a bit like climbing a mountain. The territory may follow a predictable trajectory, but day to day conditions may vary. There are some ups and down in practice. Sometimes I don't sleep well, sometimes I have an anxiety I am trying to resolve and sometimes I get sleeply.  I was watching the Space Invader Zim movie with my kids the other night and just feeling headachey and irritable. I ended up getting impatient with my son and yelling at him when he wasn't getting ready for bed. I felt shitty about it and fell into some habitual avoidance patterns. 

And yet, even with the ups and downs, it seems to be in a territory that is mostly tranquil and pleasant.

The last two sitting sessions I felt inclined to samatha and just let myself go there, and then returned to noting, but in a very open, broad way. I am still getting fatigue towards the end of sits, so I don't feel like I've got any super power equanimity, but the tranquility is very high.

I'm reading through Seeing That Frees, and am in the section in particular about samadhi. I was following some of his direction on cultivating samadhi after my sit today (similar, but subtely different from Braisington's directions for cultivating piti in Right Concentration). I sat on a lawn chair in my back yard. The weather, for my taste, was perfect -- overcast and comfortable in a t-shirt and shorts. The mindfulness of my sensations was very good and pleasurable. I sat and savored the exeprience and it turned into another meditation session, but I dropped intentions and just let mindfulness do its thing. I saw all the same stuff I would if noting, but just without the notes. It was all clear. Sounds, cravings, doubts, thoughts, sensations and visuals. Perceptions would merge together. Visuals and sound would seem to flow and connect. Lots of perceiving different sensations in unison. There seems to be a return to the wonder I felt post A&P, but with much more resolution and less attachment. About halfway through I transitioned to walking meditation and had a walking meditation unlike any I've had before. The effort and deliberateness were gone, and I just let myself walk and soak in all the myriad sensations. No noting "lifting, moving, stepping" just walking and sensing whatever I sensed.

It feels a little scary. I am feeling a sudden intensity in perception that feels a bit overwhelming. I feel a more rapid sense of things changing than I have in a long time.  A bit like, "oh my god, what have I done to my mind?" There is a sense like I just want to take a break from it, but it's exciting at the same time.

I need a good night's sleep then we'll see how I feel tomorrow.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 5/11/20 2:54 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/11/20 2:49 AM

RE: Things feel good

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
I remember Daniel saying on another thread that traversing the terrain of the POI is a bit like climbing a mountain. The territory may follow a predictable trajectory, but day to day conditions may vary. There are some ups and down in practice. Sometimes I don't sleep well, sometimes I have an anxiety I am trying to resolve and sometimes I get sleeply.  I was watching the Space Invader Zim movie with my kids the other night and just feeling headachey and irritable. I ended up getting impatient with my son and yelling at him when he wasn't getting ready for bed. I felt shitty about it and fell into some habitual avoidance patterns. 

And yet, even with the ups and downs, it seems to be in a territory that is mostly tranquil and pleasant.

The last two sitting sessions I felt inclined to samatha and just let myself go there, and then returned to noting, but in a very open, broad way. I am still getting fatigue towards the end of sits, so I don't feel like I've got any super power equanimity, but the tranquility is very high.

I'm reading through Seeing That Frees, and am in the section in particular about samadhi. I was following some of his direction on cultivating samadhi after my sit today (similar, but subtely different from Braisington's directions for cultivating piti in Right Concentration). I sat on a lawn chair in my back yard. The weather, for my taste, was perfect -- overcast and comfortable in a t-shirt and shorts. The mindfulness of my sensations was very good and pleasurable. I sat and savored the exeprience and it turned into another meditation session, but I dropped intentions and just let mindfulness do its thing. I saw all the same stuff I would if noting, but just without the notes. It was all clear. Sounds, cravings, doubts, thoughts, sensations and visuals. Perceptions would merge together. Visuals and sound would seem to flow and connect. Lots of perceiving different sensations in unison. There seems to be a return to the wonder I felt post A&P, but with much more resolution and less attachment. About halfway through I transitioned to walking meditation and had a walking meditation unlike any I've had before. The effort and deliberateness were gone, and I just let myself walk and soak in all the myriad sensations. No noting "lifting, moving, stepping" just walking and sensing whatever I sensed.

It feels a little scary. I am feeling a sudden intensity in perception that feels a bit overwhelming. I feel a more rapid sense of things changing than I have in a long time.  A bit like, "oh my god, what have I done to my mind?" There is a sense like I just want to take a break from it, but it's exciting at the same time.

I need a good night's sleep then we'll see how I feel tomorrow.
It feels a little scary. I am feeling a sudden intensity in perception that feels a bit overwhelming. I feel a more rapid sense of things changing than I have in a long time.  A bit like, "oh my god, what have I done to my mind?" There is a sense like I just want to take a break from it, but it's exciting at the same time.
This is one of the most interesting things about the occasional quantum jumps that occur in practice: we recognize abruptly that This Shit Is REAL, that what sometimes can settle into rote dogged plodding is actually quietly revolutionizing us, and then, when the right pebble at the right time sets of the more or less inevitable landslide and the earth starts moving away beneath of feet, we get of glimpse of the power of the forces we have been blithely dabbling in, and see that it's real real real and serious as a heart attack. But then it is so way too late, that the best thing we can do is read more Shargrol on MOre Surrender and Gentleness and Slow Is Fine.

Because suddenly it doesn't seem slow at all, it is happening very very fast. But it is precisely in the times sensed as Very Very Fast that the long patient dry and grueling training without any apparent effect in Slow Is Fine is revealed for the priceless labor-intensive deep cultivation of better habits that it is. Because the best paradoxical counter-intuitive thing to do with Fast is to Go Slower Still, just as the best way to handle a car in a skid is to steer with it, and the best route out of a burning house is usually straight through the worst of the heat toward the exit, and not retreat to a briefly cooler, quickly disappearing place where the fire hasn't reached yet.
I need a good night's sleep then we'll see how I feel tomorrow.
Perfect. One day at a time, come what may; one sit at a time, come what may; one breath at a time within the sit, come what may. This is also the way through the terror of infinity you discussed in another reflection above, on this thread. There is no eternity, if you go one breath a time. There is only the next breath, which none of us living has experienced as anything but ever renewed, by the gift of a spontaneously arising new inbreath. And if our worst fears come true and that next in-breath doesn't come, no big deal, we realize: it ain't a mormon picnic, where you find yourself, once the out-breath has evaporated and the in-breath hasn't arisen. That is a whole new place, there. Eternity takes on a whole new meaning, in that.

love, tim
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/11/20 9:17 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/11/20 9:17 AM

RE: Things feel good

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Slow Is Fine is revealed for the priceless labor-intensive deep cultivation of better habits that it is. Because the best paradoxical counter-intuitive thing to do with Fast is to Go Slower Still,

thanks man.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/17/20 10:50 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/17/20 10:50 AM

RE: Things feel good

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
After my experience where I thought I was in EQ (post with subject "Things feel good") things have come back down to earth -- a good indication it was probably not EQ but another A&P. I had a vivid dream the other night, the kind with the level of detail and clarity that only comes from doing lots of insight practice (I wouldn't call it lucid, as I couldn't control anything, but it felt orders of magnitude more real and detailed than regular dreams, and I've only experience these types of dreams since meditating. Is there a technical name for this?). It started out as banal and ordinary as a dream can be and suddenly became apocalyptic. I woke from the dream in a state of panic and terror. We had recently experienced 6.3 earthquake, which at the time I oddly found amusing, but now the memory of the quake reinforced a sense of impending, inevitable doom. I suddennly saw through the illusion of safety and felt a sureness of the death of myself and my family. There was nothing stable or safe. I thoughtfully calmed myself with some breathing and metta and eventually came out of the panic. After it passed I felt a surge of love and gratitude for my family and sense of soberness for how intense things can get on the path and a deep sense of humility. (kinda 6th ñana, no?)

That was basically the day when I got serious about finding some sort of teacher. It also gave me a deep sense of how important the support of others is on the path. Daniel makes the recommendation in MCTB that you have the right people on speed dial. I don't have anyone on speed dial. Once again, I am taking on a massively difficult project and not being humble enough to ask for the help I need in the process.

(For any other DhOers that are reading this, I should probably take this moment to express my gratitude that I have others that I can speak with about this stuff who will understand the experience. We all have to do this work on our own. I have to do this work on my own, but I can see how deeply I need the help of others to stay sane in the process. Thank you for any of you that are reading, and know that I humbly acknowledge how little I know and how much I rely on your support and wisdom.)

Fortunately, a few nights later I had another vivid dream, but it was a mix of tranquil and fantastical. When they're good, the dreams are really good.

Practice since then has been consistent, but less blissful, with a decent amount of craving, noticing dissatisfaction, aches in the chest, frustration, and boredom. I've been playing with things such as asking "who is experienceing this?" and paying attention to thought. I am noticing the pre-thought bubblings and pre-thought emotions. 

A very common experience lately is to be looking for thoughts and for thoughts to be happening and not realizing it until I notice a few seconds later! Very subtle stuff, much of which I am struggling to label. I feel something, and I am like "that was a thing, but I don't know what it was". I think much of that is probably emotion. I feel lots of subtle reactions, impulses, anxieties all leading from one to the other where I know where they are headed, but I don't give them time to emerge fully formed. I am paying attention to bodily sensations and mental impressions trying to sort out their order, but it's not clear enough to me. I can sit and note when I see a mental impression and when I am clearly feeling a sensation but the moments when I can unambiguously know it is one or the other come erratically.

Lots of spontaneous noting and awareness throughout the day. I am starting to see that it takes quite a bit of experience to really get a sense of the patterns. In life my interest in other things has dropped. I want to exercise, go hiking, meditate, work in the yard and write.

One thing this insight work is making clear is how many things in my life are driven by the achey craving feeling that is becoming so much more clear in my meditation. I can see this at the center of big ambitions and small past times and I just want to drop anything associated with that feeling. I think I've decided to drop Jiu-Jitsu for this reason -- It makes the decision easier with the gym being temporarily closed -- I have also lost interest in drawing for the same reason, which is tougher since this has been at the center of my ambitions for the duration of my professional career. It has been so ingrained in me that it was something I must do all the time, that I am having a hard time from detaching the ambition and tightness away from any pure enjoyment I once felt doing it. 

It's left me in a place now where I am very cautious about my motivations, and unsure how to judge and value my intentions, plans, goals and aspirations. Whatever plans I make in the future, I want to come from the right place (Right Livelihood much?) I want to take care of my family and anything on top of that I want to be driven by love and curiosity, not anxiety and ill-will. I clearly do not have the answer, but my priorities are quite radically shifting with practice. An emphasis on well being NOW does much to unravel unhealthy ambition.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 5/17/20 10:57 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/17/20 10:57 AM

RE: Things feel good

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
After my experience where I thought I was in EQ (post with subject "Things feel good") things have come back down to earth -- a good indication it was probably not EQ but another A&P. I had a vivid dream the other night, the kind with the level of detail and clarity that only comes from doing lots of insight practice (I wouldn't call it lucid, as I couldn't control anything, but it felt orders of magnitude more real and detailed than regular dreams, and I've only experience these types of dreams since meditating. Is there a technical name for this?). It started out as banal and ordinary as a dream can be and suddenly became apocalyptic. I woke from the dream in a state of panic and terror. We had recently experienced 6.3 earthquake, which at the time I oddly found amusing, but now the memory of the quake reinforced a sense of impending, inevitable doom. I suddennly saw through the illusion of safety and felt a sureness of the death of myself and my family. There was nothing stable or safe. I thoughtfully calmed myself with some breathing and metta and eventually came out of the panic. After it passed I felt a surge of love and gratitude for my family and sense of soberness for how intense things can get on the path and a deep sense of humility. (kinda 6th ñana, no?)

That was basically the day when I got serious about finding some sort of teacher. It also gave me a deep sense of how important the support of others is on the path. Daniel makes the recommendation in MCTB that you have the right people on speed dial. I don't have anyone on speed dial. Once again, I am taking on a massively difficult project and not being humble enough to ask for the help I need in the process.

(For any other DhOers that are reading this, I should probably take this moment to express my gratitude that I have others that I can speak with about this stuff who will understand the experience. We all have to do this work on our own. I have to do this work on my own, but I can see how deeply I need the help of others to stay sane in the process. Thank you for any of you that are reading, and know that I humbly acknowledge how little I know and how much I rely on your support and wisdom.)

Fortunately, a few nights later I had another vivid dream, but it was a mix of tranquil and fantastical. When they're good, the dreams are really good.

Practice since then has been consistent, but less blissful, with a decent amount of craving, noticing dissatisfaction, aches in the chest, frustration, and boredom. I've been playing with things such as asking "who is experienceing this?" and paying attention to thought. I am noticing the pre-thought bubblings and pre-thought emotions. 

A very common experience lately is to be looking for thoughts and for thoughts to be happening and not realizing it until I notice a few seconds later! Very subtle stuff, much of which I am struggling to label. I feel something, and I am like "that was a thing, but I don't know what it was". I think much of that is probably emotion. I feel lots of subtle reactions, impulses, anxieties all leading from one to the other where I know where they are headed, but I don't give them time to emerge fully formed. I am paying attention to bodily sensations and mental impressions trying to sort out their order, but it's not clear enough to me. I can sit and note when I see a mental impression and when I am clearly feeling a sensation but the moments when I can unambiguously know it is one or the other come erratically.

Lots of spontaneous noting and awareness throughout the day. I am starting to see that it takes quite a bit of experience to really get a sense of the patterns. In life my interest in other things has dropped. I want to exercise, go hiking, meditate, work in the yard and write.

One thing this insight work is making clear is how many things in my life are driven by the achey craving feeling that is becoming so much more clear in my meditation. I can see this at the center of big ambitions and small past times and I just want to drop anything associated with that feeling. I think I've decided to drop Jiu-Jitsu for this reason -- It makes the decision easier with the gym being temporarily closed -- I have also lost interest in drawing for the same reason, which is tougher since this has been at the center of my ambitions for the duration of my professional career. It has been so ingrained in me that it was something I must do all the time, that I am having a hard time from detaching the ambition and tightness away from any pure enjoyment I once felt doing it. 




Brandon, you are perfect right now. The more you can slow down and trust your instincts here, no matter how quirky or idiosyncratic or far-fetched or unlikely, the better you'll be. Easy, now, very easy: one thing at a time, starting with the breath, in she comes, arising on her own; out she goes, departing without a thought. You seem beyond haste and fear, or intermittently so, right now. Do nothing to try to stabilize that, but love the fuck out of it when it comes, and watch it without messing with it.


It's left me in a place now where I am very cautious about my motivations, and unsure how to judge and value my intentions, plans, goals and aspirations. Whatever plans I make in the future, I want to come from the right place (Right Livelihood much?) I want to take care of my family and anything on top of that I want to be driven by love and curiosity, not anxiety and ill-will. I clearly do not have the answer, but my priorities are quite radically shifting with practice. An emphasis on well being NOW does much to unravel unhealthy ambition.
You're moving so fast right now without effort. If possible, without effort, let it slow even more, sink in, sink, easy.

love, tim
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/17/20 7:57 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/17/20 7:57 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Equanimous? I dunno.

I've read descriptions recently from a few sources -- MCTB, Contemplative Fitness and the Shargol comp. Stuff there seemed to really be describing my experience for a few days. I was experiencing what seemed like formations, I was feeling tranquil, practice seemed to go into autopilot. It was just happening without me trying. I could just sit and soak up experience. That's the stuff that seemd like EQ to me.

On the flip side, it seemed like I had some big highs and lows. I had a really nice experience the other day that felt very EQ. It culminated in an intense pleasurable experience followed by the panic dream I just descriped, which kind of sounds to me like A&P into DN. I also am not putting in crazy hours of practice as I've heard happens with EQ.

Now I feel pretty good honestly. The last few days have been nice, but not over the top. Maybe that's an indicator of a good direction. 
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 5/18/20 3:52 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/18/20 3:51 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
emoticon

Equanimous? I dunno.

 I think you are in what is technically termed “un-fuck-with-ability,” in the Motherfucker tradition. I was introduced to this notion by an intense
lover, who was delighted to come into it, with a giant implication that I was the one who had been fucking with her the most, and that she was now immune. Her immunity to my bullshit was so beautiful that i forgot to be defensive; and in any case, I knew myself to be indefensible. You will always be blessed with all manner of well-intended advice and perspective, from people who love you, hoping to calibrate you properly to their own level of comprehensible misery. I am probably the worst offender here right now. May your enjoyment of un-fuck-with-ability begin with me, then. “Piss off, my man,” will do. 
I've read descriptions recently from a few sources -- MCTB, Contemplative Fitness and the Shargol comp. Stuff there seemed to really be
describing my experience for a few days. I was experiencing what seemed like formations, I was feeling tranquil, practice seemed to go into autopilot. It was just happening without me trying. I could just sit and soak up experience. That's the stuff that seemd like EQ to me. 

I still think that, in POI terms, it was EQ, but what my two cents are worth is slightly less than the value of the copper.  
On the flip side, it seemed like I had some big highs and lows. I had a really nice experience the other day that felt very EQ. It culminated in an intense pleasurable experience followed by the panic dream I just described, which kind of sounds to me like A&P into DN. I also am not putting in crazy hours of practice as I've heard happens with EQ. 

you lazy piece of shit! 
Now I feel pretty good honestly. The last few days have been nice, but not over the top. Maybe that's an indicator of a good direction. 

Yup. 

love, tim
Olivier S, modified 3 Years ago at 5/18/20 1:24 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/18/20 1:07 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 872 Join Date: 4/27/19 Recent Posts
Hello guys,

My 2cts, just some hopefully respectful thoughts to think about, or not :

-Meditation methods are ways of keeping one curious and motivated to practice. It seems to me that Brandon is getting benefits from his practice, feeling generally good, more light and spacious and acceptant in daily life, and that his curiosity towards mapping stuff is giving him motivation to practice well and a sense of confidence in what he's doing. It doesn't sound like there is unhealthy attachment there, not in excess anyways. I think you can use that curiosity about maps skillfully : why not print out the detailed ñana table (https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5037f52d84ae1e87f694cfda/t/5475825de4b0ac156d2453a4/1416987229931/Nanas+and+jhanas+tablep1.pdf) and really dive into your experience to figure out where you are, if that is a driving force for you ? Why would that not be skillfull ? What's the point of knowing about the stages if you don't try to grok them ? For me, 1st path was the time to do that (and afterwards too, actually), it gave meaning to my life and direction to my practice ; after that, it all started to unravel. It's not about attention anyways, attentional practices will break down eventually...

-Sure, this curiosity might at some point become a hindrance, but it doesn't seem to be that to me, right now. Rigid notions about what correct practice is, tight ideas around what is "being present", "being mindful", etc., will also inevitably unravel some day and create problems, IMO, but that's ok, all views will. When that happens, learning that needed to be learned will take place... Insight and meditation are not AT ALL just about being perfectly mindful about what occurs.

-About goals : dry practice that doesn't feel good but conforms to an idea of what practice should be, pursued not out of genuine moment-to-moment interest in said practice, but out of willpower, begs the question : what is the motivation to practice in that case ? Not the benefit of enjoying sitting and getting enough immediate rewards that the practice will propel itself onwards, but a notion of what practice does and where it leads to, right ? Otherwise, one wouldn't be sitting. And a serious commitment to that general direction, a faith in that, yes ? It seems logically necessary. That's great, very important, but then : who is more oriented towards an abstract goal here ?

It seems to me that Brandon is in touch with why he practices : he's experiencing the benefits, day to day, session after session, and excited about what else might be in store - keep that in check, but feeling good about meditation and motivated to keep going... sounds like the right direction to me.

-A note about noting : it's just one way to get really deep into experience. At some point it can become a hindrance too. Or not... Remember verbal noting is the Kazoo player. Not to be disparaging, but it's a quite gross tehcnique. In my experience, it was better to be silently observing things as precisely as possible. Brandon, you seem to have hit the "orchestra", the way you describe it, honestly if you can keep that level of subtelty without wandering off too far, I would say go for it. Attention and "noting consciousness" are part of something larger which is in a way ""more real", as you said, and that is the good stuff ! Personnally, during 1st path I was really curious about the maps and stages which acted as a strong motivation to pay subtler attention to the details of experience, and I never really used much verbal labeling, but got to SE, all the while being quite motivated to achieve SE. Why not. People are different. For instance, honestly, when I experimented with mahasi noting, quite seriously and intensly, I quickly realized it was preventing me from getting subtle...

-Willpower and discipline will only take one so far, and in the worst case, can actually damage one's practice long term, creating deep aversion and perhaps trauma, if one forces oneself to do something they are not enjoying for too long. I'm no psychologist, but I've experimented with both approaches and I know which was better. There's no formula. 

-Love is strong and flexible, willpower is rigid and brittle. IME, the single most important factor that propelled progress onwards, was learning how to finally love and accept myself and let go of guilt, and learn to do that with experience and love it. That was, for me, in retrospect, the key to 1st path. Then practice became easy. 

xox

edited

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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/18/20 5:03 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/18/20 4:55 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Tim -- You're a mensch. 
The more you can slow down and trust your instincts here, no matter how quirky or idiosyncratic or far-fetched or unlikely, the better you'll be. Easy, now, very easy: one thing at a time, starting with the breath, in she comes, arising on her own; out she goes, departing without a thought.
This has been running through my head lately when I practice. Thanks.

Olivier -- It's interesting to hear you're thoughts on noting. My A&P experience actually happened in the context of an unintentional "orchestra" style vipassana I had cobbled together over my first retreat. I was trying to stay focused on the breath, but my mind kept wandering, or I kept listening to sounds, or noticing sensations in my body. After the second day, I just kind of accepted that that was okay and relaxed into it. On the morning of the 3rd day -- KABOOM!

Noting, as Papa Che will attribute, turned out to be super useful in times when sitting still and consistently got tough.

To your point about the harshness of dry practice, I also found that taking a 2 month diversion into concentration and metta massively helped my insight work. I got deep enough into concentration that I learned how relaxed, effortless and pleasant practice could be. I came back to noting with a much better ability to still myself in the midst of restlessness. I now see how key finding the tranquility, love and curiousity is to making the process hum.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 5/19/20 2:30 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/19/20 2:30 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:

The more you can slow down and trust your instincts here, no matter how quirky or idiosyncratic or far-fetched or unlikely, the better you'll be. Easy, now, very easy: one thing at a time, starting with the breath, in she comes, arising on her own; out she goes, departing without a thought.
This has been running through my head lately when I practice. Thanks.

Olivier -- It's interesting to hear you're thoughts on noting. My A&P experience actually happened in the context of an unintentional "orchestra" style vipassana I had cobbled together over my first retreat. I was trying to stay focused on the breath, but my mind kept wandering, or I kept listening to sounds, or noticing sensations in my body. After the second day, I just kind of accepted that that was okay and relaxed into it. On the morning of the 3rd day -- KABOOM!

