Emil's Practice Log - Discussion
"I find it difficult to do Mahasi Sayadaw style noting technique simply because it's too boring."
in that case you either didn't do it as described or you are not yet suffering enough to really dig into your own mind stream so to see where all that suffering comes from
Have you tried Noting Aloud? (my favorite practice). If not try it out for an entire session and see how it feels you might be surprised!
Best wishes!
in that case you either didn't do it as described or you are not yet suffering enough to really dig into your own mind stream so to see where all that suffering comes from Have you tried Noting Aloud? (my favorite practice). If not try it out for an entire session and see how it feels
you might be surprised! Best wishes!
Sure 
Perhaps I'll get to that tomorrow. Right now I'm super tired and need to sleep.
I'll just throw in a short log about a short session I just did.
My practice just now was 30 minutes on the movement on the abdomen. Within minutes I get to a point where it feels like strong rapture is gonna sweep me away. But excitement and maybe a weak panic comes in and seems to prevent the rapture to continue growing in strength. I was feeling the rapture as a lightness in the body, a feeling of being a bit dreamy/distant, and then there was a pressure from behind my forehead. The meditation ended with me feeling very drowsy, dreamy and not very concentrated.
Perhaps I'll get to that tomorrow. Right now I'm super tired and need to sleep.I'll just throw in a short log about a short session I just did.
My practice just now was 30 minutes on the movement on the abdomen. Within minutes I get to a point where it feels like strong rapture is gonna sweep me away. But excitement and maybe a weak panic comes in and seems to prevent the rapture to continue growing in strength. I was feeling the rapture as a lightness in the body, a feeling of being a bit dreamy/distant, and then there was a pressure from behind my forehead. The meditation ended with me feeling very drowsy, dreamy and not very concentrated.
Thank you for answering my questions I always enjoy reading about how and what prompted people to pursue insight meditation.
In my case it was suffering, that never ending struggle.
I always enjoy reading about how and what prompted people to pursue insight meditation. In my case it was suffering, that never ending struggle.
I meditated for 55 minutes last night. This is the most I've done in the evening for a long time. I think this is a result of an increase in motivation I've felt since I started this log and since I started reading Polly Esters log too. I even considered to go back and read Mahasi Sayadaws practice instructions again in case I missed something...
Today I didn't wake up feeling depressed, although a little hopeless. Again it goes away as soon as I get into the meditation.
This morning I sat for 60 minutes. Let's see how much of it I can remember:
Started with counting 100 breaths. My attention wasn't on the rise and fall of my belly the whole time as a lot of distracting thoughts popped up. Some from my dreaming during the night. Interesting dream tho. There was a lovely dog which I played quite roughly with
I then took inspiration in what I'm currently reading in Polly's log. I'm sure I'm not doing exactly what she did then, but with inspiration I decided to focus more on my internal visuals. Last night I tried observing both the internal feels, sights and sounds. But I noticed, and recalled from earlier on, that especially the mental visuals are something which clearly change something for me when I start vipassanizing them. They are also something which I am bad at being mindful of. Whenever I get lost in thought, it's more visual than auditory or..what's that called - feelable? Tangible? Hmm..
It's like I can go for whole sessions noting feelings/touches that happen in my body without anything super interesting happening, nothing which feels like new progression. But getting into observing the internal visuals (mostly dream like images) it's like I'm finally observing something which was in the background all along and which has a sense of self attached to it; a sense of self which obviously is investigated closer in this way.
What I do is I always maintain a base-level awareness of the breath and as much of the body as I can all at once. Then, by paying attention to what imagery comes up in my mind, I notice some interesting things: Sometimes it's like a glip occurs. I think it's the glip which happens when our attention shifts dimensions/senses, but because I am now paying attention to the senses between which my attention goes, I can finally start seeing the transition phase. Or rather, lack of it. It is like a glip and I can't make out if anything is in between or not.
Along with this glip happens a dissolving of a bit of this self-feeling. When I simultaneously hold awareness of the body it's as if I become thinner/lighter.. More dissolved?
Today I didn't wake up feeling depressed, although a little hopeless. Again it goes away as soon as I get into the meditation.
This morning I sat for 60 minutes. Let's see how much of it I can remember:
Started with counting 100 breaths. My attention wasn't on the rise and fall of my belly the whole time as a lot of distracting thoughts popped up. Some from my dreaming during the night. Interesting dream tho. There was a lovely dog which I played quite roughly with
I then took inspiration in what I'm currently reading in Polly's log. I'm sure I'm not doing exactly what she did then, but with inspiration I decided to focus more on my internal visuals. Last night I tried observing both the internal feels, sights and sounds. But I noticed, and recalled from earlier on, that especially the mental visuals are something which clearly change something for me when I start vipassanizing them. They are also something which I am bad at being mindful of. Whenever I get lost in thought, it's more visual than auditory or..what's that called - feelable? Tangible? Hmm..
It's like I can go for whole sessions noting feelings/touches that happen in my body without anything super interesting happening, nothing which feels like new progression. But getting into observing the internal visuals (mostly dream like images) it's like I'm finally observing something which was in the background all along and which has a sense of self attached to it; a sense of self which obviously is investigated closer in this way.
What I do is I always maintain a base-level awareness of the breath and as much of the body as I can all at once. Then, by paying attention to what imagery comes up in my mind, I notice some interesting things: Sometimes it's like a glip occurs. I think it's the glip which happens when our attention shifts dimensions/senses, but because I am now paying attention to the senses between which my attention goes, I can finally start seeing the transition phase. Or rather, lack of it. It is like a glip and I can't make out if anything is in between or not.
Along with this glip happens a dissolving of a bit of this self-feeling. When I simultaneously hold awareness of the body it's as if I become thinner/lighter.. More dissolved?
I would be interested in reading more about Body Sensations do you notice/note any and how would you describe them. Im sure Jhana stuff is cool and feeling great but body sensations really are important in this insight work
There are those of us who are dying to read about "itchy spots growing stronger and very sharp or else, and vibrations and numbness in limbs etc" Just for our sake include a few of those during the sit 
do you notice/note any and how would you describe them. Im sure Jhana stuff is cool and feeling great but body sensations really are important in this insight work There are those of us who are dying to read about "itchy spots growing stronger and very sharp or else, and vibrations and numbness in limbs etc"
Just for our sake include a few of those during the sit
Alright papa! Thanks for the tips
I realize that I've probably neglected body part details a bit. I think I've unintentionally gotten used to finding them boring although as I'm writing this I realize that I should of course pay attention to any and all sensations.
I realize that I've probably neglected body part details a bit. I think I've unintentionally gotten used to finding them boring although as I'm writing this I realize that I should of course pay attention to any and all sensations.
I just did 30 minutes on the breath, but tried to keep some focus also on other bodily sensations.
Damn, it's difficult to articulate what's going on and how it changes, but here's what I remember:
- Hands are quickly feeling very puffy, almost like wearing a warm glove except that the glove is my hand. Later on it felt sorta prickly on the surface, almost resembling ants crawling over it but not quite. The pricks were warm and comfortable, not in many ways not like ants at all. I just don't know how else to describe this fine dotted sensation.
- Face and skull except the back of the head all felt like there was a pressure from within.
This pressure losened up a bit into the meditation.
I'm sometimes not sure if what I feel in certain areas could be called "vibrations" or not. Perhaps I think it resembles more a feeling of static on a screen rather than vibrations. Or like very fine and warm rain landing on my skin. Does this count as vibrations?
- Perhaps halfway in my eyes started glipping, as if I was blinking. My eyes were closed so it was kinda like trying to blink with closed eyes. I couldn't control it. I would guess I blinked like this 100 times or so before it stopped, after a minute or two. Feeling this happening on its own made me giggle.
- I took quite a lot of rounds going from sensing the face, hands, feet while keeping awareness on the breath.
It happened 3 or more times that I kinda glitched, for just a tenth of a second or shorter, barely long enough to notice it.
First time it felt sort of as if my whole system went "rrrum!" and then took a second or so to come back to where I was.
Second time it felt and sounded a lot like plucking in a jack stick to a set of speakers that are already turnt up. "Krh" like sound, with the same effect of kinda glitching the whole system.
Third time I don't remember, but something similar happened a third time I thinks.
Oh, quite interesting that I could actually write all of this hah. I'll try again later
Damn, it's difficult to articulate what's going on and how it changes, but here's what I remember:
- Hands are quickly feeling very puffy, almost like wearing a warm glove except that the glove is my hand. Later on it felt sorta prickly on the surface, almost resembling ants crawling over it but not quite. The pricks were warm and comfortable, not in many ways not like ants at all. I just don't know how else to describe this fine dotted sensation.
- Face and skull except the back of the head all felt like there was a pressure from within.
This pressure losened up a bit into the meditation.
I'm sometimes not sure if what I feel in certain areas could be called "vibrations" or not. Perhaps I think it resembles more a feeling of static on a screen rather than vibrations. Or like very fine and warm rain landing on my skin. Does this count as vibrations?
- Perhaps halfway in my eyes started glipping, as if I was blinking. My eyes were closed so it was kinda like trying to blink with closed eyes. I couldn't control it. I would guess I blinked like this 100 times or so before it stopped, after a minute or two. Feeling this happening on its own made me giggle.
- I took quite a lot of rounds going from sensing the face, hands, feet while keeping awareness on the breath.
It happened 3 or more times that I kinda glitched, for just a tenth of a second or shorter, barely long enough to notice it.
First time it felt sort of as if my whole system went "rrrum!" and then took a second or so to come back to where I was.
Second time it felt and sounded a lot like plucking in a jack stick to a set of speakers that are already turnt up. "Krh" like sound, with the same effect of kinda glitching the whole system.
Third time I don't remember, but something similar happened a third time I thinks.
Oh, quite interesting that I could actually write all of this hah. I'll try again later
" I spent at least half of the time trying to settle in to the meditation. Today I had stronger distractions of an uncomfortable conversation I may have to have with someone soon. Anywho, after counting 100 breaths I had de-distracted myself enough to start scanning my body."
Some here might think wasting half of sitting time to settle in is a good thing I don't think so. If I start with freestyle noting aloud 1 sensation per second then the settling in is immediate and when I state that my meditation was 45 minutes then it really was 45 minutes of practicing in paying attention to matter of fact phenomena at least 1 sensation per second throughout the entire 45 minutes sit.
But that's me
However I don't think you need more concentration. You might need more matter of fact paying attention aka noticing/ better yet NOTIN at least 1 sensation per second. Or at least 1 sensatio every 2 seconds which is very doable.
Best wishes and ma
y practice well!
Some here might think wasting half of sitting time to settle in is a good thing
I don't think so. If I start with freestyle noting aloud 1 sensation per second then the settling in is immediate and when I state that my meditation was 45 minutes then it really was 45 minutes of practicing in paying attention to matter of fact phenomena at least 1 sensation per second throughout the entire 45 minutes sit. But that's me
However I don't think you need more concentration. You might need more matter of fact paying attention aka noticing/ better yet NOTIN at least 1 sensation per second. Or at least 1 sensatio every 2 seconds which is very doable.
Best wishes and ma
y practice well!
You're pointing towards something..
"Settling in" for me may be based on a misunderstanding of sorts.
Because what I mean by that is by no means that I am trying to get to a point where I can note something every second. I can always do that, I think... At least I could right away this morning when I was "settling in".
