Beginners Questions on Mahasi Style - Discussion
Beginners Questions on Mahasi Style
Beginners Questions on Mahasi Style | Piers M | 11/01/05 1:14 |
RE: Beginners Questions on Mahasi Style | Bernardo V. | 11/01/05 7:35 |
RE: Beginners Questions on Mahasi Style | Piers M | 11/01/07 0:13 |
13年前 に Piers M によって更新されました。 at 11/01/05 1:14
Created 13年 ago at 11/01/05 1:14
Beginners Questions on Mahasi Style
投稿: 116 参加年月日: 10/12/07 最新の投稿
Hi,
I'm new to Mahasi practice but really keen and enthusiastic to give it a go after 9 years of frustration on Goenka retreats!
I did a Mahasi Style retreat recently in Thailand for 3 weeks and now I'm in Malaysia at the Buddhist Hermitage Lunas (BHL) where I plan to stay for 3 months. I've been here for 1 week and just want some advice before I completely switch off from the outside (and online) world in a few days time. The teachers at each place have given some differing instructions.
1) During walking meditation for about an hour the Thai Ajaan said that if something arises that distracts you from the object of your meditation (noting the movement of the feet) eg. an intense emotional state or a noise to STOP (walking) and note it around 3 times slowly eg. Sadness Sadness, Sadness or Hearing, Hearing, Hearing then continue noting the feet.
The Sayadaw here at BHL on the other hand said to only note the movement of the feet and to IGNORE anything else. Just to keep the concentration on the feet. Only if you really have to because the mind is distracted, to STOP and then note it but preferably to wait until you get to the end of the walkway (ie the point you turn around when you are walking to and fro).
2) This brings me nicely to the next question. When you do stop in order to turn around and start walking again in the other direction, the Ajaan suggested to STAND briefly, maybe with eyes closed and just "feel the whole body" or if you cannot do this then to quickly scan it from head to feet once or twice. The Sayadaw at BHL instructs that when standing to just note you are standing (but not to sweep or feel the body). Basically just to keep your attention on what you are doing so you can keep up moment to moment continuous awareness.
3) When sitting, the Ajaan's instructions were to alternate between observing/noting Rising and Falling of the abdomen to then switch to noting Sitting-Sitting and any inherent sensations in that posture. Basically again trying to feel the whole body whilst sitting or at times to note the pressure on the cushion for example.
The Sayadaw's instructions have been to note the Rising and Falling but then if something else distracts the mind such that the mind has moved there, then that is now the object of concentration. Eg. a sound, note it (seeing how it has arisen and passed away) and then come back to the Rising and Falling, or if a pain in the leg, to come to that and if necessary to stay there for some time. In fact he says there is no limit to observing either the Rising and Falling or the entire body during an hour of sitting. But the important point is to note whatever has become the object of your attention.
Maybe it's just down to the individual to try out what works for them. However, I would really appreciate some feedback on the above. Also, any other hints or tips would be welcome for staying on retreat for 3 months. I am feeling confident and relaxed in some ways as I'm trying not to take my fears/worries/anxieties etc too seriously. They have dogged me for too long, so now is the time to just note them and let them be and then move on.
Many of my other questions relate to the technique of noting itself, however I'm so far content with the many Q's & A's on this subject that I have already read on the DhO and KFD forums.
Thanks very much and I appreciate any help and support out there.
Piers.
I'm new to Mahasi practice but really keen and enthusiastic to give it a go after 9 years of frustration on Goenka retreats!
I did a Mahasi Style retreat recently in Thailand for 3 weeks and now I'm in Malaysia at the Buddhist Hermitage Lunas (BHL) where I plan to stay for 3 months. I've been here for 1 week and just want some advice before I completely switch off from the outside (and online) world in a few days time. The teachers at each place have given some differing instructions.
1) During walking meditation for about an hour the Thai Ajaan said that if something arises that distracts you from the object of your meditation (noting the movement of the feet) eg. an intense emotional state or a noise to STOP (walking) and note it around 3 times slowly eg. Sadness Sadness, Sadness or Hearing, Hearing, Hearing then continue noting the feet.