Noting, as Papa Che will attribute, turned out to be super useful in times when sitting still and consistently got tough.

To your point about the harshness of dry practice, I also found that taking a 2 month diversion into concentration and metta massively helped my insight work. I got deep enough into concentration that I learned how relaxed, effortless and pleasant practice could be. I came back to noting with a much better ability to still myself in the midst of restlessness. I now see how key finding the tranquility, love and curiousity is to making the process hum.

Olivier, +1 
Tim, you're a mensch
Brandon, i thought we were past the kind of overt anti-semitism that has plagued this site in the past.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/18/20 4:22 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/18/20 4:22 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Hibiscus --

First and foremost I just wanted to say that I totally appreciate your willingness to be direct and blunt with me about how you are perceiving my practice. We've got a scrappy little gang here and I don't take for granted anyone that is willing to walk the same path and offer support, encouragment or more importantly, the occasional slap in the face when it's needed. 

I do like to talk about maps a lot, and even reading back on my own logs, it gets very annoying. This is a quirk about the way I come to understand things -- I like to do a lot of speculating, and it tends to rub people the wrong way (ask my wife). It's messy, but I think it'll get me somewhere eventually. What happens in practice matters, but making sense of it matters too, and I think maps are part of that.

I understand the concern that it could lead to grasping or expectations, and it's a legitimate concern to keep in mind. When I look at it carefullly I don't think it's interfering with my actual practice, at least not right now. I think Olivier characterized it pretty accurately. Mapping is mostly an extracarricular activity that I find fun and motivating, but when it gets to practice, I'm all business. Not that I don't have mapping thoughts when I practice, but they don't account for much of my practice, and they are among the easiest to objectify.

What it will require to be awakened, I don't know, but I am doing what I can within the space I have right now. I'd love to do retreat time when it becomes possible again, but till then I feel good about my commitment. I have been practicing about hour a day, with few interruptions for the past 10 months. I remind myself of that every time I sit down to meditate.

There is a balance I think we all have to strike. As Grandma Dayton used to say, "It's nice to have something to look forward to." After half a lifetime of depression, I finally have hope and faith that life will getter via meditation. I want to awaken. I'm looking forward to it, and I have faith that the way to get there is THIS.

If I'm wrong, I take consolation knowing that you're willing to call me out. I say that with total sincerity and gratitude.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/12/20 3:07 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/12/20 3:07 PM

The Last Two Days

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
After the events of the previous post I noticed quite a bit of craving to get back there again the next day. The next day's sit was fairly uneventful but smooth. Quiet, slow noting. There was some discomfort and restlessness and it seemed like I spent some decent amount of time experimenting with the balance between restlessness and drowsiness. Opening and relaxing when restlessness emerged and breathing more energetically and noting out loud when drowsiness kicked in. The hour seemed to go by quickly which is very uncommon for me.

Today's sit there was lots of fansizing about SE again. Lots of "What if it happens now?" thoughts and strategizing about how to do EQ "right". Started with doing some metta directed at the chest area. Lots of feelings of craving which usually includes a tightness and ache in the chest. I noticed the tightness loosen up pretty quickly. With what remained I switched my approach to loving it “as it is” which loosened it up more.

Taking an approach of curiosity today as well, per advice from the Shargol Comp. Lots of investigating and looking at things. More playful approach. Investigating the sensations that make up the feeling of self. Noticing how my sense of space opened when I heard my daughter singing down the hallway. Noticed ordinariness and a feeling of ill will towards the ordinariness. Tried to observe attention and noticed the tension I felt when I tried to control it. I stopped trying to control it and it naturally started flowing between sensations.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/12/20 10:37 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/12/20 10:37 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I would honestly love to work with a teacher, for the exact reasons you've mentioned. A spot opened to work with Michael Taft a few months ago, but the finances weren't quite aligned at that time.

I feel like I'm constantly just throwing up my hands when trying to map. It's been almost a year since my A&P experience and I can't really say I've felt anything like the dukka ñanas (knock on wood), and now I'm in a place that seems to match all the descriptions of EQ pretty well. Maybe I'm just one of those. Maybe decades of depression already wrung some of that bullshit out of me, or maybe I've got it all wrong. A bit of work with a teacher would be nice give some perspective, but at the end of the day, like you say, it's just about what is happening from moment to moment.

I feel like what we are part of right now is an embryonic version of something that will hopefully become a much wider more integrated part of our culture some day. It doesn't seem optimal that the only support we have for our practice are other lone adventurers strung across the globe. And yet, at least we do have this community, we do share this practice, and we can make some sense out of all this. I'm not sure what I would have done with my A&P experience had I not found MCTB. It would have felt like a sick joke from God. 

All of that is just to say, that it would be nice if it wasn't so damn hard to get support to do this thing that should be a normal part of every human's spiritual development. 

If you ever wanted to make a referral I'd be interested in info about your teacher. I think it's always good to have as many options as possible when it comes to teachers.

OK! enough "stuff". Let's see if I can get in a bit more practice in before bed.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 5/13/20 3:31 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/13/20 3:27 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
I would honestly love to work with a teacher, for the exact reasons you've mentioned. A spot opened to work with Michael Taft a few months ago, but the finances weren't quite aligned at that time.


see above: When the student is ready . . . Sometimes without bankrupting you (as my jaunts to Richard Msss retreats contributed to, once upon a time when i had credit).

I feel like I'm constantly just throwing up my hands when trying to map. It's been almost a year since my A&P experience and I can't really say I've felt anything like the dukka ñanas (knock on wood), and now I'm in a place that seems to match all the descriptions of EQ pretty well. Maybe I'm just one of those. Maybe decades of depression already wrung some of that bullshit out of me, or maybe I've got it all wrong. 
You are suggesting that depression accomplished a lot of dark night work in advance for you with more than a little self-deprecating humor, so i will echo that, more than a little seriously. I think it did burn a lot of the bullshit out, which is, as John of the Cross says (it sounds better in the Castilian Spanish) one the the first benefits of the dark night, right after bringing us to a realistic humility as to the actual shittiness of our selves and our life.

A few years back some woman doing an article on depression and evolutionary psychology called me up, for some reason (hellamercy, i guess) to ask for a quote for the article from the "spiritual" perspective. I told her to call somebody else, then; she laughed, and we had two long, delightful, wide-ranging conversations, from which in the end, as she had told me from the start, she culled a single sentence quote from me, which wasn't "spiritual" at all.

The evopsychos basically tell evolutionary-flavored Just So stories, according to their biases, but the biases of some of the guys in the article did align nicely with my own biases. Several of them were making a case that depression, so pandemic in human beings, must have some evolutionary value, and they were making up nifty Just So stories to explain it. I tended to agree, given that Evolution is a ruthless bitch and murderous false idol: willing to sacrifice any number of Bartleby the Scriveners driving a steel-tipped clerk's quill through their left eyeball and mopey bipolar artists hanging themselves in their seedy garrets to produce one Abraham Lincoln or Winston Churchhill, with his notorious "black dog" of depression.

The quote I insisted the woman use in the article, since i was only going to get to say one thing, was, addressing the depressives themselves: "Don't bother worrying about any of this shit until you've gotten job 1 clear: don't fucking kill yourself." Suitably edited, and on an eight-second delay.
A bit of work with a teacher would be nice give some perspective, but at the end of the day, like you say, it's just about what is happening from moment to moment.
you two guys should start a cult on this notion and rake in the big bucks.

I feel like what we are part of right now is an embryonic version of something that will hopefully become a much wider more integrated part of our culture some day. It doesn't seem optimal that the only support we have for our practice are other lone adventurers strung across the globe. And yet, at least we do have this community, we do share this practice, and we can make some sense out of all this.
amen.
I'm not sure what I would have done with my A&P experience had I not found MCTB. It would have felt like a sick joke from God. 

Brandon, I love you, and i hate to say this, but . . . man, it WAS a sick joke from God, that Motherfucker with His patently perverse sense of humor, killing babies and innocents and loved ones left and right, just to help a few elite assholes realize that this shit goes deep, man, real deep.
All of that is just to say, that it would be nice if it wasn't so damn hard to get support to do this thing that should be a normal part of every human's spiritual development. 

i don't know if it can ever be otherwise. You did your depression early, but i did mine early and often, and what John of the Cross says about the darkest parts of the dark night is true: "The soul finds no solace or support in any doctrine or spiritual teacher. This dark night brings solitude and desolation with it. . . . Rather than being consoled [by the efforts of spiritual guides], the soul's suffering is intensified. She knows there is no hope, no cure, no release from affliction." (DK, II, 7:3)
If you ever wanted to make a referral I'd be interested in info about your teacher. I think it's always good to have as many options as possible when it comes to teachers.

OK! enough "stuff". Let's see if I can get in a bit more practice in before bed.

love, tim
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 7:36 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 7:35 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
Ooph, yeah I have a friend who is a big fan of Michael Taft, but the upfront cost is pretty crazy high. 

Here are some teachers:

https://www.reddit.com/r/streamentry/wiki/resources-teachers

http://noahsmonthlyupdate.blogspot.com/2017/12/links.html

You can also reach out to one of these teachers and ask them if they have any successful students or friends who teach. Sometimes teachers are too busy to take on more students or they charge a lot of money. Best to get someone who will have time for you and get to know your practice more intimately.  

I couldn't find Taft's price for teaching. How much is it? K. Folk's price is 125 US for a 45min over Skype. This is for one meeting and no commitments. You stop when you want to stop. I could afford only one meeting per month at that time. 

I wonder if one is motivated to practice more when money is involved? I think this could be the case as well as having that feeling of accountability to the teacher next time you meet.

HK do you pay your teacher or is it for free? 
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 8:47 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 8:47 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
I hope all the teachers who charge so much (which is fine) do at times some pro-bono work with those who have no money or those from countries known to have monetary issues. I prefer to believe they do, as compassion ought to be part of the enlightened ones (I assume). 
Rich and poor deserve to receive Dharma if they seek it. 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 9:59 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 9:59 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Most that I've seen have some scholarships open. I know that's the case for Michael Taft.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 5/27/20 4:23 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/27/20 4:23 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Most that I've seen have some scholarships open. I know that's the case for Michael Taft.


true. Linda just got one.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 8:50 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 8:50 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
Michael Taft charges 195 USD for an hour, but a person can sign up for 10 sessions at a rate of 1650 USD or 50 sessions at a rate of 7550 USD. 

Yes my teacher charges on a sliding scale and I contribute based on how I feel that day. Having paid for counseling sessions and taken piano lessons in the past, it is not an unreasonable amount in my opinion - certainly less than Kenneth and Michael Taft's fees.

Yes, the money aspect keeps me practicing, but also, I don't want to waste their time by showing up every two weeks without anything to report - that accountability has been really important. 

i actually think fairly viscerally that charging for the dharma is just plain wrong. if you can't walk around with a begging bowl and sleep in the forest, you should never have done this shit in the first place.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 10:10 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 10:10 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
i actually think fairly viscerally that charging for the dharma is just plain wrong. if you can't walk around with a begging bowl and sleep in the forest, you should never have done this shit in the first place.
I have similar feelings, but I'm not sure what the best answer is. I certainly don't like that good instruction seems only available to the wealthy.

Teachers need to have their basic needs met and a cost is a good way to filter out students who aren't serious, but the two things don't necessarily have to be coupled together. We need to innovate some alternatives and I think it's a super interesting issue.

Maybe I'll start a thread about the topic.





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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 10:26 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 10:23 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
Brandon, can you re-use one the many existing threads about dharma teachers and income? Here's one:

https://www.dharmaoverground.org/discussion/-/message_boards/view_message/5859590#_19_message_5859590
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 10:29 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 10:29 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I shoulda known. 
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 5/13/20 3:02 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/13/20 3:02 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
Hey Brandon,

First off, thank you for the encouragement you have provided on my logs! I'll provide an opinion on yours...


Brandon is a guy who keeps an eye on his friends.
Obviously nothing wrong with goals in meditation, but sometimes it's really helpful to talk to someone who understands the territory and has a few different students as everyone experiences these stages differently. As an example, my teacher has a student who does not really experience the dukkha nanas beyond dullness (so no existential crisis or any of that). She's mentioned some other students who have had some difficulty integrating their insights so this process runs the spectrum. 

Last night my teacher taught me the lesson of poverty,

having nothing and wanting nothing.


I am a naked man standing inside a mine of rubies,

clothed in red silk.


I absorb the shining and now I see the ocean,

billions of simultaneous motions moving in me.


A circle of lovely, quiet people

becomes the ring on my finger.


Then wind, and the thunder of rain on the way.

I have such a teacher.

Rumi

Here's the self indulgent part of my post on your log, but hopefully it illustrates the point: I've had some good convos with my teacher lately after showing her my practice log based on phenomenology of my recent sits - basically trouble shooting where I get caught up (off track) in my sessions and helping me understand where this ship is headed (which I see now is mostly my fault for taking so long as my teacher has been giving me good instructions the last few months, but some part of me has been too stubborn/pig-headed with regards to following through).
Getting to ask her about certain nanas and what I might be able to expect has been helpful considering everything I've read from MCTB (2) and shargrol and such... sometimes that missing perspective helps put all the other puzzle pieces together. I hate to call out the nanas for myself as I am such a skeptic, but after talking to my teacher last night, I have some confidence related to where I am. Time and practice will tell, but at least I know that my sits are productive based on my reporting, you know? A teacher could do the same for you!

And when the student is ready . . .
The above is said with the understanding that I've made less of a big deal about tracking the nanas in my practice, but I see that you're quite enthusiastic in terms of trying to conceptualize where you are... but maybe the right answer to that issue is to notice "This right here... and now this... and now this...."

"Waiter, I'll have what The Kid is having, please."

love, tim
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/13/20 10:31 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/13/20 10:31 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Tim and HK,

Thanks for the responses. I had a bit of a non-meditative insight about this last night that I'll post about elsewhere.

Tiim -- I'd like to hear it in the original Castellano.

HK -- I've been thinking a lot about your post since last night. Looking seriously into this. Thanks for the referrals. Noah's page also seems to be a resource that contains everything I've clawed and scratched to find over the last 10 months. I'll have to bookmark it.

Didn't you say he's got a good log too? Is that on the same site?
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 3:40 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 3:40 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Tim and HK,

Thanks for the responses. I had a bit of a non-meditative insight about this last night that I'll post about elsewhere.

Tiim -- I'd like to hear it in the original Castellano.



https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/h3iweeurzz6dxwe/nocheoscura.mp3
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 10:15 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/14/20 10:15 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Tim Farrington:
Brandon Dayton:
Tim and HK,

Thanks for the responses. I had a bit of a non-meditative insight about this last night that I'll post about elsewhere.

Tiim -- I'd like to hear it in the original Castellano.



https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/h3iweeurzz6dxwe/nocheoscura.mp3


That's pretty sick. Is that you reading?
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 5/16/20 5:49 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/16/20 5:49 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Tim Farrington:
Brandon Dayton:
Tim and HK,

Thanks for the responses. I had a bit of a non-meditative insight about this last night that I'll post about elsewhere.

Tiim -- I'd like to hear it in the original Castellano.



https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/h3iweeurzz6dxwe/nocheoscura.mp3


That's pretty sick. Is that you reading?
emoticon
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/23/20 3:04 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/20/20 10:03 AM

A pattern?

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Practice soldiers on. Been doing the normal hour sits, but I've been able to fit in some extra practice over the last few days.

I'm seeing a little pattern. Sits feel normal, I note. I note out loud when hindrances crop up. I'm mostly noting the normal stuff, but I spend bits of time being curious about self, or just listening for thoughts (very slippery). I am starting to notice intentions to think and other vague intentions for my mind to go someplace that I can't quite even note accurately. I had one sit where I felt like I was seeing the pieces that made up my sense of self. I started to get emotional, as if greiving for the loss of self.

Then I have sits where awareness is happening without the noting. They get very pleasant and almost overwhelming. Two days ago I had one of these sits again while I was sitting outside. I was reading in Seeing that Frees that nature compliments samadhi, and it seems like just crossing the threshold from inside to back-yard is enough to get the juices flowing. I was practicing in the lawn chair again, just being open to sensation. It was very pleasant when I decided to tip my head back and look at the sky. 

It filled my entire field-of-view and sent me into a place that felt like I was on acid. It was the first time I think I've ever understood what the Trascendentalists meant by "the sublime". It was enormous, beautiful and terrifying (A bit like how I imagine falling into the face of Jupiter would feel). Anyone that would have happened to see me would have thought I was tripping balls. I was literally gesturing up at the sky with a big grin on my face saying, "The sky...The SKY!!!!" Eventually, the neighbors ended up coming into their backyard and chatting and I felt like I was eavesdropping, so I packed it in. I had a difficult time sleeping that night as the high energy of the experience was still running through me. Lots of flashes of images and such. It really does feel like my mind is being re-wired.

I did a big hike yesterday that gutted me for the rest of the day. I put off my sit till the end of the day and was doing lots of head bobbing.

This morning's sit felt quite ordinary. The first half hour was noting silently and out-loud. Mind wanering and restlessness increased after that. I switched between noting anchored by the breath and the noting out-loud as restlessness and mind wandering played tag-team.

So now I'm waiting to see if this pattern continues or how else it might develop.

Another thing I have been wondering about -- I've had a hard time identifying the Dark Night and this stuff I am calling EQ has felt very, very good. I wonder if this has to do with the baseline I entered into all of this. I was depressed for many, many years before I crossed the A&P, so that is my baseline for "normal". When I crossed the A&P, it was a HUGE positive change. The only way I have been able to describe it is to compare it to my experiences with MDMA. It was dramatic. What I potentially experienced as the Dark Night did not feel as bad as I expected because it just kind of felt like a return to the baseline of depression (When I read about Desire for Deliverance, that honestly sounds like the last few years of my life). Now I am in a place that feels good, but not as ecstatic as the A&P stuff (but also better in a way). I have been doubting it is EQ, since EQ is suppossed to feel neutral and I mostly feel either good or GRRRRRREAT. But considering that my baseline was so low to start with, it would make sense that neutral would be subjectively perceived as more than neutral.

Just a theory.
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J W, modified 3 Years ago at 5/20/20 11:17 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/20/20 11:17 AM

RE: A pattern?

Posts: 671 Join Date: 2/11/20 Recent Posts
Hey Brandon that sounds awesome man, seems like whatever/wherever you are, it's working, so keep it up!

I don't know if this is helpful but maybe it will inspire some thought- the 'sublime' you talked about- i wonder if this is a manifestation of Anatta/non-self/the Void/Voidness? 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/20/20 11:27 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/20/20 11:27 AM

RE: A pattern?

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Thanks for the encouragment.

This was very much an experience and a very big one, so I don't know if it would qualify as any sense of voidness. I have felt the rare moment of rest in between sensations, but I'm not ever sure that counts as a sense of rest is still a sense of something.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/21/20 8:58 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/21/20 8:58 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
45 minute slog this morning. Lots of hindrances. Didn't sleep well the night before and was nodding off a bunch. Noted dissatisfaction with practice and craving for it be like previous sessions. Otherwise the noting was mostly gross bodily sensations with some thoughts and urges here and there. Hoping to get another one in today.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 5/21/20 12:45 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/21/20 12:45 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
When shit hits the fan try and recollect that all beings suffer just like you. We all struggle with it hence it's in a way "ours". The suffering slaps you on one cheek, you offer it the other one. Note it. Slap! Unpleasant and acceptance. Slap! Unpleasant and acceptance. Slap! ... until timer goes off. 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/23/20 2:53 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/23/20 2:53 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Thanks for the pep talk. Got in another hour session later that day after reading your response.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/23/20 3:03 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/23/20 3:03 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
40 minutes yesterday cut short to pick my brother up from the airport. Was able to get some more practice in will hiking later that day. It was much colder and windier that I expected so I did some noting aloud to stay present and not be miserable. It worked suprisingly well. Noted the sensations of the wind, whether coolness or pulling and pushing. Noted the anxiety, but also noted the craving to get around the next bend or to be done. The miserable sensations I would normally have grabbed on to during something like this evaporated as I noted them. A suprisingly calm experience, with some moments of actual enjoyment.

An hour this morning. Started with noting out-loud for about 15 min then switched to silent. Trying to work with hindrances on a subtler level. Used the breath as an anchor when my mind wandered or I got restless, or would drop intentions for a while to let my body drop into a deeper sense of samadhi. Spent some time noting without mental labels, just being awere of sensations in my mouth, the feeling of the carpet on my feet and the little mental urges and cravings that popped up. I still feel like I need mental notes to really catch the subtle stuff. Noted sensations of rest here and there, and spent some time doing Kenneth Folk's "thinking-not thinking" practice. Noted discomfort in the body as the sit drew to a close.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 5/23/20 4:02 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/23/20 4:02 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
"spent some time doing Kenneth Folk's "thinking-not thinking" practice"

Im not familiar with this! Can you tell me more? Cheers mate!
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/23/20 8:20 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/23/20 8:20 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
It's meant to a be a practice for ferreting out slippery thoughts. It's binary noting, either you are thinking or you are not thinking. I check every breath. If am thinking during a breath I note "thinking", if I am not thinking during the next breath, "not thinking".

From this section of contemplative fitness:


https://eudoxos.github.io/cfitness/html/cfitness.html#mid-equanimity
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/24/20 10:15 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/24/20 10:15 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
How do I summon Chris Marti to help split a thread?
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 5/24/20 12:19 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/24/20 12:19 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
What thread do you want to split, Brandon?
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/24/20 9:38 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/24/20 9:38 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Long enough to split this one?
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 5/25/20 8:32 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/25/20 8:32 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
I usually start thinking of splitting a thread when:

1. It gets so long it loads too slowly when I try to open it
2. It's well over 200 posts long

Neither is the case for this thread.

Why do you want to split it?
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/25/20 9:41 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/25/20 9:41 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Ok. I wasn't aware of the protocol. I just didn't want it to be annoying for anyone to read. I can wait until there's a good reason to split it.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/25/20 9:59 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/25/20 9:59 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
On another note, the "Message Board Home" doesn't load correctly when I click on it. I see the index of various topics for a split second and then a random assortment of posts appears. I'm not able to create new posts.
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 5/25/20 4:07 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/25/20 4:07 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
Brandon, you created the post on which you said you couldn't create posts. Do you mean you can't start a whole new topic?
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/25/20 6:06 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/25/20 6:06 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Nm. I think I figured it out. I had somehow collapsed the menu.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 5/24/20 10:23 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/24/20 10:23 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Oh ok I see. I do something similar when I get into a state thats unclear and just Uncertain all the time so I label "certain" when Im clear about a sensation and "uncertain" when unclear, but this usually turns to "certain" all the time and remedies the Uncertainty dull state. Then I just resume normal freestyle noting.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 5/24/20 10:46 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 5/24/20 10:46 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I've also done the version "noisy-quiet" when I'm not sure if it's a thought, but it's...something.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/5/20 2:24 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/5/20 2:24 PM

Practice Continues

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Practice continues even when my log doesn't. I've started working with a meditation teacher, and I'm adapting to how that effects my practice. I've been recommended practicing in intervals of noting and concentration with specific 7 point breathing instructions on concentration (It sounds like other students of Abre on DhO are doing something similar). The 7 point breathing is tough for me to figure out. I'm giving it it's due, but I switch to other approaches when hindrances crop up.