So what I mean by "settling in", is I'm waiting to sort of descent into what I happen to think of as a "meditative state". This means increased spaceousness and attention to smaller changes. In this kind of state the different bodily sensations that I'm aware of are so many that I just get tensed up by attempting to follow all of them individually by noting them.
Are you suggesting that it's a better start noting immediately? How about my 100 breath counting strategy? Seems to be a fairly simple and quick get-in-the-zone kinda move...
Thanks again, for your involvement in here
"Settling in" for me may be based on a misunderstanding of sorts.
Because what I mean by that is by no means that I am trying to get to a point where I can note something every second. I can always do that, I think... At least I could right away this morning when I was "settling in".
So what I mean by "settling in", is I'm waiting to sort of descent into what I happen to think of as a "meditative state". This means increased spaceousness and attention to smaller changes. In this kind of state the different bodily sensations that I'm aware of are so many that I just get tensed up by attempting to follow all of them individually by noting them.
Are you suggesting that it's a better start noting immediately? How about my 100 breath counting strategy? Seems to be a fairly simple and quick get-in-the-zone kinda move...
Thanks again, for your involvement in here
I guess I am still brainwashed to kinda believe in it. I really dislike it.
On the other hand, I can also make arguments for life being super precious and something to really make the best of while it's there. In that case, fear of being born into a hell realm.. or north korea or something like that.. then serves a useful purpose of keeping me off rooftops in times where I wanna go.
Hey thanks for the comment. Don't understand too much of the text you put down. I don't know Buddhadasa, but seems he basically says the something like "Buddha be said there no u, so thinkin' reincarnation happens be dumb".
It baffles me, like really gives me a good ol' mind-boggle head ache, to try to fathom why it is that enlightened dudes would talk about reincarnation. Like.. they wouldn't lie, would they? If so, what for? And if it is that they don't really know, why would they talk about something they merely believe in? To keep people off rooftops? Arghghhh
Haha, rant wasn't over I guess :p
On the other hand, I can also make arguments for life being super precious and something to really make the best of while it's there. In that case, fear of being born into a hell realm.. or north korea or something like that.. then serves a useful purpose of keeping me off rooftops in times where I wanna go.
Hey thanks for the comment. Don't understand too much of the text you put down. I don't know Buddhadasa, but seems he basically says the something like "Buddha be said there no u, so thinkin' reincarnation happens be dumb".
It baffles me, like really gives me a good ol' mind-boggle head ache, to try to fathom why it is that enlightened dudes would talk about reincarnation. Like.. they wouldn't lie, would they? If so, what for? And if it is that they don't really know, why would they talk about something they merely believe in? To keep people off rooftops? Arghghhh
Haha, rant wasn't over I guess :p
"Like.. they wouldn't lie, would they? If so, what for? And if it is that they don't really know, why would they talk about something they merely believe in? To keep people off rooftops?"
Mind seems to be a very pliable phenomena and if you keep hearing dhamma talks about rebirth as Tibetans do then by the time you have "awakened" you will have conditioned it into such modes of seeing the world. Realms and Elves
Maybe they talk about it because they too were conditioned to think in that mode or they simply might be afraid of death being the END
In meditation "things" can pop out like visions of creatures. In Zen all is considered Makyo and students are not encouraged to engage with it. Even if they see the Buddha one is to kill the Buddha. In Tibetan Buddhism these visions are respect much more it seems but I wouldn't know much about it. This attitude will condition the mind especially if you pay homage to such beings every single day
Who is right and who is wrong??? I don't know I go with what Buddha did when in doubt; touch the earth "the earth is my witness", meaning I can only know what is arising RIGHT NOW without adding extra hats onto the arisen experience. And experiences pass so fast hence no time to waste in self-validation (which again is but an experience to be seen/known). Who is right who is wrong? I don't know! But I can know what is happening right NOW! The way of Satipatthana
Best wishes to you mate!
Mind seems to be a very pliable phenomena and if you keep hearing dhamma talks about rebirth as Tibetans do then by the time you have "awakened" you will have conditioned it into such modes of seeing the world. Realms and Elves
Maybe they talk about it because they too were conditioned to think in that mode or they simply might be afraid of death being the END
In meditation "things" can pop out like visions of creatures. In Zen all is considered Makyo and students are not encouraged to engage with it. Even if they see the Buddha one is to kill the Buddha. In Tibetan Buddhism these visions are respect much more it seems but I wouldn't know much about it. This attitude will condition the mind especially if you pay homage to such beings every single day
Who is right and who is wrong??? I don't know
I go with what Buddha did when in doubt; touch the earth "the earth is my witness", meaning I can only know what is arising RIGHT NOW without adding extra hats onto the arisen experience. And experiences pass so fast hence no time to waste in self-validation (which again is but an experience to be seen/known). Who is right who is wrong? I don't know! But I can know what is happening right NOW! The way of Satipatthana Best wishes to you mate!
Emil Jensen:
It baffles me, like really gives me a good ol' mind-boggle head ache, to try to fathom why it is that enlightened dudes would talk about reincarnation. Like.. they wouldn't lie, would they? If so, what for? And if it is that they don't really know, why would they talk about something they merely believe in? To keep people off rooftops? Arghghhh
It's simple economics really. Buddhist monastics have a cashflow problem - they don’t produce anything that anyone really wants! People only think that they want to become enlightened until they find out that they won’t be around to enjoy it. Telling your customers they don’t really exist is hardly a sound marketing strategy is it?
Fortunately the Buddha’s teachings also contain the solution to their problem – people are primarily motivated by fear and greed. To monetize greed you need to sell a sexy version of personal enlightenment, which is what flashy gurus do. Theravada is obviously not selling the sexy version of enlightenment – they tax people’s fears instead. The biggest fear most people have is ceasing to exist after death. The obvious solution is to tell them they will be reincarnated according to their karma and sell them a karma upgrade for donations. Bingo – problem solved.
The Christian church is even more ingenious, they wrap both solutions in a single package – greed and fear, heaven and hell. This is why the Christian church is more profitable and has bigger buildings, fancier robes etc.
agnostic:
Emil Jensen:
It baffles me, like really gives me a good ol' mind-boggle head ache, to try to fathom why it is that enlightened dudes would talk about reincarnation. Like.. they wouldn't lie, would they? If so, what for? And if it is that they don't really know, why would they talk about something they merely believe in? To keep people off rooftops? Arghghhh
It's simple economics really. Buddhist monastics have a cashflow problem - they don’t produce anything that anyone really wants! People only think that they want to become enlightened until they find out that they won’t be around to enjoy it. Telling your customers they don’t really exist is hardly a sound marketing strategy is it?
Fortunately the Buddha’s teachings also contain the solution to their problem – people are primarily motivated by fear and greed. To monetize greed you need to sell a sexy version of personal enlightenment, which is what flashy gurus do. Theravada is obviously not selling the sexy version of enlightenment – they tax people’s fears instead. The biggest fear most people have is ceasing to exist after death. The obvious solution is to tell them they will be reincarnated according to their karma and sell them a karma upgrade in the form of donations. Bingo – problem solved.
The Christian church is even more ingenious, they wrap both solutions in a single package – greed and fear, heaven and hell. This is why the Christian church is more profitable and has bigger buildings, fancier robes etc.
I dont think I have that cynical economics view Sam I was simply stating that if you keep hearing daily about certain doctrine while meditating and awakening there will be an inprint on the mind. Tibetans are known for their depth of meditative Experience and make a great deal out of it. Thats ok with me. I just prefer the simple Kenneth Folk take that Experience IS Experience no matter it be a perception of an annoying itch or a pleasant rainbow body
If you ask me I would rather have people on this planet believeing in rebirth/reincarnation than in constant monetary growth.
I personally dont know if there is anyhting after death. Maybe yes, maybe no, maybe yes-no. As far as I can see so far I can only be sure of what is happening right now and even that is unfolding very fats to know how exactly it unfolds. We can track for a bit and see that one is cause and the other effect which in turn becomes the cause for another effects etc etc etc ...
Even writing all this stuff is unfodling on its own an originating from something that has long passed away. It seems to me that this phenomenal micro tracking becomes impossible for life off cushion and there is no other way but to sit back and enjoy the ride, bumpy or pleasant as it sure seems to be in flux This can feel overwhelming and rollercoaster like but just is the way it is
Another thing that "seems" is that nothing is outside the law of Anicca in consciousness and if indeed there is some consciousness after death then we could be assured even that will be subject to Anicca. So what can we do about this? The only thing I can see to be of any benefit of reducing clinging hence creating Dukkha is to be mindful without laps (or as little as possible). This way all is seen as objects (not a subject), hence not-self, impermanent and unsatifactory. During pre-path there can be a false perception that there is a Knower-Watcher-Witness but I find post-path this to turn into just a knowing-watching-witnessing. What Im trying to say is that this POI stuff sure does something to this perception of Self.
Ok, I just realised that I have written way too much Gotta relax and get some sleep. This is the last week at this tiering job of mine. From now on seeking jobs with less working days/hours, less money but more time and energy for my family and practice too
I was simply stating that if you keep hearing daily about certain doctrine while meditating and awakening there will be an inprint on the mind. Tibetans are known for their depth of meditative Experience and make a great deal out of it. Thats ok with me. I just prefer the simple Kenneth Folk take that Experience IS Experience no matter it be a perception of an annoying itch or a pleasant rainbow body If you ask me I would rather have people on this planet believeing in rebirth/reincarnation than in constant monetary growth.
I personally dont know if there is anyhting after death. Maybe yes, maybe no, maybe yes-no.
As far as I can see so far I can only be sure of what is happening right now and even that is unfolding very fats to know how exactly it unfolds. We can track for a bit and see that one is cause and the other effect which in turn becomes the cause for another effects etc etc etc ... Even writing all this stuff is unfodling on its own an originating from something that has long passed away. It seems to me that this phenomenal micro tracking becomes impossible for life off cushion and there is no other way but to sit back and enjoy the ride, bumpy or pleasant as it sure seems to be in flux
This can feel overwhelming and rollercoaster like but just is the way it is Another thing that "seems" is that nothing is outside the law of Anicca in consciousness and if indeed there is some consciousness after death then we could be assured even that will be subject to Anicca. So what can we do about this? The only thing I can see to be of any benefit of reducing clinging hence creating Dukkha is to be mindful without laps (or as little as possible). This way all is seen as objects (not a subject), hence not-self, impermanent and unsatifactory. During pre-path there can be a false perception that there is a Knower-Watcher-Witness but I find post-path this to turn into just a knowing-watching-witnessing. What Im trying to say is that this POI stuff sure does something to this perception of Self.
Ok, I just realised that I have written way too much
Gotta relax and get some sleep. This is the last week at this tiering job of mine. From now on seeking jobs with less working days/hours, less money but more time and energy for my family and practice too
no reason to do stuff that's not of interest to you. It's important to find the practice interesting and you seem to have your own way to do it. Keep it up. Im just keeping you company here in hope someone joins your journey who is more resonating with you. I'm sure such a person of benefit will appear rather sooner than later
Hey Papa D, I'm glad you're keeping me company here It gets lonely for me up in here.
Tonight's sit, 35 minutes:
I'm still in a weird place. Meditation does not feel like "proper" meditation. I also get weirdly tired and spacey and have trouble focusing. Just a few days ago I was having rapturous concentration meditations, now I can't even stay with noting for more than what seems like a couple of minutes at most. I then have to drag myself out of a syruppy mind fog. Does this smell like a dissolution nana or something? Nah, maybe I just need more vitamin D. Or milk..
