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Polly Ester’s practice log 8

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Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/21/20 6:52 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/21/20 8:54 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/21/20 9:19 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/22/20 3:22 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/22/20 5:48 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/22/20 6:21 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/22/20 6:27 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/22/20 7:25 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/22/20 7:31 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Siavash 4/24/20 6:37 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/24/20 6:11 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/24/20 6:12 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Siavash 4/24/20 6:21 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/24/20 6:24 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Siavash 4/24/20 6:30 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/24/20 8:47 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/24/20 8:52 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/24/20 9:20 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/24/20 9:33 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/24/20 10:04 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/22/20 5:59 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/22/20 6:05 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/22/20 5:42 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 3:03 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/23/20 3:55 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 5:43 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 5:37 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/23/20 5:45 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 6:18 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 11:28 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Chris Marti 4/23/20 11:33 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Olivier 4/23/20 11:42 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/23/20 11:52 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 12:25 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 agnostic 4/23/20 2:16 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Not two, not one 4/23/20 3:36 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 5:26 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Papa Che Dusko 5/24/20 2:35 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/25/20 3:07 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 5:02 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/23/20 5:07 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 5:31 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 5:34 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/23/20 5:39 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 5:39 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/23/20 5:45 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 5:47 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/23/20 6:04 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 6:22 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Papa Che Dusko 4/24/20 6:29 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/24/20 8:54 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/24/20 9:31 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/24/20 10:02 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/23/20 5:44 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/24/20 9:58 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/24/20 10:07 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 agnostic 4/26/20 3:48 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/27/20 2:25 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Steph S 4/27/20 2:31 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/28/20 1:54 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 agnostic 4/27/20 7:51 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/24/20 1:10 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/25/20 3:53 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/25/20 4:00 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/25/20 4:05 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/25/20 4:08 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/25/20 4:11 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/25/20 4:18 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/25/20 6:22 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/25/20 6:25 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/25/20 7:43 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/25/20 2:59 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/26/20 4:50 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/26/20 6:41 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/26/20 6:55 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Chris Marti 4/26/20 7:10 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/26/20 9:01 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/26/20 9:03 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/26/20 3:26 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/27/20 7:44 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/28/20 8:21 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/28/20 8:29 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/28/20 12:26 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/28/20 12:43 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Steph S 4/28/20 2:33 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Jason Massie 4/28/20 2:44 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/28/20 2:52 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Steph S 4/28/20 2:33 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/28/20 2:38 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 agnostic 4/28/20 11:40 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/28/20 11:54 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 agnostic 4/28/20 12:02 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/28/20 12:06 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/29/20 5:56 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/29/20 6:38 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Chris Marti 4/29/20 6:48 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/29/20 7:09 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/29/20 12:34 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/30/20 8:13 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/30/20 8:31 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/30/20 8:43 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/30/20 8:45 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/30/20 8:46 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/30/20 8:48 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 T 4/30/20 11:31 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/30/20 12:11 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Chris Marti 4/30/20 12:48 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/30/20 12:59 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Chris Marti 4/30/20 1:24 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 agnostic 4/30/20 2:52 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/30/20 4:18 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/30/20 4:14 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/30/20 3:26 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 agnostic 4/30/20 3:52 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 4/30/20 3:59 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 agnostic 4/30/20 4:08 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/30/20 4:27 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Siavash 4/30/20 4:08 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/30/20 4:23 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Chris Marti 4/30/20 4:08 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/30/20 4:29 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Chris Marti 5/1/20 6:20 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/1/20 6:22 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Chris Marti 5/1/20 6:24 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/1/20 6:26 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Chris Marti 5/1/20 7:02 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 agnostic 5/1/20 8:47 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/1/20 8:49 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Chris Marti 5/1/20 9:16 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/30/20 4:24 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/30/20 4:21 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 4/30/20 4:19 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 John W 5/1/20 11:23 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/1/20 4:05 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/2/20 6:01 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/2/20 10:24 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/3/20 5:46 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Siavash 5/3/20 6:40 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/3/20 7:51 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/3/20 9:42 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/3/20 2:56 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/3/20 4:38 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/7/20 6:00 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/8/20 6:03 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/9/20 1:52 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 hae1en 5/11/20 5:37 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/11/20 6:25 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 hae1en 5/11/20 6:54 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/11/20 7:09 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 hae1en 5/11/20 7:40 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/11/20 11:33 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Not two, not one 5/11/20 2:33 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/11/20 2:50 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/13/20 5:12 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 hae1en 5/13/20 6:16 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/13/20 6:51 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/13/20 10:51 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/13/20 8:36 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/13/20 9:17 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/14/20 1:57 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/17/20 9:56 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Olivier 5/17/20 10:21 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/17/20 10:31 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/17/20 11:30 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/17/20 11:28 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/17/20 11:31 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Steph S 5/18/20 9:05 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/18/20 8:58 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/18/20 11:36 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Olivier 5/18/20 12:30 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Steph S 5/18/20 1:22 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Olivier 5/18/20 1:30 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/19/20 3:06 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/19/20 6:23 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/19/20 6:32 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Steph S 5/19/20 8:33 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/19/20 6:22 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/19/20 6:20 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Hector 5/23/20 7:31 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 hae1en 5/18/20 7:03 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/18/20 8:50 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/9/20 6:12 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/9/20 7:10 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/9/20 9:07 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/9/20 11:33 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/9/20 2:44 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/9/20 2:59 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/9/20 11:32 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/10/20 12:57 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/10/20 1:04 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Not two, not one 5/9/20 4:14 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/9/20 11:36 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/9/20 11:39 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Not two, not one 5/10/20 1:48 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/10/20 2:20 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/10/20 2:24 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Not two, not one 5/10/20 3:28 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/10/20 4:43 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/10/20 7:19 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/10/20 8:59 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/11/20 4:25 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/11/20 4:39 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/11/20 4:58 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/12/20 9:06 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/12/20 12:29 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/13/20 4:47 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/13/20 5:10 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/13/20 6:06 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/22/20 9:49 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/22/20 2:20 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/23/20 12:00 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/23/20 12:39 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/23/20 1:23 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/23/20 2:16 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Hector 5/23/20 7:13 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/23/20 9:46 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Hector 5/23/20 11:24 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/24/20 12:17 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/24/20 1:07 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Hector 5/25/20 2:17 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/25/20 3:13 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/25/20 6:26 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/26/20 4:34 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/26/20 11:17 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/27/20 3:42 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/28/20 5:16 PM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Tim Farrington 5/29/20 12:15 AM
RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8 Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö 5/30/20 6:59 AM
Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/21/20 6:52 AM
It's time to start a new log again, because the last one was getting ridiculously long, again. This new log might be a boring read, because I seem to have entered a territory where the best results come from practices that don't investigate that much but rather just let awareness be aware of itself without putting it into words or even bothering to make distinctions. I seem to have a hard time trusting that, and yet, when I do it anyway, that's when space either opens up or collapses or both, so it seems to be what I need to do right now. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/21/20 8:54 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I lay down to just be for about an hour, letting sensations be sensations and mind movements be mind movements without identifying more with one or the other. There were some poppings, some of which seemed to entail electric surges like when electronic devises are turned on. The nada sound is really loud now, almost like the existence is buzzing.  

