A+P After equanimity... or Stream Entry?

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Teague Anderson, modified 10 Years ago.

A+P After equanimity... or Stream Entry?

Posts: 104 Join Date: 8/1/11 Recent Posts
Alright,
I'm still ripe from this experience, but I seem to be able to type, so here it goes, a short background first:

I've been meditating for about 2 years in the Goenka tradition, 1 year fairly seriously, and 1 month very seriously. I have a 10-day retreat starting tomorrow so I've upped my daily practice in preparation. I've been going as gung ho as possible with my sights set on Stream Entry for this retreat... that is, unless it already just happened. Allow me to explain:

I sat down for a normal, mid-day, 50 minute sit. Started out pretty usual, struggled with concentration, found it, struggled with scanning and noting (my riff off the Goenka method), got that, and then I had a textbook A+P event with rushes of energy and even a bright light in my vision (not common for me, and actually kind of took me aback.) I noted the whole way and went through a very mild dark night to the point where I had to convince myself that a knot in my stomach was it. But then I moved clearly into equanimity. There's no mistaking being equanimous after the previous stages (or is there?) and that's what I was. I started investigating things like tranquility and peace, and said that words Anicca, or no-self in my head to see what they'd do. Then I started thinking about my center-point of awareness falling away (heard that cue somewhere) and that's when something happened. I felt a rush, or almost even a suction feeling come up my body, my heart started beating out of my chest, and my eyelids started flickering so much that they were even opening a little bit, all the while I was trying to note these feelings the best I could.

If this had occurred earlier in my meditation, I would have thought, "wow, that was a crazy A+P," but it didn't. It occurred after a previous A+P and after a perceived equanimity. I didn't feel any discontinuity, or can remember the three doors, so I'm erring on the side of not thinking it was Stream Entry.

But what if it was???

I'll report on how I feel after I've had some time to digest this. I do have to say that looking at a computer screen feels pretty weird right now.

Questions, comments, insights,
Metta,
Teague
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tom moylan, modified 10 Years ago.

RE: A+P After equanimity... or Stream Entry?

Posts: 896 Join Date: 3/7/11 Recent Posts
..if it was ..congratulations! if not have a great retreat! one thing daniel mentions in the MCTB is that, "if you were there, it wasn't a cessation"...i experienced similar events recently and it is precisely this lack of a discontinuity which made (makes) me think that it was just a further A&P, which is possible. keep your eyes peeled for further DN symptoms, check out your abilities to note precisely in the next bit of time, is it wide and peripheral or can you still really bore into the nature of things...in any case have a great retreat and get SE if youdon't already have it. retreat time is precious wherever you are!
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Teague Anderson, modified 10 Years ago.

RE: A+P After equanimity... or Stream Entry?

Posts: 104 Join Date: 8/1/11 Recent Posts
Tom,
I definitely felt different afterward, like continuous equanimity, but I still have my doubts. I haven't cycled (big indicator) and when I try to recall specifically any new insights gained from the experience, nothing really stands out. I would say, however, that the three characteristics seem more naturally true, but that's more of a subtle thing. What's weird if that was just continuation of A+P is that it didn't lead to any dark night. Well, whatever it was, I'm going to work my butt off at the retreat and figure this thing out.
Thanks,
Teague
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Teague Anderson, modified 10 Years ago.

RE: A+P After equanimity... or Stream Entry?

Posts: 104 Join Date: 8/1/11 Recent Posts
I just reread this section fro MCTB:

"Separating the early stages of Equanimity from its mature stage there tends to be a "near miss" moment when we get very close to the fruit of the path, which serves to really chill one out, as it were. From this point enlightenment is likely to be attained quickly as long as the meditator continues to simply practice and gently fine tune their awareness."

That description lines up more than with a an A&P event, because I felt no dhukka afterward. Daniel mentions a "cool apathy" arising, which could be what I mistook for some new equanimity, i.e. stream entry.

Has anyone else had a "near miss" experience?

Either way, I'll have plenty of time to sort it out. Time to go pack my bags and and get my retreat on

Meta and Mudita,
Teague
Joshua L., modified 9 Years ago.

RE: A+P After equanimity... or Stream Entry?

Posts: 49 Join Date: 2/11/11 Recent Posts
I'm really new to dedicated vipassana with stream entry in mind, in addition to that I've only a couple times hard Dark Night-ish feelings, and then a plethora of subtle ones that were probably projections. Seriously though, I'm pretty sure I'm hitting equanimity most of the time, the stories may be different day after day but one thing is reoccuring: intense eye twitching and pulsating temples, clenched body, intense and rapid heart beats and it's all so distracting. On occasion my mindfulness is incredible when there's no mind wandering before meditating and I'm very intent on reaching fruition--maybe once or twice a week. During these occasions there's so much mindfulness and concentration that hitting some new shift happens less than every thirty seconds, its like gears shifting in a car practically, and it's always four. Four jhanas and it's this strange eye twitching in equanimity, or four nyanas and it's just lousy A&P.

Well, you're not alone, but I'm no help.
Stian Gudmundsen Høiland, modified 9 Years ago.

RE: A+P After equanimity... or Stream Entry?

Posts: 296 Join Date: 9/5/10 Recent Posts
Daniel Ingram:

Separating the early stages of Equanimity from its mature stage there tends to be a "near miss" moment...

I was just gonna quote that same line.

Teague Anderson:

Has anyone else had a "near miss" experience?

If I remember correctly, this one sound just like what you had, except you were more equanimous towards it.

There's also this one, but the fear that came afterwards doesn't match up with your experience. The build up though was pretty much exactly like the first one I mentioned, and in retrospect they almost certainly both happened in Equanimity (which makes the fear thing very strange).


Yippee, Teague! According to people in the know, you are close!

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