I started trying to gain focus by counting breaths to 100 and then back again to 0. I did feel more focused but what still experiencing the mind fog I mention above.
I have a real hard time saying anything about the sensations I do note. I can fairly easily note that random sensations which enter my awareness occur, when I stay with the breath as a base, at a rate of 2-5 notes per second. But what I note seems hard to see properly, as if there's fog around it.
I have a strong resistance to keep noting, but managed to note the resistance as it showed up. Then it just sort of faded to the back ground and I kept noting while feeling a bit resistant towards it.
In the end I was just feeling like falling asleep.
It gets lonely for me up in here.Tonight's sit, 35 minutes:
I'm still in a weird place. Meditation does not feel like "proper" meditation. I also get weirdly tired and spacey and have trouble focusing. Just a few days ago I was having rapturous concentration meditations, now I can't even stay with noting for more than what seems like a couple of minutes at most. I then have to drag myself out of a syruppy mind fog. Does this smell like a dissolution nana or something? Nah, maybe I just need more vitamin D. Or milk..
I started trying to gain focus by counting breaths to 100 and then back again to 0. I did feel more focused but what still experiencing the mind fog I mention above.
I have a real hard time saying anything about the sensations I do note. I can fairly easily note that random sensations which enter my awareness occur, when I stay with the breath as a base, at a rate of 2-5 notes per second. But what I note seems hard to see properly, as if there's fog around it.
I have a strong resistance to keep noting, but managed to note the resistance as it showed up. Then it just sort of faded to the back ground and I kept noting while feeling a bit resistant towards it.
In the end I was just feeling like falling asleep.
Anything we experience can be investigated y paying attention to it, noticing it. But what is there to be noticed? Body sensations, feeling tone (pleasant, neutral, unpleasant) and mind states (worry, curiosity, desire, doubt, imagining, anticipation, dullness, fogginess, joy, bliss, happiness, sadness, self pity, lost, fear, misery, disgust, urge, ...) All these can be contacted. You don't go around searching for body sensations if there is Boredom What you want is contacting exacrltly that which has arisen; Boredom how does it feel? Unpleasant. What else is there in that boredom? In that dullness? In that resistance to noting? Is it pleasant? No! What then? The very thing to be noted is already there. It's dominating the awareness It might not be the thing we want but it Is right here, right now. Watch it do stuff. THAT is insight practice. No reason to contemplate the observed but just simply note what is in awareness, whatever shape or form that might be. Yes, boredom, dullness, resistance, uncertainty all these can be contacted and clearly comprehend Awakening at its best!
Btw, speed noting takes so much of you attention that the mind can't get sidetracked into "thinking about practice" and instead just knowing the mind flow as is without the expectations (well this is also a mind state to be noted).
If you want I can show you a video of me practicing freestyle noting aloud to give you an idea how that looks like. Unless you are more inclined towards Jhanas or Calm-abiding which is also a valid practice.
It seems to me your practice is not yet on Fire you need to light it up I'm sure you will find what suits you best!
Best wishes!
What you want is contacting exacrltly that which has arisen; Boredom how does it feel? Unpleasant. What else is there in that boredom? In that dullness? In that resistance to noting? Is it pleasant? No! What then? The very thing to be noted is already there. It's dominating the awareness It might not be the thing we want but it Is right here, right now. Watch it do stuff. THAT is insight practice. No reason to contemplate the observed but just simply note what is in awareness, whatever shape or form that might be. Yes, boredom, dullness, resistance, uncertainty all these can be contacted and clearly comprehend Awakening at its best! Btw, speed noting takes so much of you attention that the mind can't get sidetracked into "thinking about practice" and instead just knowing the mind flow as is without the expectations (well this is also a mind state to be noted).
If you want I can show you a video of me practicing freestyle noting aloud to give you an idea how that looks like. Unless you are more inclined towards Jhanas or Calm-abiding which is also a valid practice.
It seems to me your practice is not yet on Fire
you need to light it up I'm sure you will find what suits you best! Best wishes!
Hey man, thanks again for the comment. You're right! I should be investigating boredom haha.
I think what you're suggesting here is something like what helped me along in today's sit. I experienced again being completely dull/foggy, but forced myself to keep up with noting whatever took place. This energized me.
Also, I would like to hear/see what it's like when you note aloud. Show ahead video
Today's 60 minute sit:
Again I started with counting 100 breaths. And again today I felt like my mind was foggy. But today I pushed through it and felt that I came out on the other side somehow.
I have a tendency to tense up a bit when noting because I'm "looking for something" and kinda straining myself to do that. Whenever I notice this, I of course note it, and that usually helps the tension.
But today I stopped doing what tenses me up, and simply noted slower. Turned out to be not too much slower, still at 1-3 notings per second, but with less tension/stress which allowed me to see better and keep going more consistently.
Today the sensations I felt opened up a bit and felt less solid. Especially in my chest which normally feels as solid as.. idk, cheese?
Also in the areas that are usually light and vibratory, my hands and face, there was an expansion of sorts. The light vibrations covered a bigger area, so my arms, neck and shoulders were now also included.
Something a bit new happened: I felt little, itchy points various places on my body. Lots of them. I must have noted dozens of very isolated, small pricks of itchyness. Sometimes they were there simultaneously in different areas, and sometimes they showed up in sequence.
Twice during the sit I was seeing a purple disk/dot in front of me. It had a red background the second time.
A consideration:
I wrote yesterday too, about the effect of having a mental image of "me", or body parts as I meditate. Today I also investigated what happened if I try to be aware of the imagery, and note it, while noting the bodily sensations. It seems that this helps to, sort of, "separate" these two types of phenomena and help me see the bodily sensations more clearly. It also makes each type, the visual and the sensual, more obviously empty.
Emptiness struck me a bit today, like "wow", when I observed mental imagery. Like.. so damn empty!
"Separating" the mental imagery and bodily sensations made this emptiness a bit clearer in the bodily sensations as well, but the visuals the most! Those are.. really empty! Hah
I think what you're suggesting here is something like what helped me along in today's sit. I experienced again being completely dull/foggy, but forced myself to keep up with noting whatever took place. This energized me.
Also, I would like to hear/see what it's like when you note aloud. Show ahead video
Today's 60 minute sit:
Again I started with counting 100 breaths. And again today I felt like my mind was foggy. But today I pushed through it and felt that I came out on the other side somehow.
I have a tendency to tense up a bit when noting because I'm "looking for something" and kinda straining myself to do that. Whenever I notice this, I of course note it, and that usually helps the tension.
But today I stopped doing what tenses me up, and simply noted slower. Turned out to be not too much slower, still at 1-3 notings per second, but with less tension/stress which allowed me to see better and keep going more consistently.
Today the sensations I felt opened up a bit and felt less solid. Especially in my chest which normally feels as solid as.. idk, cheese?
Also in the areas that are usually light and vibratory, my hands and face, there was an expansion of sorts. The light vibrations covered a bigger area, so my arms, neck and shoulders were now also included.
Something a bit new happened: I felt little, itchy points various places on my body. Lots of them. I must have noted dozens of very isolated, small pricks of itchyness. Sometimes they were there simultaneously in different areas, and sometimes they showed up in sequence.
Twice during the sit I was seeing a purple disk/dot in front of me. It had a red background the second time.
A consideration:
I wrote yesterday too, about the effect of having a mental image of "me", or body parts as I meditate. Today I also investigated what happened if I try to be aware of the imagery, and note it, while noting the bodily sensations. It seems that this helps to, sort of, "separate" these two types of phenomena and help me see the bodily sensations more clearly. It also makes each type, the visual and the sensual, more obviously empty.
Emptiness struck me a bit today, like "wow", when I observed mental imagery. Like.. so damn empty!
"Separating" the mental imagery and bodily sensations made this emptiness a bit clearer in the bodily sensations as well, but the visuals the most! Those are.. really empty! Hah
Thats good stuff; sensing a body part and then noticing a mind image impression of it Nice one!
Prickly body stuff also great. All that talk about "emptiness" not that great, however noting this as "wishful thinking or pondering" would be more interesteing maybe there are those who think that being cool talk but not me its not that you should listen to me of course!
All that stuff/insight about 3 characteristics will arise on its own. No reason to ponder during practice. All we need to do is pay attention to the matter of fact experience unfolding. If we do it 1-5 sensations a second for the duration of the sit we are on the right track. Noting body sensation, feeling tones associtated with those and mind states is the name of the game as far as I see it. (I might be very wrong of course).
Yes faster noting does energize the sit and if you go more into it (like do it daily for a few months) then it will also aid in right concentartion (the one that arises from a mind being gladdened by being in this very moment free from aflictions).
Here is a short vodeo showing how I do it with open eyes usually focused gently on a spot of sorts 2 meters in front of me and noting aloud. Curiosity about what is there in This moment ... by moment ... and saying it out loud for a more interesting engagement with arisings and passings.
I do agree that its the most uncool looking and sounding of all practices on Earth but it targets what matters the most; THIS unfolding in all shape and form. That IS what awakening is anyway in my humble opinion so why not just do it aloud until it simply does/knows itself at some stage
BTW, do not get hung up on the speed as in you need to note VERY fast. The noting speed will change on its own also and at times if resistance to practice arises one can SHOUT out aloud to get over that hindrance (which does pass away after a few minutes the most). Voice can go all from very loud, or very calm, to whispering and even silent. Go with what works I guess and what keeps you enagaged in the practice for the duration of minimum of 45 minutes. Best wishes!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FeajWRJcXA
Nice one!Prickly body stuff also great. All that talk about "emptiness" not that great, however noting this as "wishful thinking or pondering" would be more interesteing
maybe there are those who think that being cool talk but not me its not that you should listen to me of course! All that stuff/insight about 3 characteristics will arise on its own. No reason to ponder during practice. All we need to do is pay attention to the matter of fact experience unfolding. If we do it 1-5 sensations a second for the duration of the sit we are on the right track. Noting body sensation, feeling tones associtated with those and mind states is the name of the game as far as I see it. (I might be very wrong of course).
Yes
faster noting does energize the sit and if you go more into it (like do it daily for a few months) then it will also aid in right concentartion (the one that arises from a mind being gladdened by being in this very moment free from aflictions).Here is a short vodeo showing how I do it with open eyes usually focused gently on a spot of sorts 2 meters in front of me and noting aloud. Curiosity about what is there in This moment ... by moment ... and saying it out loud for a more interesting engagement with arisings and passings.
I do agree that its the most uncool looking and sounding of all practices on Earth
but it targets what matters the most; THIS unfolding in all shape and form. That IS what awakening is anyway in my humble opinion so why not just do it aloud until it simply does/knows itself at some stage BTW, do not get hung up on the speed as in you need to note VERY fast. The noting speed will change on its own also and at times if resistance to practice arises one can SHOUT out aloud to get over that hindrance (which does pass away after a few minutes the most). Voice can go all from very loud, or very calm, to whispering and even silent. Go with what works I guess and what keeps you enagaged in the practice for the duration of minimum of 45 minutes. Best wishes!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FeajWRJcXA
Funny to see that noting out loud :p True, it's not the sexiest practice, hah. But good to see. The tempo and way you note is similar to how I note, internally. Except you have a lot of "seeing", as your eyes are open, I mostly have "feeling". It's the first time I've seen/heard anyone else do the practice.