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/21/20 9:19 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Okay, so apparently it is quite possible to just lay attachment to subjectivity aside for some time when I don't have to interact. I know that it has also been possible in the midst of interaction. I love it when it happens. So maybe I should just trust it to be there. It can't hurt, I guess. Maybe I should just give my self a vacation now and then and allow me not to pop up in the foreground. I can do that. It's ethnography. That's what I do for a living. Less phenomenology, more ethnography. I actually love ethnography because it allows me to forget about myself while still having a full experience. That's a damn good reminder that might just help with my writer's block too. The book isn't about me. It's ethnography. I'm telling other people's stories, not mine. So why not just let those stories tell themselves. Yeah, why not? 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/22/20 3:22 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
So I'm experimenting with asking the question "How can there be freedom right now?", and it does something. Sensory manifestations float around and come to life. Traffic sounds, birds chirping, children shouting, babies crying etc come together as a symphony with a vibrational quality reminding somewhat of a gong bath, and there's a lightness to it. 

I think I need to stay out of things that trigger me for a while, not to bypass them but for the sake of timing. This is not the time for setting off defences. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/22/20 5:48 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
A new day, a new thread. Beautiful. Thank you again and still and always for your sharing here.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/22/20 5:59 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
This new log might be a boring read, because I seem to have entered a territory where the best results come from practices that don't investigate that much but rather just let awareness be aware of itself without putting it into words or even bothering to make distinctions. I seem to have a hard time trusting that, and yet, when I do it anyway, that's when space either opens up or collapses or both, so it seems to be what I need to do right now. 

If I'm getting this all wrong, or if you have any gentle pointers that you think might help, I'm willing to listen. I may not be able to explain myself very much right now as words are failing me. I feel insecure and question everything in some moments and feel like everything is exactly as it is supposed to be in other moments, and I don't think any of those versions are correct. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/22/20 6:05 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
This new log might be a boring read, because I seem to have entered a territory where the best results come from practices that don't investigate that much but rather just let awareness be aware of itself without putting it into words or even bothering to make distinctions. I seem to have a hard time trusting that, and yet, when I do it anyway, that's when space either opens up or collapses or both, so it seems to be what I need to do right now. 

If I'm getting this all wrong, or if you have any gentle pointers that you think might help, I'm willing to listen. I may not be able to explain myself very much right now as words are failing me. I feel insecure and question everything in some moments and feel like everything is exactly as it is supposed to be in other moments, and I don't think any of those versions are correct. 

You're doing it just right, love.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/22/20 6:21 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:
A new day, a new thread. Beautiful. Thank you again and still and always for your sharing here.


Thank you! (We seriously do need a heart emoji or at least a namaste emoji here, if hearts are considered too distracting or something.)

---

In my reclining practice earlier today, something was going on with my vision. I use a blindfold, so I know that any lights that appear are mind-made, not emmanating from a physical light source. In the beginning of the session, there was some centered brightness, nothing out of the ordinary, very basic stuff. Then a very bright point popped into the screen from my right side, seemingly with an intention, and it sort of made a jump, and then settled and either faded or mixed with the ordinary brightness. Right after that, one of my cats jumped up on my chest from the right. I cuddled him for a moment and then returned to spaciousness, and he settled down and seemed to join me in meditation. He was leaning his head to the left side of my chest and stretching his front paws to that side to maintain balance while relaxing. A red shimmer appeared at the left side of my screen. It grew stronger and sort of stabilized. It had movements to it but the strength of it and its location and size (it was a field that didn't seem to have its borders on the left side within my screen but slightly outside it, and it took up maybe a fifth of my screen, which is a wide screen that curves outward) remained relatively intact for a long time. I estimate it to be close to an hour. It was glowing steadily and brightly and it was undeniably red with some pink features. Towards the end of the session, my cat moved a bit and placed himself in a more centered way on my chest. That made the red field move the same way. Afterwards, when my cat was no longer on my chest, the red field was gone. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/22/20 6:27 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
well, you call it a red glow, i call it a cat, i guess. or was it the other way around, or both, or yes? I get us confused sometimes.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/22/20 7:25 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Maybe it was my idea of that cat. Some cats are really good at "mindmelding". They seem to know how to let information get all merged and interactive. I think that first bright spark was his intention of jumping onto my chest as manifested in my mind when information interacted. Whether it was some synesthetic processing of very subtle hearing or of kinesthetic sensing of movements in the air or something else, I'll never know. That cat sometimes wakes me up in the middle of the night by being about to climb the fence and jump onto the window to signal that he wants to be let inside. I seem to wake up from his intention before he acts on it. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/22/20 7:31 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
And all this is before we even mention Shrodinger and that cat of his.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/22/20 5:42 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I had another one of those space collapses today, that is, deconstructing depth vision. I was lying on the yoga mat before the class started and the rectangular pattern in the ceiling stood out, like it was a miniature ceiling hovering only 20 cm above me. After the class I did it intentionally. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 3:03 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Today I have the goal of identifying and not giving into the airy avoidance mechanisms of "I'll just do this little thingie first". A chat with a wise friend made me remember the strategies that I have that actually work and inspired new ones. I'm going to beat this writer's block. 

When I lay down to sleep last night there were lots of white light sparkles that converged at the centre of the visual field to form a sphere. I asked to remember dreams, which I did. I asked for a lucid dream, which did not happen. 

Writing this was actually one of those little thingies to do first, so it starts from now on. That means that I'm NOT allowed to read new posts on this forum right now, because it's time to get to work. I'll be reading scientific papers in my hammock, nothing to have performance anxiety about really. Getting rid of that totally irrational performance anxiety was one of the effects of SE that unfortunately didn't last. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 3:55 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Today I have the goal of identifying and not giving into the airy avoidance mechanisms of "I'll just do this little thingie first". A chat with a wise friend made me remember the strategies that I have that actually work and inspired new ones. I'm going to beat this writer's block. 

