Can someone explain to me how once the meditator reaches certain attainments the experience of time becomes an illusion? What does this mean? How are we defining time here?

I think time being an illusion refers to the seeing the insubstantial nature of concepts of past and future.

As you probably know, the goal of the path is complete freedom from concepts, or the full understanding that our conceptual thinking is not true, or truly existent. As one increases in attainment one understands more and more that concepts are 'false', or not inherently existent. In essence one comes to understand from firsthand experience that the concepts we hold to be true, in their own right, are naught but static reflections of the way things truly are, and have no ultimate truth. All that truly is is that which we are experiencing at this present moment, or in other words all that is is the present moment.

Thus when one considers the concept of time from the standpoint of attainment, past and future are only insubstantial mental constructs. All that truly exists in experience is the present moment. So while time could be postulated to exist, based on memory, and past experience of say a clock's display changing time, from the standpoint of experience, there is nothing but the present moment which is constantly changing.

Another way to look at this is, given that the past is a memory, and the future an idea, both are conceptions occurring in the present moment. So truly there is nothing outside of the present moment.

Anything that happens essentially goes into the past instantaneously. The present moment for us is elongated by short-term memory.

Try listening to this for more info:

Time and the emptiness of time

Here's an intentionally contrary rendering for a completely different psychological effect:


No, that right there is the illusion.

Time is not a moving/flowing stream of events.

Objects move. Time does not.

Time/Space is the arena in which things move.

Nothing is going anywhere except to some other location.

There is nothing/nowhere [else] to emerge from or disappear into.

There is movement of objects within a vast stillness.

Time is an arena, not a stream.

The notion that anything "goes into the past" is an artifact of psychological time only.

(This is not a philosophical construct that I want to argue about... it's just something to contemplate that might lead to a radically different experience of time, for anyone who's into these things).

That's exactly what I mean. It's hard to put into words but if you measure time you can subdivide the time infinitely. It's conceptual. Actual time is still being debated between quantum mechanics and relative time of Einstein. Ultimately we want to see how clinging and time go together in meditative experience.

Yep, and how different ways of framing experience can lead to radically different types of experience. (That's more of interest to me, too, than arguing about what time really is).

This talk is quite good. Goes into more depth than most.

It's more interesting in meditation because we can see how perceptions of objects and how we cling to them can lengthen time (along with dukkha). Even the general public can notice that watching a clock and waiting for something (good or bad) to happen makes it seem slower than being in a flow state getting work done. "Time seemed to go by so quickly".

Though I do like some of the physics theories:

Everything Forever





Yeah I better just meditate...

Thanks for the link! Really nice talk.

I like how he goes further and further and eventually talks about perception/evaluation. Since our brains do that so quickly it's easy to see how the brain is creating objects and then going into a like or dislike of them and then clinging.

Eg. Perception: "This object sucks". Clinging: "This object sucks because, because, because, because...." You have to interrupt the "because" but also be ready for the perception to move onto something else.

I also sometimes like to ask, "where's the aversion?" "Is it here?" "Is it there?" It's a good way to shake things up when caught up with the "because, because, because". Or you can ask "why?"

You aren't dependent on time, discovering that makes time an illusion. You could spend lightyears but you still are the same. Thought first thing is to realise who you are.
And it won't take away suffering, there is constant challenge in the universe. Its possible to piss off Buddha or Jesus but not many are capable that does not mean that it isn't possible.

edit: its just a thought, gamble.

Different cultures have very different ways to deal with time. I read of a reporter visiting an Asian country with an appointment to meet a contact. The appointment was something like go hang around this neighborhood for a few days and we will meet up whenever it happens. The reporter did this and it worked. The point is the sense of time is learned. It can be learned in different ways, or not learned, or learning can change.

You can how this works with the communications on this forum.


I cannot explain how to stop this delusion, but it does happen. It can and does stop. The boundary, for me, was quite abrupt, unplanned, and a period of delightful confusion as I immersed in the now universe.

I can identify several occurances of a refreshment of the insight with a new perspective on the time delusion, but don't know how or what was the cause. I can engage the clock to pace my day, but it is annoying and prone to errors.

It is a mixed "blessing" for me. My default state is in the present moment. This works out fine when I dont need a schedule. It is a problem when working with other people on a schedule. Overall it is a great improvement to being mentally chained to a clock. 

I am curious when I listen to other people discuss time as tho it has some kind of substance. I have lost that sense of time as something of substance. I have tried to discuss it and understand what it is they are sensing as the reality of time. I feel like an outsider to their experience. A dharma friend stuck in the time delusion tried to understand me and was equally baffled how I dont sense time.

[quote=Everything Forever
]An interesting and complicated article. It is interesting we need to go to such lengths to prove a pervasive delusion is not factually based.

DN trigger.