Yesterday I had two sits of 20-30 minutes in the evening. I felt aggitated and didn't wanna log it. Now I don't remember what happened.
For the past three sits I have just gotten right down to noting business and feel I successfully have pushed through this slumber that I've been in.
Today's sit was 60 minutes. I noted right away: "Rising, falling, feeling, feeling, itch, rising, feeling, itch, falling, touch, feeling..."
My note rate was to the higher side for me, and it was easy to note 2-4 things in between the rise and fall of the breath, without losing awareness of the breath which usually has a tendency to happen if I note in between rise and fall.
I know that I have a tendency to "look for" sensations. I know this isn't necessary as it's actually impossible to not experience sensations. No "looking" is needed. But I usually do anyway, right?
However, today I noted "looking", as well as "tension" or "stress" which tends to follow the looking as it has some frantic/stressful element to it.
This tension/stress I noted as mere emotional qualities, and since I kept on noting bodily sensations I also noted some of the bodily parts to it.
I noted tension around the eyes and inside my head. In most cases noting it means that the tension goes away immediately. However, the tension inside my head, towards the forehead, felt very solid. I got the impression that it may always be there, although not sensed unless I really tune in.
As a result of noting the "looking" and also one or two "trying", I started feeling very tranquil. It was as if it made the meditation easier for me, as noting these things has its way of making them going away. So with less effort I was able to be better aware of more things at once. It was a much more involving, spaceous meditation with a better overlook over what went on.
As I first started noting this, a bit of fear showed up as a sort of anxious feel throughout my body and a hear which felt like it had to work a little harder.
It was tempting to stop noting and just abide in this pleasant spaceousness, but I forced my way through to the end, just noting as per protocol. Therefore...this was definitely a "good" meditation
Yesterday I had two sits of 20-30 minutes in the evening. I felt aggitated and didn't wanna log it. Now I don't remember what happened.
For the past three sits I have just gotten right down to noting business and feel I successfully have pushed through this slumber that I've been in.
Today's sit was 60 minutes. I noted right away: "Rising, falling, feeling, feeling, itch, rising, feeling, itch, falling, touch, feeling..."
My note rate was to the higher side for me, and it was easy to note 2-4 things in between the rise and fall of the breath, without losing awareness of the breath which usually has a tendency to happen if I note in between rise and fall.
I know that I have a tendency to "look for" sensations. I know this isn't necessary as it's actually impossible to not experience sensations. No "looking" is needed. But I usually do anyway, right?
However, today I noted "looking", as well as "tension" or "stress" which tends to follow the looking as it has some frantic/stressful element to it.
This tension/stress I noted as mere emotional qualities, and since I kept on noting bodily sensations I also noted some of the bodily parts to it.
I noted tension around the eyes and inside my head. In most cases noting it means that the tension goes away immediately. However, the tension inside my head, towards the forehead, felt very solid. I got the impression that it may always be there, although not sensed unless I really tune in.
As a result of noting the "looking" and also one or two "trying", I started feeling very tranquil. It was as if it made the meditation easier for me, as noting these things has its way of making them going away. So with less effort I was able to be better aware of more things at once. It was a much more involving, spaceous meditation with a better overlook over what went on.
As I first started noting this, a bit of fear showed up as a sort of anxious feel throughout my body and a hear which felt like it had to work a little harder.
It was tempting to stop noting and just abide in this pleasant spaceousness, but I forced my way through to the end, just noting as per protocol. Therefore...this was definitely a "good" meditation
Oh, a funny thing happened during my sit described above.
I've been watching this 24episode count-down-to-christmas show from way back in the day. One guy plays like 10 characters, and these two guys in the images were the voices in my head as I noted. My own voice normally says "feeling, rising, falling" etc. But for quite a while Steward Stardust or Arne Nougatgren voiced these notings. Very pleasant experience
And while I'm at noting funny things. I also had a very clear "seeing through my eyelids" yesterday.
See you later, log
I've been watching this 24episode count-down-to-christmas show from way back in the day. One guy plays like 10 characters, and these two guys in the images were the voices in my head as I noted. My own voice normally says "feeling, rising, falling" etc. But for quite a while Steward Stardust or Arne Nougatgren voiced these notings. Very pleasant experience
And while I'm at noting funny things. I also had a very clear "seeing through my eyelids" yesterday.
See you later, log
"No "looking" is needed. But I usually do anyway, right?"
That act of looking for something is important. It's remembering/Sati. Hence very important part of noting. Then once you have contacted an object you Note it and sink more into it (SatiPa/Profound Mindfulness) if it lasts so to feel it's feeling tone and mind state, and so on. At times objects pass away as fast as they arise so there is no time to sink more into them. That too is cool and just noting that object is all we can do.
As long you are noting at least 1 matter of fact sensations per second you are doing it right. With stages and states changing so will the sensory clarity change. All is good
That act of looking for something is important. It's remembering/Sati. Hence very important part of noting. Then once you have contacted an object you Note it and sink more into it (SatiPa/Profound Mindfulness) if it lasts so to feel it's feeling tone and mind state, and so on. At times objects pass away as fast as they arise so there is no time to sink more into them. That too is cool and just noting that object is all we can do.
As long you are noting at least 1 matter of fact sensations per second you are doing it right. With stages and states changing so will the sensory clarity change. All is good
That act of looking for something is important. It's remembering/Sati. Hence very important part of noting. Then once you have contacted an object you Note it and sink more into it
I think I may need some details on this
So what I meant by "looking" is perhaps more of "straining to find something to note", which is something I think is definitely not wanted in my meditation. So alright, "looking" is what we'll do!
But "sinking into it"? Can you make a concreet example?
We only have one second to sink into it, right? You know, before we have to have noted something else.
Emil Jensen:
That act of looking for something is important. It's remembering/Sati. Hence very important part of noting. Then once you have contacted an object you Note it and sink more into it
I think I may need some details on this
So what I meant by "looking" is perhaps more of "straining to find something to note", which is something I think is definitely not wanted in my meditation. So alright, "looking" is what we'll do!
But "sinking into it"? Can you make a concreet example?
We only have one second to sink into it, right? You know, before we have to have noted something else.
The "looking" seems to progress into a much "softer diffused non-contracted looking" down the path so to speak. Sure there can be strain when we are just getting into this but have faith and keep practicing as the general tendency is to get wider, softer, curious, welcoming, no matter what kind of sensation arises or passes away.
The "sinking in" state/stage will also arise with consistent daily practice (twice a day minimum 45 minutes each sit). You will know when this stage arises. Practice, curiosity, acceptance. Include hindrances in this so you aren't wasting the precious sitting time on them.
Yeah, this makes sense to me, that it gets wider, softer, more curious, welcoming
Perhaps that's what's happening now, as I've done around that time daily for a little while now. Strongly intending to keep up at least two sits of 30-60 minutes daily going forward
Perhaps that's what's happening now, as I've done around that time daily for a little while now. Strongly intending to keep up at least two sits of 30-60 minutes daily going forward
The meditation last night and this morning, about 50-55 minutes each:
I note right away at 1-3 notes per second.
I get to the same point where I used to plateau: I can feel my "whole" body at once and start noting just the rise/fall of the breath and "note" for everything else. This gives this higher resolution and allows me to feel subtler things than before I discovered this little hack.
But OK, enough about all this old boring stuff that I learned daaays ago.
This, I think, is an important thing:
I've been able to note more phenomenology over "stuff" happening. For instance, all that sexual energy earlier, started just noting it as "horny". Haha, but! Then I went into each part of my body, the head, the hands, the transmission, all over, and noted "feel" whereever there was something visibly happening. "Horny" turns out to be pressure type sensations inside various body parts and seeing this made it fade quite quickly.
"Mind chatter" also was broken up into bits: Instead of calling it that, I investigated it further and broke it down into "seeing, feeling, hearing".
"I" which I sometimes use to note for whenever something has a very "me" feel to it, was also broken down into simply seeing, hearing, feeling. Braking this one down really made reality seem paper thin.
On another note, I feel very equanimous. In meditation this makes me feel like spacing out a little easier. Like, I just wanna day dream, man! Can't I just do that and have fun from this very satisfied state??
About this equanimity: I tried braking that down too! The equanimity-induced piti seemed to also just be pressure-type sensations in my body. This made the nice-ness, or the piti, of the equanimity go away and left is just a calm, chill kinda equanimity. Not pleasurable, not not-pleasurable either. I don't miss the piti. I might say that I don't think it's a pity that it's gone...
I note right away at 1-3 notes per second.
I get to the same point where I used to plateau: I can feel my "whole" body at once and start noting just the rise/fall of the breath and "note" for everything else. This gives this higher resolution and allows me to feel subtler things than before I discovered this little hack.
But OK, enough about all this old boring stuff that I learned daaays ago.
This, I think, is an important thing:
I've been able to note more phenomenology over "stuff" happening. For instance, all that sexual energy earlier, started just noting it as "horny". Haha, but! Then I went into each part of my body, the head, the hands, the transmission, all over, and noted "feel" whereever there was something visibly happening. "Horny" turns out to be pressure type sensations inside various body parts and seeing this made it fade quite quickly.
"Mind chatter" also was broken up into bits: Instead of calling it that, I investigated it further and broke it down into "seeing, feeling, hearing".
"I" which I sometimes use to note for whenever something has a very "me" feel to it, was also broken down into simply seeing, hearing, feeling. Braking this one down really made reality seem paper thin.
On another note, I feel very equanimous. In meditation this makes me feel like spacing out a little easier. Like, I just wanna day dream, man! Can't I just do that and have fun from this very satisfied state??
About this equanimity: I tried braking that down too! The equanimity-induced piti seemed to also just be pressure-type sensations in my body. This made the nice-ness, or the piti, of the equanimity go away and left is just a calm, chill kinda equanimity. Not pleasurable, not not-pleasurable either. I don't miss the piti. I might say that I don't think it's a pity that it's gone...
Last night's meditation:
Almost 40 minutes on the cushion, then 30 minutes in the bed. Then I just fell asleep while meditating in bed for quite a while. All noting practice.
I paid attention for perhaps a few minutes to strong visions of this purple spot that expands and travels - seems to be in phase with the breath. The outbreath tends to make it bigger and sortof take off. With the inbreath a new purple spot is formed. Yesterday this had more detail, color and vibrancy than usual. The formation of the purple thing sometimes started with a sharper, almost head-light bright little spark and then morphed into what I described before. At one point a dark center was circled by this little spark with purple swirls around it.
I experimented with changing the color of the purple thing. I tried green and voila!
General recap:
I have handicapped myself quite a bit from some back injury that I made a lot worse during yesterday's training. So lots of pain today to keep on tuning into while I'm figuring out how to live life without being physically active
The good part is that it hurts quite bad so at least I'm entertained while I can't do anything.. and I have some easy notes lol. Maybe some good music will emerge. A new type of blues, perhaps.. purples?
I have an increased motivation for meditation, which feels very right/healthy. I had a strong feeling this morning that it's worth it even if it takes me 40 years to reach SE. I hope it will be more like 40 minutes in reality, but still.. I'll just keep on noting and see what the hell happens.
I get a lot of inspiration from Polly's log. I think I'm almost at the point in her 2nd log where she's about to reach SE, which excites me quite a bit. Remember on my retreat I thought that I was about to do it myself and my excitement was literally through the roof! I was about to run out the door and just knock on people's door just to hug them in celebration. Hahah! But nope! No SE for me lol. One day...one day, you DhOrks mark my words :p
60 minutes this morning
I noted as per usual, but a bit slower than what I've logged earlier. I think I could just do about 1-3 notes per second today.