Writing this was actually one of those little thingies to do first, so it starts from now on. That means that I'm NOT allowed to read new posts on this forum right now, because it's time to get to work. I'll be reading scientific papers in my hammock, nothing to have performance anxiety about really. Getting rid of that totally irrational performance anxiety was one of the effects of SE that unfortunately didn't last. 
Beating writer's block is like stream entry, in that the only way to do it properly is to achieve and then maintain a decent spell of stabilized equanimity. You can't muscle through it, WB is a dukha nana par excellence. So i would advise that you treat writing as you would sitting meditation: set aside a time interval or intervals, very strict and formal, and just BE THERE during that appointment-with-writing time, complete and silent, waiting for what I think of as the "voice" to move or sound. You'll have your own very linda way of recognizing that impetus, and i'm pretty sure i don't have to belabor that, beyond saying that IT COMES AS A GIFT from being at peace, first, with silence. Leonard Cohen has a prayer of a song called, "If it Be Your Wiill," which goes in part:

If it be Your will, that i song no more,
that my voice be still, as it was before,
I will sing no more, i shall abide until
i am spoken for
if it be Your will.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TR1m98xnl5c

(sweet version, duet with Jennifer Warnes)

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:37 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I need to ask: Does the black parts of the iconic image of this podcast stand out in 3D or is my vision going heywire again?
https://anchor.fm/daniel-hill6/episodes/An-Interview-with-Daniel-Ingram-Part-One-ebvrtn/a-a1penf0

I'm on lunchbreak now, cooking food, so I'm allowed to listen to podcasts and write here. I'm working on my smage* skills, integrating dharma talks and mantra chanting with kitchen chores in order to make life as a householder practicioner function. I need to use my time effectively so that I have time both to practice and to make the world a better place (which ideally is what I do with my research). Also, it makes the kitchen chores not only bearable but even fun.

*) concept reluctantly coined by Daniel in "this fine audio recording" from the Bryngarth II fire kasina retreat. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:43 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Thankyou Tim! Yes, I definitely see the similarities and I know that what you are suggesting works, as this isn't the first time I have to cut through this. Unlike stream entry, I find that I need to do it over and over again. I deeply appreciate your input. You and others on this forum are what inspires me to get through this. I have had enormously helpful chats with spatial, and Shargrol's advice to Mike yesterday (?) as well as your determination to gradually lock in a baseline for your practice are helpful.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:45 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
I need to ask: Does the black parts of the iconic image of this podcast stand out in 3D or is my vision going heywire again?
https://anchor.fm/daniel-hill6/episodes/An-Interview-with-Daniel-Ingram-Part-One-ebvrtn/a-a1penf0

No, the black arc is a definite drop off into the void for me too, pure three D, possibly even without going in with your suggestion biasing my take on it.

 I'm working on my smage* skills, *) concept reluctantly coined by Daniel

will do kitchen chores cheerfully for explanation, as i am only into the intro so far of this fine audio recording  from the Bryngarth II fire kasina retreat. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 6:18 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Oh, I see it the other way around, as standing out. I can see that it's typically the kind of illusion that can be perceived both ways, so the 3D effect is intentional. It's just that all sorts of things have had similar effects for me lately, so that's why I was wondering. 

Great that my vagueness inspired to some dharma listening. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 11:28 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I just found out that I'll lose my employment at the University as a researcher from July 1st. My boss and colleagues want to keep me there and there is financing available and I have a book to write but the law won't allow for any more temporary employments and my department can't take the risk of offering me an employment with indefinite duration. I also got a call from the social services today because of my child's situation. We have done everything we can as parents to support our kid as much as is humanly possible in a situation where she has to wait several years for the care she needs, and because of that, they are now worried and are obliged by the law to check up on us. Thankfully the woman who called has children in a similar situation and she seemed nice, so maybe this won't have to be a bad thing.

At least I did write today. Life kind of sucks a bit but there is a sense of spaciousness and some jhanic factors.

I'm still going to write that book somehow. I don't know how, but I'll find a way. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 11:33 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I'm so sorry!

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 11:42 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
You will find a way !

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 11:52 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:

I'm still going to write that book somehow. I don't know how, but I'll find a way. 


Yup.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 12:25 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Thanks, all of you!

My conditioning kind of sucks, because this will require a lot of executive functioning that I don't really have: organizing, prioritizing, decisionmaking, structuring, making contacts, planning, administration, remembering important things that need to be taken care of, actually taking care of those things in time... and where the hell shall I put all those books and papers and stuff?! It is urgent to find a legal way to maintain access to my research data. At the same time I will have to search for a new job, one that won't make me want to die. This is going to be overwhelming and there isn't much I can do about that.

But it is a beautiful warm spring day today, with cherry blossoms, violets and wood anemones etc in full bloom, and there is that golden evening light that I love, and nobody can take that away from me, because it is just there where it is. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 2:16 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I'm really sorry to hear about this Linda. I hope you can find something else soon.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 3:36 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Really sorry to hear this.  emoticon  You will definitely find a way to achieve your goals.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:02 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I just did a two hour session of fire kasina. I had set the alarm for half an hour but it just felt so good. There's a new taste to it that hasn't been there before, a lightness and a richness of subtle nuances. I had the Avalokiteshvara heart dhurini mantra playing in my inner hearing the whole time. It's a bit long for a concentration mantra, I think, but I didn't do it on purpose. It's just there, living its own life. All senses were involved. The dot was detailed and bright (except for when it was black) and vivid and longlasting. It changed colors and had halos in different colors. The shape varied somewhat. Sometimes there was 3D movement within the dot. Sometimes there was sort of an electric shimmer outside the dot and its layers of still halos. The shimmer had tiny dots of different colors arising and passing away in rapid succession and deminded of carbon dioxide in a fluid, sort of. There were phases when the happy chemicals just flooded. It felt like I was floating and I almost burst into laughter. There were also phases of deep calm and some sort of melancholy that had a beauty to it. Grief maybe. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:07 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
TThere were also phases of deep calm and some sort of melancholy that had a beauty to it. Grief maybe. 


I love the word "poignancy," that sweetest of heartaches. And grief, accepted, has that quality.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:26 PM as a reply to Not two, not one.
Thankyou, Malcolm and Aggie! 

The feeling I have right now is that I'm done with the career thing. I want calm in my life. I'm done with the constant worry about fundings and having to compare myself with others and be top notch. I want a job that does minimal harm and that somehow makes the world a better place and that doesn't involve constant performance anxiety. If the only job I can find that lives up to that is at some second hand shop like most autistic people in this town, then I can probably live with that. That's not plan A, though. I think I could contribute more than that. If only someone would be willing to employ me for it, I could lead support groups or something. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:31 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
TThere were also phases of deep calm and some sort of melancholy that had a beauty to it. Grief maybe. 


I love the word "poignancy," that sweetest of heartaches. And grief, accepted, has that quality.
Maybe that's the best translation for the Swedish word "vemod" that came to my mind, a word that I love. Thankyou!