The Sayadaw here at BHL on the other hand said to only note the movement of the feet and to IGNORE anything else. Just to keep the concentration on the feet. Only if you really have to because the mind is distracted, to STOP and then note it but preferably to wait until you get to the end of the walkway (ie the point you turn around when you are walking to and fro).
2) This brings me nicely to the next question. When you do stop in order to turn around and start walking again in the other direction, the Ajaan suggested to STAND briefly, maybe with eyes closed and just "feel the whole body" or if you cannot do this then to quickly scan it from head to feet once or twice. The Sayadaw at BHL instructs that when standing to just note you are standing (but not to sweep or feel the body). Basically just to keep your attention on what you are doing so you can keep up moment to moment continuous awareness.
3) When sitting, the Ajaan's instructions were to alternate between observing/noting Rising and Falling of the abdomen to then switch to noting Sitting-Sitting and any inherent sensations in that posture. Basically again trying to feel the whole body whilst sitting or at times to note the pressure on the cushion for example.
The Sayadaw's instructions have been to note the Rising and Falling but then if something else distracts the mind such that the mind has moved there, then that is now the object of concentration. Eg. a sound, note it (seeing how it has arisen and passed away) and then come back to the Rising and Falling, or if a pain in the leg, to come to that and if necessary to stay there for some time. In fact he says there is no limit to observing either the Rising and Falling or the entire body during an hour of sitting. But the important point is to note whatever has become the object of your attention.
Maybe it's just down to the individual to try out what works for them. However, I would really appreciate some feedback on the above. Also, any other hints or tips would be welcome for staying on retreat for 3 months. I am feeling confident and relaxed in some ways as I'm trying not to take my fears/worries/anxieties etc too seriously. They have dogged me for too long, so now is the time to just note them and let them be and then move on.
Many of my other questions relate to the technique of noting itself, however I'm so far content with the many Q's & A's on this subject that I have already read on the DhO and KFD forums.
Thanks very much and I appreciate any help and support out there.
Piers.
13年前 に Bernardo V によって更新されました。 at 11/01/05 7:35
Created 13年 ago at 11/01/05 7:35
RE: Beginners Questions on Mahasi Style
投稿: 40 参加年月日: 09/11/19 最新の投稿
Hello Piers,
1) During walking meditation for about an hour the Thai Ajaan said that if something arises that distracts you from the object of your meditation (noting the movement of the feet) eg. an intense emotional state or a noise to STOP (walking) and note it around 3 times slowly eg. Sadness Sadness, Sadness or Hearing, Hearing, Hearing then continue noting the feet.
The Sayadaw here at BHL on the other hand said to only note the movement of the feet and to IGNORE anything else. Just to keep the concentration on the feet. Only if you really have to because the mind is distracted, to STOP and then note it but preferably to wait until you get to the end of the walkway (ie the point you turn around when you are walking to and fro).
The instruction is the same. In either case, your focus is on the movement of your feet, and that means you should ignore other objects. At some stages in the practice objects won't arrest your attention and this will be easy. Still, If your mind gets distracted or carried by any object, you stop and acknowledge that object.
Same thing. After you acknowledge the distraction you come back to the body and acknowlege it's position before start walking again, i.e. it is standing. Some times you'll feel just some parts, at others you may feel the whole body. If you'll gently sweep it or not for more sensations, it's really up to you. The point here, I think, is simply to be mindful before start walking again, and don't go about doing it mindlessly.
3) When sitting, the Ajaan's instructions were to alternate between observing/noting Rising and Falling of the abdomen to then switch to noting Sitting-Sitting and any inherent sensations in that posture. Basically again trying to feel the whole body whilst sitting or at times to note the pressure on the cushion for example.
The Sayadaw's instructions have been to note the Rising and Falling but then if something else distracts the mind such that the mind has moved there, then that is now the object of concentration. Eg. a sound, note it (seeing how it has arisen and passed away) and then come back to the Rising and Falling, or if a pain in the leg, to come to that and if necessary to stay there for some time. In fact he says there is no limit to observing either the Rising and Falling or the entire body during an hour of sitting. But the important point is to note whatever has become the object of your attention.
