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Krishnamurti - pls asses

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Krishnamurti - pls asses
Answer
6/17/15 3:11 AM
"On the first day while I was in that state and more conscious of the things around me, I had the first most extraordinary experience. There was a man mending the road; that man was myself; the pickaxe he held wasmyself; they very stone which he was breaking up was a part of me; the tender blade of grass was my very being, and the tree beside the man was myself. I almost could feel and think like the roadmender, and I could feel the wind passing through the tree, and the little ant on the blade of grass I could feel. The birds, the dust, and the very noise were a part of me. Just then there was a car passing by at some distance; I was the driver, the engine, and the tyres; as the car went further away from me, I was going away from myself. I was in everything, or rather everything was in me, inanimate and animate, the mountain, the worm, and all breathing things. All day long I remained in this happy condition."

http://www.bodysoulandspirit.net/mystical_experiences/read/notables/krishnamurti.shtml

Where would that fit on the map ?

I find it interesting that for many this would be the end of a spiritual journey - you've done it, received personal communion with God, Allah, The Great Spirit or Gaia - yet with this Buddhist map model it's just an experience not to get attached to - like God isn't enough.

RE: Krishnamurti - pls asses
Answer
6/17/15 9:19 PM as a reply to Stick Man.
I've always thought that such an experience (as mentioned above) is a contender for being behind the origin of reincarnation theories. Logic going something like this -

- The experiencer finds that the self essence is simultaneuously personal yet distributed everywhere - like an ocean with many waves, as the saying goes.

- Death means loss of personal location of consciousness within the body, and a return to the ocean

- A new birth, like a new wave, arises from the distributed self.


My reading tells me -

"a fundamental shift in the meaning of afterlife from the Vedic
perspective. The Upanishads abandoned the goal of having communion with
the gods (Agni, Indra, etc.), attained as a result of bringing good
sacrifices, and came to consider man’s final destiny to be the
impersonal fusion atman-Brahman, attained exclusively by esoteric
knowledge. In this new context, karma and reincarnation are key
elements that will define all particular developments in Hinduism"

Could it be that someone having an experience such as Krishnamurti's injected this into the vedic tradition ?
If that is so then ideas of reincarnation could have co-existed with the more established vedic religion, maybe as unusal and personal matter, maybe heretical, rather than an orthodox preistly one ?

RE: Krishnamurti - pls asses
Answer
7/18/15 12:23 PM as a reply to Stick Man.
I don't think those experiences are that uncommon, at least I have had them. In my "map system" I simply call them "unity experiences". It's awesome, perhaps the greatest experiences available, but as all other experiences they seem to come and go. K-man seem to have been able to handle his with equanimity, when these experiences have happened to me they've been too instense for the body to be able to to much more than just stand with mouth open and go "Hrrrngghhhh..." as you get fucked by the universe.

RE: Krishnamurti - pls asses
Answer
11/2/15 3:30 AM as a reply to Mattias Wilhelm Stenberg.
Thank you for your description, Mattias. Can definitely relate to it. I remember it was one of the last sessions of the fourth day on my first Vipassana (Goenka) retreat. Scanning happening on its own then sensations all over the body. Merging with the universe. I also remember moaning softly (thinking "Wtf is going on"). True, getting fucked by the universe is a very apt description of this phenomenon.

RE: Krishnamurti - pls asses
Answer
11/2/15 10:02 AM as a reply to Mattias Wilhelm Stenberg.
It seemed to me pretty much the same feeling as orgasm but bigger and with a loss of personal boundary. I got wood too, but you don't want to know that :-)

I've been seeing people who are into ayahuasca claim that it puts them repeatedly into connection with "source" or "gaia", and my intuition is that this is what they mean because it does seem like tapping into a greater source of life energy. Yet if that's true then buddhism - at least this type of buddhism - isn't really happy to stay with it. In hippy Gaia lover terms that's like tuning your back on mother earth isn't it ?

I also assume that it's what a lot of people go on about when they claim to have experienced the "quantum field" or whatever. I doubt it. I doubt if many people would know a quantum field if it but their arse, but as something that's supposed to "connect all things" it sounds superficially like a good candidate.

RE: Krishnamurti - pls asses
Answer
11/3/15 1:16 PM as a reply to Stick Man.
Psychedelics are definetely a valid shortcut to unity experiences, but in my experiences those were not as profound as the "unassisted" ones. Actually that is not 100% true since one of the strongest ones was after I had smoked a joint, so if you count THC as a "psychedelic" YMMV.

It seems supremely healthy and nourishing for the body/mind/soul system, but ultimately these experiences do seem to come and go, and frankly you would have to be incredibly well disciplined in order to "get anything done" while experiencing these states. At least to me they are way too overwhelming for there to be any sort of intelligent response to the enviroment other than kissing it and surrendering to it.

The God-orgasm is not like other orgasms... I'd have an easier time operating heavy machinery while getting a BJ from Scarlett Johansson than I would taking a short walk when this is going on. My wife actually ended up killing herself while having one of these. 

RE: Krishnamurti - pls asses
Answer
11/6/15 12:55 PM as a reply to Stick Man.
They say in flow states, your awareness merges with or becomes it's object of perception - so if you are concentrating on X, you become X. For me, I was concentrating on the universe and the earth as a sort of holistic symbol- long story short I found myself viewing the planet from the moon's perspective, orbiting and following and feeling the gravitational pull of earth as we traveled through space, and simultaneously being flooded with the feeling of universal love(principle of connection). I also had some archetypal experiences, eg metaphorically reliving the Buddha's Bodhi tree events (a la Asvaghosa's Life of the Buddha) and also feeling very close to and/or inhabiting the concepts I was studying (this happened while writing a paper, am a religion scholar/phD student). Sri Aurobindo uses the concept of knowledge by identity to describe this state, distinguished from separative or direct contact with the object of knowing. I think this can be applied to people as well, though it becomes much more tricky there- like a snake in a rope...

RE: Krishnamurti - pls asses
Answer
11/6/15 4:52 PM as a reply to Stick Man.
lol, "asses" emoticon