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:34 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Deleted double post (there’s a bug in the code that messes with the time stamp if a post is deleted so I edit instead).

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:39 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.

för all del!

(de nada.)

(edit) i just went to slip in a simple response to a "thank you," and you had time to (not)-delete a double post and re-write it as an edit, with your eye on the time stamp integrity! You terrify me, you super-real creature of wonder and joy.


RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:39 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
I think you mean "Det var så lite så". 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:44 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Too bad I can't make a living on that. emoticon  You really have a talent for compliments. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:45 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
I think you mean "Det var så lite så". 

What i really meant was, "de nada," which has a particular tone, with a touch of "Of course! Don't mention it." I was also leaning toward ingen orsak. "

Det var så lite så," is simple polite standard response, right? I wanted the casual affectionate no-big-deal, anything-for-a-friend note.


RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 5:47 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
That's what I would say in that case. That's colloquial Swedish.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 6:04 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.

Det var så lite så?


RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/23/20 6:22 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Yes. With a warm smile. That says it all. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 6:37 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
We seriously do need a heart emoji or at least a namaste emoji here, if hearts are considered too distracting or something.

I am trying to post a solution here for this emoji problem, but I am getting an error saying "Message Boards is temporarily unavailable."!

Sorry for spamming, I am writing this to see if it's because of emojis in that post that I get this error or not.

Edit:
Below was the solution, but when emojis are included in the post, it raises the above error, and it seems that is not working.

When you right click here on the editor, sometimes it opens browser' paste popup, and sometimes DhO' paste popup (I don't know its logic). If it's browser' popup, it may have a Emoji & Symbols menu item. If it didn't have, just click DhO popup' paste item, and in the next dialog, right click, and there you'll get browser' popup. For me, Chrome on Mac, browser' popup has this Emoji & Symbol item, that if you click it, it opens another dialog containing many more emoji and symbols and you can choose or type the word you want, like thanks or love, and select from results. But I don't know all browsers and in all platforms have that option or not.


And sorry about your job. You'll be fine.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 6:11 AM as a reply to Siavash.
Siavash:
I am trying to post a solution here for this emoji problem, but I am getting an error saying "Message Boards is temporarily unavailable."!

Sorry for spamming, I am writing this to see if it's because of emojis in that post that I get this error or not.

emoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticon

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 6:12 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:
Siavash:
I am trying to post a solution here for this emoji problem, but I am getting an error saying "Message Boards is temporarily unavailable."!

Sorry for spamming, I am writing this to see if it's because of emojis in that post that I get this error or not.

emoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticonemoticon
This is what my emoji Master Papa Che would call, a very good practice log entry, in noting emoji practice technique.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 6:21 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Yeah!

It didn't work. Liferay' editor doesn't recognize symbols it seems, and it only recognize text, and for its own emojis, it has textual representation for each one. Legacy system problems! Sorry Linda, again.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 6:24 AM as a reply to Siavash.
Siavash:
Yeah!

It didn't work. Liferay' editor doesn't recognize symbols it seems, and it only recognize text, and for its own emojis, it has textual representation for each one. Legacy system problems! Sorry Linda, again.


Ask Chris Marti about this tech stuff, it's way beyond my pay grade.

It is very polite of you, gracious and sensitive to apologize to Linda for this besmirchment of her practice log. She is perfectly capable, as i well know, of telling both of us to take it to another bar. So i will hide behind you, dear Siavash, for the time being, as you are so much nicer. That woman scares the shit out of me, to tell you the truth.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 6:29 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Ska vi så prata på Svenska her? Hur seger man dependent origination så? emoticon I dem åtta år i Sverige har inte rigtigt lert mig at skriver gott. Men Lagom er et bra ord i sammanheng med Dharma = middle way. I like it! emoticon 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 6:30 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:
Siavash:
Yeah!

It didn't work. Liferay' editor doesn't recognize symbols it seems, and it only recognize text, and for its own emojis, it has textual representation for each one. Legacy system problems! Sorry Linda, again.


Ask Chris Marti about this tech stuff, it's way beyond my pay grade.

It is very polite of you, gracious and sensitive to apologize to Linda for this besmirchment of her practice log. She is perfectly capable, as i well know, of telling both of us to take it to another bar. So i will hide behind you, dear Siavash, for the time being, as you are so much nicer. That woman scares the shit out of me, to tell you the truth.


Yes, Linda is capable of course!
But don't worry, we will end this emoji thing here, and Linda will be kind and won't say anything this time emoticon

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 8:47 AM as a reply to Siavash.
Siavash:
Yeah!

It didn't work. Liferay' editor doesn't recognize symbols it seems, and it only recognize text, and for its own emojis, it has textual representation for each one. Legacy system problems! Sorry Linda, again.

Oh, I tried that sollution ages ago. emoticon I'm not a programmer, but I'm meddling. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 8:52 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Siavash:
Yeah!

It didn't work. Liferay' editor doesn't recognize symbols it seems, and it only recognize text, and for its own emojis, it has textual representation for each one. Legacy system problems! Sorry Linda, again.

Oh, I tried that sollution ages ago. emoticon I'm not a programmer, but I'm meddling. 
Linda, about messing up your thread here and lowering the general DhO vibe with a bunch of crap, i just want to . . .

tell you it was Siavash, it was all Siavash!! He made me do it!!

(sorry, Siavash, this isn't about friendship anymore, this is just survival. Do you truly understand the extent of the powers this person "Linda" has available to her, should she care to use them for the purposes of, say, lightning strikes or something? Run for cover, man, it's everyone for themself at this point.)

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 8:54 AM as a reply to Papa Che Dusko.
Papa Che Dusko:
Ska vi så prata på Svenska her? Hur seger man dependent origination så? emoticon I dem åtta år i Sverige har inte rigtigt lert mig at skriver gott. Men Lagom er et bra ord i sammanheng med Dharma = middle way. I like it! emoticon 


I don't have a clue. I'm doing all my dharma reading in English. Yeah, "lagom" is a great word that is surprisingly hard to come across in other languages. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 9:20 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:

Do you truly understand the extent of the powers this person "Linda" has available to her, should she care to use them for the purposes of, say, lightning strikes or something? Run for cover, man, it's everyone for themself at this point.

I was just using the word jinx in a different conversation with a friend on messenger and was reminded of the fact that I actually believed for a while that I was a jinx. At the time it really seemed like I was a magnet for chaos. As soon as I felt happy for a little while, someone around me died or something. It was total chaos wherever I went, like a portable chaos field. It sounds like a really weird thing to believe, but I’m still immensely happy that it’s not like that anymore and that it probably wasn’t me. I was scared of me. At that time I adopted the alias Tintomara from a book by C.J.L. Almqvist. Tintomara was a non-binary being who was always at the centre of others' tragedy, and although innocent, was eventually sentenced to death for it. 