In addition to the pain in my mid-back there's also a pain/stiffness that shows up in my upper back. This comes and goes depending on whether I'm meditating and has been for some weeks I think. I don't remember what Daniel wrote about this type of trap-pain in his book, but as I recall it's related to some nana..yes? No? Maybe I'll look it up but who cares. Just note, man!
Vibration type feelings seem not to be there! I rather feel light and slightly transparent.
I am still getting used to noting more accurately what is actually going on, rahter than having preferences to what ought to be going on. Some things are still going under my radar, just enough so that I notice that something's there, but also enough to not be noted accurately.
For instance, I tend to get caught in rationalizing thoughts a few times during my meditations. I discover this after some time between a few seconds and a minute I would guess.
Also, I take note of "trying" which is a certain feeling that I get when I can't bounce my attention around the body completely fluidly. I get this small strain of sorts and I've had it for so long, in so many sessions, without noting it. But noting it makes it release and drives my practice towards more ease/fludity/tranquility. It almost evades my note every time but I'm getting practice in calling it out.
I'm really happy that I have started noticing these more subtle inclinations towards wanting/clinging/trying/intending. It's a game changer for me. Another game changer is the note of "emotion" which is a bit of a vague note for an emotion, really. But noting it this way makes it seen and a lot of the time brings attention to the bodily components of the emotion. These are often in the throat and heart, which previously was a no-mans land for me. Feels really good to feel the heart!
Get showers of goose-bumbs which are very metta-y quite often. I like this love-stuff. Tastes good.
Almost 40 minutes on the cushion, then 30 minutes in the bed. Then I just fell asleep while meditating in bed for quite a while. All noting practice.
I paid attention for perhaps a few minutes to strong visions of this purple spot that expands and travels - seems to be in phase with the breath. The outbreath tends to make it bigger and sortof take off. With the inbreath a new purple spot is formed. Yesterday this had more detail, color and vibrancy than usual. The formation of the purple thing sometimes started with a sharper, almost head-light bright little spark and then morphed into what I described before. At one point a dark center was circled by this little spark with purple swirls around it.
I experimented with changing the color of the purple thing. I tried green and voila!
General recap:
I have handicapped myself quite a bit from some back injury that I made a lot worse during yesterday's training. So lots of pain today to keep on tuning into while I'm figuring out how to live life without being physically active
The good part is that it hurts quite bad so at least I'm entertained while I can't do anything.. and I have some easy notes lol. Maybe some good music will emerge. A new type of blues, perhaps.. purples?I have an increased motivation for meditation, which feels very right/healthy. I had a strong feeling this morning that it's worth it even if it takes me 40 years to reach SE. I hope it will be more like 40 minutes in reality, but still.. I'll just keep on noting and see what the hell happens.
I get a lot of inspiration from Polly's log. I think I'm almost at the point in her 2nd log where she's about to reach SE, which excites me quite a bit. Remember on my retreat I thought that I was about to do it myself and my excitement was literally through the roof! I was about to run out the door and just knock on people's door just to hug them in celebration. Hahah! But nope! No SE for me lol. One day...one day, you DhOrks mark my words :p
60 minutes this morning
I noted as per usual, but a bit slower than what I've logged earlier. I think I could just do about 1-3 notes per second today.
In addition to the pain in my mid-back there's also a pain/stiffness that shows up in my upper back. This comes and goes depending on whether I'm meditating and has been for some weeks I think. I don't remember what Daniel wrote about this type of trap-pain in his book, but as I recall it's related to some nana..yes? No? Maybe I'll look it up but who cares. Just note, man!
Vibration type feelings seem not to be there! I rather feel light and slightly transparent.
I am still getting used to noting more accurately what is actually going on, rahter than having preferences to what ought to be going on. Some things are still going under my radar, just enough so that I notice that something's there, but also enough to not be noted accurately.
For instance, I tend to get caught in rationalizing thoughts a few times during my meditations. I discover this after some time between a few seconds and a minute I would guess.
Also, I take note of "trying" which is a certain feeling that I get when I can't bounce my attention around the body completely fluidly. I get this small strain of sorts and I've had it for so long, in so many sessions, without noting it. But noting it makes it release and drives my practice towards more ease/fludity/tranquility. It almost evades my note every time but I'm getting practice in calling it out.
I'm really happy that I have started noticing these more subtle inclinations towards wanting/clinging/trying/intending. It's a game changer for me. Another game changer is the note of "emotion" which is a bit of a vague note for an emotion, really. But noting it this way makes it seen and a lot of the time brings attention to the bodily components of the emotion. These are often in the throat and heart, which previously was a no-mans land for me. Feels really good to feel the heart!
Get showers of goose-bumbs which are very metta-y quite often. I like this love-stuff. Tastes good.
"I'm really happy that I have started noticing these more subtle inclinations towards wanting/clinging/trying/intending. It's a game changer for me. Another game changer is the note of "emotion" which is a bit of a vague note for an emotion, really. But noting it this way makes it seen and a lot of the time brings attention to the bodily components of the emotion. These are often in the throat and heart, which previously was a no-mans land for me. "
Nice man joy to read this! This is, I guess, what ancient Greeks meant by "Know Thyself" We learn to read ourselves like an open book (the experiential sensate reality-unfolding) by doing this practice of Noting/Noticing/paying Attention/Being profoundly mindful.
Best wishes!
Nice man
joy to read this! This is, I guess, what ancient Greeks meant by "Know Thyself" We learn to read ourselves like an open book (the experiential sensate reality-unfolding) by doing this practice of Noting/Noticing/paying Attention/Being profoundly mindful. Best wishes!
Sat for 30 minutes last night and 60 minutes this morning.
Feel very tranquil/EQ, and feel like I don't have to note because I'm just very alert. I feel that sometimes the noting is in the way of being properly aware of all that stuff of which there's too much of to note anyway.
I found out that no noting at all is not good. This makes me space out and float off...
But noting just the "rising, falling, sitting" works well for keeping an integrated awareness of the body. Then, if I add "seeing" when I have visuals going (which is all the time) and "feeling" when I discover something new pop up somewhere on the body, then I have a very integrated, broad and spaceous awareness going on. Turns out there's plenty to note just sticking to this, so I still note probably every second or every second second anyway
Feel very tranquil/EQ, and feel like I don't have to note because I'm just very alert. I feel that sometimes the noting is in the way of being properly aware of all that stuff of which there's too much of to note anyway.
I found out that no noting at all is not good. This makes me space out and float off...
But noting just the "rising, falling, sitting" works well for keeping an integrated awareness of the body. Then, if I add "seeing" when I have visuals going (which is all the time) and "feeling" when I discover something new pop up somewhere on the body, then I have a very integrated, broad and spaceous awareness going on. Turns out there's plenty to note just sticking to this, so I still note probably every second or every second second anyway
TIM:
Man, you can write. I was lolling when I read the "EQ is playing chicken with nothingness". Dude..
And also, beautifully put, through and through. I love the wrestling analogy, it really is on point in a lot of ways. Especially for me atm since one of my big worldly concerns recently has been giving up MMA training - like, where are the new wrestling/strangling/killing moves gonna come from?! Despair..
I really look forward to gaining SE to see how I things may gain some new clarity.
I haven't read your logs yet, Tim - how far along the path are you?
Appreciate your inputs
Man, you can write. I was lolling when I read the "EQ is playing chicken with nothingness". Dude..And also, beautifully put, through and through. I love the wrestling analogy, it really is on point in a lot of ways. Especially for me atm since one of my big worldly concerns recently has been giving up MMA training - like, where are the new wrestling/strangling/killing moves gonna come from?! Despair..
I really look forward to gaining SE to see how I things may gain some new clarity.
I haven't read your logs yet, Tim - how far along the path are you?
Appreciate your inputs
Emil Jensen:
3) Perhaps related to 1) is that I can see a bit more continously. I think this is what allows me to see the dissatisfactoriness of more moments. And to be real, it was there whenever I looked for it.
I had a real genuine curiosity about what to do with this unsatisfactoriness seemingly pervading every moment. It definitely helped to not sort of buy into it, for instance by trying to make the discomfort go away. Instead one can just see the characteristics of it: Which was to show up uninvited, to do everything on its own including going away again, and to provide no comfort/satisfaction whatsoever.
Ugh.. screw sensations, man. I'm outta here!
Wait.. still here
I had a real genuine curiosity about what to do with this unsatisfactoriness seemingly pervading every moment. It definitely helped to not sort of buy into it, for instance by trying to make the discomfort go away. Instead one can just see the characteristics of it: Which was to show up uninvited, to do everything on its own including going away again, and to provide no comfort/satisfaction whatsoever.
Ugh.. screw sensations, man. I'm outta here!
Wait.. still here
This is the basic dukkha assoicated with trying to maintain these projections of awarenss and nothingness and subjectivity in relation to independently arising sensory phenomena. You're going pretty fast here so your mind may need some time to accept these things.
"would I be better off just sitting continuously till I passed out, wake up and then do it again? Or is it good for over all progress to just stick to a slow and steady pace?"
Who knows? Only you can try it out and see what you discover there in any case.
I would lean towards daily 2 to 3 sits (45-60 minutes per sit). But if you feel the "thirst" towards long sits then by all means do it and see what you discover there.
Fact is we all have that sense of a "dancer" inside who keeps dancing the dance in hope to get there and gain something etc ... This "dancer" is different from person to person (call it Karma if you like). As long this dancer is full of enthusiasm to get something other than This right Now the practice will go on and on until the "dancer" is totally exhausted and there is nothing other but This-ness unfolding, 1-5 sensation noted per second for the duration of the sit (sense of "dancer" also part of the noted This-moment).
You might need to simply practice more just to come to the point of that sense of the "dancer" being sick and tired of its own dancing so it gives up on all that and gives space to simply abiding in the noting of 1-5 sensations per second for the duration of the entire sit.
If you need less lost in scenarios then note aloud. If you need more concentration then open eyes and gently rest the seeing on a Kasina object in front of you while noting aloud. You need to relax more then check every so often if body is tensed and relax it and keep calm body noting 1-5 sensations/feelings/mind states a second.
And treat SE as if it's sold out in the Dhamma Store! They might never be able to restock on it
you fucked! all you have left is the noting 1-5 sensations per second for the duration of the sit day after day and trust that this is all there is to it.
Best wishes Emil!
Who knows?
Only you can try it out and see what you discover there in any case. I would lean towards daily 2 to 3 sits (45-60 minutes per sit). But if you feel the "thirst" towards long sits then by all means do it and see what you discover there.
Fact is we all have that sense of a "dancer" inside who keeps dancing the dance in hope to get there and gain something etc ... This "dancer" is different from person to person (call it Karma if you like). As long this dancer is full of enthusiasm to get something other than This right Now the practice will go on and on until the "dancer" is totally exhausted and there is nothing other but This-ness unfolding, 1-5 sensation noted per second for the duration of the sit (sense of "dancer" also part of the noted This-moment).
You might need to simply practice more just to come to the point of that sense of the "dancer" being sick and tired of its own dancing so it gives up on all that and gives space to simply abiding in the noting of 1-5 sensations per second for the duration of the entire sit.