Practice has felt bumpy lately. Lots of working with drowsiness and lethargy, which is just something that has not been much of an issue before. I feel like I am finding my way through it. In the past, my response would be to do very energetic things to react, such as switching to standing. I've experimented a lot with being absorbed by the sleepiness, and I find I can stay alert and still note, but it doesn't seem productive right now. Just a lot of dullness. I've had luck with subtle concentration. Not sure how it works, but I can intuit my way into a place that is concentrated and but also very calm and relaxed. Somehow this allows me to not be overwhelmed by the sleepiness.

I'm finding the bumpiness to be a valuable time to strengthen certain areas of my practice such as faith, commitment and equanimity. Not that I even have to try to work on those things, I just see them functioning more effectively each time I pass through a rough spot. The anxiety and doubt is harder to justify after you've put in a certain amount of time.  

I'm starting to gain a bit more confidence in identifying where I am in cycles, but things still feel uncertain. I was feeling some intense negative body feelings during my sit last night (pain, discomfort, sadness, heaviness, aversion), although I was happy with my equanimity throughout. Then, last night, I had a crackle of energy and a sensation like coming out of a waterslide that woke me up and made me immediately aware of all my body sensations followed by flashing,flowing, dissolving images that started to creep me out. It appeared to be a 3C's to A&P to Dissolution to Fear thing.

Practice this morning involved much more mind wandering then I am used to. I'm getting too wrapped up in current events and it made concentration a challenge. With time, things settled down. During noting I took a moment to break apart the chain of sensations leading to my anxiety - anticipation of mind bringing up stressful subject, image of a guy I'm having a dissgreement with on facebook, ache in my chest, urge to compose a response, and then it's all gone. By the end of the sit I was noting and my concentration felt very strong and calm.
 
 
Sam Gentile, modified 3 Years ago at 6/5/20 2:36 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/5/20 2:36 PM

RE: Practice Continues

Posts: 1310 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Practice continues even when my log doesn't. I've started working with a meditation teacher, and I'm adapting to how that effects my practice. I've been recommended practicing in intervals of noting and concentration with specific 7 point breathing instructions on concentration (It sounds like other students of Abre on DhO are doing something similar). The 7 point breathing is tough for me to figure out. I'm giving it it's due, but I switch to other approaches when hindrances crop up.

Practice has felt bumpy lately. Lots of working with drowsiness and lethargy, which is just something that has not been much of an issue before. I feel like I am finding my way through it. In the past, my response would be to do very energetic things to react, such as switching to standing. I've experimented a lot with being absorbed by the sleepiness, and I find I can stay alert and still note, but it doesn't seem productive right now. Just a lot of dullness. I've had luck with subtle concentration. Not sure how it works, but I can intuit my way into a place that is concentrated and but also very calm and relaxed. Somehow this allows me to not be overwhelmed by the sleepiness.

I'm finding the bumpiness to be a valuable time to strengthen certain areas of my practice such as faith, commitment and equanimity. Not that I even have to try to work on those things, I just see them functioning more effectively each time I pass through a rough spot. The anxiety and doubt is harder to justify after you've put in a certain amount of time.  

I'm starting to gain a bit more confidence in identifying where I am in cycles, but things still feel uncertain. I was feeling some intense negative body feelings during my sit last night (pain, discomfort, sadness, heaviness, aversion), although I was happy with my equanimity throughout. Then, last night, I had a crackle of energy and a sensation like coming out of a waterslide that woke me up and made me immediately aware of all my body sensations followed by flashing,flowing, dissolving images that started to creep me out. It appeared to be a 3C's to A&P to Dissolution to Fear thing.

Practice this morning involved much more mind wandering then I am used to. I'm getting too wrapped up in current events and it made concentration a challenge. With time, things settled down. During noting I took a moment to break apart the chain of sensations leading to my anxiety - anticipation of mind bringing up stressful subject, image of a guy I'm having a dissgreement with on facebook, ache in my chest, urge to compose a response, and then it's all gone. By the end of the sit I was noting and my concentration felt very strong and calm.
 
 
Welcome back! I missed your posts. Abre hasn't introduced the 7-point breathing with me. We meet for the 2nd time next week,
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/5/20 3:05 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/5/20 3:05 PM

RE: Practice Continues

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Sounds like you've spent your fair share of time with concentration practice, so you may not need such specific instructions. Still not sure if it works for me, honestly.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/5/20 8:15 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/5/20 8:15 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
It's a different technique than I'm used to for concentration on the breath. Focusing on each segment of the breath breaks up the flow of sensations in a way that feels clunky for me, and I often end up getting lost in thought. Maybe I'm being too intentional with labeling each segment and it's making the concentration too tight and effortful, maybe it's meant to be kind of a hybrid concentration/vipassana technique, or maybe I just need time with it. I'll talk more about it with Abre when I have the chance.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 6/6/20 2:12 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/6/20 2:12 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
HK is Abre also your teacher? Was she Kenneth Folks student at some time? I remember reading something on DhO but forgot the name of that person. I think it might be her. 
Sam Gentile, modified 3 Years ago at 6/6/20 11:17 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/6/20 11:17 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 1310 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
Yep, she is my teacher.

She was a student of Kenneth's: 

https://twitter.com/KennethFolk/status/1037548918379347968
She's my teacher too.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 6/6/20 4:59 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/6/20 4:59 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
Yep, she is my teacher.

She was a student of Kenneth's: 

https://twitter.com/KennethFolk/status/1037548918379347968

Good to know thanks! How is she as a teacher? I mean is she "my way or highway" or does she give the student the freedom to choose the practice from the tool box she offers? Is she from Europe? 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/6/20 6:02 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/6/20 6:02 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I've only done one session, but I got a good vibe from our first consultation. I think she's French.

HK would be able to say more.
Sam Gentile, modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 9:10 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 9:10 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 1310 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
With regards to Abre as a teacher:

Yes she is from France, but lives in the US (EST). 

She has studied with Kenneth (obvs) and I believe he 'authorized' her to teach, if that means anything to prospective students. She is steeped in the Pragmatic Dharma world.

In her 20's, she invested a lot of time practicing according to the instructions in the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali which is a concentration/siddhi based yogic system. Worth asking her about maybe.

She seems to have extensive knowledge of the Tibetan Elephant Path system as is laid out in "The Mind Illuminated", but (if my memory serves correctly) she felt that TMI missed the mark slightly in presenting that particular system accurately - but that's not to say TMI is somehow a bad resource. She's read it herself, but that's not how she practiced in that particular system.

I am sure she has waaayyyy more experience than what I laid out above (and she has revealed more than what I wrote above but I want to keep it somewhat brief). She has a lot of practical knowledge and has been very open to trying practices I've brought up to her. She is great as she has walked the fine line between being kind, understanding, but also strict and sometimes fed up with me when I'm being difficult (I mean, look at my previous logs and you'll see I like to complain and get angsty). She takes it all in stride. She simply wants students who are sincere and will put in the work, and besides that, I don't interact with her besides my biweekly video chats and the occasional intermittent email. It's funny - rereading what I just wrote above may not be a 'glowing review', but I think that's maybe how it should be... Like if she was just nice all the time, I'd get complacent and she hasn't allowed that to happen, you know? Yeah I pay her, but she isn't just boosting my self esteem all the time in the hope of a good contribution. Reminds me of my piano teacher in a way - takes no shit, won't accept half rate practice, but still wants the best for me. I think that's a productive balance. This is someone I'd never be able to worship and that's how it should be. 
Thanks for puttting this in here. She hasn't answered yet my questions on her background.
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Steph S, modified 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 7:39 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 7:34 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 672 Join Date: 3/24/10 Recent Posts
Is Abre a one who has got it done?

I basically never hear about women folk in the pragmatic dharma circles who are Arahantas. (Maybe she's not - correct me if I'm wrong). It is so heavy with men, with regards to people who are post 4th path that I read about. I'd love a list of non-binary and women post-4th pathers, that are alive today, who are ordinary laypeople and not ordained. WHO ARE THEY? I NEED TO KNOW. WHERE ARE THEY? Why aren't they here on DhO?

I'm gonna hijack the shit out of this conversation, and go all feminist on everybody's ass and I'm not even gonna apologize. Me & Linda are the only non-binary or women folk who post with any regularity in these modern times that I know of on DhO. 

emoticonemoticonemoticon
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 7:55 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 7:55 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
I know Abre, and my answer to your question, Steph, is yes.
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Steph S, modified 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 8:01 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 8:01 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 672 Join Date: 3/24/10 Recent Posts
Amazing. Too bad she doesn't post here. I don't know that I'm in the market for a formal teacher right now, but ya never know. It could be cool to talk to her. Would you PM me her info, Chris, if you think she'd be okay with that.
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 6:39 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 6:39 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
Would you PM me her info, Chris, if you think she'd be okay with that.

PM sent.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 1:08 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:10 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Steph S:
Is Abre a one who has got it done?

I basically never hear about women folk in the pragmatic dharma circles who are Arahantas. (Maybe she's not - correct me if I'm wrong). It is so heavy with men, with regards to people who are post 4th path that I read about. I'd love a list of non-binary and women post-4th pathers, that are alive today, who are ordinary laypeople and not ordained. WHO ARE THEY? I NEED TO KNOW. WHERE ARE THEY? Why aren't they here on DhO?

I'm gonna hijack the shit out of this conversation, and go all feminist on everybody's ass and I'm not even gonna apologize. Me & Linda are the only non-binary or women folk who post with any regularity in these modern times that I know of on DhO. 

emoticonemoticonemoticon
you can't hijack an already hijacked conversation, Steph. Can you? Oh, I see. You just did!

nice move.

This is a better hijack, if so. If you can get more women like you and Linda around this macho, locker room, towel-snapping old boys shooting the privileged shit, then more power to you. I'm with this hijack now. Papa Che was driven off by Chris's grimness anyway.

Call me white hetero cis, worst possible thing as i understand it, redeemed only by my patent insanity, but don't we have enough de facto patriarchy in the religions we tried to abandon? We're like the Russian Revolution's secret police. We call each other "Comrade" while we shut the dissidents down. Fucking Tsar's secret police never called each other "Comrade," did they? So there IS progress, Comrade Steph. Now go get us another round of drinks.

oops, my bad. How patriarchal of ME.

Now go get us another round of drinks, PLEASE.

p.s. Brandon, if Steph is mean to me because of my male pig lapses, i will help you hijack the conversation back to your practice, and the Dharma talk that prevails here normally, or whatever you do on this thread during non-riot intervals. But act quickly, please, my friend, if she's riled. She is a tigress. Linda is a tigress. Two tigresses mad at me at the same time does not bode well for, uh, well . . . me.

Papa Che, save yourself! Leave me to hold the rear! keep running.

Chris, [obscenity deleted, per DhO forum rules and protocols].

p.s. 
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 1:10 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 1:10 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
All good here emoticon drinking my morning coffee. I guess we ARE getting off topic here in Brandon's log. My apologies mate! I'm Nobely out unless I have Noble speech to offer emoticon 
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Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 6:46 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 6:46 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 7134 Join Date: 12/8/18 Recent Posts
Steph S:
Is Abre a one who has got it done?

I basically never hear about women folk in the pragmatic dharma circles who are Arahantas. (Maybe she's not - correct me if I'm wrong). It is so heavy with men, with regards to people who are post 4th path that I read about. I'd love a list of non-binary and women post-4th pathers, that are alive today, who are ordinary laypeople and not ordained. WHO ARE THEY? I NEED TO KNOW. WHERE ARE THEY? Why aren't they here on DhO?

I'm gonna hijack the shit out of this conversation, and go all feminist on everybody's ass and I'm not even gonna apologize. Me & Linda are the only non-binary or women folk who post with any regularity in these modern times that I know of on DhO. 

emoticonemoticonemoticon

That difference stood out for me very clearly when I first entered the context of dharma. It seemed like the women and non-binary people who had had realizations didn't go around bragging about it because they realized that it isn't a personal accomplishment whereas there were plenty of men who were willing to talk about their enlightenment and for that reason were celebrated. I found one woman on youtube. She talked about it in an entirely different way than the men. Unfortunately she wasn't alive anymore, it turned out.

Mukti? Tina Rasmussen? Catherine McGee? 
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 8:17 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 8:17 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
My personal observation is that women can be found more in the Zen and Vajrayana traditions. This pragmatic dharma thing seems to attract testosterone more than estrogen. Not sure about the Thai Forest tradition or any others.

FYI - more contemporary awakened women - Emily Horn also comes to mind, and Kenneth Folk's wife Beth.
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Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 9:08 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 9:08 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 7134 Join Date: 12/8/18 Recent Posts
That makes sense. For some strange reason I have always been very comfortable in environments where soft nerds like to play macho. I think I may be a soft nerd playing macho myself, and since I don't look the part, I get away with not being consistent about it. 

Lol, realized women in no need of the spotlight, patiently watching their husbands standing at the center of it? 
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 9:37 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 9:37 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
No, please don't get the wrong impression. Both of those women have advanced practices and they are both prominent teachers and coaches in their own right.
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Steph S, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 9:49 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 9:49 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 672 Join Date: 3/24/10 Recent Posts
Chris Marti:
No, please don't get the wrong impression. Both of those women have advanced practices and they are both prominent teachers and coaches in their own right.
The list is growing. I knew that Emily practiced and taught, didn't realize she was 4th path because I haven't kept up with "the scene" really (is there a "scene"?) I hadn't heard about Beth before, so that's cool.
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:08 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:08 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
We should add Laurel Carrington to this list, too. She's on Dho. She just posted here.
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Steph S, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:11 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:11 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 672 Join Date: 3/24/10 Recent Posts
I just saw in the Recent Posts that she commented. I remember her from way-back-when I first joined DhO and haven't seen her post in a while. Excellent.
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Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 1:16 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 1:16 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 7134 Join Date: 12/8/18 Recent Posts
Chris Marti:
No, please don't get the wrong impression. Both of those women have advanced practices and they are both prominent teachers and coaches in their own right.

Good to hear. I stand corrected. 

Sorry Brandon!
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Steph S, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 9:46 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 9:46 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 672 Join Date: 3/24/10 Recent Posts
Linda & I over here being macho AF but not really.

I doubt if I get 4th path I'll really flaunt it and would be more low-key about it. I don't think that I'd want to keep it a secret, but I'm for sure not gonna go the route of the high profile/well-known personality that everyone's heard of. I'm definitely not starting a YouTube channel or somethign really public like that. Not a criticism, just not my style. 
Freeling, modified 3 Years ago at 6/19/20 4:35 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/19/20 4:35 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 4 Join Date: 4/5/20 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
With regards to Abre as a teacher:

Yes she is from France, but lives in the US (EST). 

She has studied with Kenneth (obvs) and I believe he 'authorized' her to teach, if that means anything to prospective students. She is steeped in the Pragmatic Dharma world.

In her 20's, she invested a lot of time practicing according to the instructions in the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali which is a concentration/siddhi based yogic system. Worth asking her about maybe.

She seems to have extensive knowledge of the Tibetan Elephant Path system as is laid out in "The Mind Illuminated", but (if my memory serves correctly) she felt that TMI missed the mark slightly in presenting that particular system accurately - but that's not to say TMI is somehow a bad resource. She's read it herself, but that's not how she practiced in that particular system.

I am sure she has waaayyyy more experience than what I laid out above (and she has revealed more than what I wrote above but I want to keep it somewhat brief). She has a lot of practical knowledge and has been very open to trying practices I've brought up to her. She is great as she has walked the fine line between being kind, understanding, but also strict and sometimes fed up with me when I'm being difficult (I mean, look at my previous logs and you'll see I like to complain and get angsty). She takes it all in stride. She simply wants students who are sincere and will put in the work, and besides that, I don't interact with her besides my biweekly video chats and the occasional intermittent email. It's funny - rereading what I just wrote above may not be a 'glowing review', but I think that's maybe how it should be... Like if she was just nice all the time, I'd get complacent and she hasn't allowed that to happen, you know? Yeah I pay her, but she isn't just boosting my self esteem all the time in the hope of a good contribution. Reminds me of my piano teacher in a way - takes no shit, won't accept half rate practice, but still wants the best for me. I think that's a productive balance. This is someone I'd never be able to worship and that's how it should be. 

Abre sounds awesome. Do you think you would be able to PM me her details, if she's comfortable with that? I can't see that she has a website. I've been looking for a woman meditation for awhile but haven't had much luck. Thanks!!
Sam Gentile, modified 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 11:17 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 11:17 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 1310 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
Freeling:
Hibiscus Kid:
With regards to Abre as a teacher:

Yes she is from France, but lives in the US (EST). 

She has studied with Kenneth (obvs) and I believe he 'authorized' her to teach, if that means anything to prospective students. She is steeped in the Pragmatic Dharma world.

In her 20's, she invested a lot of time practicing according to the instructions in the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali which is a concentration/siddhi based yogic system. Worth asking her about maybe.

She seems to have extensive knowledge of the Tibetan Elephant Path system as is laid out in "The Mind Illuminated", but (if my memory serves correctly) she felt that TMI missed the mark slightly in presenting that particular system accurately - but that's not to say TMI is somehow a bad resource. She's read it herself, but that's not how she practiced in that particular system.

I am sure she has waaayyyy more experience than what I laid out above (and she has revealed more than what I wrote above but I want to keep it somewhat brief). She has a lot of practical knowledge and has been very open to trying practices I've brought up to her. She is great as she has walked the fine line between being kind, understanding, but also strict and sometimes fed up with me when I'm being difficult (I mean, look at my previous logs and you'll see I like to complain and get angsty). She takes it all in stride. She simply wants students who are sincere and will put in the work, and besides that, I don't interact with her besides my biweekly video chats and the occasional intermittent email. It's funny - rereading what I just wrote above may not be a 'glowing review', but I think that's maybe how it should be... Like if she was just nice all the time, I'd get complacent and she hasn't allowed that to happen, you know? Yeah I pay her, but she isn't just boosting my self esteem all the time in the hope of a good contribution. Reminds me of my piano teacher in a way - takes no shit, won't accept half rate practice, but still wants the best for me. I think that's a productive balance. This is someone I'd never be able to worship and that's how it should be. 

Abre sounds awesome. Do you think you would be able to PM me her details, if she's comfortable with that? I can't see that she has a website. I've been looking for a woman meditation for awhile but haven't had much luck. Thanks!!

Abre is awesome! (but can be tough) Did you get details for HK? If not, you can PM me and I can send you her email.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 5:26 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 5:26 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Papa Che Dusko:
Hibiscus Kid:
Yep, she is my teacher.

She was a student of Kenneth's: 

https://twitter.com/KennethFolk/status/1037548918379347968

Good to know thanks! How is she as a teacher? I mean is she "my way or highway" or does she give the student the freedom to choose the practice from the tool box she offers? Is she from Europe? 

also, could we get a link that is not this twitter shit?
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 7:38 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 7:36 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
The link is Chris Marti's recommendations. First requirement is Noble Speech emoticon 
Edit; if you can pass that a Firewall you get the secret dharma password! 
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Siavash ', modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 8:51 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 8:51 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 1679 Join Date: 5/5/19 Recent Posts
The link is Chris Marti's recommendations. 


I wonder why Kenneth mentions Daniel as one of his students in that tweet!
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 8:57 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 8:57 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I wonder why Kenneth mentions Daniel as one of his students in that tweet!

If you read the twitter thread, he also acknowledges his own narcissism.
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Siavash ', modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 9:00 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 9:00 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 1679 Join Date: 5/5/19 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
I wonder why Kenneth mentions Daniel as one of his students in that tweet!

If you read the twitter thread, he also acknowledges his own narcissism.


Yes I noticed that, but that should be enough to misrepresent facts, unless he really was Daniel's teacher.
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 10:48 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 10:30 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
Yes I noticed that, but that should be enough to misrepresent facts, unless he really was Daniel's teacher.

Word has it, from the horse's mouth, of course, that Kenneth Folk introduced Daniel Ingram to the dharma, and to Bill Hamilton. 
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 10:50 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 10:50 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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I'm going to tattle on ya'll to Abre for talking about her like this here  emoticon
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 10:59 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 10:58 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Chris Marti:
I'm going to tattle on ya'll to Abre for talking about her like this here  emoticon


I've just been trying to get some info on her more substantial than a tweet from a narcissist. I hate tweets. But some of my best friends are narcissists.
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Siavash ', modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 11:24 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 11:24 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 1679 Join Date: 5/5/19 Recent Posts
Chris Marti:
Yes I noticed that, but that should be enough to misrepresent facts, unless he really was Daniel's teacher.

Word has it, from the horse's mouth, of course, that Kenneth Folk introduced Daniel Ingram to the dharma, and to Bill Hamilton. 


Now I noticed a typo in my post. I actually meant "but that should NOT be enough to misrepresent facts,"! Anyway emoticon
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 11:02 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 11:02 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Chris Marti:
Yes I noticed that, but that should be enough to misrepresent facts, unless he really was Daniel's teacher.

Word has it, from the horse's mouth, of course, that Kenneth Folk introduced Daniel Ingram to the dharma, and to Bill Hamilton. 

Do we really want to go there, on the horse's mouth here? Are you, uh, crazy? By the time that horse stops being quoted, it's life in the Grand Canyon again, yes?
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 11:10 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 11:10 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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Sometimes we really do have to go there.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 11:25 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 11:25 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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emoticon
 yeah, but what time is this?
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 11:26 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 11:26 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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emoticon

also, the tweet is from 2018. This is old narcissism.
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 11:56 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 11:52 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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It seems to be a tweet for recordkeeping purposes. Personally, I don't think this lineage shit matters much, especially in regard to pragmatic dharma, wherein wisdom is passed along as much or more by internet osmosis as it is due to teachers.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 12:16 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 12:16 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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emoticon

I think that's true.

