A Question On Noting

Scott LaRocca LaRocca, modified 11 Years ago at 12/17/12 7:47 PM
Created 11 Years ago at 12/17/12 7:47 PM

A Question On Noting

Posts: 2 Join Date: 12/17/12 Recent Posts
I know this may not be the right place to post this, but I could not find a better place for it.

Hello everybody. This is my first post here. I recently have gotten into Ingram's book MCTB, and that has led me this website. Ive been meditating for a while, but never got into any insight practices before. So I tried Ingrams noting technique.But my mind just doesnt seem to be fast enough to note everything. Without doing the actual noting, I can "see" everything thats going on, and have gained a little insight into the 3 C's in it all. I even can feel the sensations, etc. more vividly and clearly when not trying to think up names for them. I guess my question is, should I keep striving to get quicker at perceiving/naming things? Im sure that will help me out with how quickly and sharply I perceive things. But for now its kind of awkward and not as efficient. Has anybody else struggled with this before? Any tips?
Jason , modified 11 Years ago at 12/18/12 9:20 AM
Created 11 Years ago at 12/18/12 9:20 AM

RE: A Question On Noting

Posts: 342 Join Date: 8/9/11 Recent Posts
It's common for it to feel klunky in the beginning. It's worth acquiring the skill of noting even if it doesn't become your primary practice. There will be stages where concentration is really difficult, and noting can blast you through them.

But my mind just doesnt seem to be fast enough to note everything.


If you've been meditating awhile it may well be that your awareness is better than your noting, or this may be the effect of being overwhelmed by becoming aware of everything that's going on. Either way, don't worry about having to note everything or finding the right word. Just note steadily. Fast noting is one approach, but slowing things down a little can be beneficial too.
Scott LaRocca LaRocca, modified 11 Years ago at 12/18/12 3:02 PM
Created 11 Years ago at 12/18/12 2:57 PM

RE: A Question On Noting

Posts: 2 Join Date: 12/17/12 Recent Posts
Thanks alot. I guess any new skill is awkward at first right? I think that I was trying to rush it too much the first few times. I actually found that last night, after a nice long concentration meditation, I was able to do it alot better. Still dont have the mental agility to note everything, but when kept at a slow, steady pace I was.pretty consistent. Ill definetely keep it up, im sure this practice will come in handyemoticon
Andre d, modified 11 Years ago at 12/19/12 2:53 AM
Created 11 Years ago at 12/19/12 2:53 AM

RE: A Question On Noting

Posts: 9 Join Date: 2/22/12 Recent Posts
hey!

don't stress yourself too much with finding right names for labels or try to note everything very quickly.
just observe the objects you're aware of very clearly!
in my opinion it is more efficient to note one object clearly and see it arising and passing away instead of trying to note as much as possible. (but that depends on the person).
however, it should be a relaxed noting and labelling and not a struggle too label as much as possible.

I also asked the question about the speed of noting my teacher on my last reatreat and he answered, you can compare it with watching a passing train and trying to count the carriages. even though you are unable to count every single one, cause the train is too quick and you count only the 1, 3, 5, 8, etc., but you still see them all and that's important

And If you decide to do "mental noting" then I recommend keep labelling while noting!
It makes it easier to the see clearly things disappear and see them more objective.

for getting a better understanding read this

Vipassana Excercices by Mahasi Sayadaw


And it takes a while to become comfortable with the technique!
just keep going! that's the main thing!

cheers!

Andre
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Alan Smithee, modified 11 Years ago at 12/22/12 3:04 PM
Created 11 Years ago at 12/22/12 2:55 PM

RE: A Question On Noting

Posts: 310 Join Date: 4/2/10 Recent Posts
Scott LaRocca LaRocca:
I know this may not be the right place to post this, but I could not find a better place for it.

Hello everybody. This is my first post here. I recently have gotten into Ingram's book MCTB, and that has led me this website. Ive been meditating for a while, but never got into any insight practices before. So I tried Ingrams noting technique.But my mind just doesnt seem to be fast enough to note everything. Without doing the actual noting, I can "see" everything thats going on, and have gained a little insight into the 3 C's in it all. I even can feel the sensations, etc. more vividly and clearly when not trying to think up names for them. I guess my question is, should I keep striving to get quicker at perceiving/naming things? Im sure that will help me out with how quickly and sharply I perceive things. But for now its kind of awkward and not as efficient. Has anybody else struggled with this before? Any tips?


Hey Scott! I'm relatively new to noting as well, but I've learned a few things as late via my practice and research.

In the early nanas, for instance, Mind and Body, Cause and Effect, and Three Characteristics, it isn't super important to note at an extremely high rate, for instance, 5 notes per second, etc. Some folks do this, but others note at a more relaxed rate. This is because what you are trying to do when you note is, in essence, maintain present moment awareness of anything with passes through the sense doors, while building concentration, and not getting lost in fantasy/memory/image/etc, and not identifying with the sensations which you observe. Noting is a tool. It is like training wheels. The point of a bike isn't the training wheels themselves, but the actual act of riding along, which the training wheels helps facilitate.

For this purpose, noting one sensation per second is a fine goal. Even noting one sensation every couple of seconds is fine.

Here's the thing: while you are noting one sensation per second or every couple of seconds, you may also be "noticing" other sensations as well, taking place at a faster rate than you can possibly "note them," which is good. You don't have to note every sensation which occurs, necessarily. You want to notice them, while also maintaining the process of applying notes to a handful of them as they arise and pass.

As I understand it, the function of noting is to: 1) help keep you present moment focused, 2) help you not get lost in images/fantasy/memory/rumination/etc., 3) help keep you from identifying with the sensations which are occuring, or, disembed as it is sometimes called, and 4) help develop concentration.

That is why some folks suggest verbal noting. Obviously you can probably only verbally note one sensations every couple of seconds or so, but as long as it does the fore mentioned 1-4 it is performing its purpose. From what I've heard, some folks have verbally noted their way to Equanimity.

Once you get to A+P, your concentration is faster and stronger, and you will probably be able to note faster at that time, which likewise helps build up the concentration even more, which itself helps you notice more sensations, etc and so forth, but you will never, ever, get to the point where you can actually note every sensation which arises and passes. Can't be done. You will be able to notice a lot of them, but not note them individually.

That is why some folks recommend that when you get to the higher nanas you stop noting all together for a more choiceless awareness kind of thing. But a teacher I respect suggested to me that even in these situations, where you are bombarded by sensations, such as High Equanimity, you should continue to note every 5-7 seconds.

Concentration, and building it up, is one of the secrets to ultimately being able to sense more and more sensations. Maintaining present moment awareness helps build up the concentration, and the act of applying notes helps build up the concentration, and noticing stuff [maybe which you cannot all note] also helps build up the concentration.

Hope this helps.

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