If you need less lost in scenarios then note aloud. If you need more concentration then open eyes and gently rest the seeing on a Kasina object in front of you while noting aloud. You need to relax more then check every so often if body is tensed and relax it and keep calm body noting 1-5 sensations/feelings/mind states a second.
And treat SE as if it's sold out in the Dhamma Store! They might never be able to restock on it
you fucked! all you have left is the noting 1-5 sensations per second for the duration of the sit day after day and trust that this is all there is to it. Best wishes Emil!
Che
Arghghghh!! SE sold out at the Dharma Store?!?!
You know, that's a good mindset, I have experimented with that already. I am already past the point of expecting too much from practice. Just gotta keep it going, that's the most important thing.
If I were never to get SE my reasons for practicing meditation would just be to have better focus, to have a more equanimous mind. Oh, and of course to pick up chicks. Dharma girls love a good meditator. Right?
I actually very much don't want to note aloud, hehe. Also I feel that noting internally is doing the trick just fine! I don't really get lost in scenarios, typically expect when I space out with no noting at all. Noting is key for energy and presence indeed!
About the intensity of sits, I'm considering adding a third sit to the morning/evening routine. Some time during mid day may work out for me, at least until I start my job in mid-january
Let's goooo!
Arghghghh!! SE sold out at the Dharma Store?!?!
You know, that's a good mindset, I have experimented with that already. I am already past the point of expecting too much from practice. Just gotta keep it going, that's the most important thing.
If I were never to get SE my reasons for practicing meditation would just be to have better focus, to have a more equanimous mind. Oh, and of course to pick up chicks. Dharma girls love a good meditator. Right?
I actually very much don't want to note aloud, hehe. Also I feel that noting internally is doing the trick just fine! I don't really get lost in scenarios, typically expect when I space out with no noting at all. Noting is key for energy and presence indeed!
About the intensity of sits, I'm considering adding a third sit to the morning/evening routine. Some time during mid day may work out for me, at least until I start my job in mid-january
Let's goooo!
"I actually very much don't want to note aloud, hehe. Also I feel that noting internally is doing the trick just fine!"
that's fine mate. You do what you feel is doing it for you. I was suggesting aloud noting as a tool in case of much resistance as in Re-observation or even in early stages. But sure thing, even silent calm-abiding can also work here (Shamatha was my first ever practice for close to 3 years).
I think you are doing just fine as is and the rest of us here are just creating noise Look at poor agnostic getting all stick now from Olivier and Chris (I better shut up now before they turn their attention to me)
that's fine mate. You do what you feel is doing it for you. I was suggesting aloud noting as a tool in case of much resistance as in Re-observation or even in early stages. But sure thing, even silent calm-abiding can also work here (Shamatha was my first ever practice for close to 3 years). I think you are doing just fine as is and the rest of us here are just creating noise
Look at poor agnostic getting all stick now from Olivier and Chris (I better shut up now before they turn their attention to me)
Thanks for the comfort, Polly Your logs are greatly appreciated too!
the thought about fruitions actually popped up after reading your log. Your first description of it in your 2nd log is so.. uneventful? You know, it's not like you were storming out the door running around with a chapagne bottle hahaha. Imagine that :p
It had me think that maybe I am experiencing fruitions but since I am very unimpressed by even the most spacey A&P-out of body-alien-vortex-alternate reality or bliss kinda stuff, then I just kinda shrugged at it. Does that make sense? I mean.. so what if I disappeared for a moment and felt clarity and whatnot?
aaanyway
I look forward to exploring more. It's true for me as well that these occurrences don't actually have that much of a physical feel to them. Today it did a little bit tho... I think. I might have misperceived it due to some subtle visual stuff going on but I'm not sure.
but the restarts are different now than earlier on. I remember having a "dat.dat.dat.gone" experience several times.
lately my gone moments are a lot less datdatdat and more like just blipping out from a bit spaced out place.
ill have to just explore and find out what's going on.
Your logs are greatly appreciated too!the thought about fruitions actually popped up after reading your log. Your first description of it in your 2nd log is so.. uneventful? You know, it's not like you were storming out the door running around with a chapagne bottle hahaha. Imagine that :p
It had me think that maybe I am experiencing fruitions but since I am very unimpressed by even the most spacey A&P-out of body-alien-vortex-alternate reality or bliss kinda stuff, then I just kinda shrugged at it. Does that make sense? I mean.. so what if I disappeared for a moment and felt clarity and whatnot?
aaanyway
I look forward to exploring more. It's true for me as well that these occurrences don't actually have that much of a physical feel to them. Today it did a little bit tho... I think. I might have misperceived it due to some subtle visual stuff going on but I'm not sure.
but the restarts are different now than earlier on. I remember having a "dat.dat.dat.gone" experience several times.
lately my gone moments are a lot less datdatdat and more like just blipping out from a bit spaced out place.
ill have to just explore and find out what's going on.
I'm glad to hear that.
Haha, yeah, I see what you mean. It was a bit anti-climactic. That very uneventful thing did have some profound effects, though. It changed some stuff that was hardwired, such as the inbility to tolerate prolonged eye contact that I used to have becase of being autistic. Lots of social anxiety suddenly went away. Stuff like that. And jhanas happened by themselves, and there was like a huge buffet of highlights from my practice that would show up accumulated, and everything felt unsolid to the extent of feeling like I was sinking through the floor when walking sometimes. All this wasn't apparent from the first fruition, though, and in retrospect I have been wondering if some of the earlier unknowing event were fruitions after all. I'm thinking specifically of the time when three images of sacred geometry were flashing by in rapid succession. Maybe it's more like a bunch of fruitions do the job together rather than the first one alone, and maybe the effect comes after it has accumulated enough? I really don't know. I have noticed a pattern of having a bunch of unknowing events right before a few more clearly demarcated ones occur that seems to involve some tangible shift. I'm not sure how to interpret that.
Haha, yeah, I see what you mean. It was a bit anti-climactic. That very uneventful thing did have some profound effects, though. It changed some stuff that was hardwired, such as the inbility to tolerate prolonged eye contact that I used to have becase of being autistic. Lots of social anxiety suddenly went away. Stuff like that. And jhanas happened by themselves, and there was like a huge buffet of highlights from my practice that would show up accumulated, and everything felt unsolid to the extent of feeling like I was sinking through the floor when walking sometimes. All this wasn't apparent from the first fruition, though, and in retrospect I have been wondering if some of the earlier unknowing event were fruitions after all. I'm thinking specifically of the time when three images of sacred geometry were flashing by in rapid succession. Maybe it's more like a bunch of fruitions do the job together rather than the first one alone, and maybe the effect comes after it has accumulated enough? I really don't know. I have noticed a pattern of having a bunch of unknowing events right before a few more clearly demarcated ones occur that seems to involve some tangible shift. I'm not sure how to interpret that.
Polly:
Its a bit new to me, to hear of fruitions not being the most super climatic thing on the planet. If I recall correctly, Daniel described his first moment as "waves and waves and waves of grattitude (and bliss?)". Something like that. I don't even remember when I had my first blip, fruition or not. But then again, I do remember crying tears of gratitude.
The benefits coming after your first fruition - that's very good to hear
I myself have had my life transformed completely from this journey. In a good way.
I would say that along with all the more "normal" benefits, like reduced anxiety, ability to hold eye contact, ability to enter jhanas, isn't there really just one "true" measure of progress of insight? I mean the amount of suffering! You know, the taste of salt and freedom and all that.
I would say, fruitions or not, that my amount of suffering has reduced to being just 10% of what it used to be. Possibly to even less.
I have gained the super human powers of not having a problem with stuff to a very high degree. This freedom is really the biggest benefit to all of this.
I would find it weird that I have experiences such freedom, if I didn't also have a relatively high level of insight.
Regardless, the good part about this fruitions-or-not thing, is that if it turns out I am not having them, but still doing this good with regard to a progression in the reduction of suffering - well, then all the more to come once I do get them! (Which I bloody hell swear I will).
Che:
I'm with you on the "don't know" train. In fact, I do don't know stuff really well.
It's not that easy to say "no", though. Because in my experiences there is no sense of anything during the blips. All I remember is some stuff leading up to and then as if waking up from.. you know.. whatever that was.
Writing this makes it sound like I think I do know.. And I must say that right now I'm feeling like "OK, I have cessations. Wasn't what I expected from them. They're actually pretty boring and who cares anyway".
Over all I think this is healthy enough. Because if what I'm having is cessations, then I don't give (much of) a crap about them. I just want deeper insight which (fruitions or not) seems to deminish my level of suffering. All is well. I'll stick to practice.
Its a bit new to me, to hear of fruitions not being the most super climatic thing on the planet. If I recall correctly, Daniel described his first moment as "waves and waves and waves of grattitude (and bliss?)". Something like that. I don't even remember when I had my first blip, fruition or not. But then again, I do remember crying tears of gratitude.
The benefits coming after your first fruition - that's very good to hear
I myself have had my life transformed completely from this journey. In a good way.
I would say that along with all the more "normal" benefits, like reduced anxiety, ability to hold eye contact, ability to enter jhanas, isn't there really just one "true" measure of progress of insight? I mean the amount of suffering! You know, the taste of salt and freedom and all that.
I would say, fruitions or not, that my amount of suffering has reduced to being just 10% of what it used to be. Possibly to even less.
I have gained the super human powers of not having a problem with stuff to a very high degree. This freedom is really the biggest benefit to all of this.
I would find it weird that I have experiences such freedom, if I didn't also have a relatively high level of insight.
Regardless, the good part about this fruitions-or-not thing, is that if it turns out I am not having them, but still doing this good with regard to a progression in the reduction of suffering - well, then all the more to come once I do get them! (Which I bloody hell swear I will).
Che:
I'm with you on the "don't know" train. In fact, I do don't know stuff really well.
It's not that easy to say "no", though. Because in my experiences there is no sense of anything during the blips. All I remember is some stuff leading up to and then as if waking up from.. you know.. whatever that was.
Writing this makes it sound like I think I do know.. And I must say that right now I'm feeling like "OK, I have cessations. Wasn't what I expected from them. They're actually pretty boring and who cares anyway".
Over all I think this is healthy enough. Because if what I'm having is cessations, then I don't give (much of) a crap about them. I just want deeper insight which (fruitions or not) seems to deminish my level of suffering. All is well. I'll stick to practice.
The story you shared about the window jump; I wonder if you have considered going for therapy about that? I personally did much talking therapy because of PTSD and it can be of benefit on this spiritual journey which can be at times shaky ground. Usually out of the blue all sorts of shit starts pouring down Having a therapist to talk out shadow emotional stuff can help a lot.
Btw, thank you for sharing with us Emil!
Having a therapist to talk out shadow emotional stuff can help a lot. Btw, thank you for sharing with us Emil!
I know I'm not seriously in danger. I think there's a long way still before actually taking a jump.
I want more to figure life out than to throw it away. Still, in those dark times its just tempting to consider escapes. Like drugs. I crave that quite a bit from time to times. But I don't take it either cuz I don't wanna fuck up stuff going forward
If I could afford a therapist, maybe I'm getting a job next month, so perhaps I'll consider it if the night turns dark again.
Thanks for tuning in - this is a small community man. Love it
I want more to figure life out than to throw it away. Still, in those dark times its just tempting to consider escapes. Like drugs. I crave that quite a bit from time to times. But I don't take it either cuz I don't wanna fuck up stuff going forward
If I could afford a therapist, maybe
I'm getting a job next month, so perhaps I'll consider it if the night turns dark again.Thanks for tuning in - this is a small community man. Love it
Well therapists in Denmark are cheap man I think I paid only 330dkk per session which is nothing. Of course you need your local doctor to appoint you to one to get such cheap price.