In the absence of armageddon here, on this peaceful day in samsara, i would like to say in my mildest possible tone that KF bleating about Daniel like that, as if KF laid that golden egg and hatched it too, is some lame ass bullshit of the very lowest order.
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 12:24 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 12:23 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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We'll let the two of them hash it out. We can call it Dharma Lineage Combat. Or, like a twisted Abbott and Costello routine, we can call it "Who's There First?" Or it could appear in a version of Dharma Jeopardy, with a high point total, under the category "Pragmatic Icons."

emoticon
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 2:00 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 2:00 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Chris Marti:
We'll let the two of them hash it out. We can call it Dharma Lineage Combat. Or, like a twisted Abbott and Costello routine, we can call it "Who's There First?" Or it could appear in a version of Dharma Jeopardy, with a high point total, under the category "Pragmatic Icons."

emoticon

What? Second Base.

Alex, I'll take "Schism" for 500, please.

The answer is, "He was enlightened before anyone else."

Uh, who is---

I'm afraid your time is up. Other players? No. Game over.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 1:33 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 1:33 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Tim Farrington:
emoticon

I think that's true.

In the absence of armageddon here, on this peaceful day in samsara, i would like to say in my mildest possible tone that KF bleating about Daniel like that, as if KF laid that golden egg and hatched it too, is some lame ass bullshit of the very lowest order.

Dude emoticon you badmouthing my teacher here! This aint the end of this! Im keeping my eyes on YOU! emoticon
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 1:58 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 1:58 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Papa Che Dusko:
Tim Farrington:
emoticon

I think that's true.

In the absence of armageddon here, on this peaceful day in samsara, i would like to say in my mildest possible tone that KF bleating about Daniel like that, as if KF laid that golden egg and hatched it too, is some lame ass bullshit of the very lowest order.

Dude emoticon you badmouthing my teacher here! This aint the end of this! Im keeping my eyes on YOU! emoticon

I believe i merely made the mildest possible remark about the quality of your teacher's bleat. emoticon

a thousand apologies, that your teacher appears to be a narcissistic [epithet deleted, per DhO forum rules.]

emoticon
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 3:03 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 3:03 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
Dude emoticon you badmouthing my teacher here! This aint the end of this! Im keeping my eyes on YOU! emoticon

Don't rise to the bait!
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 3:28 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 3:28 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Chris Marti:
Dude emoticon you badmouthing my teacher here! This aint the end of this! Im keeping my eyes on YOU! emoticon

Don't rise to the bait!
emoticon That Farry F Timmington has stepped on my big toe!!! I demand justice!!! 






emoticon 


p.s. I mean seriously why dont all use smilies like all the time! emoticon I mean really emoticon emoticon emoticon Thats why we have them around emoticon emoticon
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 4:25 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 4:25 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Papa Che Dusko:
Chris Marti:
Dude emoticon you badmouthing my teacher here! This aint the end of this! Im keeping my eyes on YOU! emoticon

Don't rise to the bait!
emoticon That Farry F Timmington has stepped on my big toe!!! I demand justice!!! 






emoticon 


p.s. I mean seriously why dont all use smilies like all the time! emoticon I mean really emoticonemoticonemoticon Thats why we have them around emoticon emoticon

emoticon

i'm so sorry papa guedusko! emoticon i didn't mean to give you an ouchie! emoticon

emoticon
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 4:26 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/8/20 4:26 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Chris Marti:
Dude emoticon you badmouthing my teacher here! This aint the end of this! Im keeping my eyes on YOU! emoticon

Don't rise to the bait!

lol, yeah, right. Get real, Marti, lol.
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 7:19 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 7:19 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 7:39 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 7:39 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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Chris Marti:
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 10:39 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 10:39 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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Chris Marti:

Did you forget how hard and full of pitfalls it is, this journey to "get real" ? It's easy for you to say it! 
I'm trying! I'm trying real hard gawd damn it! 
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 3:41 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 3:41 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
Maybe you should...

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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 3:54 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 3:54 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
I was just joking Chris. But I get it emoticon Che out. 
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 4:05 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/9/20 4:05 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
So you assumed I wasn't joking?
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:00 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:00 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Chris Marti:
So you assumed I wasn't joking?


after that heated sequence between the two of us, how could he possibly even suspect you were joking? Papa Che is a sensitive  and scrupulous man. He knows how to treat people with deference and respect. To him, "get real" means "Go do 10,000 hours of dry vipassana in a desert environment, living on locusts and wild honey."

I will have to go after him now and tell him you just have a very very, uh, dry, and deadpan sense of humor. The desert is no place for a 4-year-old, and the aridity will mess up his new amp. You can't even remember your name there, cause there ain't no one for to give you no pain. Papa Che needs us, to give him pain. Vipassana is dukha-driven, after all.
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 6:27 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 6:27 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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You can't even remember your name there, cause there ain't no one for to give you no pain.

This is in America, right?
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 6:44 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 6:44 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Chris Marti:
You can't even remember your name there, cause there ain't no one for to give you no pain.

This is in America, right?

Horse with No Name, aka, Equine Anatta.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:02 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:02 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Papa Che Dusko:
I was just joking Chris. But I get it emoticon Che out. 

emoticon

Whiskey Tango Foxtrot to Papa Che Actual, do you copy? Mistakes were made. Repeat, mistakes were made. Do you copy? Over.

emoticon
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 9:18 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 9:18 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I'm sure its a bit of an intentional self-deprecation, but their might be some truth in it.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 9:22 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 9:22 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Papa Che Dusko:
The link is Chris Marti's recommendations. First requirement is Noble Speech emoticon 
Edit; if you can pass that a Firewall you get the secret dharma password! 


The password is SCHISM?
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/6/20 1:16 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/6/20 1:16 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
Yeah I can see how it can be clunky, but she told me to 'ride the breath' which I found helpful. So yes, try to notice the individual points, but hold the breath close and be intimate with that. Skip awareness of the body if the next breath follows really closely behind.

Personally, I slow down my breathing during this exercise so I only do a few at a time before switching back to normal breathing, at which point I find the sensations a bit more vivid. 

How do you usually practice breath concentration? 
That helps. I think I'm putting too much effort on marking the points and not on the riding the breath. I'm doing 70% noting the points and 30% riding the breath and I think that mix needs to flip.

I've got a few approaches to concentration. I usually start with counting breath to 8 and back down which usually gets me to the point where I can fly solo with the breath.

Other times, If my mind is in a good place, I can just remember how it felt before and just drop into it. It's like being in a new city where I'm still getting my bearings and suddenly recognizing a street I turned down before. I take it and suddenly the territory all seems familiar.

If I'm noticing my my mind is wandering, it's usually because my concentration is too tight. In this case it helps for me to drop all intentions for a bit, open up to the sense of space around me, relax and then find the breath again from that place of openess.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 5:26 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 5:26 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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Thanks HK. That was a clear introduction. Since she comes from Kenneth's flock I'm sure she is using Mahasi style too. Will consider her if time for a teacher arises. 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 8:45 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/7/20 8:45 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
With regards to the 7 point breathing:

"It possibly sounds like you're being a bit rigid? "

"Another point: Abre told me, if you can do this exercise succesfully for about 7 breaths, you're probably in access concentration."


Lol, yeah I'm probably being too rigid. I can do this for seven breaths, so I should probalby just be taking it a bit easier -- like I'm really trying to nail down EXACTLY when each thing stops or starts.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:32 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:32 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I feel like I just opened a door to a confessional and found all my friends having lunch inside.
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:40 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 12:40 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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emoticon

Sorry, Brandon.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 1:33 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 1:33 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
I feel like I just opened a door to a confessional and found all my friends having lunch inside.

Whats Brandon doing in here ??? emoticon
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 6:03 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 6:03 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I'm just glad you all feel comfortable hanging out in my confessional. Drinks are on Tim, right?
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 11:04 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 11:04 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
I'm just glad you all feel comfortable hanging out in my confessional. Drinks are on Tim, right?

Absolutely. I've got a FaceBook fundraiser going to cover this.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/11/20 8:28 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/10/20 11:08 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Papa Che Dusko:
Brandon Dayton:
I feel like I just opened a door to a confessional and found all my friends having lunch inside.

Whats Brandon doing in here ??? emoticon

Wasn't someone supposed to warn him about the wreckage? Tell him the party had not only gotten out of hand, but had been hijacked by feminist Bodhisattvas? Break it to him easy? Steph, I think, was going to do it. Or Linda, in her one binary facet. That selfless compassion thing.

I wouldn't trust the rest of these testosterone-driven arhant wannabes with such a delicate task as far as I could throw them uphill on that mountain Sisyphus pushes his rock up. Polly, this includes you, in your macho binary facet.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/19/20 4:59 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/19/20 4:29 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
For a few weeks now I've been feeling lots of blah, aversion, and lethargy off the cushion. It feels like "depression" which I haven't felt in a long, long time, but without the distress. Today it feels particularly heavy. Just writing this is more than I want to do. On the cushion practice usually feels very strong, sometimes even going longer than the timer, except for maybe once every two weeks I have a sit that is rough. I kinda feel like this is practice related as I can't see any reason in life for things to be rough. Speculating that I am hitting EQ on the cushion but dropping back into reobs the rest of the time. Just keep practicing, I guess.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/19/20 4:30 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/19/20 4:30 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Oh yeah, starting practice is always hard. Lots of resistance to it lately, but once I get going, it takes off.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/19/20 10:46 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/19/20 10:46 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
For a few weeks now I've been feeling lots of blah, aversion, and lethargy off the cushion. It feels like "depression" which I haven't felt in a long, long time, but without the distress. Today it feels particularly heavy. Just writing this is more than I want to do. On the cushion practice usually feels very strong, sometimes even going longer than the timer, except for maybe once every two weeks I have a sit that is rough. I kinda feel like this is practice related as I can't see any reason in life for things to be rough. Speculating that I am hitting EQ on the cushion but dropping back into reobs the rest of the time. Just keep practicing, I guess.
This honestly is what i feel like i need right now, Brandon. I am so volatile, have been for endless months it seems. As a bipolar lifelong, i'm of course familiar with that ride, which is obviously this ride too; but there's something weird about this one. I should be locked up long since, and keep surving by the skin of my teeth. like Wile E. Coyote, falling off cliffs, and coming back in the next scene with another plan, curtesy of Acme Scheme Equipment. I long for some good dense shit, a working depression.

be careful what i wish for, i guess. gotta quit wishing entirely, as far as i can see.

hang in there, i think you're spot on right now.

love, tim
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 2:35 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 2:35 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
You too man. One breath at a time, right?
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 2:47 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 2:47 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
But honestly, whatever I'm calling "depression" right now is a huge improvement over whatever I've experienced in the past. My working theory is that my personal mix of chemical imbalance and dark night is heavily weighted to the dark night stuff, which means meditation seems to go a long way in alleviating the symptoms.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 2:59 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 2:56 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
But honestly, whatever I'm calling "depression" right now is a huge improvement over whatever I've experienced in the past. My working theory is that my personal mix of chemical imbalance and dark night is heavily weighted to the dark night stuff, w

i actually sort of crave the symptoms right now, honestly, no lie. People respond to me so much better when i have a good depressed affect going. not humor, here, serious as a heart attack. Mania just scares the fuck out of most everyone, and no one ever takes a word i say seriously. I could be standing outside the Holocaust Museum saying this shit must never be forgotten and never be repeated, and they'd say, don't listen to him, he's just manic.

depressed, most people think i'm deep! lol. Chicks dig it.

which means meditation seems to go a long way in alleviating the symptoms.

meditation for me is just dying with every breath, in everything up to desire for liberation. I'm not sure what Re-Obsrevation actually is, to tell you the truth, i haven't really got anything obvious in my own vocabulary and experience that makes it an easy translation (lol, or offers the trap of an apparently easy translation). Shargrol Of Course once said he thought Re-Ob had an element of poignancy, and i sort of had a flash what he might be talking about from that, but basically, most people's phenomenology chops on DhO are de facto so far beyond my primitive God-language cloud of unknowing shit that it's just no go. My dark night in its reliable apparent perpetuity is simple and stupid:I'm over myself, over life, sick of fucking up and being fucked with and the whole fucking shit show, and i just get as gate gate gate as letting go into oblivion on each outbreath allows, and trying to not be too disappointed when the next inbreath comes on its own, despite my most cherished hopes to be done done stick a fork in me done.

and then the fucking timer rings and by the grace of God, sometimes my limbs don't weigh a ton and i go on with my day.

sometimes not.

love, tim
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Siavash ', modified 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 3:19 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 3:19 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 1679 Join Date: 5/5/19 Recent Posts
and no one ever takes a word i say seriously.


Yeah. You can forgive their ignorance and cruelty.

I think this is one of the biggest crimes a person can do, when they are not taking someone seriously.
I've had a few different flavors of this, and what amazes me is how we people have high capacity for not understanding.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 4:34 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 4:34 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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Siavash:
and no one ever takes a word i say seriously.


Yeah. You can forgive their ignorance and cruelty.

I think this is one of the biggest crimes a person can do, when they are not taking someone seriously.
I've had a few different flavors of this, and what amazes me is how we people have high capacity for not understanding.
well, 

Go, go, go, said the bird: human kind
Cannot bear very much reality.

T.S. Eliot, "Burnt Norton"

given that, the human mind eliminates as many possible sources of new information as survival allows, and sometimes more (lol). Insane people, black people, brown people, women, Catholics, Protestants, believers, non-believers--- use the old shut off valve before ever listening, and life seems so manageable.

until life bites you on the ass, of course, because the person trying to mention that fucking lion sneaking up on your ass was an Azerbhaijani, those well-known rascals, and you fucking ignored the warning. emoticon


love, tim
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Siavash ', modified 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 12:11 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 12:11 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 1679 Join Date: 5/5/19 Recent Posts
until life bites you on the ass, of course, because the person trying to mention that fucking lion sneaking up on your ass was an Azerbhaijani, those well-known rascals, and you fucking ignored the warning. emoticon


Sorry!


And sorry Brandon.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/21/20 12:27 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/21/20 12:26 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Siavash:
until life bites you on the ass, of course, because the person trying to mention that fucking lion sneaking up on your ass was an Azerbhaijani, those well-known rascals, and you fucking ignored the warning. emoticon


Sorry!


And sorry Brandon.

There is an old tribe Motherfucker proverb that, loosely translated from the single word in Ur-Motherfucker, says something like, "But who will warn the Azerbhaijanis?"

srouwb, your apology for your good deeds is heard on high, and accepted at all places where major credit cards are used.

p.s. unless Brandon decides to give you shit, of course.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/19/20 8:19 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/19/20 8:19 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
27 minute practice today. Fell asleep while practicing. Gonna try for another 30 min sesh to finish off the day.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 2:54 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/20/20 2:54 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Did another hour while the family started watching the first Lord of the Rings. Joined them after I was done and the movie still seemed to drag on forever.

Session seemed to be typified by stillness and quiet. 

I am going to try and get in some extra practice this weekend. We have the birth of a new baby that is imminent. There is kind of quiet before the storm as we have made preparations and my wife's responsibilities at work have wound down. There is some space here before things get chaotic.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/24/20 4:09 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/24/20 4:09 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Just getting hammerred by sleepiness in my sits lately. That is all.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 6/24/20 4:32 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/24/20 4:32 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Just getting hammerred by sleepiness in my sits lately. That is all.

I have started a new job lately which is rather physical and being knackered tired after the job is my normal me now emoticon 
Turning up the noting voice's volume so I really hear myself does help and even standing meditation helps. 
There are times when putting extra effort is needed. This is such time emoticon 

Quiet meditation will just doze me off if physically tired. Daily meditation is paramount! Show must go on! That's why we have a Yogi Toolbox! Something in there for any situation. 

Speak out as loud as you can in your household so you really get that energy pumping. Also try and use word Certainty if certain that each note is matter of fact. This helps motivation. 

Give it a spin and see how it goes. If necessary bring the meditation time down a bit but keep the 45 minutes as absolute minimum. It's ok to note 1 sensation per second, but keep the stream of noting unbroken. 

Itching-Certainty, touching-certainty, tiredness-certainty, sleepiness-certain, low energy-certainty, inability to focus-certainty, itching-certainty ... ... 45 minutes rings. Well done! 

Better sit shorter but be awake throughout than sit longer but dozing off many times. Unbroken stream of noting. emoticon you can do it! 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/25/20 3:04 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/25/20 3:04 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I've got a new baby on the way, so I'm sure I'll have to make use of this soon. Today I mostly solved the problem by taking a huge nap before I meditated.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 6/25/20 3:47 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/25/20 3:47 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
All the best with your new baby emoticon sleepless nights and diapers emoticon You will be ok mate! 

Be gentle on yourself.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/26/20 10:49 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/26/20 10:49 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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Thanks man.

This is #3, so not too many surprises, but yeah, I'm still getting prepped psyhcologically.
Sam Gentile, modified 3 Years ago at 6/26/20 11:59 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/26/20 11:59 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 1310 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Thanks man.

This is #3, so not too many surprises, but yeah, I'm still getting prepped psyhcologically.
Allow me also to express my best wishes to you and your family, Three is hndful but you got it!
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 6/26/20 1:47 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/26/20 1:47 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

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Thanks Sam.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 6/29/20 3:07 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 6/29/20 3:07 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
I've got a new baby on the way, so I'm sure I'll have to make use of this soon. Today I mostly solved the problem by taking a huge nap before I meditated.

way to nail the rocket science of meditation, amigo.

love, tim
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 7/9/20 10:02 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 7/9/20 10:02 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Still practicing. Now that I have a teacher, some of the need to log regularly is gone. I keep a seperate log for coaching which fulfills some of that role. Now I feel like logging is mostly just about staying in touch with the community which is still incredibly important to me. Sorry I've been away so much!

We've also got a new baby in the house which is amazing! I remember much more stress with my other two kids, but this new baby has been all upside. The labor and delivery was without drama, my wife is recovering beautifully and our new child is healthy and perfect. 

It's made me think about how meditation makes life better. Yeah, there are these discrete stages we are gunning for, but there is also incremental growth that happens with each sit. I look at where my life is now compared to where it was a couple of years ago and it is vastly better. I spent many years of my life sitting with the open question of whether or life was worth the misery, like, in the balance of things mostly life was unpleasant, and it was hard for me to justify that it was worth it (not that I was ever suicidal or anything, but it was still a sucky way to live). My greatest solace was a kind of nietzschean heroism, where I could ground myself in purpose and morality. That approach certainly had its benefits, but how my life is now beats the pants off of it. Now, at least the balance has shifted where life feels good enough to be worth it. 

Practice itself has been a bit irregular since the new baby, but I feel like I'm getting back into a groove. This morning's practice felt good which is probably why this log has such a cheery tone. Abre has me doing what she calls Mahayana style vipassana which is quite a bit more techincal than the noting practice I have become accustomed to (although noting is still a part of it). It first requires taking a few minutes to get into access concentration with the breath. I can do that as quickly as 10 minutes, but sometimes it takes longer. Today it took about half an hour to get there. From there the technique  involves methodically focusing on specific areas of attention, starting with breath, then the body, then sound, then the mental space and finally attention. After working your way up to attention, you start at the bottom again. From there you repeat the loop. It has the effect of working the mind up towards subtler and subtler states of awareness, which is meant to be conducive to the High Equanimity stage of the POI. Having good concentration seems to be very important to getting it to work right. Whith each stage I can feel my concentration getting stronger and stronger and I normally find myself on the verge of jhana many times throughout the practice. 

Planning on doing some additional sits today. 
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 7/9/20 10:13 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 7/9/20 10:13 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Congrats papa Brandon !!!!!!!! emoticon all the best wishes to you and your family!!!!!!! emoticon 
Sam Gentile, modified 3 Years ago at 7/9/20 11:40 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 7/9/20 11:40 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 1310 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
Congrats Brandon to you and your family. I'm happy to hear everything has been going so well. emoticon
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 7/10/20 10:48 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 7/10/20 10:48 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
emoticon

How wonderful, Brandon! A new life, a new era. Baby-practice will enlighten you as fast as anything except heroin (where you either get enightened fast or die; baby practice is delightfully time-sensitive, a new enlghtenment every time the kid learns something new). Blessings on the happy mother, father, and the beautiful wide eyed new soul.
love, tim
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 7/24/20 1:32 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 7/24/20 1:32 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
If this doesn't do the trick, I'll give heroin a shot. Thanks for the kinds words.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 7/24/20 1:47 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 7/24/20 1:46 PM

Shhh

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I'm gonna bury this here, where only those who are gonna take the time to read my log will find this, but I've been recording episodes of a podcast over the last few months. It's mostly focused on art, but looking at art from a more philosophical, spiritual perspective. I'm gonna have some episodes that give more particular attention to meditation and I'll post those in the general threads when the come up. 

Still practicing BTW. I'll have to do a bigger update sometime.

Enjoy!


https://anchor.fm/h2bna
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Chris M, modified 3 Years ago at 7/24/20 4:58 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 7/24/20 4:58 PM

RE: Shhh

Posts: 5117 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
Nice, Brandon!
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 7/25/20 7:28 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 7/25/20 7:28 AM

RE: Shhh

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
I'm gonna bury this here, where only those who are gonna take the time to read my log will find this, but I've been recording episodes of a podcast over the last few months. It's mostly focused on art, but looking at art from a more philosophical, spiritual perspective. I'm gonna have some episodes that give more particular attention to meditation and I'll post those in the general threads when the come up. 

Still practicing BTW. I'll have to do a bigger update sometime.

Enjoy!


https://anchor.fm/h2bna

why Brandon, you sly old dog, holding out on us . . .

love, tim
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 9/2/20 8:58 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/2/20 8:58 PM

Be Careful What You Ask For

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Thought it was about time for an update.

Ever since getting my first big A&P experience and learning about the POI I've been anxiously anticipating when and it what form the Dark Night might manifest itself. There was a moment when I thought that I had skirted it, but now it seems I am likely passing through it. I wrote about some of my most recent experiences in the thread below.

https://www.dharmaoverground.org/discussion/-/message_boards/message/21584140

I had another experience last night in the middle of the night. I was fast asleep when there was a sense of something flashing on and off rapidly. It wasn't visual or auditory and it had a snappy feel to it. My immediate reaction was that I was sensing some sort of impermanence and I was like, "oh shit, is this stream entry?!" And my heart started racing and I woke up. Everything had a soft feel to it, especially the visual impressions that filled in the gaps of what I wasn't directly sensing. The visual impressions of the structure of the room, my wife lying next to me and my own body had a soft cartoony feel to them. My consicous mind felt very thin and any sense that I was fading back to sleep felt like the potential of getting dumped down a waterslide straight to emptiness -- which was creepy.

As far as what my practice has looked like lately, I've started practicing again after taking two weeks off, but my practice has been less -- 30 minutes a day, and the practice has been irregular. I've also started a new job which has made it tough to fit in the practice. Trying to focus just on getting practice in regularly now.

