So I'm basically at the point where I have no significant personal motivation to do anything.. there are sparks of motivation that gets me off the bed but nothing really that gets me fired up. I sit at times thinking about this lack of motivation and there is an underlying sense of confusion.. and the confusion seems to be a long the lines of: Why is my true passion, my true hearts desire, the thing that's most important that I would give my life for, why is it not known to me? It should be the most obvious thing and I shouldn't have to ask.. yet if I try to let go, all that happens is that I get calm and still, nothing moves me.

So I'm confused why there is confusion and not clarity. Any help?

Hi Patrick Na,

Welcome to the DhO.


You may have a good "koan" here : )

So what specifically do you have to do? This is not a trick question. Once you sit down, a) what are some of the activities that you will have to do ~ be obligated to do ~ in time? And b) what are you doing automatically?

Thanks for the reply. It seems like a koan as no rational answer comes to mind.. well that is not completely true, one answer that did come to mind was "the answer to the question" which is an answer in itself. It just ties me into a knot contemplating it, guess it what they call a dog chasing its tail.

Does this relate to meditation, or dharma practice? I don't mean to be rude. What I mean is, I'm assuming this has something to do with the path, as you are posting it on a meditation forum. If you post a bit more about how this relates to practice, it might be easier for people, myself included, to give you advice on your situation.

Just by reading your post I have a hard time understanding what you are experiencing. How much do you meditate? Did this lack of drive begin after you started meditating, as in a resulting effect?

One thing I think of is that sometimes when focused on the meditative path, events in life, like sports or interaction with people, can seem meaningless, and bland or unfulfilling compared to trying to meditate and get to the bottom of delusion and suffering. At these times the best course of action may to try an sit it out, so to speak (ha sit = meditate, get it?!). However it also may be a different issue requiring a different antidote. Does this help, or resonate?

Anyhow, cheers!

Hi, no offense taken. When I said "sit at times thinking" I meant meditating, usually a couple of times every day (about 45 minutes per session). I've been meditating primarily by using the simple directions from Adyashanti (direct-path teacher) to "let everything be as it is". I also try to avoid any technique as much as possible, only when I find my mind getting caught up in thoughts I use focus on breathing as a way to stay grounded. I also inquiry about questions like "What is most important?" and "What do I really really want?".

I've felt stuck in this place of as you said, finding events in life to be unfulfilling. It's been like this for a long time, even before I started meditating. My primary concern has been to find happiness but for a couple of months now I've found myself prioritizing truth, honesty, integrity more - it felt very much like my spiritual search has deepened and matured.

The feeling of finding life to be unfulfilling used to be depressing but the feeling has changed to a more easy attitude, I don't feel burdened by it as I used to. Its not a depression but its does seems like something I need to "resolve" as just lying/sitting around with nothing to move me in life feels unsatisfying.

I try to sit it out. I've had deep relaxing experiences when meditating in the past, but right now the experience in my meditating is that I get to a place when I feel a lot of facial tension and slight physical discomfort (I get to that place within a few minutes in meditating), it feels like being up against a wall.. usually what happens is that I try to let go, to let the physical discomfort be, and sometimes the feeling dissipates only to return a few moments later, after this goes on for a while I feel like I'm just sitting feeling pain and after a while it gets tiresome and I "shake it off" so to speak and stop meditating. I also feel like somehow the physical tension is not something that can be relaxed (like other muscle tensions that can be let go off), its more like if you had a thorn in your finger, no amount of meditating can make it disappear - its just there causing pain.

I can't think of anything but to keep sitting and see if any resolution comes.

Just some thoughts here....may or may not resonate with you.
It sounds like you are describing stress. The tension and discomfort and pain and against the wall feelings might be all stress. When I say stress I mean Dukkha= stress. Have you totally focused on this feeling and stayed with it to the end? Have you investigated it? What sensations make up the feeling? Is there a start middle end to the moments? Is it impermanent or is it continuous? Does it change? What triggers it? What untriggers it? Is there a sense of self to it? noself? other? I'd poke the nest and stir it up and see what fears come up. Or does the very idea of this trigger and cause more stress?
Dukkha is one of the doors to fruition. Perhaps you should get to know the door very well as long as it is presenting itself so clearly to you...maybe you should open the door?

Good luck,
~D

Regarding feelings of low motivation, confusion, angst, depression, etc. I remember this fantastic exchange with Christopher Titmuss (C) and a meditator (M) on retreat with him, and I wish I could duplicate their heavy English accents in text form, as somehow it makes it more Monty Python-esque to me, but anyway, here goes my best attempt at recalling the conversation:

M: Christopher, I am so confused! My mind is a mess. I feel like I have no idea what is going on.

C: You're certain?

M: Absolutely! It is total chaos. My mind is all over the place. I just feel like I am going nowhere.

C: You are clear about this?

M: Oh, yes, definitely. These thoughts are just out of control. I can't make sense of any of it.

C: Quite sure?

M: Quite! ...

And so on like that for what felt like 5 minutes but was probably only 2. It made quite an impression on me and was an exchange that I replayed in my mind again and again and again to remind myself of its essential message. Hopefully you get what Christopher was pointing to: there was the clarity about the chaos. The clarity is what he was pointing to. It is there in and intrinsic to the depression, the lack of motivation, the existential questions, the whole thing. Notice that again and again and again.

People reject their own clarity, their own direct experience, as they don't like it. It is understandable enough, but it really doesn't work on the path of insight.

As to hard pain mingled with lack of motivation, that just screams Three Characteristics, which is known for physical tensions in the back, neck, and face (and sometimes other places), but is less well known for the fact that sometimes it will totally lay people out due to a deep, tight, hard feeling of meaninglessness, like something is just wrong and if they could just go far enough back into the couch they would somehow be ok.

Ha, that's funny. It reminds me of a shroom trip I had recently wherein I took a few too many at a point where I was already tired and drunk. Essentially, I totally lost my mind for a few hours. I had absolutely no idea what was going on. I thought lifting and putting my pillow back would help but then I did that and it just didn't help at all. I thought the sensation of my head on the pillow was actually coming from a corner of the room. etc. But, I wouldn't call it a bad trip, because I *knew* as it was happening that I was basically losing my mind, and that all I had to do was wait it out - which I did. It was almost funny in a way. Definitely not pleasant, though.

Thanks for the replies everyone. I've followed an instruction to ask what fascinates me about the physical tension, i.e. what impulse holds me there.. its a simple thing and it has been working.



Interesting conversation.