Hi, I am new to this forum and new to meditation in general, but for various reasons I am suddenly very motivated. Just picked up MCTB and am slowly working through it, just getting into the insight stages now. I am sure most of my contributions will be questions until I get my feet under me.

I was practicing concentration on the breath a few nights ago. For a second or two I entered into a state of extreme mental clarity and then later into a state of where I was completely present, I was no longer the watcher but instead I became the breath. It was great. But then something bad happened. I started thinking, "I wonder what, if any, Jhana I am in". I started trying to analyze the experience and immediately lost all concentration.

So here is my first question related to MCTB. How is it possible to follow a map-based approach without letting the analytic mind go wild trying to decipher what stage you are in at any given moment? Should I just ride the experience and resist any attempt to analyze it until afterwards?

Also, related to that. How to avoid scripting? How to allow experience to flow naturally, without trying to conform it to a preset idea of what that experience should be at any given stage?

If you are practicing insight then noting thoughts is very important. Consciousness (the knowing part) knows thoughts so thoughts cannot be a permanent self. If you have analyzing thoughts you can note them and watch them naturally pass away. Trying to stop them is like trying to stop anything else and it includes a little stress. If you think "I don't want to think about that" the brain locates what you're trying to not think about and poof! you're thinking about it. Just recognize it's there and don't add anything or try to stop anything. It goes away on it's own if you let it. Noting with verbal talk is only okay at the beginning but you want to note what is already hitting consciousness so no verbalizing is needed. Try staring at an object until you recognize what it is without the verbal part and you can get what I mean about noting without mental verbal talk.

Shinzen Young has a good explanation of what I'm talking about. You want to pay attention to what's in your experience more and more and including more and more of the background of what you think is a you (thoughts/images/intentions/movements/actions). To do that properly means there's little time for analysis because there's too much to notice.

Return to the source

If you want to do concentration first then you have to stop thoughts except for thoughts of the breath. You would acknowledge thoughts arising and as quickly as you can (without further analysis) bring the mind back to the breath over and over again. The trick to understand is you don't need a huge thought process to find out how to return to the breath. Just do it.

Maps are there to guide you when you actually have an experience you can't explain, not before.

Some other good resources:

How to note and label

Gil Fronsdal - Mental Noting

Thanks Richard Zen, that was very helpful. A related question that you might have already answered:

From what I've read of MCTB so far, Daniel seems to recommend mentally verbalizing 1 word labels when noting. He also suggests noting 5-10 sensations per second. Needless to say I cannot mentally verbalize 5 things in a second even if I had them lined up...so I am guessing that he is talking about starting verbal, maybe 1 label per second, and then quickly switching into recognizing sensations faster without the mentally labeling, as you describe.

Is this about right?

It's right but he believes you shouldn't stop or alter things with verbal noting which many people do. You are noting things and leaving it alone. It's good for concentration and when you get to the A & P you should just be noticing vibrations and verbal noting would be mainly to keep from checking out into daydreams. It's about consistency of paying attention to enough detail of what now brings. I would look at his Hierarchy of Vipassana practice get more than what is in the book. He's currently making an updated one......which will never come out :joking: that may have more.

Hierarchy of Vipassana Practice

Favorite threads

In the favorite threads sticky I would recommend Ian And's book suggestions on the Five Aggregates and Depending origination to go deeper into how reactivity works. Feeling tone and perception/recognition are really important ones. Understanding how things work is just as important as practice. This is a shit load of reading but I would start 50/50 reading and practice and then eventually 99% practice and 1% reading as you need to apply what you learn and keep from being addicted to reading.