But yes having some income sure helps!
Wish you all best with that new job!
therapists in Denmark are cheap man I think I paid only 330dkk per session which is nothing. Of course you need your local doctor to appoint you to one to get such cheap price. But yes having some income sure helps!
Wish you all best with that new job!
"The map answer is that after a good taste of EQ, you started hurrying and grasping, and fell back into the dukkha nanas. It's sort of a classic loop, really, and it is generous of you to be so open about it."
+1 on this and rest what Tim said!
Have faith in Noting 1-5 sensations per second for the duration of your sit. Ponder afterwards if you need it. If insight happens during the noting sit so be it but no reason to spend time in self-validation. Sure thing note that self-validating also as "thinking" and move on through this vast samsaric ocean. Don't forget to relax the body and breathing but let the mind be fast as it certainly can take this. Trust that mind knows all which was noted beforehand anyway Don't fear loosing "control" just keep plain simple noting of your own matter of fact experience. It's all we have really
Look at it like going to the gym for 45 minutes and lifting weights non stop. Then afterwards have a hot shower, make a tea, watch a movie, read a book, play music, wash dishes, go for walk, talk with friends ... etc ... no reason to drive yourself mad with Dhamma 24/7. When on cushion then weight lifting without lapse. Timer goes off after 45 minutes say well done and find a hobby until the next sit etc ...
It is very important to let go of this stuff mentally and do other life things as well.
Map is good to use as a general guideline rather than point to point exact replica.
Best wishes and be gentle with yourself
+1 on this and rest what Tim said!
Have faith in Noting 1-5 sensations per second for the duration of your sit. Ponder afterwards if you need it. If insight happens during the noting sit so be it but no reason to spend time in self-validation. Sure thing note that self-validating also as "thinking" and move on through this vast samsaric ocean. Don't forget to relax the body and breathing but let the mind be fast as it certainly can take this. Trust that mind knows all which was noted beforehand anyway
Don't fear loosing "control" just keep plain simple noting of your own matter of fact experience. It's all we have really Look at it like going to the gym for 45 minutes and lifting weights non stop. Then afterwards have a hot shower, make a tea, watch a movie, read a book, play music, wash dishes, go for walk, talk with friends ... etc ... no reason to drive yourself mad with Dhamma 24/7. When on cushion then weight lifting without lapse. Timer goes off after 45 minutes
say well done and find a hobby until the next sit etc ... It is very important to let go of this stuff mentally and do other life things as well.
Map is good to use as a general guideline rather than point to point exact replica.
Best wishes and be gentle with yourself
I think I needed to hear this, guys. To ease off a bit
I read what you wrote earlier, Tim, and resonated with it. I took the "day off" in a way haha since I was planning on meditating some more. Just chilled instead. I could definitely feel the pressure I had put on myself.
Just had another 60 minute sit and found that I could feel the effect of having let off some mental pressure a bit. I felt giggly and equanimous. This made practice easier and less stressed. That's probably a good thing.
It's difficult to know exactly what to do now. I am starting my job 15th of january and expect that I will be very busy. Would be cool to make as much of my, for now, unlimited free time as possible before then. If I can do it without putting stress/pressure on myself I would like to maintain at least 3 or 4 hours daily until then. Ideally more...
Agnostic, I think I'll have to read some Mahasi again. I've been meaning to and it's been a while since I read it. I also tend to not remember anything which is unrelateable/unintuitive for me, so I'm guessing I'd read it with new eyes now.
I read what you wrote earlier, Tim, and resonated with it. I took the "day off" in a way haha since I was planning on meditating some more. Just chilled instead. I could definitely feel the pressure I had put on myself.
Just had another 60 minute sit and found that I could feel the effect of having let off some mental pressure a bit. I felt giggly and equanimous. This made practice easier and less stressed. That's probably a good thing.
It's difficult to know exactly what to do now. I am starting my job 15th of january and expect that I will be very busy. Would be cool to make as much of my, for now, unlimited free time as possible before then. If I can do it without putting stress/pressure on myself I would like to maintain at least 3 or 4 hours daily until then. Ideally more...
Agnostic, I think I'll have to read some Mahasi again. I've been meaning to and it's been a while since I read it. I also tend to not remember anything which is unrelateable/unintuitive for me, so I'm guessing I'd read it with new eyes now.
60 minute sit this morning.
Still feel like taking a step back and remembered that tranquility is a factor of awakening that I could possibly learn to amp up a bit...
Instead of doing strict noting all the way through I let myself groove a bit here and there and experimented with what felt right. Whenever sloppiness turns up, I am pretty fast at getting back at the noting which seems to keep up the energy.
This session I especially focused on seeing impermanence in felt sensations. I noted something and stayed with it until I could perceive a change. This felt good. Normally quick noting doesn't allow for really studying each sensation more, one is just off to the next.
I also remembered reading Mahasi, who put emphasis on noting "rising" and "falling", as well as "sitting". To me he didn't seem eager to have note as many different things as fast as possible, which has been what I've been trying to do.
Today it felt like "sitting" had a tendency to generate that broad awareness which actually makes me notice many sensations other than feelings in the spine yielding the "sitting" feel. I.e. other bodily sensations as well as subtle visual sensations aiding this sense of space and me in relation to it.
I have to read Mahasi again to see if I get some new understanding. Perhaps next year hehe...
Today I again encountered the very solid feeling of "me" in my skull. I spent a little time trying to look for impermanence in it with some success. Whenever I work in this area, around my eyes, the seen and the skull, my sense of self does something. It tempts me to believe that there's important work to be done there. I don't know
It's new years. Don't go blowing off your fingers and toes, kids. And don't smoke cigars while you light explosives, lest you mix them up. Wouldn't wanna try and vipassanalize a face that's not there anymore, would we...?
Still feel like taking a step back and remembered that tranquility is a factor of awakening that I could possibly learn to amp up a bit...
Instead of doing strict noting all the way through I let myself groove a bit here and there and experimented with what felt right. Whenever sloppiness turns up, I am pretty fast at getting back at the noting which seems to keep up the energy.
This session I especially focused on seeing impermanence in felt sensations. I noted something and stayed with it until I could perceive a change. This felt good. Normally quick noting doesn't allow for really studying each sensation more, one is just off to the next.
I also remembered reading Mahasi, who put emphasis on noting "rising" and "falling", as well as "sitting". To me he didn't seem eager to have note as many different things as fast as possible, which has been what I've been trying to do.
Today it felt like "sitting" had a tendency to generate that broad awareness which actually makes me notice many sensations other than feelings in the spine yielding the "sitting" feel. I.e. other bodily sensations as well as subtle visual sensations aiding this sense of space and me in relation to it.
I have to read Mahasi again to see if I get some new understanding. Perhaps next year hehe...
Today I again encountered the very solid feeling of "me" in my skull. I spent a little time trying to look for impermanence in it with some success. Whenever I work in this area, around my eyes, the seen and the skull, my sense of self does something. It tempts me to believe that there's important work to be done there. I don't know
It's new years. Don't go blowing off your fingers and toes, kids. And don't smoke cigars while you light explosives, lest you mix them up. Wouldn't wanna try and vipassanalize a face that's not there anymore, would we...?
Emil Jensen:
YES! You're right, fuck mind boggling one stupid experience or the other.
+1 to what Tim of the Cross said above. That man knows "his Camels"
Btw, it's not stupid experience. It is what it is and it's ALL we ever have; try and cherish each moment as it arises. Your guests are arriving at the 6 sense doors. They cjust bract they door and you say their name without pushing them away or giving them a big wet kiss. You just name them with a gentle smile. Acceptance and Clear Comprehanding of all guests contacting your 6 sense doors. There are 6 doors and they are bombarded by guests keen to enter your cool party because you have the best parties in the Dhamma Town. So don't blame the "stupid" guests for wanting to be in such a cool place
1-5 sensations-feelings-Mind states noted per second. Relax the body so it doesn't go into tension. Relaxed body with a mind tensed like a guitar string; tune it too much and the string will snap. Tune it too little and it doesn't make music. Tune it just right in the key of E and off the unfolding of Dhamma music goes; one after the other, the Dhamma notes arise and pass away. 1-5 notes per second for the entire sit ithout laps in mindfulness. Self validating thoughts is a laps in mindfulness (is this near miss or isn't this near miss, is this close to cessation or not) when such are noted then they usually pass away very fast just to be replaced my an itch on your buttocks
Practice well and name with acceptance each arising and passing Dhamma guest at your 6 sense doors!
Best wishes Emil!
Yes! Thank you again, for keeping on tuning in to this log. A lot is happening at the moment and your encouragement and advice is so helpful and energizing!
Enough with the sobbing hehe.It's Dhamma time
I meditated for over 3 hours yesterday. In the evening I was so jacked up on rapturous energy that I simply HAD to keep sitting to investigate.
I am very much getting over it, but yesterday I was like OMG OMG OMG WOW! I had formation moments where the sense of the observer really felt like it was really gone - just the seen/felt was there. What I saw kinda blew the air out of my lungs and it felt like I turned my insides out a bit.
It felt like I was being pushed closer to the edge of a cliff, dancing an inch away. I could feel that if I could really catch up to the generation of the thin veil of ignorance keeping me in the illusion of being "me", then I could just fall and fall and fall... I don't know. It felt like there was a lot of kindalini type energy just on the verge of exploding.
Today I'm still very excited. I meditated for 45 minutes this morning, some in the train, and just sat for another hour at home.
I don't really know what to write. I feel like I could probably sit here and write for an hour about what has been unravelling for me the past 24 hours but I don't think it will benefit anyone.
Something short I could write could be this: I feel like I saw so clearly in my meditation yesterday only because of the work I've done so far. I feel that the practice of noting more and more really is the way to go. In my powerful meditation I saw how that's what's needed to generate those formation moments where the three characteristics simply are so clear that it makes you forget how it would be any other way.
Like, all that separates me from seeing through the thin veil is for my awareness to catch up to all the sensations entering my experiential field. The illusion lies in the sensations not seen clearly.
Enough with the sobbing hehe.It's Dhamma time
I meditated for over 3 hours yesterday. In the evening I was so jacked up on rapturous energy that I simply HAD to keep sitting to investigate.
I am very much getting over it, but yesterday I was like OMG OMG OMG WOW! I had formation moments where the sense of the observer really felt like it was really gone - just the seen/felt was there. What I saw kinda blew the air out of my lungs and it felt like I turned my insides out a bit.
It felt like I was being pushed closer to the edge of a cliff, dancing an inch away. I could feel that if I could really catch up to the generation of the thin veil of ignorance keeping me in the illusion of being "me", then I could just fall and fall and fall... I don't know. It felt like there was a lot of kindalini type energy just on the verge of exploding.
Today I'm still very excited. I meditated for 45 minutes this morning, some in the train, and just sat for another hour at home.
I don't really know what to write. I feel like I could probably sit here and write for an hour about what has been unravelling for me the past 24 hours but I don't think it will benefit anyone.
Something short I could write could be this: I feel like I saw so clearly in my meditation yesterday only because of the work I've done so far. I feel that the practice of noting more and more really is the way to go. In my powerful meditation I saw how that's what's needed to generate those formation moments where the three characteristics simply are so clear that it makes you forget how it would be any other way.