My teacher has me focusing on a grounding meditation. I normally begin by spending about 10 minutes in concencentration then I turn to a visualization where I sink into the earth in 5 foot increments. The first time with the practice it felt more like bobbing on top of the earth as I would visualize, then my mind would revolt and pull me back up to the surface. I've been experimenting with where to focus to with the subterranean practice and I find that focusing on bodily sensations and doing it with minimum effort works best. I simply note, "sinking, sinking" and focus on sensations and that seems to do the trick.

The last couple of sits have been typified by mind wandering that never settles. I discussed this in a bit in my coaching session and Abre gave me some good things to try. Today was more focused, but I got sleepy.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 9/4/20 2:29 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/4/20 2:29 AM

RE: Be Careful What You Ask For

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Hi Brandon! How is the little one doing emoticon hope it's sleeping well during the night! I find that aspect the most important for my basic sanity emoticon Otherwise daily activities might be very challenging. 


Im glad for you that Abre is of benefit in this situation. It really feels good to have someone familiar with these states and stages especially when shit hits the fan. 


All the best wishes for you and your family and for your teacher. 
Keep us updated when you can. 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 9/4/20 5:42 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/4/20 5:42 PM

RE: Be Careful What You Ask For

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
The Baby is great. Mostly smooth sailing in life right now which helps with the practice bumps.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 9/6/20 10:23 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/6/20 10:23 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
59 minutes. The first hour-long session I’ve done in a few weeks. There was a bit of doubt going into the session. I’ve been feeling a bit depressed lately, but I had also skipped the last two days. I started with a resolution to attain Stream Entry and to attain Equanimity and with an intention for the practice that my mind will be concentrated and tranquil and that I will trust in the mind to do what it needs to do.

I started with concentration on the breath. There was some mental agitation. I used some of the recommendations Abre gave me in our last session. I did a Buddha smile and smiling eyes. I repeated phrases about relaxation and release and took deep breaths and exhaled through my mouth. I am also trying out an eye position that is focused towards the tip of my nose. The particular cue of focusing on the tip of my nose doesn’t quite work for me, but I set my eyes in the general direction. In the right mind state it can deepen the focus, but at least for now, it seems like I need to calm my mind first before I can get there.

It took about 25 minutes for my mind to calm and focus to the point I like, probably the result of having skipped two days. When I was practicing consistently before panic attacks it would take me 10 to 15 minutes.

I decided to switch to the subterranean grounding practice. Minimum effort and trust in the mind seemed to be the key as it continued to be throughout the practice. I started by just letting the attention settle on the body. It wasn’t settling, and I decided to just let my mind do what it wanted to, there was a soft pleasant upward energy and then my attention opened up and settled on the body.

Once I had settled on the body I decided to start the actual sinking visualization. Just letting go, opening up and setting the attention created a sufficient sense of sinking. At a few of the stops I took a moment to imagine the sense of weight, texture and hardness of rocks and dirt surrounding me and pressing on to my body. My 30 minute timer went off and decided to keep sitting, this time just setting a stop watch to track the additional time, but let the practice end whenever it felt natural. As the practice progressed I would repeat just the first phrase in my metta progression: “May I be safe, may I be safe, may I be safe.” I did this as I sank lower and lower into the earth.

Eventually there was a sense that the grounding was enough and I decided to slowly start a Mahayana loop (I think I describe the practice above someplace). My body felt very heavy, solid and grounded. I started focusing on sound. My mind felt very open and tranquil. I focused on various sounds and then directed my attention towards areas of the sound field that were empty.

Eventually things settled and I moved on to focusing on mind. I repeat a reminder at this phase to help notice the subtleties: “Thoughts, feelings, urges, intentions.” I also make mental labels at this stage, for the same reason. For the first time in the phase of practice, I intenionally brought up recent events and memories to investigate them. There would be a seed of a memory, like quick visual impression of someone I know and I would let that unfold a bit and feel the emotions and thoughts connected to it. Some pleasant senses of space opening up in weird orthogonal, unstable, shifting ways.

To finish up I let thoughts and feelings go and spent a bit of time with awareness, just repeating “awareness, awareness” and letting the mind go. Decided not to go too far at this point and finish by bringing attention back to the body and doing some metta.

I am noticing that I am feeling a greater sense of mastery at the base of the Mahayana pyramid and less and less as it proceeds up to the mind. My body feels SOLID and stable, and I feel like it settles into some sort of unified sensation. Sound is closer to that, but less so, it never quite settles into a singular “wave” as Abre describes it. That trend seems to continue up into thoughts and feelings and into awareness.
Wondering if there is a practice I can do to greater sense of mastery over the level of sound, like I have been doing with the grounding practices and the body. I like the sense of stability and grounding in the body that proceeds investigation of more refined states of mind. As Abre has described it is like having a pool floor to push off of to move back up into higher states of mind.
Sam Gentile, modified 3 Years ago at 9/6/20 11:56 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/6/20 11:56 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 1310 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
Hi Brandon,

It's good to see your check in and that your baby and family are doing well. Abre has me doing the Buddha Inner Smile too.

Sorry to hear about your anxiety and panic attacks. From experience, just remember that they are impermenant. They will not last forever.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 9/7/20 9:45 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/7/20 9:45 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Thanks Sam. Hoping with practice to get more skilled with passing through the rough stuff. Thanks for the thoughts.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 9/7/20 9:47 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/7/20 9:47 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
64 minutes. Started with concentration, as always. Access concentration seemed as if it came very fast today, about 7 minutes or less, since I spent some time just to test that it was stable. I moved on to the body but noticed some residual mental agitation. I continued with the attention to the body until the mind settled down. I didn’t do very much of the sinking practice today. I let myself get grounded, but then moved on to sound and spent a leisurely amount of time focusing on sound. A bit of just listening, listening to the empty areas and a bit of letting myself be absorbed by the sound.

The time spent on sound seemed to be worth its time as the transition to mind felt more refined than usual. I could sense mental chatter popping in and out. Some of it was music playing in my mind, but there were bits of images and fragments of audio and words. I have been watching Star Trek TOS with the kids lately, so there were a few little fragments of Kirk, Spock and Bones in the mix.

Before moving on to awareness, I dropped down to body awareness again and worked my way back up. Again, just repeating “awareness, awareness” and relaxing. There was a moment when I focused on sensations in my face and there was a sense of “that is not awareness” and suddenly awareness opened up around the sensations and became more spacious. Maybe not the panoramic awareness all the kids are talking about, but it was certainly more open. Lots of stability and tranquility and a strong sense of uprising energy. At one moment I visualized an energy beam originating at my base and shooting up through my body into the sky. It made it hard to try and re-focus on my body. There was just a very energetic inertia moving up into the mental space. Maybe another little A&P.

Nonetheless, I took some time to slowly return to the body and ground myself to finish up.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 9/12/20 5:40 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/12/20 5:40 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
50 minutes. Concentration came very quickly. Strong waves of pleasure and well being. Body was quickly suffused and moved on to vipassana. Felt very absorbed and pleasant at every stage. Spent quite a bit of time turning attention to the calmness, quietness and emptiness underneath everything, but every time I got a sense of it, it would quickly well up into a stronger pleasure, so strong I wanted to jump up and run around. A strong upwards movement of energy during the first half. Second half felt more lethargic and sleepy. I am starting to “hear” more thoughts as I focus on mind, but they still mostly sound like chatter. I hear mental music too. Sense of space continues to feel about the same each practice, but I will still do small techniques to turn attention towards space, whether it is while listening to sound or focusing on awareness in all directions. Have not yet felt a very panoramic sense of awareness, things feel pleasant and cozy but very contracted around the face and eyes.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 9/13/20 11:54 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/13/20 11:54 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
73 minutes. The deepest I’ve gone since taking my panic attack break. I start with a resolution to attain Stream Entry and a resolution for this current session to find the fourth jhana. The usual drill. Concentration on breath, body, sound, mind and then awareness. Piti is strong, I can really absorb myself into the sound. It all feels very pleasant. There is a texture to it. Even the sounds of my family chattering in the other room or my wife running the epilator on her legs has a pleasant texture to it.

I work up to mind and then awareness. I’m noticing a “seeking” feeling. Maybe you can call it digging, or efforting. I try to let that go, and let objects in the mind present themselves rather than digging for them.

After a few (3?) loops I decide to do a bit of trying to observe the observer. I decide to focus on the sensations of shifting pressure on the bridge of my nose, between my eyes. I start by penetrating the object as best I can and then tracing that back to the observer.

When I’ve done this in the past, it’s like I look away from the observed sensation to see the observer. This time, I keep the sensations in view, almost as if I am looking at them through a telescope and follow the sight-line back to the observer. I notice how effortful and contracted I am and just decide to release things and let go of effort.

I got better clarity than I ever have. I get a sense of something immediately behind my eyes and face. There is an itching in the back of my eye sockets as it happens. Still very vague and elusive, but this feels like a step forward.

After doing this for a bit I decided to just let go of everything, and just sit. Things got very quiet, clear and open. Things felt very spacious and simple. Definitely an overall pleasant sensation that pervaded my body. Breath felt clear, simple and cool. Tried gently turning my attention to the subtle sensations underneath the bigger pleasant ones, tried to incline towards the silence, emptiness and settledness. Got very dreamy and ethereal. Subconscious content could be felt bubbling to the surface, mostly as visual impressions. Felt like I could have kept sitting there for a long, long time. Maybe a light 3rd Jhana?

Finished up and there was a sense of disorientation. Looked at my hand and it felt like I was watching something on a television screen. I probably got up and jumped back into life a bit too quickly. The noises and sensations of family and life got kind of overwhelming and irritating and I started to shiver and feel cold and nauseous. A bit of a strobbing sensation in my visuals and when I close my eyes. I bundled up, started on my morning green smoothie and sat down to write this.

Planning on going on a hike with my wife and baby once the baby wakes up. Probably a good idea to do some grounding after a space-out like that. The kids are going to church with friends. They decided they wanted to see what it was like. My 7 year old son has combed back his unruly mane and is wearing shorts, a golf shirt and a bow tie.

Sorry for switching back and forth between past and present tense so much.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 9/14/20 1:12 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/14/20 1:12 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
73 minutes. The deepest I’ve gone since taking my panic attack break. I start with a resolution to attain Stream Entry and a resolution for this current session to find the fourth jhana. The usual drill. Concentration on breath, body, sound, mind and then awareness. Piti is strong, I can really absorb myself into the sound. It all feels very pleasant. There is a texture to it. Even the sounds of my family chattering in the other room or my wife running the epilator on her legs has a pleasant texture to it.

I work up to mind and then awareness. I’m noticing a “seeking” feeling. Maybe you can call it digging, or efforting. I try to let that go, and let objects in the mind present themselves rather than digging for them.

After a few (3?) loops I decide to do a bit of trying to observe the observer. I decide to focus on the sensations of shifting pressure on the bridge of my nose, between my eyes. I start by penetrating the object as best I can and then tracing that back to the observer.

When I’ve done this in the past, it’s like I look away from the observed sensation to see the observer. This time, I keep the sensations in view, almost as if I am looking at them through a telescope and follow the sight-line back to the observer. I notice how effortful and contracted I am and just decide to release things and let go of effort.

I got better clarity than I ever have. I get a sense of something immediately behind my eyes and face. There is an itching in the back of my eye sockets as it happens. Still very vague and elusive, but this feels like a step forward.



This sounds like your balance in your sits is strong and lucid, active engagement and a good sense of when to ease off and let go of the effort. As you say, a depth emerging again here after the integration period following your panic attack break.

After doing this for a bit I decided to just let go of everything, and just sit. Things got very quiet, clear and open. Things felt very spacious and simple. Definitely an overall pleasant sensation that pervaded my body. Breath felt clear, simple and cool. Tried gently turning my attention to the subtle sensations underneath the bigger pleasant ones, tried to incline towards the silence, emptiness and settledness. Got very dreamy and ethereal. Subconscious content could be felt bubbling to the surface, mostly as visual impressions. Felt like I could have kept sitting there for a long, long time. Maybe a light 3rd Jhana?

This kind of taste of effortless quiet and spaciousness is so renewing. The gentleness of the practice is a sweet thing, and my experience is that a lot of work gets done in these states, the old paradox of effortless effort. 

Finished up and there was a sense of disorientation. Looked at my hand and it felt like I was watching something on a television screen. I probably got up and jumped back into life a bit too quickly. The noises and sensations of family and life got kind of overwhelming and irritating and I started to shiver and feel cold and nauseous. A bit of a strobbing sensation in my visuals and when I close my eyes. I bundled up, started on my morning green smoothie and sat down to write this. 

This is why there is often a dead-man pose and slow easing back up and in period at the end of intense yoga sessions. The body-mind has experienced a depth in which work is done, and the re-integration period is very real. We all need green smoothies! More green smoothies!

Planning on going on a hike with my wife and baby once the baby wakes up. Probably a good idea to do some grounding after a space-out like that. The kids are going to church with friends. They decided they wanted to see what it was like. My 7 year old son has combed back his unruly mane and is wearing shorts, a golf shirt and a bow tie. 

lol, your balance, again. What a beautiful scene. Your son's shorts, golf shirt, and bow tie no doubt delighted God.

Sorry for switching back and forth between past and present tense so much.
I am fine with that. I was fine with that. I have been fine with that. If i'm not fine with that in the future, it's my own damn problem.

love, tim
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 9/14/20 7:54 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/14/20 7:54 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
God bless you Tim.

Just finished Slow Work, BTW. Lovely book. Reminded me of Ozu or Bruce Beresford's Tender Mercies. I left a review on goodreads.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 9/14/20 7:56 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/14/20 7:56 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
50 minutes. I’ve started a new job and I’ve reluctantly accepted that if I want to find time for meditation, I’ll have to start getting up early in the morning again. Set an intention (and an alarm) to get up at 5:30 this morning. Got up pretty easily, and sat down to meditate in the dark. I had a hacking cough that kept bothering me, but mostly my mind was incapable of settling down. I spent the entire session with brief moments of following my breath, but mostly my mind was wandering like a noob.

The non-intuitive sense that I got from the experience was that the mind-wandering was not due to sleepiness, but rather high energy. This makes sense as I engage in a minimum of reflection. Sleepiness in morning meditation has always been very rare for me and I have always been very productive and creative in the mornings. I think this may actually be an issue of not being accustomed to the energy of early morning meditation. Regardless, I had a very high degree of faith in this session. Remembering my streak of early morning work after my A&P of last year created a strong, embodied reminder of what my mind and body are capable of.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 9/17/20 4:59 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/17/20 4:59 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
All the best on your new job mate emoticon 
I will take a fork lifter driving license end of this months which should increase a chance of finding a job closer to where I live. 

Just to share;
I was never a morning person but had no issues to sit 4 in the morning when I was Post A&P back in 2010. I just needed less sleep and could not wait to wake up and sit again (out of bed onto the cushion, 60 minutes then go pee in the toilet afterwards) emoticon 
Right now I'm back to not being a morning person and find it impossible to sit if too early hence practicing when more alert and awake. Would be nice to get that morning energy back again! 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 9/17/20 1:09 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/17/20 1:09 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Ah yes, the post-A&P honeymoon, where my depression was magically gone and getting out of bed was effortless. The early morning sits are inconsistent so far but at least the all-day sleepiness is dependable.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 9/17/20 4:26 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 9/17/20 4:26 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Ah yes, the post-A&P honeymoon, where my depression was magically gone and getting out of bed was effortless. The early morning sits are inconsistent so far but at least the all-day sleepiness is dependable.

This reminds me of sharing war stories emoticon look at my victories and check out my wounds kind of thing emoticon I like it emoticon 

Best wishes to you and your family mate! 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/1/20 12:08 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/1/20 12:08 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
55 minutes. Things have been hectic lately, so I squeezed another one in at the end of day. Worked perfectly to put the kids in bed, do 30 minutes while they read, check in on them then do another 25 minutes.

Mind is buckling against any format. It wants to just do its thing. Mostly just sitting until the mind calms, then trying some Mahayana loops, but things are very unstructured. As things get calm and tranquil I am starting to hear mental chatter. It's an indiscernible babble that sounds like my voice or the voice of others I know, much like the garble you get when trying to find a radio station, but nothing ever resolves into a dialogue or anything clear. Lots of music mixed in with that. A friend recommended I revisit Frank Black earlier this week and that has been in heavy mental rotation since then.

Have been experiencing energy flows that seem to carry my awareness upwards. Abre has recommended I follow those flows and that they are likely to lead me in higher equanimity. I try to lock in (in the non-striving contemplative way) to one of these flows. In the process I’m thinking about a metaphor Shargol made of a bird guiding a ship to land and of the anti-climactic, climactic moments of A Wizard of Earthsea where it is an endless expanse of water at the edge of the world. For the first time I think I got a taste of panoramic stuff everyone talks about. Very, very peaceful and pleasant and open, but it is a new threshold so there is also a bit of that disorienting apprehension that goes along with it.

I just want to keep practicing, but lots going on in life right now. Comparing this to logs earlier when I thought I was in equanimity. This seems more like the real thing, particularly considering the extremely shitty stuff I experienced recently that felt very Dark Night. Life is hectic. Lots of stress, but it feels okay. Feels like that James Bondy okayness that MCTB talks about. The highs are also not that high, particularly compared to my past A&P experiences. The caveat of my lack of experience always applies. Feeling more confident about the diagnosis, but there is still uncertainty. Either way, practice continues.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 10/1/20 2:49 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/1/20 2:49 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
"Comparing this to logs earlier when I thought I was in equanimity. This seems more like the real thing, particularly considering the extremely shitty stuff I experienced recently that felt very Dark Night."

emoticon This totally aligns with my experience. I say if you are unsure/uncertain even a bit that you are in EQ then you likely are not in EQ. EQ stage is very much obvious especially after a shitty heavy DN. 

My biggest mistake in past EQs was clinging to the pleasantness of it as in comparison to the very unpleasant DN and fear I might fall back. This was a mistake and caused falling back emoticon of course. 

It's very good you have a teacher mate! Don't fret about not having much time to sit. Once a day can be enough when in EQ and through the day just keep living and do what you do, changing diapers and feeding and looking after kids, etc ... EQ stage is there all the way anyway emoticon 

My very best wishes to you mate! 
BTW, my partner is preagnant emoticon im
to be a father for the 2nd time sometime next year if all goes well emoticon We should start a group Mastering the Core Teaching of Parenting ;) 

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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/2/20 9:18 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/2/20 9:18 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
My biggest mistake in past EQs was clinging to the pleasantness of it as in comparison to the very unpleasant DN and fear I might fall back. This was a mistake and caused falling back emoticon of course. 


Keeping this in mind in last night and this morning's practice. Noticing lots of little expecatations and frustrations after the depth of the previous sit. Nearly bit off the head of my son when he interrupted my morning trance. EQ indeed!

My very best wishes to you mate! 
BTW, my partner is preagnant emoticon im
to be a father for the 2nd time sometime next year if all goes well emoticon We should start a group Mastering the Core Teaching of Parenting ;) 

Congrats dude! I think parenting is just like the POI -- learn to accept the disaster until you don't give a shit anymore. So far, so good.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 10/3/20 2:42 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/3/20 2:42 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
I have a feeling that if we dont really learn the Dark Night well, and really see it in a most profound way, the EQ might be a slippery place hard to stay in and prone to backsliding.

I really found it helpful to imagine (as an analogy of course) a huge Tsunami wave comming my way in form of DN and me having no place to hide, no tricks and games left to protect me, only utter acceptance of Dhammic Tsunami (Re-observation) crushing me any minute now. Thats it! I cant do shit about it but accept it and be crushed by the matter of fact noted phenomena. Thats it. Just that huge scary Tsunami wave and me staring at it coming and crushing over me. Thats it. Sensation after sensation after sensation, feeling after feeling after feeling, mind state after mind state after mind state ... no place to hide just acceptance and letting it crush me to bits and pieces.

... ... ... 


... (Im not going to write more as I hate spoilers and they stand in the way of really accepting that Tsunami about to crush your tiny little self. You don't want it to crush you! You just accept you not being able to hide from it anylonger. Its right infront of you. Your only salvation is being Awake in those last moments; keep noting, one after the other as they arise and pass away ... yes, its a vast flood of fear, disqust and misery) 

Best wishes my friend! emoticon 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/3/20 4:20 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/3/20 4:20 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Sounds a bit like Take Shelter.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFtsNj1-GFM
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 10/3/20 4:44 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/3/20 4:44 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Sounds a bit like Take Shelter.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFtsNj1-GFM

emoticon It certainly can feel like it in my experience emoticon except, there is no taking shelter! emoticon 

(tiny spoiler; feels great after such a Tsunami sit, so if it shows up, persist, don't resist, and certainly do not get up early from your timed sit).


You will be fine emoticon 
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 10/3/20 11:27 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/3/20 11:27 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Papa Che

You will be fine 
emoticon 


Brandon, listen to Papa Che, he's right. You'll be fine after the tsunami obliterates you, just as a drowned rat is fine! Just assume the Drowned Rat Mudra as the vast wall of water engulfs you, and kiss your ass goodbye.
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Niels Lyngsø, modified 3 Years ago at 10/2/20 2:57 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/2/20 2:57 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 413 Join Date: 11/15/19 Recent Posts
Good for you! I'm happy to read that things are going better. And btw it's a pleasure following your log. All the best, N.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 10/2/20 3:11 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/2/20 3:11 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
I just want to keep practicing, but lots going on in life right now. Comparing this to logs earlier when I thought I was in equanimity. This seems more like the real thing, particularly considering the extremely shitty stuff I experienced recently that felt very Dark Night. Life is hectic. Lots of stress, but it feels okay. Feels like that James Bondy okayness that MCTB talks about. The highs are also not that high, particularly compared to my past A&P experiences. The caveat of my lack of experience always applies. Feeling more confident about the diagnosis, but there is still uncertainty. Either way, practice continues.

I think in real equanimity, the entire practice, on the mat, is not fucking up the EQ, doing nothing ever more skillfully, basically. The cutting edge of EQ is off the mat, it's the only place anything "really" happens, the only place anything arises. EQ forces us into seeing our whole life as practice. Now what? On the mat, not a damn thing. But who's that screaming in the next room, lol? This is a job for 008, Dayton, Brandon Dayton. Famous Green Grounding Smoothie pureed, not stirred, please.

love, tim
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/4/20 2:33 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/4/20 2:33 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Now what? On the mat, not a damn thing. But who's that screaming in the next room, lol? This is a job for 008, Dayton, Brandon Dayton. Famous Green Grounding Smoothie pureed, not stirred, please.

Yeah, life was feeling pretty "EQ" there for awhile. Just had to put our cat down, and something about that tipped the scales. No panic attacks or anything, but the last few days have felt bumpy.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 10/5/20 12:23 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/5/20 12:23 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Now what? On the mat, not a damn thing. But who's that screaming in the next room, lol? This is a job for 008, Dayton, Brandon Dayton. Famous Green Grounding Smoothie pureed, not stirred, please.