Being harmless is quite the relief. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 9:31 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Papa Che Dusko:
Ska vi så prata på Svenska her? Hur seger man dependent origination så? emoticon I dem åtta år i Sverige har inte rigtigt lert mig at skriver gott. Men Lagom er et bra ord i sammanheng med Dharma = middle way. I like it! emoticon 


I don't have a clue. I'm doing all my dharma reading in English. Yeah, "lagom" is a great word that is surprisingly hard to come across in other languages. 

"beroende ursprung" is the phrase you're looking for here, i think, Papa Che.


RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 9:33 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Tim Farrington:

Do you truly understand the extent of the powers this person "Linda" has available to her, should she care to use them for the purposes of, say, lightning strikes or something? Run for cover, man, it's everyone for themself at this point.

I was just using the word jinx in a different conversation with a friend on messenger and was reminded of the fact that I actually believed for a while that I was a jinx. At the time it really seemed like I was a magnet for chaos. As soon as I felt happy for a little while, someone around me died or something. It was total chaos wherever I went, like a portable chaos field. It sounds like a really weird thing to believe, but I’m still immensely happy that it’s not like that anymore and that it probably wasn’t me. I was scared of me. At that time I adopted the alias Tintomara from a book by C.J.L. Almqvist. Tintomara was a non-binary being who was always at the centre of others' tragedy, and although innocent, was eventually sentenced to death for it. 

Being harmless is quite the relief. 

That's a good one, "harmless." You stick to that story and i'll have your back all the way. I might occasionally giggle when you say it, but am becoming the Master of My Face, and soon will never even crack a smile at the Cosmic Joke itself.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 9:58 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Something seems to have loosened up in my practice. Maybe the forced letting go of my dream job and lots of stuff that came with it at least does some good. The world seems more vibrational. 

I did a simple routine of basic Bön lineage practice: nine breathings of purification, guru yoga with chanting, visualizations and seed syllables (Taphiritsa), and inner refuge practice (the three doors, not the fruition doors but the other ones). Space opened up and there was brightness and lightness and a vibrational quality to the existence (words are failing me here). I dedicated that part of the practice. Then I chanted the SA LE Ö mantra. My chanting is full of overtones. That just happens automatically. At least that's how it sounds for me. I don't know how much is hearable for others. I dedicated the chanting. Then I lay down to do Michael Taft's lates SF Dharma Collective guided meditation, the Vimilakirti experience 3B. As long as I could still hear the content of what he was saying, my experience followed his instructions. After that I have no idea what he was talking about. It was just all light and soundwaves and vibrations floating around and morphing, and it was amazing. I hope I didn't miss something essential. 

Then I went to pick up the large Avalokiteshvara art print that I've had put into a frame (beautiful!). The visual field is at extreme wide angle again.

The nada sound is loud and I feel sort of lightheaded and yet grounded. I can see the vibrational quality of the visual field. There seem to be tingling nerve ends at my scalp. It feels pleasant, like energetic misty vapor seeping out in an intricate dance, but when I touch those many points, they are hot and tender. One of my partners is coming over tonight for the first time for quite some time now, but I kind of feel like meditating the rest of the day instead, and that doesn't seem fair to him.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 10:02 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:
"beroende ursprung" is the phrase you're looking for here, i think, Papa Che.


That sounds awfully stilted, to be honest, but then again, translations often do. I don’t have any better suggestion.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 10:04 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:

That's a good one, "harmless." You stick to that story and i'll have your back all the way. I might occasionally giggle when you say it, but am becoming the Master of My Face, and soon will never even crack a smile at the Cosmic Joke itself.


Hey there, when I warned you that my energies might be risky business after all, you didn’t believe it.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 10:07 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Something seems to have loosened up in my practice. Maybe the forced letting go of my dream job and lots of stuff that came with it at least does some good. The world seems more vibrational. 

I did a simple routine of basic Bön lineage practice: nine breathings of purification, guru yoga with chanting, visualizations and seed syllables (Taphiritsa), and inner refuge practice (the three doors, not the fruition doors but the other ones). Space opened up and there was brightness and lightness and a vibrational quality to the existence (words are failing me here). I dedicated that part of the practice. Then I chanted the SA LE Ö mantra. My chanting is full of overtones. That just happens automatically. At least that's how it sounds for me. I don't know how much is hearable for others. I dedicated the chanting. Then I lay down to do Michael Taft's lates SF Dharma Collective guided meditation, the Vimilakirti experience 3B. As long as I could still hear the content of what he was saying, my experience followed his instructions. After that I have no idea what he was talking about. It was just all light and soundwaves and vibrations floating around and morphing, and it was amazing. I hope I didn't miss something essential. 

Then I went to pick up the large Avalokiteshvara art print that I've had put into a frame (beautiful!). The visual field is at extreme wide angle again.

The nada sound is loud and I feel sort of lightheaded and yet grounded. I can see the vibrational quality of the visual field. There seem to be tingling nerve ends at my scalp. It feels pleasant, like energetic misty vapor seeping out in an intricate dance, but when I touch those many points, they are hot and tender. 

Waiter, I'll have what non-binary over there is having, please, thank you.

One of my partners is coming over tonight for the first time for quite some time now, but I kind of feel like meditating the rest of the day instead, and that doesn't seem fair to him.


I'm sure he/she understands that if s/he can't stand the Linda heat, s/he should stay out of the Polly Ester kitchen.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/24/20 1:10 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
1 h fire kasina

The dot is still vivid, bright, detailed and longlasting. The field around it had tiny points in different colors arosing and passing away very rapidly. The black disc appeared, with the dot and its halo/s/ blinking through it. There were color swirls, sometimes rapidly spiralling around a pitch black point. When the dot appeared again, it was less sharp in its contours and also less flat. The background stood out more. Tentacles came out from the dot when it was golden/yellow. They moved around a bit.  

There were phases when looking at the flame had gaps in the focus, blinked out, which made the image sort of choppy. There was a strain to it and a heavy feeling in the head. I realized that I was trapped trying to be a doer, using attention rather than trusting the vision to do its own thing. I eased back into a lighter approach. The strain went away, and so did the choppiness. The flame took on a somewhat different quality, an obviousness or self-evident-ness. I think this was when the dot turned into more 3D. It also made the experience more pleasant with more subtle nuances to it.

