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The irony of fear.

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The irony of fear.
Answer
11/6/15 6:48 PM
Our deepest fears are happening in every moment and it is hilarious! We want to have something but we can't have anything, we want to know something when there is nothing to know. We are literally losing everying we love the most in every moment when we look closely. It looks like this [url=]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FhSg6qqGz8 and it's hilarious! Our deepest fears are also the funniest! emoticon 

RE: The irony of fear.
Answer
11/7/15 8:59 PM as a reply to Drew Miller.
Well I have not even once shown up at school for a test without having studied and also realizing I forgot to wear pants, and I've never once been chased by a 3 foot long angry hornet (some of my dream time fears).  Nor from a waking perspective am I destitute, in long term painful agony, starving to death, totally alone in the world, crippled, or about to die so no, I don't think I am facing my worst fears every minute. 

As for the dog video, I guess you are saying the dog is trying to grasp the ungraspable?  But ironically, I suspect the dog knows well that it can't be grasped and is just having fun with the game instead.  Smart dog!  ;-P
-Eva

RE: The irony of fear.
Answer
11/7/15 10:04 PM as a reply to Eva Nie.
Eva,

The fears you are describing seem to be fears of the loss of self or the death of self.  Primal existential fear.  Motivating cetana, intention, movement of mind.  "shown up for school without having studied for the test wearing no pants"=existential fear of the loss of the self that is identified and/or prefers to be with pants and prepared for and imagining control...."destitute, in long term painful agony"=existential fear of the loss of self that is identified with not being destitute or in pain....."starving to death"=existential fear of the loss of self that is identified with being fed and not starving..."totally alone in the world"=existential fear of the loss of self that is identified with being connected with others..."crippled"=existential fear of the loss of self that is identified with not being crippled..."about to die"=existential fear of the loss of consciousness and body...."  Maybe you don't notice these existential fears in every moment.  Sensation is falling away.  How is this different from dieing in an ultimate sense?  You seem identified with knowing, or the self that knows that the dog knows well that the water can't be grasped. How do you know this with certainty? Along this line of thinking, I must concede that I do not know that the dog is grasping or clinging to the possession of the water either. I also must concede that I also do not experience the falling away of sensation in every moment, but on retreat, the frequency of noticing the loss of sensation, or the death of sensation, increases, excentuating the dukkha resulting from clinging to the self that is identified with sensation, and the addition of a relationship of humor or looking at the humor aspect of the ironic tragedy of imagined self creation, as apposed to the sorrowful, grieving aspects of it, can be helpful for me at times, although acknowledging the sorrow/grief of the loss of sensation is also useful, I think. I experience release from both laughing and crying. 

With sincere desire for our liberation and the liberation of all sentient beings,

Drew

RE: The irony of fear.
Answer
11/9/15 8:44 PM as a reply to Drew Miller.
I just don't like the feeling of pain, you can call that an identity issue if you like but if there is someone here who does not mind living in painful agony, I 'd be curious who that would be! 
[quote=

Drew Miller]Eva,

The fears you are describing seem to be fears of the loss of self or the death of self.  Primal existential fear.  Motivating cetana, intention, movement of mind.  "shown up for school without having studied for the test wearing no pants"=existential fear of the loss of the self that is identified and/or prefers to be with pants and prepared for and imagining control...."destitute, in long term painful agony"=existential fear of the loss of self that is identified with not being destitute or in pain....."starving to death"=existential fear of the loss of self that is identified with being fed and not starving..."totally alone in the world"=existential fear of the loss of self that is identified with being connected with others..."crippled"=existential fear of the loss of self that is identified with not being crippled..."about to die"=existential fear of the loss of consciousness and body...."  Maybe you don't notice these existential fears in every moment.  Sensation is falling away.  How is this different from dieing in an ultimate sense?  You seem identified with knowing, or the self that knows that the dog knows well that the water can't be grasped. How do you know this with certainty? Along this line of thinking, I must concede that I do not know that the dog is grasping or clinging to the possession of the water either. I also must concede that I also do not experience the falling away of sensation in every moment, but on retreat, the frequency of noticing the loss of sensation, or the death of sensation, increases, excentuating the dukkha resulting from clinging to the self that is identified with sensation, and the addition of a relationship of humor or looking at the humor aspect of the ironic tragedy of imagined self creation, as apposed to the sorrowful, grieving aspects of it, can be helpful for me at times, although acknowledging the sorrow/grief of the loss of sensation is also useful, I think. I experience release from both laughing and crying. 

With sincere desire for our liberation and the liberation of all sentient beings,

Drew

RE: The irony of fear.
Answer
11/9/15 10:03 PM as a reply to Eva Nie.
I'm with you Eva. I don't like pain alot of the time either....except distance running, and deep tissue massage, and sometimes other stuff.  I am a bit masochistic in some ways....but still human and don't like pain most of the time.  

So, a bit of back story for the post.  I tend to identify with fear alot, have had anxiety throughout much of my life and fear during the dark night has been difficult for me, usually manifesting as anger (reacting to fear with desire to control and or dominate the fearful stimuli), which doesn't work and ironically identifies me as the one who is angry with fear as its underlying root.  I'm also a big fan of The Simpsons, having watched it alot growing up, and that show is full of irony and is hilarious to me.  It struck me several years ago that the becoming of the imagined Self is an ironic tragedy and I have focused on the tragic aspects of it until just recently. I remembered Daniel Ingram in MTCTB discussing how humor can be helpful and realized that there may be humor in this ironic fearful tragedy.  Maybe the dog image isn't the best image but I was going for the whole clinging aspect of things.  Maybe this one is a bit better? I think I could use some help finding an image that depicts this irony accurately. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcGQpjCztgA

RE: The irony of fear.
Answer
11/12/15 10:08 PM as a reply to Drew Miller.
I've heard it said that pain plus time equals humor, that seems to hold true in general it seems.  And yeah, the Simpsons are often a great commentary on the typical USA lifestyle and how it's often counterproductive.  ;-P
-Eva