I've been living with rather low self-esteem in context of spirituality or my-relation-to-the-core-of-my-being for a couple of years now, at least.

(I, self, being? Did someone say "selfing" and "anatta"? Well, to shed the illusion of self, some healthy real self is needed, and to shed light on the reality of self, there needs to be some stable place where you can light the fire. Shaky light won't help too much. First things first.)

But it is interesting, when I ponder the uncertainty, I just find a need to be recognized and a lack of memory and trust to what I've personally experienced and lived through. It has to do with unlucky discussions with people I considered authorities on the subject, who in the end could not understand my point of view, and it has to do with lack of connection with a social context that could support my search. I used to have a few of these supports back in the day, but had to quit them for various psychological, social etc reasons. Leaving social scenes comes with a price sometimes.

DhO has been one substitute. But this forum cannot help in every possible needed way, since my background and experiences don't fit quite well into the vocabulary and models used in buddhism and pragmatic dharma. Though, some of these models do and example of others does help clearly.

The solution is just to settle down, remember and trust in the guidance of and for being that is revealed by each moment, sensation and experience. Why it has been so difficult? I'm actually a bit baffled by this question right now. I used to be very confident. Maybe half of it was unfounded, as it transpired when I was evaluated as someone who had got even the basics wrong.

DhO and the progress of insight stuff with the maps, attainments and such has been an interesting trap and a mirror for some of my experiences. A trap in the sense that I cannot really find myself in the maps, and if I try, it creates the well-known neurotic zig-zag of thinking. There's so much of me that seems like pre-stream entry dark night yogi stuff - and then a lot of my daily experiencing is similar to what people with "paths" describe. So what to make of it. I cannot know if I've "had" "cessations" or "fruitions". Possibly - or maybe not. Should I remember and recognize them if they happened? Who knows. I really don't trust my evaluation and won't be able to describe the possible moments in such a way that someone else could diagnose them trustworthily. It would be "too vague" to begin with, and people seem to have all kinds of views on what is or isn't it, etc.

There is easy access to at least light jhanas most of the time when I practice, though I doubt it really matters much, and have never put much effort in learning or categorizing the experiences. For some it would be a sign of stream entry. But I don't know, why would it be so. There have happened a bunch of things that changed the self-view (partial insights in the nature of being human) and the boundary of me and the other, inner and outer has collapsed in many ways. But in the end what I experienced as a teenager and most likely as a small baby, was already this (nondual being together). Is that a sign of an attainment, and if so, which attainment? And what then? Some sort of nonlocal experiencing has been happening for a long time, though there are always the questions of differences between imagination, psychotic delusion and real inner events. Some undoubtly impossible and real moments take away the otherwise tempting idea that every nonconventional experience would be imagination or delusion. So there are some possible siddhis? Is that an attainment? Who cares? It's quite not so important in the end, is it. I've given up much of ritualistic behaviour, and at the base of my psyche do trust the unfolding of experiences to lead towards reality and truth - though I can be neurotic and doubtful, too, if shaken enough. I don't know if suffering has diminished or grown in my psyche - the life eperiences have been stressful and challenging during recent years, and there is a baggage of old trauma that I've gone through and still have to work with to a degree. Some new reactivity has probably grown out of difficult situations, and some new resilience. So is there just more recognition of pain and so the suffering seems to have grown even if it actually just is experienced more clearly? Who knows. I've never been afraid of death, but death feels kind of familiar, as if it already happened. But it didn't. I've had suicidal thinking (never done anything suicidal) on and off since childhood, but I'd say it is just a reaction to emotional energy getting too low, a kind of emotional exhaustion valve. The boundary between "spiritual dark night" and "clinical depression" from my perspective is pretty unclear.

It seems that most of the terrain in the maps is contested and can be seen like this and like that and everything in between. So I don't know where I'm on the progress of insight map/trap. But does it matter really? Probably not. I feel that sharing such details of my situation feels awkward and unnecessary. That also does not much matter.

What does matter? A good question!

I'll repeat myself: "The solution is just to settle down, remember and trust in the guidance of and for being that is revealed by each moment, sensation and experience." That's a starting point at least. Living the question, perhaps.

Now, writing all this, I ask if this belongs on the forum or not. I really don't know. Though I was asked to offer some drinks, and here's some. I think I'll share this here for the benefit of a possible reader who is in a similar place. A place where they don't quite well enough remember the aliveness of themselves and don't quite find a helping hand or clear context outside themselves to guide their search. A shaky place. Just maybe settling in it and listening to what grows out of uncertainty will be the needed thing, the something that is searched for.

It's ok to not to fulfil the expectations of the ten thousand dharmas, disciplines, religions, sects and philosophies.

Some self-esteem should be granted for us all just by the fact of being alive. With or without labels for the way we are. It is a unnerving and unnecessary burden not to trust being as such, how painful it might be, how complex and wrecking - or simple and wonderful - the content of being might be. It is a precious gift to be alive, baffled and constantly on the brink of forgetting the most important.

However different you think your experience may be I reckon a lot of us can relate. This is suffering. 

I've had a lot of self worth issues in my time, that's a lot of my core wound and losing a friend group that meant a lot to me did not help. 

When we enter into the post conventional stages of development it is critical to align yourself with a friend or a Sangha or a community that can support you. This doesn't need to be a perfect relationship, it certainly won't be but it may end up being somewhat deeper than what you've experienced before. 

Do you have a regular meditation practice? Or any sort of practice? 
A lot of what you describe mirrors the difficulty I was experiencing in my life.

