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Daniel M. Ingram, 7 hours ago.

Liferay 7.3 Upgrade Done! Please us know in if it is working properly. Important

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Dear All,

The remarkable Manish has managed to upgrade Liferay, the platform the DhO runs on, to version 7.3! This is a remarkable accomplishment, as Liferay upgrades have proved mind-boggling difficult, with each one we have done taking teams of people over a year each with many errors and failures along the way. Many thanks to Manish! If you find any errors, glitches, problems, or areas for improvement, please let us know in the dedicated thread below "Liferay 7.3 Feedback." Thanks!

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Dwelling in awareness without location

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Nipuna Ross A., modified 9 Years ago.

Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 123 Join Date: 6/15/11 Recent Posts
Title sums it up pretty much.
I still my mind paying attention to the breath long enough to get significant unification of mind. then I switch mind back on itself. Dwelling in just knowing, or awareness itself. I figured I wouldn't find location (duality?) of awareness but I give it a shot anyway. I sense it in the back portion of the inside of my skull, so i look there its illusive like wind or water through the fingers. moves to the front. I try to pin it down in front and it goes to the heart. again chasing it there it is everywhere and nowhere all at once. I burst out in laughter realizing that craving cannot pin it down either. it is an infrastructure of netting made of the root of craving. craving sticks to craving and to objects/phenomena, but, never the mind. what freedom!
still I sense a doer despite all evidence to the contrary. and, I am still doing and knowing and envision myself not knowing, or knowing/non dwelling in the grand un-knowing.
your thoughts, kindness, and suggestions please!
with metta - Ross
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Nikolai ., modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 1648 Join Date: 1/23/10 Recent Posts
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Nipuna Ross A., modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 123 Join Date: 6/15/11 Recent Posts
Thanks Nick,
I talked to Bhante G about this. Asking if one can proceed through jhana strictly as mental factors based upon this awareness (as opposed to white light nimitta based). His eyes lit up and he confirmed to my satisfaction that this is a great way of progressing through jhana and insight. I feel solid 1st jhana, more unstable 2nd, and reached 3rd briefly a few times. This awareness during normal activities is astounding as there is a high quality of non-sticky-ness.
I was sort of inclining to this for some time. But, would back out because I thought I should be glued to my nose tip or any other spot in my body that breath sensations are felt. A glance at Ken Wilber's Book, "No Boundary" made me unafraid to dwell (or Non-abide) in this state.
I told a pa auk student that I was using awareness itself as my "nimitta" and got a confused look lol, and, a no you must have white nimitta at anapana spot for jhana. a good case of not being wrong or right, but, righteous.
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Nikolai ., modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 1648 Join Date: 1/23/10 Recent Posts
Nipuna Ross A.:
Title sums it up pretty much.
I still my mind paying attention to the breath long enough to get significant unification of mind. then I switch mind back on itself. Dwelling in just knowing, or awareness itself. I figured I wouldn't find location (duality?) of awareness but I give it a shot anyway. I sense it in the back portion of the inside of my skull, so i look there its illusive like wind or water through the fingers. moves to the front. I try to pin it down in front and it goes to the heart. again chasing it there it is everywhere and nowhere all at once. I burst out in laughter realizing that craving cannot pin it down either. it is an infrastructure of netting made of the root of craving. craving sticks to craving and to objects/phenomena, but, never the mind. what freedom!
still I sense a doer despite all evidence to the contrary. and, I am still doing and knowing and envision myself not knowing, or knowing/non dwelling in the grand un-knowing.
your thoughts, kindness, and suggestions please!
with metta - Ross


What you seem to be describing here seems to be what some have called The Witness. I used it to go up and down jhanas awhile back to great effect. I wrote about it here

Maybe it could help.

Nick
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Nipuna Ross A., modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 123 Join Date: 6/15/11 Recent Posts
Yeah I posted on KFD asking if it (the Witness)was synonymous with awareness itself. Kenneth has influenced my practice. This truly has a non location quality when I try to pin it down as being "here" or "there" but, if I am just dwelling in it that area of the back inside of the skull seems most frequent. I think location (duality?) is irrelevant and is slippery. main point is its working. I'm just trying to get some pointers on honing the skill. which you are providing, thank you!
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Nipuna Ross A., modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 123 Join Date: 6/15/11 Recent Posts
I got to admit, with my traditional orthodox thervadan views I found the jhana arc videos with Kenneth and yourself comical. Espesially verbalizing entry to 2nd jhana (vitakkavicara being verbal fabrications dropping away being described in suttas as true "noble silence") But, now that I've tasted witness territory for myself it seems more valid. I cant knock that which I don't know. And, Thus far this awareness feels damn (better than orgasm) good! emoticon
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Nikolai ., modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 1648 Join Date: 1/23/10 Recent Posts
Nipuna Ross A.:
I got to admit, with my traditional orthodox thervadan views I found the jhana arc videos with Kenneth and yourself comical. Espesially verbalizing entry to 2nd jhana (vitakkavicara being verbal fabrications dropping away being described in suttas as true "noble silence") But, now that I've tasted witness territory for myself it seems more valid. I cant knock that which I don't know. And, Thus far this awareness feels damn (better than orgasm) good! emoticon