Yeah, life was feeling pretty "EQ" there for awhile. Just had to put our cat down, and something about that tipped the scales. No panic attacks or anything, but the last few days have felt bumpy.

The only time i ever saw my Marine Corps father cry was when we had to put our dog down. It's a big deal for a family, and often the first taste of real grief for the children. I have always felt that the stages of grief make a strong and fruitful counterpoint with spiritual practice: from denial through the array of emotions and rationalizations to the darkness of depression, before the grace of acceptance. And now there's a pig of grief in the python of the family life, something real and palpable to be digested and, hopefully, accepted. What is the upaya, the skillful means, for telling a four-year-old the cat is gone for ever? Four is actually still young enough for pure mythology to work for most kids: kitty is in heaven still flies as a comfort. And it's not like you can tell the kid to start meditating, because life is dukkha and nobody really knows shit, and kitty is worm food, as we all will be. But it's okay, because I am tasting some equanimity in my sits, honey. I think the transition from depression/grief to faith/grief can meaningfully be called faith, that every acceptance is a species of faith, and there is going to be a state of the art acceptance for every grief, and hopefully a healthy one that doesn't cripple us back toward a species of denial or suppressed rage at existence or glib intellectualizations of things that only the heart can really resolve in its own time: premature "acceptances" that only add to the mess. So it's a real thing, grief in any form.

The other thing about your present interesting poise between quiet sits and bumpier life stuff is that you are practicing at what through much of history has been a monastic level of meditation, and you are doing it as a householder. Our contemporary Buddhism takes it more or less for granted, but that level of practice is like a permanent second job, in its way. It's going to put real pressure on the normal rhythm of life in a lot of ways, it's why monasteries are designed the way they are, to minimize exactly the kinds of things that family life and careers and social circumstances across the board bring up every day. Thank God for the famous green smoothies, and God bless you. I have a hard enough time getting out of bed most days with only myself to feed.

love, tim
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/4/20 2:50 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/4/20 2:50 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
60 minutes. Practice feels like it is progressing. Still generally following mahayana loops, but allowing myself to drop intentional practice as it seems appropriate and just let my mind do its thing. The mind quiets bit-by-bit throughout practice until it's at a very still place. More of that increasing sense of openess. Part of Abre's instructions to me while at the stage of the mind have been to allow myself to be aborbed by the present state of mind and let it wash over me. Some experiences of deep cool bliss, and also one big ecstatic surge of pleasure. As the practice gets deeper everything has a pleasant quality to it. Sometimes the volume is high, sometimes low, but the general feeling tone is pleasant. Sounds particularly become very pleasant as things progress. 

As I repeat the loop the body feels less and less grounded, and the work up into awareness gets more pure and open. Maybe need to spend more time grounding the body at the beginning of each loop, but it seems that I get higher (into EQ or just higher?) with each loop.

After practice I go upstairs and my wife starts talking to me and it's clear I'm still way up in the clouds. I have a surge of anxiety. Sounds around the house are now irritating and I'm feeling lightheaded. I take a walk, take a nap, have some lunch and am now feeling a bit more settled. Feel like I'm passing through rough insight territory again. Funny how it doesn't happen on the cushion for me. On the cushion is most often pleasant in some form or another, but returning to life feels grating. More to learn apparently.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 10/5/20 11:48 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/5/20 11:46 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
"Some experiences of deep cool bliss, and also one big ecstatic surge of pleasure. As the practice gets deeper everything has a pleasant quality to it. Sometimes the volume is high, sometimes low, but the general feeling tone is pleasant."

As Tim da Cross said, we do this as householders meaning we are not protected by the monasitc life style. We are the cavalary, front line, under full on barrage fire!!! emoticon 

What you describe has also happened to me, and especially alot during my early years when I believed that this joy/rapture/bliss was THE TRUTH. These Jhana absorptions make my life look totally washed out and crappy. I want that bliss. Clinging wants that bliss. 

What you are now learning is the truth about Jhanas; they do not last! They are unsatisfactory because they cant fucking last emoticon 
The bliss part of 3rd Jhana is mostly in the long outbreathing, so next time try and unpack that in-breathing some more. See if there is some Dukkha in it. See if this 3rd Jhana really feels so great or is there even in this very state some unsatisfactory aspect of it. I mean its all 3rd Jhana, both in and out breathing, so check them out and see if you can notice any difference between the two.


On another note;
When DN Nanas have something really importnat to tell us they might come up in off cushion life as they cant really talk through the milk and honey of the Jhana stuff which is on cushion. 
When you have time for the DN Nanas to tell you their story maybe turn off the absorption stuff and let the DN Nanas speak. May this be your decision, when ready or just plain fed up with this utter struggle and you just yell at it "here I am, standing infront you, naked and without a shield, come and get meeeee!" emoticon (yes Im suggesting Noting here, I know, the shamless Papa)

Best wishes!
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/5/20 3:55 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/5/20 3:55 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
"here I am, standing infront you, naked and without a shield, come and get meeeee!"

Gonna write this on a notecard and keep it next to me for reference during practice.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/8/20 2:17 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/8/20 2:14 PM

Hello ñanas my old friends

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Feels like my practice is retracing the ñanas over the last few days and I am becoming more and more familiar with the how things present for me. Things probably got kicked off this time around when I had a big orgasmic rush on Sunday. Probably another A&P. Sounds like something Shargol has described, where you are getting close in EQ and your mind grabs on to the A&P instead. He also says you’ll likely hit 1000’s of those before SE, so this looks like just another lap around the block.

Woke up early Monday (Tuesday maybe?) morning with lots of creepy images. Felt a subtle unease during the day. As I notice uneasy feelings I’m starting to accept them in the right way -- “oh yeah, this isn’t about everything feeling great, but accepting stuff as it is.” I keep thinking about PCD’s advice from above and Ron Crouch’s advice that the ñanas are not about being okay with the crappy feelings, but just being willing to feel them. The "come and get meeeee!" attitude feels right.

Yesterday I woke up with the uneasy feelings escalating. Lots of creepy, icky dreams too. Just feeling exhausted all day. I think this is how part of the dukkha ñanas manifests to me -- just a grinding, oppressive exhaustion that I feel even when I’m lying down. I think it’s somewhere in the realm of Misery or Disgust. Maybe I did a bit of both that day. Didn’t want to work, lots of daydreams. Spent about a half an hour looking up Amish farm equipment and fantasizing about having my own horse-tilled farm.

After dinner I sat for half an hour and all of the sensations just felt like the volume was turned way up and everything was pressing in on me. Was restless and groggy. I did the practice, but without any extra credit.

I put our baby to bed. The last few nights when I’ve been doing this, she is totally inconsolable for about half an hour, then finally whimpers to sleep. This feels viscerally like practicing through the dukkha ñanas (maybe it is in its own form). I am not trying to fix it. I am just staying with her patiently and calmly until the crying subsides. I’m impressed by how unphased I am by the experience.

I finally get into bed and notice an oppressive sense of unease and claustrophobia that I recognize from my past few recent experiences with panic attacks. My whole body feels wretched and I just want to get out. I’m guessing this is some Desire for Deliverance type stuff. I feel mentally prepared for it, particularly having passed through it a few times now. I accept it totally and let the sensations wash over me. My body and face convulse and contort in kriyas as I let the sensations do their thing. My wife is a champ as I explain that this doesn’t feel as bad as it looks. She shrugs and turns over to go to sleep as I grunt and contort next to her. She’s pretty amazing how trusting she’s become about all of this weird stuff. It’s become a joke now that I can use it as an excuse for any odd behavior. Laying a cloud of fart gas in my wake? Oh yeah, that’s just a meditation thing, honey. This DFD stuff maybe lasts for 20 minutes. The whole time I am thinking about how I will describe it in my log and giving myself a Kenneth Folk brand attaboy for facing it like a champ, then cautioning myself not to jinx it. I imagine a tsunami sized wave shadowing me as I raise my arms in victory.

Afterwards I sit in bed with insomnia until 2 in the morning (usually I’m asleep by 10) my mind rushing with intense optimism. After a while I decide I might as well just practice while I’m bed, which turns out to be a bad idea. I spend about 20 minutes and when I transition into mind the absorption opens up hard into my subconscious. Lots of creepy, disturbing images start to flood out, along with the trippy fractals I’ve heard so much about. Whatever skill I am gaining at being willing to accept shitty emotions is not translating well over to fear. I have always been very sensitive to fear and it just feels overwhelming. I make some attempts at acceptance but quickly retreat. Live to fight another day.

I am starting to nod off, but every time I do so disturbing images pop into mind, waking me again. I have a brief moment where I am asleep and the dreams are surreal in their details but feel totally grounded and embodied in their quality. I’m navigating some sort of Daliesque space and the sense of climbing up and down and traveling through space is as real as when fully awake. There is a glee to it, but also a simmering dread as to how this reality will transform. The dread startles me awake and I repeat this process until sleep finally wins over the heebie jeebies.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 10/8/20 4:25 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/8/20 4:23 PM

RE: Hello ñanas my old friends

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Fear is already part of the lovely DN package emoticon 
Best thing with all things DN related is to fast note them for what they are. Fear is VERY much in the BODY sensations as well as in the mind state and feeling but most of the stuff that holds it is actually in the body. Do silent noting but keep at it;

inability to sleep, fear, unpleasant, mind images, unpleasant, uneasiness, anticipation, unpleasant, listening, tension, unpleasant ... (remembering the body sensations and really investigating them fast), short breathing, in ears ringing, strange sensation in the forehead, eyebrows clenching, heat and tension in hands, arms, jaw tension, strong presence in the eyes, ... In fear there is this urge to LOCATE the danger and readiness in arms and legs to fight or flight. This locating has more to do with seeing, hearing and smelling could also be in body being able to detect shaking of the ground in case its a large animal attacking. Check those sensations, in the eyes, ears, nose, skin. 

Dont run away from the fear but also dont treat it lightly, rather you want to see all its aspects (ardent, alert and mindful without lapse), want to get to know it well, body sensations included. Its easy to feel overwhelmed with just the Feeling Tone and Mind State emoticon  Body sensations are the mama and papa of this awakening game, always retruning back to the body sensations and connecting them with the feeling tone and mind states is a good idea. Calling out the Dragons name takes away 50% of its power over you emoticon Note it at least once a second and soak into it, and you are doing it right.

Fear will inevitabley pass away. Anicca never fails at this.

Best wishes to you!
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 10/11/20 3:26 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/11/20 3:26 AM

RE: Hello ñanas my old friends

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
Feels like my practice is retracing the ñanas over the last few days and I am becoming more and more familiar with the how things present for me. Things probably got kicked off this time around when I had a big orgasmic rush on Sunday. Probably another A&P. Sounds like something Shargol has described, where you are getting close in EQ and your mind grabs on to the A&P instead. He also says you’ll likely hit 1000’s of those before SE, so this looks like just another lap around the block.

Woke up early Monday (Tuesday maybe?) morning with lots of creepy images. Felt a subtle unease during the day. As I notice uneasy feelings I’m starting to accept them in the right way -- “oh yeah, this isn’t about everything feeling great, but accepting stuff as it is.” I keep thinking about PCD’s advice from above and Ron Crouch’s advice that the ñanas are not about being okay with the crappy feelings, but just being willing to feel them. The "come and get meeeee!" attitude feels right.

Yesterday I woke up with the uneasy feelings escalating. Lots of creepy, icky dreams too. Just feeling exhausted all day. I think this is how part of the dukkha ñanas manifests to me -- just a grinding, oppressive exhaustion that I feel even when I’m lying down. I think it’s somewhere in the realm of Misery or Disgust. Maybe I did a bit of both that day. Didn’t want to work, lots of daydreams. Spent about a half an hour looking up Amish farm equipment and fantasizing about having my own horse-tilled farm.

After dinner I sat for half an hour and all of the sensations just felt like the volume was turned way up and everything was pressing in on me. Was restless and groggy. I did the practice, but without any extra credit.

I put our baby to bed. The last few nights when I’ve been doing this, she is totally inconsolable for about half an hour, then finally whimpers to sleep. This feels viscerally like practicing through the dukkha ñanas (maybe it is in its own form). I am not trying to fix it. I am just staying with her patiently and calmly until the crying subsides. I’m impressed by how unphased I am by the experience.

I finally get into bed and notice an oppressive sense of unease and claustrophobia that I recognize from my past few recent experiences with panic attacks. My whole body feels wretched and I just want to get out. I’m guessing this is some Desire for Deliverance type stuff. I feel mentally prepared for it, particularly having passed through it a few times now. I accept it totally and let the sensations wash over me. My body and face convulse and contort in kriyas as I let the sensations do their thing. My wife is a champ as I explain that this doesn’t feel as bad as it looks. She shrugs and turns over to go to sleep as I grunt and contort next to her. She’s pretty amazing how trusting she’s become about all of this weird stuff. It’s become a joke now that I can use it as an excuse for any odd behavior. Laying a cloud of fart gas in my wake? Oh yeah, that’s just a meditation thing, honey. This DFD stuff maybe lasts for 20 minutes. The whole time I am thinking about how I will describe it in my log and giving myself a Kenneth Folk brand attaboy for facing it like a champ, then cautioning myself not to jinx it. I imagine a tsunami sized wave shadowing me as I raise my arms in victory.

Afterwards I sit in bed with insomnia until 2 in the morning (usually I’m asleep by 10) my mind rushing with intense optimism. After a while I decide I might as well just practice while I’m bed, which turns out to be a bad idea. I spend about 20 minutes and when I transition into mind the absorption opens up hard into my subconscious. Lots of creepy, disturbing images start to flood out, along with the trippy fractals I’ve heard so much about. Whatever skill I am gaining at being willing to accept shitty emotions is not translating well over to fear. I have always been very sensitive to fear and it just feels overwhelming. I make some attempts at acceptance but quickly retreat. Live to fight another day.

I am starting to nod off, but every time I do so disturbing images pop into mind, waking me again. I have a brief moment where I am asleep and the dreams are surreal in their details but feel totally grounded and embodied in their quality. I’m navigating some sort of Daliesque space and the sense of climbing up and down and traveling through space is as real as when fully awake. There is a glee to it, but also a simmering dread as to how this reality will transform. The dread startles me awake and I repeat this process until sleep finally wins over the heebie jeebies.

Hey Brandon, In the Judeo-Christian tradition, the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom. They don't say it explicitly, but I think raging terror is wisdom a few steps down the path. I think if you don't feel some serious dread once in a while, dread threatening to be overwhelming, you probably don't know what's at stake.

This is why I keep going back to the Psalms, which from one angle are a dark night phenomenology journal:

"Save me, O God; for the waters are come in unto my soul. I sink in deep mire, where there is no standing: I am come into deep waters, where the floods overflow me." (Psalm 69)

You appear to have a very good idea of what is at stake. Live to fight another day, my friend, one sit at a time, amen. 

love, tim
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/16/20 10:42 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/16/20 3:02 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
10/15

Had a good coaching session with Abre today. Her take is that the last two weeks have been eventful, but my logs have not been regular enough to really see clearly what is going on. I'm frustrated with this too. I'm spending too much time trying to make my logs readable, which means I don't log on days when I feel rushed. I'm frustrated that I haven't kept better daily notes so I can retrace more clearly how things have progressed. My commitment for the next two weeks is to log after each sit. Not sure how much of that I'll post here.

60 min. Around 8pm. Sit started immediately feeling unstable and fluid. Felt like images were bubbling up. A creepy vibe. All sensations seemed to be accompanied by some sort of visual impression. Not a full color image, but a flash or just a sense of an image. I think there was some sleepiness too. I felt like I kept losing concentration, but it wasn’t like my mind was wandering. It was probably more like I was dozing off. The tone remained kind of creepy with a bit of neutral for a while.

Around half way through things quieted down and the tone became more pleasant. I thought about releasing the sense of awareness around the face and things seemed to shift a bit. Felt like I was above or below the sensations. I thought about the sensations in my face expanding or relaxing outwards.

No new territory. Everything felt basically familiar. Kids interrupted and heard some noise here and there that spooked me. I'm finding I'm very jumpy lately. After being interrupted things got a bit creepy again and I started to feel a bit restless.

10/16

Ugh. Rough one this morning.

40 minutes this morning. Woke up at 4 am and couldn’t fall back asleep so around 5 am I decided to do a sit. I sat down and my mind was immediately totally empty. I did some following the breath, but it was so obvious that my mind was already completely quiet that I just moved on to the vipassana. There was a subtle sense of unease with the quiet. At some point I tried moving through the jhanas. Felt like I could do something that could be classified as 1-4, but I stalled out at 5. Didn’t really get that sense of infinite space and ditched the attempt.

Overall there was a sense of some space that opened up. I feel like there was a good sense of space particularly when I focused on sound, like I had awareness of empty areas of the sound field. I tried releasing “sensations” in my face and felt a tightness and constriction in my face that I haven’t felt before. Usually I feel a pressure or bubbling sensations but this time it felt like my skin was being pulled tightly to the center.

Things seemed to get deeper as I moved into awareness. There was a sense of finding new ground although I can’t remember why that was. During this phase there was a sense of eyes forming in front of my eyes. Mostly dark splotches. This was creepy and I felt a resistance to it.

At 30 minutes I stretched and started a new timer. I was feeling optimistic enough that I decided to continue. There was a feeling of quiet and upward energy. I started to bob back and forth, which has never happened before. Perhaps there was a sensation up my back. Started to think this could be actual kundalini as oppossed to the weird convlusions that I had thought were kundalini before. I had a strong sense of anticipation that started to turn into anxiety, like the type of anxiety you get when you are on too much coffee or about to vomit.

I had to use the bathroom and I wasn’t liking how the anxiety was feeling so I decided to stop at 40 minutes and tried grounding myself. I was searching the house for my computer to log when the anxiety started to surge again. I got back in bed and went through 20 minutes of convulsions. I had icky sensations in my throat and stomach that caused me to gag along with the convulsions. Kept reminding myself I was okay, I was safe, ect and ect and kept resolving to accept whatever sensations came along, but man it was hellish. After the convulsions were done, cramps and nausea started to come up. I had IBS symptoms that I’m familiar with for the rest of the morning -- cramping, nausea, and diarrhea. Called in sick to work and was in bed till 10 am.

Not sure if this was a DN thing, something bad I ate the night before or a collisions of the two (I'm leaning towards theory #3). Tired and still not much of an apetite. Trying to decide how to approach my next sit, or if it's time to take another little break.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/16/20 10:40 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/16/20 10:40 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Did another 30 minute session tonight while sitting in bed.

Took a leap of faith and did another session. Mind felt quite easily into it. Some creepiness, but things mostly felt settled. There was weird stroby sense of motion in my field of view as a I started. Was sitting back with my head on a pillow so I was looking at a 45 degree angle, which felt very interesting. Mind was very quiet again. Some sounds and images made me jump here and then. Sit felt pretty typical. Even the creepiness started to feel a bit boring. At the awareness stage I felt again the sense that eyes were forming in front of my eyes.

Like I said, felt typical, but also felt good that I wasn't freaking out.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/17/20 1:55 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/17/20 1:55 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
60 minutes.

Came to the sit with a bit of apprehension after the ickiness of yesterday. Started with the normal resolution to attain Stream Entry and an intention for the sit to accept willingly whatever arose in the session. Sat down and again, quietness of mind was nearly immediate and absorption came on. Spent a moment with the breath and did a few counts to 8. There were actually a few errant thoughts, but things got even quieter. The sit progressed as normal - body to sound to mind to awareness. Familiar territory mostly. Things felt quieter, more relaxed and deeper with each loop. With each pass things became more pleasant. For whatever reason, absorption into sound is the most pleasant and I would find sounds like the refrigerator kicking on or a distant car to be pleasurable. No real opening of space or panoramic feelings.

Spent some time in the mind testing out jhanas. Still totally unsure how to define things, but went from the pleasant feelings of 2nd jhana to something more subtle (3rd?) and then dropped down to something quieter (maybe 4th). Had a moment thinking about sex and wondered how much of the feeling I could replicate just by inclining towards it. A definite feeling of pleasure that followed, not 100% there, but interesting.

Very quiet sit. Subtle boredom, expectation, wanting and disappointment cropped up. I could note those and let them go. Towards the end I started to notice fatigue and some sleepiness.

Off cushion feel okay with some apprehension about anxiety or other icky things popping up. Libido seems to be higher lately.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/18/20 9:54 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/18/20 9:54 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
10/18

Off cushion. Woke up feeling icky and blah and took an hour to get out of bed after I had turned on the lights. Went hiking with the kids and it was fine with some moments of exhaustion and irritation. Mosty feeling neutral with some subtle dread that things are going to mentally go south.

50 minutes. Started the sit after having a tense conversation about a potential business venture among family members (I know), but was confident I would be able to quiet my mind. After a few series of counting the breath to eight, I felt ready to get started. Normal progression. One new thing I tried to do this time was to be absorbed by bodily sensations the same way I soak into sound or into the mind. The embodiment came quickly, along with pleasant absorption. Lots of jerking and sneering in my face.

Things felt quite ordinary from there. Moved from sound to mind and to awareness. Noticed boredom, expectations, wanting and little bits of fear. Becoming used to the body jerks that happen with an errant sound or other distraction.

On the second loop spent a bit of time directing awareness towards the empty areas of sound. At the awareness phase I spent some time letting go of the concept of my head and just felt the sensations of my face floating in space. Got a sense for a moment that expanded out from the sensations. Almost like I was looking from underneath them. Other than that it felt like familiar territory.

Towards the end I started another loop at the body and decided to be absorbed into the body again. The body felt very vibrant and energetic. There were much stronger jerks and twitches in my face. I felt a big upwelling of energy that surged but didn’t ever really climax. The energy dropped but I could tell my concentration was deepening and I started to feel similar to the end of the session on the morning of the 16th. Very concentrated, energy was rising and some energetic stimulant-like anxiety. At this point my family finished watching a show and I could hear them milling around outside the room where I was practicing. Their noises were very irritating. My wife came into the room to use the bathroom and things were even more grating. She left to do some dishes, but things were starting to feel more and more unstable. The clinking of dishes in the other room were like nails on a chalkboard. Decided to wrap up. Took me a good long while to feel myself settle down. Finally taking some big sighs of relief as things settle.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 10/19/20 2:41 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/19/20 2:41 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
"The clinking of dishes in the other room were like nails on a chalkboard."

This was the gold mine Brandon emoticon This is what you want to sit with. Try and see if you can warm up to the idea of Accepting all that Mysery, Disqust and Agony of those sounds "nails on a chalkboard" when they come up next time. It WILL be VERY unpleasant to sit with it but sweet at the end. In my case, it was the sound of cars passing our house that drove me nuts but was the very sit that resolved my last Dark Night really well. It was worth each miserable, agonizing and disgusting second of that sit. 