​​​​​​​Around the time I first found pragmatic dharma but many years into my spiritual search. More and more POI stuff was happening to me as I did more and more meditation and I didn't really understand any of it. It was a tough time as my life was crumbling around me. I ended up giving up meditation for a year and more and more of my plans kept going nowhere and my life seemed to just keep crumbling. Then one day I said "fuck it" and I really sat and did some serious meditation and two weeks later I was a stream enterer. That changed things. Significantly. The path became clear.

Awakening brings with it a deep regulation of the vagus nerve. The vagus nerve is how self esteem or lack thereof works. A lot of this anxious, neurotic, lack of self esteem is a result of a dysregulated vagus nerve. Poor vagal tone is a consequence of compulsive and obsessive self referential activity. The practice is relax and the fruit at the end of the branch is relaxing. 

Thanks for your mirroring and questions!

I might have a regular practice now. For a long time I didn't, as it was useful to get rid of a habitual practice (which was not vipassana but similar to it, body scanning and noticing, being with breath, and so on) that I had during the years 2006-2016. After that there were many phases of non-practice, some practice and no practice at all. Also psychotherapy. Some of the past practicing is diffused into daily life.

I still do have some friends to share the inner stuff with, luckily, although the communities and commitments I had are gone (which is fine). I guess I had my share of the "deeper relationships" you mention. Maybe support is necessary. Which kind of and at what points, am not sure. And it is quite true, as you mention, that most personal experiences are common and shared by many.

As I had extensive experience with rigorous practice, I don't find it too believable that my perhaps newly found spark with practicing would produce a dramatic change in how I am or perceive things. Though I've grown a bit curious. There's no other aim than letting what is emerge. And to clear some clutter of mind, which may ease some things in life. Everything changes, of course, and I'm open to it.

Kettu, may I ask a few questions from 30,000 feet above the details? Why were you originally drawn to spiritual practice? Is the motivation to continue now different from the original? What do think the future results of your practice should be?

Sure, thank you for the questions.

I was raised into a form of protestant Christianity, so spirituality has been part of my life from early on. In kindergarten I realized that not many people shared the view I had learned – Jesus was not their saviour, but something perhaps laughable or just uninteresting. That broke something and resulted in a great need to understand what the world and life actually and really are.

In my early twenties I remember seeing this need in a new way, and somewhat more consciously wanting to understand life. Around that time I begun to approach more seeriously less religious spirituality (Gurdjieff work and forms of bodywork especially – a more superficial interest in buddhism and many other things has been there too).

I wrote to Bahiya Baby about my aim now:”letting what is emerge”. It is not much different than the original aim of wanting to understand life. But there must be a difference in the motivation. Maybe the suffering feels more acute than it used to, or I’m more conscious of it. Perhaps not. Need for clarity comes to mind as an aim. I’m not sure if I truly believe in ”the end of suffering”, though I’m happy that some people can claim they experience such. I kind of trust that what ever is, and the way things are, is for purpose.

I seem to be vary of thinking about end results to study of life or practice. How would I know it beforehand? One motivation would be the fear of wasting the possibilities life has given. I don't know how deep and real that fear truly is. It still might work towards right direction, at least somewhat.

All of this calls up a sort of grief. But there is an innate knowledge or sensation of something real, patient and easily forgotten – maybe I would wish that to grow more familiar, give it the space that belongs to it. I did not know that I had this knowledge back in 2005. But the knowledge is older than that, for sure. (Oh, life calls. Feel free to comment or ask more.)

​​​​​​​I was totally confused about what I was seeking, other than to understand the nature of my angst and worry. I had a lot of doubt, too - why is this meditation thing taking so long, and are any eventual benefits, whatever they are, worth all this time and effort? As I went along, my doubts were reduced (not eliminated) by various insights that happened just often enough. Further, as I continued, my expectations changed many times. The one constant motivation that was with me from early in the pursuit and that remains today is my curiosity about what being human means. That curiosity seems to be of tremendous value no matter what we expect, or want, when we start or how it progresses. I think it's right to be wary of the end, if for no other reason than there seems to be no end.

Also, if anyone says to me that they've rid themselves of suffering entirely, I know I'm talking to someone who is fooling themselves or lying.

I really like your honesty about this.

I think being a human involves that need to be recognised, to be a part of the tribe, have a place in that tribe, show off one's colourful feathers etc ...&nbsp;<br /><br />Very natural in my book.&nbsp;<br />Awakened or not.&nbsp;<br /><br /> 

"The one constant motivation that was with me from early in the pursuit and that remains today is my curiosity about what being human means."

Yes, I agree that this question of what we are is very attractive and rich. Peeling off the assumptions, opening for the unfiltered.

Yeah, a human being without meaningful and felt connection to others is kind of lopsided human being.

Thank you everyone for your encouragement, questions and words! The experience of being seen helps also to see oneself. Trying to express something like motivation makes it more clear, more felt, stronger perhaps. It makes one remember those impulses that are hearfelt and beat in the bones. In many ways a human being is not connected to themselves if connection to others is lacking. Best wishes to all!

We the meditator folks can forget to get out some more and mingle with the rest  

I mostly just meet the "rest", though in my view splitting people into meditators and others sounds like an unreal and uninteresting dichotomy.
There are a few friends that I occasionally meet, who are more seasoned practitioners than me of different traditions, but the meetings could be more frequent. So, that's how I grew identified with DhO, it seems. I [edit: meant "it", but sure, all this might have been an I, too] has helped to clarify my position and travel plan.
But yes, meditators should meet regular people. Some might find their awareness, presence or views helpful and calling.

I have always had this too. Recently my interest has shifted more and more towards a disinterest in the meta of it all, the big picture, to the more subjective, internal inquiries. It's hard to imagine having gotten here without the drive of curiosity though. 

Sounds good. Interest into oneself or the being that is perceived leads to moments where how the being views itself changes and where the change of being is viewed. Maybe!