1st path made that extremely easy for me for some reason. A lot of room in the head/brain/mind was cleared out so jhana factors were just will of mind, one thought away type access. These days, factors, especially certain arupa factors/aspects are seen to be present all the time in the current structure of mind. Not sure if all this is possible pre-1st. I know not why. And I have no idea why the Witness worked so well going up and down the jhanas non-manipulatively, but it did.
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Nipuna Ross A., modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 123 Join Date: 6/15/11 Recent Posts
I think I heard a pop of my own head coming out of my own ass! Before I make any 'claims' I'm gonna give this the test of a little more time, and every day life situations. To see if this is just a temporary glow or a "here-on-out" brightness. It seems that in this last week a glow or brightness of the mind has illuminated my life. I don't want to under or over estimate/diagnose this.
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Daniel M. Ingram, modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 3158 Join Date: 4/20/09 Recent Posts
remember to include core processes in your investigation as they occur, things that really seem to be self, agent, doer, observer, etc., such as looking, effort, the mechanisms that tune awareness, the processes that judge the quality of the meditation, expectation, analysis, comparison, subtle fear, subtle longing, subtle frustration, and the like, and do this in a volumetric way, such that they are seen where they are, how they move and morph and shift.

these are easy to miss as they seem so close to home, and tuning to purely bodily stuff might miss them to some degree

daniel
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Nipuna Ross A., modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 123 Join Date: 6/15/11 Recent Posts
Daniel M. Ingram
remember to include core processes in your investigation as they occur, things that really seem to be self, agent, doer, observer, etc., such as looking, effort, the mechanisms that tune awareness, the processes that judge the quality of the meditation, expectation, analysis, comparison, subtle fear, subtle longing, subtle frustration, and the like, and do this in a volumetric way, such that they are seen where they are, how they move and morph and shift.

these are easy to miss as they seem so close to home, and tuning to purely bodily stuff might miss them to some degree

daniel

Thanks
Yeah. Mind inclines to Samadhi/Tranquility, and if there is not an opening mind inclines investigates phenomena. I see in real time a multitude of phenomena pass before awareness like a vibration. the vibration being many many beats and each beat being one mental moment of phenomena. Like in 1/3 or less of a second I will see a streak of this phenomenal vibration that has at least 100. without the powerful investigative qualities of the mind at this level it just looks like a trail of light in the darkness. before you can say nirodha there is 1000's or more rising and vanishing.
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Elena Joy, modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 98 Join Date: 6/30/11 Recent Posts
Guys, seriously, why should it be so cryptic, so hard to understand? It's simple. We make it complicated because the natural inclination of the mind of modern man to analyze. What would you say?
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Nikolai ., modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 1648 Join Date: 1/23/10 Recent Posts
Elena Joy:
Guys, seriously, why should it be so cryptic, so hard to understand? It's simple. We make it complicated because the natural inclination of the mind of modern man to analyze. What would you say?


What is simple?
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Elena Joy, modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 98 Join Date: 6/30/11 Recent Posts
Hey, Nikolai! Sorry, didn't see your message. You was the first guy on this forum I spoke to! I am glad to talk to you again! So what is simple? The truth is simple. Suffering is from identification with illusionary self - life is the best teacher here. Nothing in the existence is permanent - all in the flux - vipassana meditation is great for this. Therefore, there is no solid you - direct pointing, insight work are very effective.


Hugs, my friend.
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Nipuna Ross A., modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 123 Join Date: 6/15/11 Recent Posts
Its too bad we couldn't realize that (it being so simple) before we realized thatemoticon!
I was sitting on my bed in my kuti at the bhavana society (on july 13 of this year) when this simple truth was seen. things stood still for a split second (12,13, 14? hows that for cryptic lol) then I thought really thats it? no, really? and a resounding yes. that's it. this was fallowed by me laughing hysterically. I then had the thought that i was crazy for laughing all by my self in the middle of the woods. that just intensified my laughter. this of course is a working hypothesis. ah what the fuck I'm claiming stream entry! there I said it. phew feels good. (now all i got to do is push save lol)
Im opening myself up here. and hope I can get some practical advice on how to finish this thing.
Oh thanks all!!!!
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Elena Joy, modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 98 Join Date: 6/30/11 Recent Posts
How is going, Nipuna?
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Nipuna Ross A., modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 123 Join Date: 6/15/11 Recent Posts
Elena Joy
How is going, Nipuna?


Great! Here is my official claim thread:
http://www.dharmaoverground.org/web/guest/discussion/-/message_boards/message/2190769

I have incorporated AF into my practice now. I don't see a 180 degree difference at all. Maybe AF compared to mainstream Buddhism is, But its really none other than bad ass Dharma, in my humble opinion!

peace - Ross
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tom moylan, modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 896 Join Date: 3/7/11 Recent Posts
Congratulations! Well done! Right behind you....
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Brian Eleven, modified 9 Years ago.

RE: Dwelling in awareness without location

Posts: 221 Join Date: 9/14/10 Recent Posts
Congratulations!!
I'm working on incorporating AF into my practice as well , and also see the two as similar and complementary. Keep up with what you're doing, it seems to be working for you!!emoticon

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