Of course try not to bleed out onto your wife or kids. Better to wrap up if you feel it's just going the wrong way, and you start feeling anger towards them making noise. 
There has to be the aspect of you wanting to meet face to face with your mind in those moments rather than projecting onto those who are making the sounds. 

Best wishes mate! 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/19/20 3:21 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/19/20 3:21 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
You're right. I feel lately like I'm trying to strike a balance. It's like I've got a pot of water and I want to apply enough heat to it to keep it boiling, but not enough that it boils over. I've had it boil over once, and it wasn't pretty, but yeah trying to stay with the yucky stuff.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/19/20 9:40 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/19/20 9:32 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Some insomnia last night (early this morning). Woke up around 12 AM and was awake until 4am. Actual insomnia wasn’t that stressful. Just kind of rode it out. It was worse around 5am when I woke up from eerie dreams after only having had an hour of poor sleep. Wondered if the insomnia had to do with practicing so close to bedtime the night before.

Practice tonight -- 60 minutes. Starting around 6:30 so it wouldn’t affect my sleep. Lots of rough experiences with pratice the last few days, so there is part of me that is like, "jeez, should I really be doing this?" Started with a decent amount of stress and some surges of anxiety and panic. Sounds felt oppressive and dissonant. Some icky feelings too, particularly in the face which caused my face to contort and grimace. Some unpleasant feelings in the body too as I began the loops. I looked at it, opened to it and let it pass.

During the sound phase, there were sounds from my family in the other room and distant cars. I noted when the sounds vanished and the emptiness that remained.
Maybe it was the exhaustion from the night before, but there seemed to be a cap on how far deep my concentration could go. Paid attention to a bit of boredom and expectation. Some impatience and restlessness and urge to get up or check the clock toward the end.

Mostly all familiar territory.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/24/20 11:39 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/24/20 11:39 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
10/20

60 minutes. 4:30 pm. Aversion to practice today. Today generally felt glum and unenergetic. Lots of sleepiness during the sit, so lots of opportunity to investigate sleepiness. Took a while to quiet the mind and concentration did not get very deep. Just wasn’t a lot of mental energy available without straining. Did a few loops and everything felt pretty ordinary and boring. Expectation, wanting, dissatisfaction.

10/21

32 minutes. 7:15 pm

Getting hammered by sleepiness. Doing what I can of the loops but everything is overwhelmed by sleepiness. Try standing for a while but afraid I’m going to fall over. Finally sit and do some of the more physical stuff from TMI, like tensing the body all over and releasing. This seems to help a bit, but the sleepiness eventually comes back. Tapped out at 32 minutes.

Off the cushion -- neutral okayness. I kind of like it. Enjoyed riding bikes with my daughter. A lovely quiet pleasantness.

10/22

50 minutes, 6:50 AM

Finally got up for an early morning session. Ended going to bed at 8 last night, so the sleepiness of yesterday was no joke. An erratic, stressful week, so it’s no surprise my sleep was off.

Normal routine, but my mind kept getting lost in thought. Maybe concentration got a bit better over time, but by 30 minutes in it was still not settling. Funny to experience this when concentration was completely effortless less than a week ago. Finally, realized that the mind state was due to restlessness and decided to drop all intentions for a bit.

That seemed to be the right approach. The mind relaxed and I was able to start the loops. spent time with the body and did some sinking practice. Most of the practice felt pretty ordinary, and I noted relief from the feeling of ordinariness. When it came to the mind phase I took an approach that I’ve been trying to soak into the state of mind as reflected or expressed in my sense of the room and space around me.

When I came to awareness, I thought back to Sunday when I was hiking with my kids. We hiked up to a point with a vista of the valley. I took some time to just pay attention to the feeling of space and openness at that point and noticed that I could even collapse that sense. I could make distant mountains feel like they are sitting right in front of my eyes. I tried to recall this sense of space as I was sitting in awareness and it seemed to help open up the sense of space.


10/23

30 minutes 3pm

Was hoping to practice early this morning, but had some more insomnia after waking up at 4 am. This usually means I end up falling back asleep right when it’s the best time to wake up for practice. This was doubly problematic as it meant I had to fit practice in later in the day and when I finally got around to practice I ran into sleepiness again from the insomnia.

The practice started normal. I got to a concentrated phase and I started moving through the loops. At some point I was concentrated enough that I stopped and paid attention to the quietness.

Sleepiness hit hard around 20 minutes. Not sure what to do with it. I try to find a spot of stability that I can hold to or sometimes I investigate it. This time I started bobbing and just kind of let my body start bobbing around with the sleepiness. Eventually I tapped out. I know I’m going to be facing sleepiness again, but honestly it’s such a rare occurrence that I’m not sure I need to worry too much about developing approaches to combat it. Getting a good night’s sleep seems to be the best prophylactic.

Off cushion the day felt quite good, like I was getting back to some EQ type off-cushion vibes. I sat in my bed in the morning and noticed the pleasantness of cool air on my feet. It was so enjoyable it started to feel sexual, which was very weird. I’m noticing all of these places in my life where I just enjoy and savor simple pleasures: being with my children, being in nature, playing games. Such a radical difference from just 2 years ago where I found it impossible to be happy.

I do have my DN moments, and when they happen, they are like thunderbolts -- dramatic, fast and big, but at least so far, they are short lived.


10/24


60 minutes 8:45 am

Started today feeling discouraged and annoyed by yesterday’s practice, like I was losing momentum with the many bouts of sleepiness. Was averse to practice too. Took my time waking up and reluctantly getting to the cushion. Started like normal, trying to follow the breath and my mind just felt like it didn’t want to settle. Decided to take the “do nothing” approach again. Dropped all intentions and just let whatever emerged, emerge. Also thinking about Daniel’s bat-hat video on the DN. He made the comment about the action happening in the periphery. Which is something that I had heard and read many times before, but this time it stuck and I decided to apply it any time I became very concentrated or felt a surge of piti. My normal instinct is to contract around those sensations at this focused area in front of my face (any wonder I have so many intense sensations at the brow?), but during this entire sit, when I felt my attention narrowing I would relax it. Not trying to push it open to a panoramic level, but opening it to the periphery of my field of vision. Quickly got into a concentrated, relaxed state and decided to just stay there to see how things developed. Objects presented themselves clearly, whether mental or sensations. It was very much a “still forest pool” (SFP?) type of mind state. Recollected that this was the mind state my A&P emerged in. I’m sure one of the seven factors covers this. I’m guessing it’s acceptance, but acceptance in a very metta way. Probably some faith too, just letting the mind guide the practice. I initially gave myself permission to "do nothing" the entire practice, but then it became clear that I was forcing it a bit and my intuition wanted to go to the mahayana loops.

I started with the body. I decided to take the SFP mindset with each stage of the loop and let the sensations of the body present themselves to me. The body already felt very light, as if I had already done a loop. I moved on to sound with the same SFP approach. Lots of noises of a house on a Saturday morning, but I took it all in. At this point I felt an uprising of energy, almost as if someone was pulling on the top of my head and began to feel an ecstatic pleasure. It quickly peaked and I felt the energy begin to flow downwards.

I continued with the mind. Again trying to sense the state of mind as reflected in all the perceptions around me rather than in the space in my head. Nothing unusual about the awareness phase.

Started another loop feeling very grounded in the body this time. Moved up the chain. At the sound phase I turned my attention to the quietness which triggered a peaceful bliss. At the mind phase I opened my eyes, and looked around the room and again asked the question how is my state of mind reflected in the visuals of the room? This started another surge of ecstasy this time. I closed my eyes and a giant smile broke across my face as it began to build. It surged, but in a much more open way than usual.

I stayed with it and a sense of space began to open up in front of me. When I normally have my eyes closed it feels like there is a dark surface about 6 inches in front of my eyes that wraps around my head. This time it felt like that surface moved outward as if it was now 10 to 20 feet away. Like I was sitting in a large empty cavern. The energy dropped a bit, but it was still a very euphoric open feeling.
The timer went off, startling me. Could sense that the transition back to life would take some time. A little bit of post practice anxiety. Took about 10 minutes to adjust, but was still edgy coming upstairs to write my log.

A bit of dread that after such a high I might crash into some DN territory again, but also feeling more confident in navigating that territory after having passed through it a few times now.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 10/25/20 11:03 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 10/25/20 11:03 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
56 minutes 8 am

Mind was very quiet from the outset. Took some time just to check things out with the breath, then went to the body. Tried to take a similar approach to yesterday and let the sensations of the body present themselves rather than trying to intentionally focus, but that didn’t quite work. I think my concentration has to be higher first. Followed the loops up. Mind continued to be quiet but there was a lack of clarity throughout the practice. Felt like I was getting lost in thought, even though it was all sensations. Had a clear sense at some point of descending energy, coolness and drowsiness. I interpreted it as a 3rd Vipassana Jhana and decided to follow it down. Ended back at the base of the practice, in the body. At the mind phase, I noticed an extremely neutral mind state. It sounds funny to say it that way, but that is what popped into my mind. At the top of the loop there were some openings of space here and there, but the sensations mostly felt very scattered and diffuse. I tried doing some more “do nothing” and things just got more scattered, diffuse and vague. Hard to settle at any point in the loops with a sense of clear concentration. Towards the end I noticed restlessness, some body discomfort and drowsiness. Got up 4 minutes early.

I feel like I have much to learn about identifying specific mind states and knowing what approach to bring to them. I was trying to bring the techniques that worked yesterday to a different mind set today and things just felt too loose and wandering. Probably should have brought more energy and effort to today’s practice.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 11/2/20 9:05 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 11/2/20 9:05 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
10/26

60 minutes 6:40 am

Took a while to establish concentration again. Started the loops, but there weren’t any big breakthroughs. Some sleepiness, but not as strong as in days before. The downward energy of yesterday’s practice seemed to predominate. Things felt otherwise fairly normal. A bit of a sense of space opening up here and there, but nothing radical. Restlessness towards the end.


10/27


60 min. 6:45 AM Concentration took a bit longer than normal, but got established. Started loops. Body took a little while to settle. Technique was pretty normal. Did some loops. Some stuff that stood out, but hard to put them all in order.

Lots of clear awareness of subtle mental things like expectation, anticipation, optimism, wanting.
Had a moment of opening similar to the other day, where it felt like the “surface” with my eyes closed moved back about 10-20 feet. Felt very relaxed and concentrated during this moment. At the same time my brow spontaneously scrunched up during this time, or at least it felt that way.
Maybe on the second loop there was an upward flow of energy and anticipation starting with the body and moving to sound.
Took some time to “do nothing” at the end of each loop which seemed to quiet the mind and increase concentration.
A little bit of the body and posture wobbling, maybe due to some sleepiness, but there was some unsteadiness here and there.
On the last loop, as I was paying attention to the body, it felt like the sensations were undulating or pulsing.
At the mind phase, when I checked on the state of mind, it was neutral to slightly pleasant.

10/28

50 minutes 6:45 AM

Practice started with a drowsiness. Was able to get concentrated nonetheless although it took about 15 minutes. 2 loops. 1st loop there was a cozy drowsiness for most of it. Felt warm and pleasant. Body felt a bit unstable. There was some bobbing around and feeling like balance was a bit off. During the mind phase the mind state was neutral with a bit of sadness. Spent more time in awareness in the 1st loop than usual. Minimum effort, just relaxing repeating “awareness” ect. Felt cozy and dreamy. Some sense of space opening up, but also noted grasping for that feeling or anticipation or trying to push it or make it happen.

2nd loop, body felt very light and airy. There was a buoyant upward energy. Felt more like a bubble than the geysers I have felt in the past. Mind state at this loop was pleasant and blissful. Strong sense of quiet. In awareness energy started to build. Had some anxiety and coolness in the hands. Had to use the bathroom, so stopped with 10 minutes left.

10/29

50 minutes 8pm

Sleepiness. Just sleepiness. Went through the practice, accepted the sleepiness. Half way through, took off my sweater and blanket. That livened things up a bit, but sleepiness came back.


10/30

Off cushion: life feels neutral wobbling back and forth between unpleasant and pleasant. when it leans pleasant, it feels cozy, when it leans unpleasant it feels numb. Some subtle craving for pleasant highs. No real distress about any of this.

58 minutes 6:45 am

Drowsy but not sleepy. The whole session had a very low energy, heavy feeling to it, almost like being baked inside a custard. Took 20 minutes with the breath to feel strong enough to start, but even then things felt a bit scattered. At some points my body felt kind of squished. Absorption felt very strong. Mind state was neutral to slightly pleasant. Everything was quiet. No big rushes of energy. Felt very, very absorbed by sound. Picked up all sorts of little subtleties I hadn’t heard before. A rhythmic purring in my left ear and rhythmic whooshes on both sides. Moments of anticipation or wanting as interesting mind states emerged. At the first loop of awareness, I was aware of body, sound and mind simultaneously for a little bit. Sensations started to get clearer towards the end. If I had more time I felt like I could have kept sitting.


10/31

Halloween! 52 minutes 7:45 pm

Immediate face twitching and creepy images as I tried to set up concentration. Concentration never got great as there was so much twitching and energy in the face. Twitching moved into frowns and scrunched up faces. Sadness with no object of sadness. Moved on to body and then sound. Attention was scattered. There was some mind wandering here and there. Impressions of images throughout. Relationship to images was not as aversive as in the past. Some were a bit creepy, but mostly there was fascination.

At the mind phase the state of mind was quiet and sad. Things continued to be scattered into awareness.

Started another loop. Things quieted down. By second check-in on state-of-mind mind was now just quiet.

Quiet heaviness began to settle in and more and more drowsiness and sleepiness. Sleepiness intensified until it was very heavy. Ended sit with heavy sleepiness.


11/1

15 minutes + 28 minutes
Sleepiness. Just sleepiness. State of mind feels neutral. Exhaustion off cushion.

11/2

Concentration came on pretty quickly. Quiet mind and neutral feeling, leaning towards unpleasant. Almost a feeling like being in a tomb. Felt a strong sense of just letting the mind do its thing today. Took the attitude of watching rather than controlling. Mind focused on the sensations in my face for a bit, getting very absorbed and zooming into the details until the sensations became more granular. Let go at that point. Mostly very quiet, neutral and open. At the sound phase of the 2nd loop the mind naturally incorporated the body as well. Feeling sound and body as if stacked on top of each other. Things felt drowsy although I never got lost in thought or spaced out. Just a cozy, drowsy feeling. Dropping intentions when I notice them. Noticing doubts, expectations, anticipation, craving. Letting the experience be as it is. At the top of the loop, with the awareness I was repeating: “expanding, opening, relaxing, releasing” but without any effort, just repeating the phrases and letting my mind do whatever.

At one point I thought to do an exercise I’ve read from Kenneth Folk where you just ask if energy is expanding or contracting. Once I asked this question I could sense energy expanding. It felt like I described before -- a bubble expanding. Again, upward energy, but much more subtle than in the past. Felt a sense of space open up around my body, but this was the first time it happened without some visual sense of space opening up too.

I kept asking the question on expansion and eventually felt the expansion stabilize and then contract but the sense of space remained as the energy settled down.

The rest of the sit was very stable and quiet. Felt like I could have just kept going. Still feeling very quiet and inclined to continue.

Transition back to life feels much smoother.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 11/8/20 9:55 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 11/8/20 9:55 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
11/3

12:30 AM 46 minutes

Again it was hard to settle on breath. Facial sensations were very strong. Seemed hard to concentrate in the loops. 

Eventually heavy sleepiness again. My resolve this time was to sit as still as possible during the sleepiness and not wobble. In the midst of this I felt some intensely unpleasant feelings in my body that made my whole fast twist in contortions. Was able to find a place of stability with the sleepiness. Went longer than I have in the past but didn’t quite get the full hour.

11/4

5:15 AM 68 minutes

Took about 15 minutes to establish concentration. Nothing unusual. Practice progressed like normal. Very focused on letting the mind do its thing and to not try and force it around. There was some drowsiness, but it never got into sleepiness. On my first or second loop as I was checking in on state of mind I felt sadness again. This time I noticed it caused by a sensation in my chest that quickly shrank like a star imploding into a singularity. I tiny, intense speck remained then slowly faded. Strong sense of clarity in state of mind at this point.

Sit felt very quiet and normal. Energy felt balanced, neither heavy or rising upward. Had moments where I noticed vibrations in the body. Sound felt like one big foggy ring around my head like a protoplanet with a ring of dust expanding from its center. Had one moment where I was checking in on my state of mind and noticed that I was looking at the sensations of my face to get a sense of state of mind. For a moment my sense of perspective shifted in front of my facial sensations. Weird. Felt multiple waves of absorption come on. A little bit of anxiety with that. Space opened up and things felt very open and quiet. Tried to go another half hour, but I had to use the bathroom so it was only another 8 minutes.

Life off cushion has felt meh.

11/5
6:50 AM 60 minutes

Not a great night of sleep the night before. Spent 20+ minutes trying to establish concentration. Mind kept wandering. Felt scattered and a bit drowsy. Finally decided to do nothing and things cleared up. Started the loops. Sense of opening in the awareness phase. More of the sense of a buoyant, bubble like upward flowing energy. Still had interruptions in concentration.

11/6

No practice

11/7

3 pm 50 minutes

Mind was quiet but not very clear which was an indication that sleepiness would arise later. I was able to get concentrated but focusing on the phases in the loops took a lot of effort. Eventually sleepiness came on stronger and just focused on staying still and calm and letting the sleepiness be the object of the meditation.


11/8

6:40 AM 60+ minutes

Off cushion: neutral with slight wobbles between positive and negative. When stuff is positive it feels good in a very refreshing, satisfying way. High libido, finding pleasure in sex and finding myself craving it frequently which I think is a general craving for highs lately. Kind of disinterested in lots of activities lately and lacking energy and inertia, but feeling kind of okay with that disinterest. Sleep disturbances. Some insomnia,  and waking early.

Concentration took awhile to get established. Lots of face twitching to start which seems pretty common lately when I’m starting to get concentrated. When the concentration finally came, it happened very quickly and was very clear. When I started the loop, I didn’t sense the body sensations clearly. I felt like my mind wanted to go elsewhere, so I let it go and it eventually settled on the body naturally. During sound in the first loop I paid attention to the empty areas and got a more expansive sense of the empty areas of the sound field. That helped bring on a level of absorption. Things were quiet at the mind phase. Mental music is a common occurrence at this phase lately and is by far the loudest mental object. This time there were other subtle mental objects detected too.

During this practice I paid attention to the expansion and contraction of energy again. I found that it naturally led the practice. At one point I could feel it rising and is it led to awareness then begin contracting and flowing downward which settled me back into my body. I am interfering very little with the practice and mostly letting the mind guide the flow. 

Ended with a strong uprising of energy. Very clear, bright and open. Didn’t want to stop practicing, but felt like it was time to get up. It seems less necessary to ground myself before I jump into life. Still feeling this energy an hour after practice.

I feel aversive to regular life stuff right now, just want to sit in the state of mind I’m currently in.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 11/9/20 9:20 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 11/9/20 9:20 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Another sit yesterday:

45 min 11:30 AM

Got another session in. Started out very energetic with big-grin, face-twitching pleasantness. Energy eventually reversed direction and sit became very drowsy and heavy. Ended in the drowsy territory.


6:50 AM 60 minutes

Used earplugs this morning, knowing my family would be up and about not long after I started. Concentration felt difficult to establish. Mind was wandering and a bit drowsy. Things got better, but there was a certain degree of doubt and impatience. Tried to do-nothing for a bit, but it’s not a good fit for a drowsy mind. Finally started the loop at the body. Body was hard to get into focus. Noted sensations until things got clearer. Did some sinking into the ground practice to settle into the body more. Worked my way up to sound, then mind. State of mind was drowsy, cozy, and heavy but not oppressive. Spent a long time with this first loop. Recognized this as 3rd Vipassana Jhana and inclined my mind towards the periphery. Things started to feel buoyant as I moved into awareness, but very subtly so. As I progressed into awareness, the energy became clear, settled, stable and tranquil. Spent quite a bit of time in awareness just settling into the state of mind. Things continued to get more still and settled. Dropped all intentions for a bit and just let the mind chill there. Sat patiently until it felt right to start a new loop. Body was very clear and present in the midst of the tranquility. Loops went faster this time, but any upward or pleasant energy was subtle. As I progressed space started to open up in different ways. I was repeating words like, expanding, relaxing, zooming-out, opening and just completely letting go and not trying to force anything and there was a sense of pulling backwards and space opening up (zooming-out turns out to be a good cue in this regard). It was almost like the expansion of a bubble. Things would gently open up, then gently contract. As I did a loop into sound there was an opening of space above my head as if I was sitting in a cathedral. Some moments where I felt like I drifted off into a dreamy state. There was recognition, and expectation and mapping throughout and worry that by recognizing a thing I was gonna lose it, which happened, ha, ha. This continued until the timer went off. Could have sat longer.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/11/20 12:13 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/11/20 12:13 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
In lieu of dumping my daily log for the past month on here, I thought I'd give a general overview things.

I've been continuing the Mahayana style vipassana for the past month, bobbing somewhere up in the 10th ñana and sometimes popping up into equanimity. The practice has been leaning more towards Reobservation than Equanimity with the jhanaic quality of the pracitce tilting towards the 3rd Vipassana Jhana. Lots and lots and lots of sleepiness. Maybe once a week I have a session that doesn't involve sleepiness, but otherwise it's been the most defining feature of practice lately. I've had a few sessions where I am able to practice through it, which feels like an accomplishment, and other times where I tap out.

Met with Abre the other day, and after doing noting together she recommended that I might want to switch to noting a bit to get more energy into the practice. She's also recommended I spend some time with binary pleasant/unpleasant noting. The last couple of days I've been making the process of making the change has been bumpy -- along with more sleepiness -- although I am seeing the energy I can bring to practice via noting and particularly in increasing the pace of noting.

This was even more the case with practice today. The sit was high in energy, mindfulness, equanimity and clarity. I can tell when mindfulness and equanimity are strong when I am aware of sensations and my reactions to sensations and am not getting caught up in them. Family was up and about and my wife was even in the room with me getting ready and making lots of noise. I could note both the noise, and my reactions to the noise, whether annoyance, amusent, love, craving or anything else. The noting allowed me to incorporate it all into practice. Once the energy had been established I spent a little bit of time cultivating states, particularly space and silence. Spent a brief time with awareness. Minimal to no sleepiness! I nice break for the slog of drowsiness I've been plowing through.