What in this is the murk, really? The color swirls? They don't seem that murky to me. More psychedelic. There were occasional constellations flashing by that might have been small sets of sharp teeth or something, or maybe some primitive organism. At one point I thought I saw a gently smiling woman's face, like a dakini image, but it disappeared as quickly as it arose. There were like strands of star-pearls beaded on strings for a while, shining so brightly that they looked like rifts in the darkness. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/25/20 3:53 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Yesterday I went to sleep far too late after pretty intense social interaction, and jeeze, there were bright lights moving around everywhere. It seems like all the sensory impressions, including the thoughts and feelings, autoliberated and transformed into light. The restless whisps of bright light conjoined in the center and formed a sphere-shaped cluster that gradually came into stillness.

This partner is very intense. We can be very much in synch but I can't maintain it for long. Since I started my systematic meditation practice, my need for stillness has increased drastically. That's how I regenerate. There have been times when I have found it draining to get drawn into this vortex of thoughts and feelings and associations of his, perhaps especially since I have historically had sort of a disconnect between talking and experiencing (textbased communication has given me the space to connect with the communication more energetically and kinesthetically). Luckily I seem to have found a way to bridge that disconnect. I have heard Jeff Warren describe how Shinzen Young has explained to him about his favorite meditation: tuning into the vibrational of a person during social interaction and sort of get a massage from it. I found myself doing that yesterday. I'm sure it was nothing compared to Shinzen's experience, but for me it was revolutionary - and yet it felt very familiar. I recognize that I have managed to get into that mode before under special circumstances. Now I could just tune into it. It made the interaction so much less draining! (Just to clarify: he is totally amazing, but I am very introverted.)

Still I found myself wired-up this morning. It was great to have a yoga class to get more in tune with my body. 

I'm squeezing in this time to reflect on my way home from the yoga class. I won't be able to read much on the forum this weekend. This partner of mine gets drained by every shift in focus. Focus shifts are generally very draining for me too, but shifting into stillness is the opposite for me. For him it is just as draining as any other shift. There isn't much he can do about that, as it is due to brain damage (he is very open about this on a variety of online forums so this is not sensitive information). I'm taking the time for yoga and meditation and some other stuff that I must do. Cutting up our time together more than that gets abusive for him. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/25/20 4:00 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:

This partner is very intense. We can be very much in synch but I can't maintain it for long. Since I started my systematic meditation practice, my need for stillness has increased drastically. That's how I regenerate. There have been times when I have found it draining to get drawn into this vortex of thoughts and feelings and associations of his, perhaps especially since I have historically had sort of a disconnect between talking and experiencing (textbased communication has given me the space to connect with the communication more energetically and kinesthetically).

text-based communication has always been the living thread from my impossibly-diferent-seeming inner to trying to find a language in the outer that is true to both.


Luckily I seem to have found a way to bridge that disconnect. I have heard Jeff Warren describe how Shinzen Young has explained to him about his favorite meditation: tuning into the vibrational of a person during social interaction and sort of get a massage from it. I found myself doing that yesterday. I'm sure it was nothing compared to Shinzen's experience, but for me it was revolutionary - and yet it felt very familiar. I recognize that I have managed to get into that mode before under special circumstances. Now I could just tune into it. It made the interaction so much less draining! (Just to clarify: he is totally amazing, but I am very introverted.)


"Luckily. . ."

Jesus Fucking Christ, Linda.

emoticon

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/25/20 4:05 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
I also said it was revolutionary, didn't I? emoticon

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/25/20 4:08 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
I also said it was revolutionary, didn't I? emoticon

It's like planting a vineyard, working your ass off for five or ten years to get all the grape plants trained and rooted and supported, going through another five years of harvests and tinkering with the wine-making process, and then saying, "Luckily, this glass of wine tasted really good."

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/25/20 4:11 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
It doesn't feel like my doing, though. With regard to these experiences, there is no subjective agency. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/25/20 4:18 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
just like you, to get right to the pointless point. I bow at your lotus feet.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/25/20 6:22 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Waves of Kundalini. I was just about to take my medicines and they were all over me.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/25/20 6:25 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Waves of Kundalini. I was just about to take my medicines and they were all over me.

I hope you're riding them better than i'm handling mine. I'm walking with a fucking stick at the moment. Mama Shakti wants my back alignment different, and She gonna get it done, too.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/25/20 7:43 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Sorry to hear. Yes, I lay down and surrendered to it, rode some delicate waves (fierce at first, then gradually more subtle), and then it tipped over into dissolution with lucid dreamless light sleep (basically my body slept and I listened to it snoring).

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/25/20 2:59 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
50 minutes of fire kasina. The dot was still readily there but wasn't entirely in focus and was flickering in and out of existence from start. The black disc appeared fairly soon, and the murk was murky. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/26/20 4:50 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I woke up all dissolutiony and brain foggy. The fog soon not so much dispersed as revealed itself not to be fog. It really is the falling away of phenomena before I had a chance to see them arise. There were flickerings, waves and vortexes where there "should" be bathroom walls and confusion where there "should" be thoughts and feelings. Confusion is just the flickerings, waves and vortexes of mental sensations. 

I took a yoga class and made sure to be careful with my shoulders, because there is an excess of histamines in my body right now. I have finally found how to use whatever the muscles are called that go from the triceps down to the hips, on the outside of the core, on the back side.That's a whole new stability. Lately I'm also finding that there is always much more relaxation available in the body than the mind tends to believe. That frees up resources. It's a very tangible liberation, like "Do I really have to put that much strain in my breath right now? Uhm... actually no! Do I really have to tense my entire body when I really slowly sink down into shavasana from sitting upright? No, I really don't." I'm learning precision and finding that it's all insight.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/26/20 6:41 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I think that if I were to do one of those meditative rants that Spatial mentions in a recent thread, it would be about the practicioners that think of themselves as doing socratic teaching in questioning other practicioners in areas where questioning isn't wanted and totally out of the blue. I'm talking about the kind that jumps onto you from behind and takes a bite and then just won't let go. They think that they are doing delivery work, but in reality they are shoving their own baby down someone else's throat, and when you choke on it, they take credit for it. When you spit it out, they either get butthurt or generously let you know that they are above taking offense when pigs like you don't appreciate their pearls. They think that they are doing the right thing in attacking everything that you hold dear, but they fail to see how fiercely they are clinging to their own identity or non-identity as a socratic nobody who is beyond mundane matters such as identity work, or socializing for that matter. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/26/20 6:55 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
I think that if I were to do one of those meditative rants that Spatial mentions in a recent thread, it would be about the practicioners that think of themselves as doing socratic teaching in questioning other practicioners in areas where questioning isn't wanted and totally out of the blue. I'm talking about the kind that jumps onto you from behind and takes a bite and then just won't let go. They think that they are doing delivery work, but in reality they are shoving their own baby down someone else's throat, and when you choke on it, they take credit for it. When you spit it out, they either get butthurt or generously let you know that they are above taking offense when pigs like you don't appreciate their pearls. They think that they are doing the right thing in attacking everything that you hold dear, but they fail to see how fiercely they are clinging to their own identity or non-identity as a socratic nobody who is beyond mundane matters such as identity work, or socializing for that matter. 

