Kasina practice confusion

Michal, modified 1 Year ago at 9/29/22 3:09 PM
Created 1 Year ago at 9/29/22 2:54 PM

Kasina practice confusion

Posts: 33 Join Date: 6/9/20 Recent Posts
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1uDIcymFM16MEnMEt5UkFddARFvip2epE/view

What I do:
I have been on a solo retreat (5 - 10 hours a day) for a few days.

This is my second day of kasina practice.

So, I use the attached image as my kasina, stare at it for 1m - 3m, close my eyes and then concentrate on the after image. The after-image disapears after roughly the same time as I have been watching the kasina (1 - 3m). Then I recharge (look at the kasina again) for 5 - 30 seconds, close my eyes, the after-image now appears for anywhere from 20 seconds to a few minutes. 


My problem:
I have done that for about 12 hours spread over two days (5 - 10 hours a day) and I still havent gotten anywhere. Minimal concentration gains. Just frustration with how fast the after image dissapears. I could have probably gotten more concentrated with some simple body scanning for a few hours. The main benefit has been just some nice equanamity practice with how frustrating this has been so far.

I have read that you should do this a few hundred to a few thousand times before the learning sign appears - surely I must have done it hundreds of times already. Am I doing something wrong or should I just do more? I will probably do a lot more before someone replies but I would like to hear the opinion of someone more experienced than me.

​​​​​​​Thanks in advance.
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Bud E, modified 1 Year ago at 10/1/22 12:01 PM
Created 1 Year ago at 10/1/22 12:01 PM

RE: Kasina practice confusion

Posts: 22 Join Date: 4/29/22 Recent Posts
Any particular reason you're using that image as a kasina? Generally you'll be better off using a solid color, or a candle flame, etc. As well, images on screens are like a weird fusion of light and color kasina in addition to whatever the image is. I'd highly recommend reading the Visuddhimagga, and/or the Vimuttimagga and following the instructions for creating a physical kasina and using it optimally. The colors seem to be easiest to get into, blue is a nice calming one.

Both books can be found online in free PDF form, skip to the sections on kasinas if you don't want to read seemingly endless descriptions of the types of concentration etc. Hope this helps in some way.  emoticon
Michal, modified 1 Year ago at 10/1/22 5:12 PM
Created 1 Year ago at 10/1/22 2:46 PM

RE: Kasina practice confusion

Posts: 33 Join Date: 6/9/20 Recent Posts
Bud E
Any particular reason you're using that image as a kasina? Generally you'll be better off using a solid color, or a candle flame, etc. As well, images on screens are like a weird fusion of light and color kasina in addition to whatever the image is. I'd highly recommend reading the Visuddhimagga, and/or the Vimuttimagga and following the instructions for creating a physical kasina and using it optimally. The colors seem to be easiest to get into, blue is a nice calming one.

Both books can be found online in free PDF form, skip to the sections on kasinas if you don't want to read seemingly endless descriptions of the types of concentration etc. Hope this helps in some way.  emoticon


Thanks for the feedback. 

Well this specific image helps create a stronger after image than simple blue circle on a black background. Another reason is that seemingly staring at my phone is more acceptable in a Christian household than explicitly staring at a candle or a physical circle.

I have edited an e-form of water kasina & fused it with the first image (I will attach it). Ill see how that goes. My concentration is definitely stronger now & I have had a few interesting experiences but still not nearly enough. But then again, my perception might be a bit skewed by practicing concentration for 2 - 4 hours everyday for like two years.

I will definitely read the maggas instructions on kasina practice. Thanks for the reccomendation.

My new kasina-object. I can feel the "pull of the water" immedietaly when I look at it, so that tells me it should work. But Ill have to see how that goes.
https://www.dharmaoverground.org/documents/10128/0/Screenshot_20221001-134418.png/fd0bdeeb-9d50-eb21-772c-0b5ac054692d?t=1664653546942
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Bud E, modified 1 Year ago at 10/1/22 10:26 PM
Created 1 Year ago at 10/1/22 5:47 PM

RE: Kasina practice confusion

Posts: 22 Join Date: 4/29/22 Recent Posts
Michal

Well this specific image helps create a stronger after image than simple blue circle on a black background.

I have had a few interesting experiences but still not nearly enough.

When using blue kasina, I use a blue disc with a thin black edge stuck to a white wall, which produces a clear yellowish afterimage. Eventually a white version of the disc overlays the yellow one, and then eventually the entire visual field inverts and begins to flip back and forth until the normal and inverted versions merge. Once they merge the entire visual field can be played with in the same way you do initially with the yellow afterimage, the murk and afterimage basically become one panoramic thing. Both the color blue and its opposite yellow become very bright and glowing in the entire visual field. This is also where the visionary and siddhi type stuff tends to occur.

I wouldn't worry too much about interesting experiences, they'll come naturally as it progresses. Just attend to the kasina and refresh as necessary, and if you get distracted go back to the kasina. If you get bored with doing it eyes closed, it can develop quickly with eyes open as well. At first your eyes will seem to feel stressed and dry, then you'll learn to relax your eyes instead of staring, and you'll need to blink less often. Have fun with it, the more playfully and curiously you approach it, the better.
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Bud E, modified 1 Year ago at 10/1/22 10:30 PM
Created 1 Year ago at 10/1/22 6:36 PM

RE: Kasina practice confusion

Posts: 22 Join Date: 4/29/22 Recent Posts
Since your aim is to increase concentration, here's an exercise that helps build it, and also show visually how strong it's getting. It's also kind of fun. However, it's an eyes open exercise using a more traditional color kasina, I wouldn't use the phone image for this one. The complexity of the image would likely make it more difficult than it needs to be.

1) Look at kasina attached to wall with eyes open until afterimage forms
2) Look one kasina width to the right of the kasina, afterimage is now beside the kasina object where you're looking
3) Look at afterimage until it begins to fade slightly, then look back at kasina object (ignore the afterimage which now jumps to the left of the kasina)
4) Hold until a new afterimage forms, and then look one kasina width to the right of where you "placed" the first one
5) There is now a kasina object with two afterimages to the right of it, the one furthest right being stronger than the one beside it

See how many afterimages you can line up beside the kasina object, and how vividly you can maintain each one while still seeing all of them. It's a bit like spinning plates.   emoticon

As to your home situation and the ability to use physical kasinas, not sure what to say. I can sympathize, my neighbors probably think i'm odd because I sit in a chair and stare at colored discs on my walls every day. Family is different though, perhaps you can find somewhere in nature, or some neutral location where it would be possible to use a more traditional kasina?

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