The binary noting of pleasant/unpleasant has also been revealing (I guess a better name for it would be noting vedana). I've done this practice before, but working with Abre has made me realize that I wasn't doing it right. Vedana is subtle and often quickly followed by a reaction that in the past I have confused for the vedana itself. To perceive the vedena clearly takes concentration and a more refined sense of perception that I was capable of before (there are still many instances where my perception is not clear enough).  It was a big-mind blower when I made this realization.  It made me see how so much of my past depression and anehdonia was due to judging experiences by my reactions to them, and not by the quality of the experiences themselves.

Off cushion has been feeling a bit blah lately. I'm in a holding pattern while I wait for my wife's last day of work. Once she leaves work it should open me up to commit my time to some meaningful work, but for now I'm kind of floundering. On the recommendation of my therapist I'm also looking into doing some Inner Child work and I've been reading John Bradshaw's Homecoming. I've been going through some frustrating family stuff lately and the Inner Child work seems to be illuminating stuff in a way that's mostly depressing right now, but hopefully will be useful as I do the practice.
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Niels Lyngsø, modified 3 Years ago at 12/11/20 12:31 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/11/20 12:31 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 413 Join Date: 11/15/19 Recent Posts
Such good and clear reflexions! Funny, a couple of months ago I went through exactly the epiphany you describe so well here, suddenly being able to distinguish vedana from reaction, in my case almost alway "unpleasant" from "aversion": Wow, it is possible, if your mind is very sharp and fast, to get a knife in there and cut off the causal bond from "unpleasant" to "aversion". Also the sleepiness is very recognizable, I have had some phases of just massive dullness, even though I had had plenty of sleep. Culadasa has some nice counter messures: Meditating with open eyes, for instance, or standing. – Keep up the good work!
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/14/20 10:08 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/14/20 10:08 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Thank Niels! Great to hear your reactions.  
George S, modified 3 Years ago at 12/15/20 8:17 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/15/20 8:11 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2722 Join Date: 2/26/19 Recent Posts
With sleepiness for me, unless it is actually lack of sleep (which it often is with kids and work lol) then usually it's aversion to something (same with wandering mind). Sometimes just accepting to myself "this is sleepiness" and stopping fighting it works. Sometimes I just let myself fall asleep while meditating, which often leads into some interesting territory and it's amazing how refreshing a 5 minute drift-off can be. That inner child stuff can be pretty deep and uncomfortable, which could be a source of aversion. I've noticed watching my son grow up that I tend to get triggered on my childhood stuff as he goes through the same stages. I loved your comment about parenting being like POI. emoticon I find it rough at times watching someone I love so much developing some of my own neuroses in response to my behavior. Part of my practice is just trying to *avoid* falling into that trap. I can't say I'm more than 50% successful, but it's better than nothing. It's amazing with parenting how as soon as you feel like you've got one stage half figured out your onto the next one already. I guess that's like most stages of life, it's just so much more full-on with your kids. Anyway, starting to ramble now. Cheers g
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/15/20 9:51 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/15/20 9:51 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
agnostic:
With sleepiness for me, unless it is actually lack of sleep (which it often is with kids and work lol) then usually it's aversion to something (same with wandering mind). Sometimes just accepting to myself "this is sleepiness" and stopping fighting it works. 
Thinking about the aversion angle. Noticing something there in my practice today. 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/14/20 10:14 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/14/20 10:14 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
60 minutes 7:45 AM

Decided to sit on a chair again to avoid my leg falling asleep. Started with a body scan. Noticed a buzzy, irritable quality about sensations. With how life is feeling lately, I think it's safe to assume I'm back down in DN territory. Mind wandered a bit with the body scan and felt a bit drowsy. Switched to noting. Mostly doing so out loud with eyes openemoticon. Could feel absorptions and energy increasing. Closed eyes and switched to noting vedana. Around 30 min. things started to feel sleepy. Adjusted posture to sit more upright, took off my blanket and returned to noting out loud with eyes open. Noting sped up, visuals got blurry and foggy which was fun and interesting. I continued to note space which is great with eyes open and seems like a powerful way to counteract sleepiness.

I’m starting to realize the choose-your-own-adventure quality of noting; that I can choose what things to note and therefore nudge the quality or direction of the practice.

Things were feeling energetic and pleasant. I closed my eyes and decided to do a Mahayan loop. It felt very strong. At the phase of awareness, a strong absorption came on, very centered in front of my eyes. It had the sensation of moving through a tunnel. Feeling of anticipation and craving along with it. The highest energy state I’ve felt in meditation in months. 

I returned to noting and continued the rest of the session. Energy came down and things felt very settled, but alertness, energy and absorption continued. Dropped all intentions for a bit then did vedana noting. Everything felt pleasant. Would have liked to stick around a bit longer and see how things developed, but I had to start the day.
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Pepe ·, modified 3 Years ago at 12/14/20 3:58 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/14/20 3:57 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 713 Join Date: 9/26/18 Recent Posts
Hi Brandon! I may be wrong, but your practice and insights doesn't look like DN. Perhaps some A&P/DN cycles but within EQ? Don't you spot somewhere some easiness / stability / jhana element / not buying 100% / etc while experiencing the ups and downs? Where you not doing the Inner Child stuff or the Mahayan loop, would your practice be probably smoother? Of course, not that they aren't worthwhile or necessary... Just that they colour your practice, much like you say that you can nudge the quality or direction of the practice. Have you tried to build some absorption / jhana just picking up the pleasant & neutral sensations? 

Forget about this if it's unhelpful!

Metta,

Pepe 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/15/20 9:49 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/15/20 9:49 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Thanks for the thoughts Pepe,

I certainly think you are on the right track with the fractal interpretation of the POI. Once you get a bit of experience with it, you start to see that things are much less linear than the simplest form of the maps suggest. There is definitely some cycling going on, but I am partial to modeling it as cycling back into the DN rather than something fractal within equanimity. The baseline doesn't feel equanimity to me. I confident enough in the moments I've spent in equanimity to say that the underlying quality feels different. It has the buzzier, dissonant feeling to it. Equanimity has felt quiet, light and empty to me.

FYI, the Mahayana stuff is actually jhana heavy, so it tends to smooth things out quite a bit. According to my teacher, that's the cause for the sleepiness -- it's the dukkha ñanas tilting towards a 3rd Vipassana Jhana experience. I also haven't really jumped into the inner child work yet, so I don't think that's causing the bumps.

That all being said, I am unemployed, trying to figure out what to do with my life while being stuck in my house and trying to keep my son on task with schoolwork while I play support with the new baby. So there could be some other things adding "texture" to the experience. 

Whatever the reason, things have been feeling quite a bit like my old "depressed" self lately -- low energy, anehdonia, lack of motivation/interest. Maybe it's sticky psychological territory, but it also seems like a good candidate for stuff that would arise in ReObs.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/15/20 9:52 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/15/20 9:52 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
60 minutes 4:30 PM

Did not sleep well last night and have been feeling blah all day. HEAVY sleepiness from the start. 12 minutes in and I was feeling discouraged and ready to tap. Made a resolution to sit till the end and decided to see where things went from there.

Switched between noting with variations on eyes closed, eyes open and out-loud and silent and at different speeds. Also noted vedana. Moments of intense sleepiness where unpleasant sensations surged through my body as I sat relaxed and non-responsive to the sleepiness. The heaviness of the sleepiness waxed and waned. There was a moment towards the end where concentration and clarity were quite strong despite the sleepiness. For a few minutes there was a sense of quiet, tranquility and peace. Sleepiness returned and it felt like a heroic 60 minutes by the end of it.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/17/20 9:35 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/17/20 9:35 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
12/16
60 minutes 7:45 AM

Sleep has been funky over the past few months. Think it might be practice related. Woke at 4 AM then fell back asleep around 5ish. There were surges of sleepiness in practice again, but not as bad as last night. Still, I couldn’t really practice with my eyes closed without starting to nod off.

Practice started with feeling restless and uncomfortable in my sitting position. Did mostly noting with eyes open and some noting vedana. Towards the end sleepiness came on so I decided to stand up. Rather than standing still I started swaying back and forth at the hips. I found it added a good energy to the practice. There was a sense of expanding energy, pleasantness and joy as things progressed.


12/17
60 minutes 6:50 AM

Holy hell. A full night of sleep last night. Got out of bed at 6:30 AM. Mind was a bit restless, ruminating on interesting ideas. Sat down and started with the body scan. Mind was still slightly restless, body felt a bit uncomfortable. Made some adjustments to pose and things started to feel comfortable.

Mind and body felt very relaxed and alert so I decided to do Mahayana practice today. As I entered awareness things got very quiet, still and pleasant with a subtle sense of space. A bit like walking through a snowy field after a snow storm. The rest of the practice stayed mostly within this territory. Pleasant, strong mindfulness, quiet and effortless, with waves of absorption. Mostly continued with Mahayana with some noting vedana mixed in. When I noted vedana it tilted very heavily towards pleasant, although the neutral sensations were easily recognized as neutral. Strong sense of relief after the rough sessions lately. Ended practice noting with eyes open. Energy picked up and I noted gratitude, happiness and normalness.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/20/20 11:51 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/20/20 11:51 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
12/20
60 minutes 9:20 AM

Heavy aversion to practice yesterday and today although I seem to be having many impromptu moments of mindfulness and absorption. Been feeling the pervasive sense of quiet and stillness again, which indicates I’m getting back up into equanimity territory again. Trying to do a bit of noting vedana when I notice that to prevent dullness.

Sat down and started with a body scan vocally. Did some noting with eyes closed. Things felt contracted around the face, some fogginess and slight drowsiness. Did noting with eyes open and noting vedana. Things were quiet so I switched to Mahayana. Did some loops. Felt a thread of absorption that seemed like drowsiness. I followed it and it never really became full sleepiness. Things got very quiet, still and peaceful feeling. A very settled, restful feeling. Was able to stay there the rest of the session. Did some choiceless awareness and more noting of both types from within that space. Tried to nudge it towards the very quiet equanimous quality. Energy remained very settled and peaceful. Noted a bit with eyes open to finish. Mindfulness and quiet seem to be persisting after practice. Space stayed fairly contracted during this entire time.

Looking over my log from the past two weeks it seems like I'm might be getting out of this sleepiness territory I've been stuck in. Knock on wood, but hopefully its a turn in the right direction.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 12/20/20 1:59 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/20/20 1:59 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
"knocking wood" emoticon Best wishes! 

I wondered if you still have a teacher? Also all the best to your family! How is the baby? 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/20/20 2:12 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/20/20 2:12 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Thanks! Yes, I'm still working with a teacher. The baby is doing great - 6 months old now. No crawling or talking yet, but she is really good at making pterodactyl screeches.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 12/20/20 4:48 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/20/20 4:48 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
emoticon Good to know! Happy for you mate! Our 2nd is about 6 months in the belly and is kicking now a lot emoticon I'm yet to wrap my head around this actually happening emoticon It's amazing how life become so complex out of nothing really emoticon tiny seed grows into a huge tree. emoticon wow! It just never cease to amaze me! 

All the best mate! 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/21/20 10:37 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/21/20 10:37 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
12/21
45 minutes 7:20 AM

Still feeling the pervasive stillness off-cushion. Sat down today. Mind was a bit groggy and there was some slight aversion. Started with a body scan and the mind entered access concentration before I was finished with the scan. Strong sense of the mind having its own agenda today. Seemed to go from absorption to absorption. Lots of flickering sensations as I closed my eyes. Had moments of confusion where I was trying to match the right technique with what my mind was doing. Did a little bit of straight noting, more noting vedana. When noting vedana, much of what I noted felt neutral. Also did some choiceless awareness.

Finally decided to do some Mahayana. My mind seemed to jump right into it. Got very deep, very quickly. At awareness things got subtly energetic but very soft and open. Flickering turned to flashes of light and my heart raced a bit. Some anxiety and anticipation. Was in a still and open place. Did more noting vendana, but had to use the bathroom. Ended at 45 minutes, but considering how deep things got I felt fine about wrapping this session. Felt very sensitive afterwards and spent a bit of time to ground myself before returning to life.

I feel like I’m seeing a pattern emerge over the course of the past 8 months or more. I work up into EQ, I have some energetic experiences then I drop back down into a DN type space and repeat. Each time it happens the energy in EQ is less intense and each time I drop back down into the DN, the sensations are less distressing. The odd thing for me is that I actually find something a bit unsettling about the quietness of the EQ mindspace. Abre has suggested that this is due to dullness in the perception of EQ. I think this is why she has me doing noting vedana. I think I am uneasy with the stillness because I am not used to it and a bit apprehensive about how it will develop, but when I stop and note actually vedana, it’s mostly pleasant.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 12/22/20 5:42 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/22/20 5:42 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
I feel like I’m seeing a pattern emerge over the course of the past 8 months or more. I work up into EQ, I have some energetic experiences then I drop back down into a DN type space and repeat. Each time it happens the energy in EQ is less intense and each time I drop back down into the DN, the sensations are less distressing. The odd thing for me is that I actually find something a bit unsettling about the quietness of the EQ mindspace. Abre has suggested that this is due to dullness in the perception of EQ. I think this is why she has me doing noting vedana. I think I am uneasy with the stillness because I am not used to it and a bit apprehensive about how it will develop, but when I stop and note actually vedana, it’s mostly pleasant.

This interplay between DN and EQ is fascinating territory to me. I sometimes think of it as something akin to a tuning process: dissonance in the dukkhas nanas, and the clean true note in EQ. Part of the sometimes "unsettling" quality of EQ, for me at least, is that after all that bad noise, the quietness of being "in tune" is disorienting; we got so used to noise that quiet seems like something is wrong. There must be something more to do, to tune, to fix! And yet one thing the interplay between DN and EQ teaches us is that if we twiddle with the EQ note, trying to make something happen, we generally just untune ourselves back into some degree of dissonance. I think that simply to abide in EQ allows vast amounts of subliminal tuning to occur, fine tunings we could not have done on purpose. What feels like doing nothing is really just not making useless noise, and allowing your instrument to be ever more deeply attuned precisely because you have stopped doing the things that knock it out of tune. EQ is what the orchestra needs before the real music starts.


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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/22/20 10:58 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/22/20 10:58 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Great to hear from you Tim. This seems like a really accurate description of what I am experienceing right now. There is a bit of, "Alright, let's lock this in!" and then the reaction "Don't try and lock anything in, you're gonna ruin it!" Thinking a lot about Kenneth Folk's packing-peanut-on-the-ocean-wave metaphor. Fortunately I've got a coaching session today, so we maybe I very, very carefully get that "right effort" tuned in.
Sam Gentile, modified 3 Years ago at 12/22/20 12:24 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/22/20 12:24 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 1310 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
"Finally decided to do some Mahayana"

Hi Brandon, good to see you here and that your practice is going well. What do you mean by doing Mahayana? As we know, the Mahayana is vast with the compassion, Boddhicitta practices, etc. What part are you doing? Are you doing it with Abre?
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/22/20 1:11 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/22/20 1:11 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I'm the least well read person in the world when it comes to Mahayana. All I know is that Abre taught me a vipassana technique that she calls Mahayana-style vipassana, so that's what I'm referring to in this case. It involves moving through succesive focuses of awareness. You start with awareness of the body, then move to awareness of sound, then mind and last just pure awareness -- then repeat. Because of the cyclical nature of it I often refer to it as "Mahayana loops" too. That's been my core practice since the end of June, but Abre has recently had me incorporating more noting back into the mix again. I was slogging through a lot of sleepiness and the noting was really helpful in increasing energy enough to get some escape velocity.
Tim Farrington, modified 3 Years ago at 1/1/21 2:53 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 1/1/21 2:53 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2464 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Brandon Dayton:
I'm the least well read person in the world when it comes to Mahayana. All I know is that Abre taught me a vipassana technique that she calls Mahayana-style vipassana, so that's what I'm referring to in this case. It involves moving through succesive focuses of awareness. You start with awareness of the body, then move to awareness of sound, then mind and last just pure awareness -- then repeat. Because of the cyclical nature of it I often refer to it as "Mahayana loops" too. That's been my core practice since the end of June, but Abre has recently had me incorporating more noting back into the mix again. I was slogging through a lot of sleepiness and the noting was really helpful in increasing energy enough to get some escape velocity.
The terminology of various traditions is always disorienting, but from what I understand of your "Mahayana loops" here it sounds very much like the progression of consciousness in deepening equanimity. I get light, not sound, moving awareness from the body, and what i think of as space, not mind, and "nothingness," not "pure awareness," and maybe it really is not the same territory, of course, with all due humility. But I'm struck by your sense of the mini dark night spin cycle being active here (thank you for both those graphics, i love them and they really help, in a way that will almost certainly fuck me up, lol). Equanimity is on the cusp of the dark night, that is a huge part of its efficacy: we can move deeper into increasingly disorienting disappearance of the usual signals and signs largely because the alternative to that acceptance of the less palpable stuff is dukkha. And also, deepening equanimity is a perfect place for the despair and nihilism to make its case to us, as the increasing sense of emptiness is where a lot of cherished reifications go to die, leaving us bereft as certain things we may have believed were faith evaporate. The deeper faith that emerges does so in its own time, in my experience, and the no-man's land before it does, but after the other stuff has crapped out, is a lot of the "work" of EQ: trusting the meditation, trusting the path, in what seems like a void without support. That the void doesn't feel unbearably distressing can be the best reason to accept it, at such points, lol: again, the alternative is serious dukkha.

I'll look forward to your new year's new log! God bless you and yours, my friend.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 1/1/21 8:24 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 1/1/21 8:24 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
 And also, deepening equanimity is a perfect place for the despair and nihilism to make its case to us, as the increasing sense of emptiness is where a lot of cherished reifications go to die, leaving us bereft as certain things we may have believed were faith evaporate. The deeper faith that emerges does so in its own time, in my experience, and the no-man's land before it does, but after the other stuff has crapped out, is a lot of the "work" of EQ: trusting the meditation, trusting the path, in what seems like a void without support. That the void doesn't feel unbearably distressing can be the best reason to accept it, at such points, lol: again, the alternative is serious dukkha.

Thanks for the comforting words Tim. There is something about what you've written that really nicely gets to the bottom of the distress I'm feeling. There is a part of me that is still desperately looking for something to hold on to and there is nothing there. However I am discovering one of the benefits of morality at this time. I can't hold on to it, but there is something about right action, right speech ect. (being a decent human being) that is stabilizing right now. They're like fins on a bomb -- I'm still falling, but at least they help from spinning out of control in the process.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 3 Years ago at 1/1/21 9:59 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 1/1/21 9:59 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 2680 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Maybe we should have a group Skype video chat where we all can cry together, honestly just letting it all out. Being there together, for our own group funeral with flowers and all. emoticon emoticon emoticon all dead yet crying together emoticon emoticon emoticon 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 1/1/21 12:16 PM
Created 3 Years ago at 1/1/21 12:16 PM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Count me in. Did someone once float the idea of putting a dischord server together?
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 12/22/20 11:04 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/22/20 11:04 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
12/22
60+ minutes 6:57

The stillness is developing. Practice today seemed effortless. Body was quiet, comfortable and still. There was a feeling of unease as things started. Having some aversion to the quietness, like my mind wants to go back to the way things were before. Gently reminded myself -- this is a one-way street. Started with noting vedana which helped to bring the pleasantness of sensations to the forefront. Everything is so subtle, it’s not surprising that things feel kind of numb and that I end up having an aversion to that. Flickering and flashes as I was getting started. For the first time I noticed waves in the sensations of the breath. Like there were 5 or so chunks to each in-breath and out-breath.

Decided to do Mahayana practice for the most part. Started with the body feeling very light. Successive waves of absorption as I moved up the stack. Mind would get lost or wander a bit, but things just felt very settled the whole time. Space opened up at times, but would then contract into a very pleasant, cozier substrate. Felt very playful today. A bit of guilt that I wasn’t following any plan. Spent a bit of time considering the 3C's. I felt like I could kind of just get it. When I tried to pay closer attention, the anicca and anatta felt clear. I feel like anicca is the one I really have a natural sense for. Dukkha is less clear to me.  When things are unpleasant, sure, but I don't yet get the dukkha of pleasant sensations. Wanted mindfulness to be stronger.  Things were fuzzy. I could sense sensations and reactions to sensations, but things were subtle and a bit vague. Ended the session with a feeling of energy and positivity as I left the cushion.

A feeling of relief that I seem to be out of the fog. If I have to drop down again, I’m sure it’ll be for a good reason, but it feels encouraging to be getting more and more familiar with the particular points in the path as they present themselves in my personal experience. If I am over the hurdle for good on this path, I won't complain about that either. 
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Brandon Dayton, modified 3 Years ago at 1/1/21 8:08 AM
Created 3 Years ago at 12/31/20 9:04 AM

RE: Brandon's Practice Log

Posts: 511 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
After coming out of the clouds recently my practice has been effortless, and yet off cushion there has been distressing phenomenology. 

Feeling of despair and nihilism, paranoia about dementia, surges of panic, and just generable irritability.

With the various passages I've made through raw territory up to this point I feel more confident with my coping strategies, but I decided to err on the side of letting Abre know. She recommended I take another little break from practice to let things settle. 

I haven't meditated over the past few days, and now in retrospect, I think it was a good idea. With the change in practice, I was suddenly feeling full steam ahead about sitting as much as possible, but I can now see that not only was I moving through rough territory, but I was getting seriously caught in the stories I was spinning. I couldn't distinguish between reality and delusion, particularly as these fears of dementia were concerned. I was convinced I had early onset dimentia and was sitting in bed, in tears grieving.

I recently stumbled on to Daniel's mind maps of the POI thanks to Dream Walker, and it was an "aha" moment for me. I've heard much mention of how the stages cycle pre-path, but I never had a clear picture of how it works, and the mind map finally helped illustrate that.

It feels very much like I am in the mini-dark night spin cycle.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/npsnqpzymnkbidp/mini%20dark%20night.jpg?dl=0

(How the heck do you post images BTW?)

I've also recently found ye old Hamilton project podcast and its been comforting just to hear their down-to-earth descriptions of progress on the path. Makes me think it'd be great to have a podcast dedicated just to describing individual experiences of progress on the path. Maybe a project for later.

Anyway, I have taken a break from practice and life mostly feels dull right now with some surprising pleasant moments. I certainly feel like I've come down to earth in a good way. I spent the last two days of the winter break building a massive cardboard fort with my kids in our living room. Nothing more grounding then building something with your hands. emoticon

At any moment I can sit down quietly and get sucked up into an absorption. I feel like I could sit for an hour at the drop of a hat and there is certainly a craving to do so. It feels kinda like discovering porn for the first time.

The path continues. I look back at the year+ of dedicated effort I have made since my A&P of 2019 and it's remarkable seeing how radically my mind has changed in that time. It's terrifying at times, but there is also clearly no going back. For all the bumps and valleys it a journey I am still profoundly greatful to be on.

With tomorrow being a new year I think I'll start a new practice log.

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