Good thing you passed on doing a meditative rant!! But if you ever do one, use this.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/26/20 7:10 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
emoticon

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/26/20 9:01 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Yeah, it's a non-rant about non-persons. emoticon

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/26/20 9:03 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Yeah, it's a non-rant about non-persons. emoticon


well, that non-person pit bull tore a big chunk out of nobody's ass.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/26/20 3:26 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I spent quite some time in the afternoon (a couple of hours?) just letting the mind be aware of itself. It did a lot of vaporizing. Now I did 30 minutes of fire kasina. It didn't do anything special. The dot became more alive towards the end of the session. More time would have been great. I'll make up for it.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/26/20 3:48 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:

The nada sound is loud and I feel sort of lightheaded and yet grounded.

Hi Linda, I'm glad to hear that something has loosened up in your practice. How is the nada sound? I have had tinnitus since I was 20. It used to bother me terribly but mostly I can ignore it now. However I'm wondering if it might have been premature awakening phenomenon. Mine is like a constant steam train hiss combined with high pitched whistle.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/27/20 2:25 PM as a reply to agnostic.
I don't know of there is a difference between nada sound and tinnitus apart from the approach to it. For me the sound varies depending on how I listen to it. It can whirl like the wind or sound like crickets. It can sound like white noise if I zoom out. I can zoom in on different tones. A dharma friend once asked me to try to zoom in some tone from the right side. The location is of course only a construction, but it can be done.  I noticed that when I did that for quite some time, discursive thoughts fell away. When I shifted back to discursive thoughts to report on it, I could only hear the tones from the left. I mentioned this to her, and it turned out she had the same experience. She had been working with this on retreats and arrived at a deeper version of it. I used a centered tone as concentration object to get into fourth jhana a while back, and that made the tone eventually distill into bright white light. It kept drawing me in and taking me through 4th-8th jhana and then fruition over and over again until I felt that I had to make it stop. It was the suffering door and quite intense and I had to get at least a couple of hours sleep before an early job meeting or teaching or whatever it was that I had to be alert for. Sometimes in dissolution the nada sound slows down to a wobble rather than sound. During a very strong Kundalini awakening a decade ago, there was like an electrical buzzing and sometimes loud tones. It wouldn't surprise me at all if what you are hearing is the nada sound, since the Kundalini force is strong with you.

I actually really like the sound. It's like a biofeedback system and reminder in one. I use it as a reminder to focus on the stillness and the space of open possibilities. 

If there is a sharp tone, what would happen if you try to zoom out? 

Have you checked out the so called exploding head syndrome? I suspect that is just the biomedicine trying to make sense of Kundalini symptoms. 

---

I just came home from a class of traditional yoga. I seem to be back in A&P again. I don't think I have ever had this much body control. The nada sound is loud, like a lot of crickets. Everything is buzzing and bubbling and clarity is warped up. If this is going to be a longer period of strong A&P, I may need to stay grounded, but I think it may also be wise to build concentration, because what comes up must come down, and I would prefer to deal with a macho version of the dukkha nanas with strong concentration if I can. 

Now grounding, taking a shower and cooking dinner, and then meditating. Where did this day go?

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/27/20 2:31 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Interesting.. I just posted about playing with the nada sound in Tim's thread about music & arpeggios. I was basically saying that it can be fun to put in some earplugs to filter out "external" sounds and play around with the rhtyhm of nada sound, heart beat, and breath. The nada sound for me is really high pitched and gets much louder when I have plugs in. I haven't been using it as a practice object for long at all, so I haven't parsed much difference in how it sounds other than its volume seeming to change. For some reason I also get kind of a conceptual visual of the nada sound.. like it's a bunch of microscopic multi-colored dots going in a stream between the ears. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/27/20 7:44 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Fire kasina, didn't time the session. The dot was longlasting, vivid and detailed again, with the area around it full of colored dots arising and passing away in rapid succession. There was movement inside the dot, similar to the movements of fire. The dot often had yellow as its predominant color. Before it eventually turned black, it had a black halo with petals on it. 

After the sit, I lay down in the dark. The dot continued to morph around a bit, more in color than in shape. Then it was dark. Stars lit up. They danced around a bit. I felt a jhanic pull and the stars started to form into patterns. It didn't quite get there. I was at the threshold to fourth jhana but didn't get in. I could feel the taste of it but was too exhausted to keep it up, and maybe too emotional to get into full equanimity.

I'm exploring the vibrational level and the wave level of feelings. It's a whole new world opening up. 

Need to sleep. Please remind me to reply to Steph if I forget!

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/27/20 7:51 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Thanks for the nada sound ideas Linda and Steph. I will play around with it a bit. I think I just have a base of anxeity/fears associated with it because it started before I had any meditation practice to deconstruct it. Something to work with ... thanks again.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/28/20 1:54 AM as a reply to Steph S.
Steph S:
Interesting.. I just posted about playing with the nada sound in Tim's thread about music & arpeggios. I was basically saying that it can be fun to put in some earplugs to filter out "external" sounds and play around with the rhtyhm of nada sound, heart beat, and breath. The nada sound for me is really high pitched and gets much louder when I have plugs in. I haven't been using it as a practice object for long at all, so I haven't parsed much difference in how it sounds other than its volume seeming to change. For some reason I also get kind of a conceptual visual of the nada sound.. like it's a bunch of microscopic multi-colored dots going in a stream between the ears. 
Cool. That's a whole symphony with some disco lights, then. I suspect that the nada sound and the kinesthetic vibrations and the statics or colored dots are basically the same thing: the mind's processing of stuff at a vibrational level. What do you think?

edit: I just saw that you had already written at least what your husband thinks:

I asked my husband, who is a musician, more about the inner ear noise and here's how he explained it. In this description the nada sound/inner noise is equivalent to what is termed "operating noise" in the description.