Like, all that separates me from seeing through the thin veil is for my awareness to catch up to all the sensations entering my experiential field. The illusion lies in the sensations not seen clearly.
Hey agnostic, didn't see your comment there.
I can recognize what you're talking about: blissed on the cushion, pissed in the kitchen. Haha, that's accurate and also it sounds funny.
Thanks for the good luck!
60 minute sit this morning:
I practiced concentration with the LED light as a kasina and counting breaths for a little over 40 of these minutes.
The remaining 20 I spent doing what I usually do with noting.
My concentration is not totally fire this morning. That's ok I guess. I've spent more time in samadhi jhanas these past few days than I have combined over the last year!
Another cool note: What I wrote yesterday about calling up a jhanic state. What I did in my meditation last night, I did in bed as well as I was going to sleep. I didn't cultivate it then and make it grow, but the rapture came on immediately after I called upon it. Now that is cool!
This morning I tried the same thing. It was as if the rapture wanted to come on but I couldn't grasp it with my attention. I'll remember to try when my attention is a bit stronger, perhaps later.
One thing I noticed (for the many'th time) this morning, was that a certain point in the kasina practice exists where concentration seems quite stable on the dot. Then it's as if there's a "test" of this concentration, as if the mind wants to make sure you really want it. It's as if there's a refocus, perhaps 3-5 times where the goes away unless you really have that relaxed, super fixed concentration well in place.
I can recognize what you're talking about: blissed on the cushion, pissed in the kitchen. Haha, that's accurate and also it sounds funny.
Thanks for the good luck!
60 minute sit this morning:
I practiced concentration with the LED light as a kasina and counting breaths for a little over 40 of these minutes.
The remaining 20 I spent doing what I usually do with noting.
My concentration is not totally fire this morning. That's ok I guess. I've spent more time in samadhi jhanas these past few days than I have combined over the last year!
Another cool note: What I wrote yesterday about calling up a jhanic state. What I did in my meditation last night, I did in bed as well as I was going to sleep. I didn't cultivate it then and make it grow, but the rapture came on immediately after I called upon it. Now that is cool!
This morning I tried the same thing. It was as if the rapture wanted to come on but I couldn't grasp it with my attention. I'll remember to try when my attention is a bit stronger, perhaps later.
One thing I noticed (for the many'th time) this morning, was that a certain point in the kasina practice exists where concentration seems quite stable on the dot. Then it's as if there's a "test" of this concentration, as if the mind wants to make sure you really want it. It's as if there's a refocus, perhaps 3-5 times where the goes away unless you really have that relaxed, super fixed concentration well in place.
Emil Jensen:
I started inducing fear in myself by visualizing snakes and snake like worms penetrating my body and brain. I also imagined leaping into a sea of shit, pus and parasites. Ugh..! Some panic inducing stuff indeed.
That's an awesome practice, going as deep into your fears as you can.
Hehe, I don't know if it's good or bad. It is what it is
It was fun tho and I hate being a slave to my fear. I want to study it so I can learn how to overcome it
It was fun tho and I hate being a slave to my fear. I want to study it so I can learn how to overcome it
"Let me know if you're an enlightened badass, reading this,"
Maybe you will get more replies if you don't call out in this fashion Many here don't pride themselves with being enlightened There is no body there to get or be enlightened You are enlightened or not only if such self-validating thinking arises
I think you are doing great! You are totally rocking that meditator-self who is wanting this and that and trying out experiences deeper and deeper until one day all those loose their shine and rot away showing their true nature and then the meditator gives up and all just is as it is. So keep that dancer dancing the dance of Dhamma until it gives up This is a good thing!
Maybe you will get more replies if you don't call out in this fashion
Many here don't pride themselves with being enlightened There is no body there to get or be enlightened You are enlightened or not only if such self-validating thinking arises I think you are doing great! You are totally rocking that meditator-self who is wanting this and that and trying out experiences deeper and deeper until one day all those loose their shine and rot away showing their true nature and then the meditator gives up and all just is as it is. So keep that dancer dancing the dance of Dhamma until it gives up
This is a good thing! Papa Che Dusko:
"Let me know if you're an enlightened badass, reading this,"
Maybe you will get more replies if you don't call out in this fashion Many here don't pride themselves with being enlightened There is no body there to get or be enlightened You are enlightened or not only if such self-validating thinking arises
I think you are doing great! You are totally rocking that meditator-self who is wanting this and that and trying out experiences deeper and deeper until one day all those loose their shine and rot away showing their true nature and then the meditator gives up and all just is as it is. So keep that dancer dancing the dance of Dhamma until it gives up This is a good thing!
Maybe you will get more replies if you don't call out in this fashion
Many here don't pride themselves with being enlightened There is no body there to get or be enlightened You are enlightened or not only if such self-validating thinking arises I think you are doing great! You are totally rocking that meditator-self who is wanting this and that and trying out experiences deeper and deeper until one day all those loose their shine and rot away showing their true nature and then the meditator gives up and all just is as it is. So keep that dancer dancing the dance of Dhamma until it gives up
This is a good thing! [p.s. afterthoughts] In a way, DhO was set up by enlightened badasses, for aspiring enlightened badasses. The subtitle of MCTB is "An Unusually Hard-Core Dharma Book," and all those unusually hard-core dharma geeks were badass to the core. They wouldn't have wasted their time with a vague word like "enlightened," but a lot of them could tell you where they were on the theravadan four-path model or its variants, with GPS coordinates precise to within inches. The ethic and style was free-wheeling, no bullshit, and not without some macho swagger; you get a good taste of it reading the lightning-bolt sections in MCTB.
Emil, Chris Marti wouldn't cop to being an enlightened badass if his life depended on it, but I'll bet he's met his share of them and if you can get him to tell some of their stories, it would be priceless. He's probably too discreet, but maybe the names could be changed or something.
Papa Che:
I'll be learning how to communicate to more and more knowledgable people, hopefully. Badass or not, if they're progressing in insight they're badasses to me
Thanks for the encouragement! I do feel that I'm in a pretty good place. My mood is good and energy and curiosity high. This is very sustainable and progress is seen after just one intense day
"Enlightened Badass" is an awesome lyric title! I'm thinking rock-hip-hop haha
Tim:
I've noticed that you've noticed, and you may have noticed that I've noticed that you're quite the no-bullshit kinda badass yourself.
lol.
About baddassity..badassness?.
It's seriously such a MUST for me. When I read MCTB I felt such relief. Finally!!! Someone who.. doesn't bullshit?!
I'm here to become a enlightened badass myself.
My Dhamma sword was forged in the fires of no bullshit
Oh and you've conviced me that I'll have to hit up Chris Marti at some point Perhaps I'll start stalking him 
I'll be learning how to communicate to more and more knowledgable people, hopefully. Badass or not, if they're progressing in insight they're badasses to me
Thanks for the encouragement! I do feel that I'm in a pretty good place. My mood is good and energy and curiosity high. This is very sustainable and progress is seen after just one intense day
"Enlightened Badass" is an awesome lyric title! I'm thinking rock-hip-hop haha
Tim:
I've noticed that you've noticed, and you may have noticed that I've noticed that you're quite the no-bullshit kinda badass yourself.
lol.
About baddassity..badassness?.
It's seriously such a MUST for me. When I read MCTB I felt such relief. Finally!!! Someone who.. doesn't bullshit?!
I'm here to become a enlightened badass myself.
My Dhamma sword was forged in the fires of no bullshit
Oh and you've conviced me that I'll have to hit up Chris Marti at some point
Perhaps I'll start stalking him
"Enlightened Badass" is an awesome lyric title! I'm thinking rock-hip-hop haha"
Hm I'm more leaning towards Funk-hip-hop funk is much funnier
Hm
I'm more leaning towards Funk-hip-hop funk is much funnier
Fuck your oops, Tim
I did recall seeing something about fucking my own raptures yesterday - and I did fuck em! Please keep telling me to fuck whatever necessary going forward, it will be appreciated
My meditation is a beatiful mess these days. I'm trying various techniques in order to strengthen concentration while I explore my sensate experience bit for bit with vipassana. I go back and forth between struggling with creating concentration and end up in a tranquil carelessness when going back to vipassana. I can't see why this should not be EQ as I just feel so at ease sitting. And itch shows up, I don't care. A pain, a feeling, whatever, I don't care. I just observe it with ease and it dissolves at let me stay at rest in my comfortable position where I feel I could sit for hours.
Ranty EDIT: I don't know anything about stages, man. I say I believe this could be EQ but I still have no idea about anything (read: anything at all, not just stages). To be honest, I don't know for sure that I even ever got a glimpse of "mind and body". Ok, maybe I feel pretty damn certain about that. But it's still not clear what a stage is to me. Is it something we get a flash of every now and then? Am I in a certain stage when I'm taking a dump or scrolling through instagram? How come I go back to what I think is EQ in almost every sit during a several weeks-long period when I never notice "disgust" for example. How can I go through without ever noticing it? How come its been a long time since I noticed what I think could be "dissolution"? Aren't I supposed to start with going through that every day? Ugh!
In conclusion to this rant, I think best not to think about it at all. Perhaps clarity will come after 23854970 more sits.
I did about 1.5 hours last evening and just finished a 1 hour sit this morning.
This morning I rediscovered the "do nothing" practice in a new light. I was so aware of sensations arising and passing that I completely dropped the noting, just keeping a light effort on being attentive to the broad range of sensations across the sense doors.
In this dropping I was allowed to also observe the mind distribiuting its attention to random sensations. I also observed identification processes arise here and there, for example when a little bit of "trying" to do something, like doing nothing, showed up.
I did recall seeing something about fucking my own raptures yesterday - and I did fuck em! Please keep telling me to fuck whatever necessary going forward, it will be appreciated
My meditation is a beatiful mess these days. I'm trying various techniques in order to strengthen concentration while I explore my sensate experience bit for bit with vipassana. I go back and forth between struggling with creating concentration and end up in a tranquil carelessness when going back to vipassana. I can't see why this should not be EQ as I just feel so at ease sitting. And itch shows up, I don't care. A pain, a feeling, whatever, I don't care. I just observe it with ease and it dissolves at let me stay at rest in my comfortable position where I feel I could sit for hours.
Ranty EDIT: I don't know anything about stages, man. I say I believe this could be EQ but I still have no idea about anything (read: anything at all, not just stages). To be honest, I don't know for sure that I even ever got a glimpse of "mind and body". Ok, maybe I feel pretty damn certain about that. But it's still not clear what a stage is to me. Is it something we get a flash of every now and then? Am I in a certain stage when I'm taking a dump or scrolling through instagram? How come I go back to what I think is EQ in almost every sit during a several weeks-long period when I never notice "disgust" for example. How can I go through without ever noticing it? How come its been a long time since I noticed what I think could be "dissolution"? Aren't I supposed to start with going through that every day? Ugh!
In conclusion to this rant, I think best not to think about it at all. Perhaps clarity will come after 23854970 more sits.
I did about 1.5 hours last evening and just finished a 1 hour sit this morning.
This morning I rediscovered the "do nothing" practice in a new light. I was so aware of sensations arising and passing that I completely dropped the noting, just keeping a light effort on being attentive to the broad range of sensations across the sense doors.
In this dropping I was allowed to also observe the mind distribiuting its attention to random sensations. I also observed identification processes arise here and there, for example when a little bit of "trying" to do something, like doing nothing, showed up.
Fuck your oops, Tim