You note the raising and falling of the abdomen and the sitting posture whenever it's possible; when other objects are more proeminent, you note them. If you feel you are expending excessive time noting other objects, get back to the raising and falling of the abdomen and the sitting posture. This will prevent you from simply chasing after anything that is arising.
Follow instructions as best as you can, and acknowledge it if your're obsessing about them. It sounds to me that you are on track. Just stay with things moment-to-moment. From waking up in the morning, while still in your bed, until you're completly asleep in the night.
Bernardo
Piers Mackeown:
1) During walking meditation for about an hour the Thai Ajaan said that if something arises that distracts you from the object of your meditation (noting the movement of the feet) eg. an intense emotional state or a noise to STOP (walking) and note it around 3 times slowly eg. Sadness Sadness, Sadness or Hearing, Hearing, Hearing then continue noting the feet.
The Sayadaw here at BHL on the other hand said to only note the movement of the feet and to IGNORE anything else. Just to keep the concentration on the feet. Only if you really have to because the mind is distracted, to STOP and then note it but preferably to wait until you get to the end of the walkway (ie the point you turn around when you are walking to and fro).
The instruction is the same. In either case, your focus is on the movement of your feet, and that means you should ignore other objects. At some stages in the practice objects won't arrest your attention and this will be easy. Still, If your mind gets distracted or carried by any object, you stop and acknowledge that object.
2) This brings me nicely to the next question. When you do stop in order to turn around and start walking again in the other direction, the Ajaan suggested to STAND briefly, maybe with eyes closed and just "feel the whole body" or if you cannot do this then to quickly scan it from head to feet once or twice. The Sayadaw at BHL instructs that when standing to just note you are standing (but not to sweep or feel the body). Basically just to keep your attention on what you are doing so you can keep up moment to moment continuous awareness.
Same thing. After you acknowledge the distraction you come back to the body and acknowlege it's position before start walking again, i.e. it is standing. Some times you'll feel just some parts, at others you may feel the whole body. If you'll gently sweep it or not for more sensations, it's really up to you. The point here, I think, is simply to be mindful before start walking again, and don't go about doing it mindlessly.
3) When sitting, the Ajaan's instructions were to alternate between observing/noting Rising and Falling of the abdomen to then switch to noting Sitting-Sitting and any inherent sensations in that posture. Basically again trying to feel the whole body whilst sitting or at times to note the pressure on the cushion for example.
The Sayadaw's instructions have been to note the Rising and Falling but then if something else distracts the mind such that the mind has moved there, then that is now the object of concentration. Eg. a sound, note it (seeing how it has arisen and passed away) and then come back to the Rising and Falling, or if a pain in the leg, to come to that and if necessary to stay there for some time. In fact he says there is no limit to observing either the Rising and Falling or the entire body during an hour of sitting. But the important point is to note whatever has become the object of your attention.
You note the raising and falling of the abdomen and the sitting posture whenever it's possible; when other objects are more proeminent, you note them. If you feel you are expending excessive time noting other objects, get back to the raising and falling of the abdomen and the sitting posture. This will prevent you from simply chasing after anything that is arising.
Follow instructions as best as you can, and acknowledge it if your're obsessing about them. It sounds to me that you are on track. Just stay with things moment-to-moment. From waking up in the morning, while still in your bed, until you're completly asleep in the night.
Bernardo
13年前 に Piers M によって更新されました。 at 11/01/07 0:13
Created 13年 ago at 11/01/07 0:13
RE: Beginners Questions on Mahasi Style
投稿: 116 参加年月日: 10/12/07 最新の投稿
Thanks Bernardo.
I'm giving it a go. It seems that perhaps the instructions from the two teachers are not so different after all. Just slightly, and sometimes it is just the perception of an explanation, not that they are actually that inherently different.
Piers.
I'm giving it a go. It seems that perhaps the instructions from the two teachers are not so different after all. Just slightly, and sometimes it is just the perception of an explanation, not that they are actually that inherently different.
Piers.