How is this state of mind called?

P K, modified 4 Years ago at 3/8/18 1:55 AM
Created 7 Years ago at 12/31/14 12:05 PM

How is this state of mind called?

Posts: 45 Join Date: 5/12/13 Recent Posts
thumbnail
Dream Walker, modified 7 Years ago at 12/31/14 12:55 PM
Created 7 Years ago at 12/31/14 12:55 PM

RE: How is this state of mind called?

Posts: 1470 Join Date: 1/18/12 Recent Posts
Paweł K:
and suddenly got strange 'crystallized' state of mind in which there is no movement
Contemplating it cuts every notion of anything mind, all conditioned things just stops, and there is this clarity and crystal-like feel to every sensation. When I am in bliss it stops all bliss. When I am in some kind of suffering from entanglement it stops all that. Nothing alive, nothing dead, just kinda frozen. It is also perfect for meditation as it doesn't need any object, any sensation, it deny there being anything real to meditate on.

When 'normal' sensations start creeping in then their most prominent quality is 'alive' by which I mean that they are moving, vibrating, entangled with mind. Every state or jhana I experienced so far was far more 'alive' and normal than this so it doesn't seem to be jhana... 

Anybody know name of this state of mind? maybe some sutta or book where it is described?

Perhaps you could explain it a bit more. Is this a temporary state? What do you do to get into it? This is not any of the pure land jhanas? How does time feel?
~D
thumbnail
Chris M, modified 7 Years ago at 1/1/15 9:34 AM
Created 7 Years ago at 1/1/15 9:30 AM

RE: How is this state of mind called?

Posts: 4538 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
Congratulations!

Sounds to me like you've come to a deep realization of the emptiness of things. This same kind of thing happened to me first durng a nice, quiet plane ride and was preceded by contemplations, much like yours. I had been listening to Christopher Titmuss podcasts in which he was talking about this kind of emptiness "experience." It's real, and it's wonderful.

BTW, if your experience was like mine has been, then and since, it is not jhana. It's something very different. When I read dsescriptions of what they call "kensho" in Zen practice it sounds very much like that. I have validated that interpretation of my experience with a number of my Zen practitioner and teacher friends.

Celebrate!
thumbnail
Psi, modified 7 Years ago at 1/1/15 10:11 AM
Created 7 Years ago at 1/1/15 10:11 AM

RE: How is this state of mind called?

Posts: 1094 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent Posts
Paweł K:
About week ago I contemplated intensively on Diamond sutta, and this quote from it
"Subhuti, if someone were to offer an immeasurable quantity of the seven treasures to fill the worlds as infinite as space as an act of generosity, the happiness resulting from that virtuous act would not equal the happiness resulting from a son or daughter of a good family who gives rise to the awakened mind and reads, recites, accepts, and puts into practice this sutra, and explains it to others, even if only a gatha of four lines. In what spirit is this explanation given? Without being caught up in signs, just according to things as they are, without agitation. Why is this?

"All composed things are like a dream,
a phantom, a drop of dew, a flash of lightning.
That is how to meditate on them,
that is how to observe them."

and suddenly got strange 'crystallized' state of mind in which there is no movement
Contemplating it cuts every notion of anything mind, all conditioned things just stops, and there is this clarity and crystal-like feel to every sensation. When I am in bliss it stops all bliss. When I am in some kind of suffering from entanglement it stops all that. Nothing alive, nothing dead, just kinda frozen. It is also perfect for meditation as it doesn't need any object, any sensation, it deny there being anything real to meditate on.

When 'normal' sensations start creeping in then their most prominent quality is 'alive' by which I mean that they are moving, vibrating, entangled with mind. Every state or jhana I experienced so far was far more 'alive' and normal than this so it doesn't seem to be jhana... 

Anybody know name of this state of mind? maybe some sutta or book where it is described?
Hey Pawel, I call, would call this Fourth Jhana,  No ego, or just a  tiny tiny ego, no thinking, no sukkha, no multiple sensations arising, just balanced , locked in, equanimity.

Of course , as all this happens in mind moments, one could, bob out and back in of the mind state, like a fisherman cork on the surface of the water when getting a nibble fromm a fish.  So, one can observe the differences of the mind state, and the thinking about the mind state.  But when one is within the mind state, one will not be able to think about the mind state.

State of Equanimity, nothing else.  Deep Samadhi.

But, as I am not in your mind , it could be something else, for instance if very deep, could be no-thingness, or neither perception nor non-perception, but I don't think so.

It could also be the mind has entered a deeper level of a deeper level...

Or, perhaps I do not know, our minds work differently, in regards to visualization anyway...

Just some thoughts.

Psi
thumbnail
Psi, modified 7 Years ago at 1/1/15 3:55 PM
Created 7 Years ago at 1/1/15 3:51 PM

RE: How is this state of mind called?

Posts: 1094 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent Posts
Had to stop meditating to communicate this thought that arose, to you Pawel.

Another possibility for the state you are describing, is what Ayya Khema has described as the Still Point, and it is from the Still Point that one may try to launch from to contact Nibbana.  This would be the launch pad for the Path Moment,  she also taught that the mind also has to be ready, just as a fruit will only fall from the tree when it is ripe.

So, from the Still point, in order to lean into Nibbana one does have to make the intentional effort towards the complete letting go, of everything, all of it... 

Again, just thoughts arising, it may or may not be of importance or relevance.

Just felt I should communicate this to you...

Psi

Also found this excerpt:

from this link

http://www.wisdomlight.org/T-end-of-the-world-english.html


Ayya Khema, who was my meditation master until her death in 1997, spoke of the search for the “stillpoint”, for the point of immobility, of calmness, of tranquillity, of silence, inside oneself, in the deepest part of the heart. This point is not only the centre of our being, but the centre of the world, of the universe that surrounds us – this illusory projection of our conceptual and dualistic mind. The still­point, like the hub of a wheel, is immobile, and the ten thousand things of samsara, of conditioned existence, turn tirelessly around it.To find this tranquil point is to escape from the infernal round of birth, suffering, death and rebirth. It is also the point of equanimity, where all that happens in the world – happiness and misfortune, pleasure and pain, hope and fear, gain and loss, success and failure – no longer disrupts our inner calm. Here, worldly phenomena are perceived for what they really are: illusions, mirages, dreams… a movie without end, full of sparkling colours, varied landscapes, passions, intrigues and romances, projected onto the screen of our conceptual mind. The stillpoint, on the other hand, is when the movie has disappeared, leaving the empty and luminous screen of our awakened mind.On the path of meditation, one meets the tranquillity of equanimity in the fourth absorption, when the subtle and decreasing agitation of the characteristics of the first three absorptions – beatitude, joy and contentment – have been completely quieted, and the mind has found again a state of stillness, like water in a deep well. 
x x, modified 7 Years ago at 1/4/15 6:52 PM
Created 7 Years ago at 1/4/15 6:52 PM

RE: How is this state of mind called?

Posts: 122 Join Date: 8/18/13 Recent Posts
Paweł K:
About week ago I contemplated intensively on Diamond sutta... and suddenly got strange 'crystallized' state of mind in which there is no movement


It's "diamond samahdi" of course! That blinding clear state of mind of no movement. Pretty cool, isn't it?
thumbnail
Chris M, modified 7 Years ago at 1/6/15 2:38 PM
Created 7 Years ago at 1/6/15 2:38 PM

RE: How is this state of mind called?

Posts: 4538 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
Yes, I know a Zen person who you could talk to at length. PM me and I'll get his e-mail address to you.