Concentration and other parts of life

Jinxed P, modified 12 Years ago at 9/20/11 9:16 PM
Created 12 Years ago at 9/20/11 9:16 PM

Concentration and other parts of life

Posts: 347 Join Date: 8/29/11 Recent Posts
Have you noticed that in developing your concentration ability on the cushion it has transferred over to other parts of life?

Can you read a boring textbook without getting distracted? Are you more 'in the now' just walking through life? Do you zone out less during speeches or conversations? Are you more calm?

How long were you meditating before you started noticing these effects?
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Simon T, modified 12 Years ago at 9/21/11 4:42 AM
Created 12 Years ago at 9/21/11 4:42 AM

RE: Concentration and other parts of life

Posts: 383 Join Date: 9/13/11 Recent Posts
All I have to offer is some reflection on the matter. Let's look at the variable in the equation:

-Your capacity to concentrate
-Your interest in the object in the moment
-The complexity of the object
-Your degree of motivation (end goal)
-External distractions
-Internal distractions

Concentration meditation is usually about focussing on one simple object. It's a different form of concentration than what is required to solve complex math problems, for example. I know a friend that has a very menial job and he apply the techniques he learned while meditating to get through his day. How much can be applied to complex tasks? I don't know. Insight meditation can help to deal with both internal and external distractions by being less reactive and developing equanimity. Reducing the internal chatters, attaining fourth path... cannot hurt. Also, increasing the general sense of happiness could help getting more interest in the object.
Matt L, modified 12 Years ago at 9/21/11 6:41 AM
Created 12 Years ago at 9/21/11 6:41 AM

RE: Concentration and other parts of life

Posts: 41 Join Date: 11/4/10 Recent Posts
Pre-path i didn't notice much in terms of concentration ability increasing. Having said this, my practice was not very formal (some meditation, some self-inquiry, AF deconstructing beliefs, 'quest for the end' type thing). I was able to do things like zone-out of situations including pain in endurance sports (dwell as witness), but not zone-in, definitely increased calm though.

Post-path is a different animal with vastly less clog in the pipeline, concentration is loads better in any task requiring it including reading textbooks, listening to speeches and conversations. If i am tired, hungover or otherwise concentration is still garbage.

I hope that was helpful in some way, perhaps people with a more formal background can provide better input?
Jinxed P, modified 12 Years ago at 9/21/11 2:46 PM
Created 12 Years ago at 9/21/11 2:46 PM

RE: Concentration and other parts of life

Posts: 347 Join Date: 8/29/11 Recent Posts
What do you mean pre and post path?
Matt L, modified 12 Years ago at 9/21/11 4:29 PM
Created 12 Years ago at 9/21/11 4:29 PM

RE: Concentration and other parts of life

Posts: 41 Join Date: 11/4/10 Recent Posts
I mean pre-stream entry and post-stream entry, commonly referred to as first path around here. It is a milestone that is the fruit of one's practice http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sotāpanna
Jinxed P, modified 12 Years ago at 9/21/11 11:28 PM
Created 12 Years ago at 9/21/11 11:28 PM

RE: Concentration and other parts of life

Posts: 347 Join Date: 8/29/11 Recent Posts
Interesting.

I would have expected something of a linear relationship between meditation and concentration, but it sounds like not much changed in your concentration, until you hit stream entry and then it drastically changed...??


Did you follow the normal protocol of reaching access concentration..and then insight to reach stream entry? And you didn't notice a huge difference in your ability to concentrate on things from before you ever started meditating to the time you reached access concentration?

If so, how long/many hours did it take you to reach access concentration? And then same question for stream entry?

I'm surprised that your concentration didn't improve just by reaching access concentration..that this generalize over to the rest of your life..
Matt L, modified 12 Years ago at 9/22/11 2:18 AM
Created 12 Years ago at 9/22/11 2:18 AM

RE: Concentration and other parts of life

Posts: 41 Join Date: 11/4/10 Recent Posts
I think thats why this question would be best answered by someone who went through a well defined set of meditation practices to reach stream entry including following of the access concentration then insight type path. My path was a mish-mash of things/ 'kick all the doors in'/drill 100 wells type approach. It would be a long off topic ramble to write out here. Further, i never really knew what the hell i was meditating for anyways.

Yes, big change in concentration after stream entry both on and off cushion.

On cushion: hadn't meditated with any frequency for maybe a year before stream entry because it was uncomfortable (with hindsight i was just hitting dark knight and thought something had gone wrong). Post SE concentration is much more laser like (and lots of fun now to boot) and i go through the insight stages and jhanas through to fruitions, although i am still sketchy on which jhana or dark night insight stage is which most of the time. I'm not a technical meditator due to my lack of formal background, but am working on things because its fun, a supportive internet community and there is still work to do (ie. still becoming).

Off-cushion: 2 months after SE i returned to engineering studies after number of years break. Did not know what SE was, only that something significant had occurred that shook identity in a deep way and had a number of odd side effects. Went from middle/fair/average student to top of year student, attributing this to both maturing with age and significantly less of 'my' stories/proliferations/schemes getting in the way. i understand now that the reduced mental proliferation is due to SE.

I am still unsure what access concentration is referring to as people seem to describe it in different ways. If you use the definition found in Daniel Ingram's excellent book Mastering the Core Teachings of the Buddha (http://www.interactivebuddha.com/Mastering%20Adobe%20Version.pdf) i am unsure about when i first managed to do this. i would take a punt and say a couple of months of trying to meditate 'every now and then' without a formal plan. i would say SE occurred around 4.5 years after becoming interested in this type of stuff. i stress that because i am a westerner from a country town with conservative anglican parents, asking questions like 'who am i apart from all these labels and names?' and 'what is this energy/well of bliss that can be willed from the base of my spine?' would have gotten me some strange looks, let alone following an eastern tradition.

Recalling a little more now i remembered when i first started meditating after reading about counting breaths in a meditation book. I think i lasted about 10 minutes before becoming fed up with it as this seemed like a long time to be sitting still doing nothing. This improved with time (so there must have been improvement), there was one point maybe a couple of years before SE when i managed to do 40 mins a day for a few months...probably hit DN constantly after that and stopped.

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