Your ear has both an input and an output. The sound of the world hitting your ear and resonating your ear drum is the input. The output is the connection between the ear and the brain. Anything with an output is going to produce operating noise that can be detected. Operating noise is the result of the interaction of all of the components in a device that interact to synthesize and produce the audible information. Operating noise only exists in an analog domain, meaning it's produced by voltages. The voltages interacting with one another produce the noise. The body is full of electricity, which are the voltages.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/28/20 8:21 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I think I have had my first depersonalization experience now, or rather, I think this was the first time I recognized it as such. After a rather weird night with basically no sleep and some freaking strong piti (not the pain kind) and some vaporizing into thin air, and a really tough beginning of the day, I was having a zoom job seminar and realized that it didn't feel like me participating. I saw my face in zoom and it wasn't mine. Experiences didn't feel like mine. I didn't even look like this mammal usually does. No ADHD or ticcing visible even for a trained eye. I was perfectly still and looked so relaxed, and the eye balls felt like they were pressed back into their sockets, and my eyes looked like they so often do on meditation teachers. Empty. They weren't trying to catch up and process everything all the time. I investigated the sensory level of the experience and recognized it as spaciousness. It was basically the same experience I've been having for some time now. I just never recognized it as depersonalization before, but more like a widening. A slight fear reaction was there, with rapid heartbeating. I have had that before without understanding why. I couldn't see why it would be threatening to have a widening of the experience. Now I think I know why: the widening is a shift in focus not only with regard to an assumed object. It goes deeper than that. The widening is the experiences knowing themselves, which I already knew, AND it means that the I that processes experiences, or thinks that it does, is bypassad as irrelevant. I somehow didn't quite see that bypassing before. 

Okay, so that's what it is? Is it? Then what's all the fuzz about? It felt somewhat creepy for a little while, but it was mainly a relief. There has been so much excess processing of stuff over here that I welcome the change. It is simpler and much less draining, and yet so much more nuanced. It's like someone finally opened the good bottle of wine, from a bottle that just keeps refilling because there are no boundaries between inside and outside the bottle, and the more you drink from it, the less intoxication and hangover you get (yeah, I overdid that analogy and mixed it so it doesn't quite make sense, but maybe you get the picture anyway). 

I can imagine that it might take some time getting used to this in all kinds of situations. I still don't quite understand how investigation is possible in the midst of this. Maybe that is like a back and forth movement between assumed perspectives, a comparing of references that takes place as part of the universe unfolding. 

I had experiences of this in the review after stream entry. I think I called it feeling unsolid, like I was vaporizing. Now it was clear that the awareness of sensate experiences tangibly "moved out" from the sense organs and the brain, with the exception of those experiences that actually belong to those parts. I have had experiences of that since before stream entry, but it always felt like they were still attached to the sense organs, with or rubber band or something, and were drawn back to it. Now it's rubber band free. There never was a rubber band. There was always just the inferior echo. 

This feels somewhat anticlimactic. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/28/20 8:29 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
I think I have had my first depersonalization experience now, or rather, I think this was the first time I recognized it as such. After a rather weird night with basically no sleep and some freaking strong piti (not the pain kind) and some vaporizing into thin air, and a really tough beginning of the day, I was having a zoom job seminar and realized that it didn't feel like me participating. I saw my face in zoom and it wasn't mine. Experiences didn't feel like mine. I didn't even look like this mammal usually does. No ADHD or ticcing visible even for a trained eye. I was perfectly still and looked so relaxed, and the eye balls felt like they were pressed back into their sockets, and my eyes looked like they so often do on meditation teachers. Empty. They weren't trying to catch up and process everything all the time. I investigated the sensory level of the experience and recognized it as spaciousness. It was basically the same experience I've been having for some time now. I just never recognized it as depersonalization before, but more like a widening. A slight fear reaction was there, with rapid heartbeating. I have had that before without understanding why. I couldn't see why it would be threatening to have a widening of the experience. Now I think I know why: the widening is a shift in focus not only with regard to an assumed object. It goes deeper than that. The widening is the experiences knowing themselves, which I already knew, AND it means that the I that processes experiences, or thinks that it does, is bypassad as irrelevant. I somehow didn't quite see that bypassing before. 

Okay, so that's what it is? Is it? Then what's all the fuzz about? It felt somewhat creepy for a little while, but it was mainly a relief. There has been so much excess processing of stuff over here that I welcome the change. It is simpler and much less draining, and yet so much more nuanced. It's like someone finally opened the good bottle of wine, from a bottle that just keeps refilling because there are no boundaries between inside and outside the bottle, and the more you drink from it, the less intoxication and hangover you get (yeah, I overdid that analogy and mixed it so it doesn't quite make sense, but maybe you get the picture anyway). 

I can imagine that it might take some time getting used to this in all kinds of situations. I still don't quite understand how investigation is possible in the midst of this. Maybe that is like a back and forth movement between assumed perspectives, a comparing of references that takes place as part of the universe unfolding. 

I had experiences of this in the review after stream entry. I think I called it feeling unsolid, like I was vaporizing. Now it was clear that the awareness of sensate experiences tangibly "moved out" from the sense organs and the brain, with the exception of those experiences that actually belong to those parts. I have had experiences of that since before stream entry, but it always felt like they were still attached to the sense organs, with or rubber band or something, and were drawn back to it. Now it's rubber band free. There never was a rubber band. There was always just the inferior echo. 

This feels somewhat anticlimactic. 
that's what i hear too.

It's like someone finally opened the good bottle of wine, from a bottle that just keeps refilling because there are no boundaries between inside and outside the bottle, and the more you drink from it, the less intoxication and hangover you get 


That's the happy hour special at the Bar of Last Resort this week! Eeerie, we haven't even put that on the board yet.

You witch.


(yeah, I overdid that analogy and mixed it so it doesn't quite make sense, but maybe you get the picture anyway). 


my kind of non-binary neuro-alternative witchlock!

love, tim

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/28/20 11:40 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
The widening is the experiences knowing themselves, which I already knew, AND it means that the I that processes experiences, or thinks that it does, is bypassad as irrelevant. I somehow didn't quite see that bypassing before. 

You can't see the bypassing, that's why you had to be absent for the bypassing to be seen!

I can imagine that it might take some time getting used to this in all kinds of situations.

I can empathize with that but in reality there's nothing to get used to - this is just the way things are. You might reappear and decide that you need to get used to this in different situations, but that's just the dream restarting.

 I still don't quite understand how investigation is possible in the midst of this.

Investigation is not necessary if experiences are knowing themselves and there's no processor there to do the investigating.

This feels somewhat anticlimactic. 

I think that's right. The seeker expects fireworks at the end of the show!

It sounds like you are handling it well, due to good preparation. I am happy for you.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/28/20 11:54 AM as a reply to agnostic.
I agree with all that. It's just that in this case, investigation is still ongoing so the switch isn't permanently flipped. I'm not saying that investigation is necessarily required, just that it is subjectively happening, and I'm describing how that subjectively happens. The flip will happen, and I'm not worried about how that will happen. I'm just describing the phenomenology. I actually don't think I'm in that much of a hurry. I don't mind taking some time to integrate it. I think that may be why I'm not particularly scared or in pain now. Instead of the incredibly fast and painful way, I'm taking the fast and pleasant way. That sounds cocky, but the truth is that there has been so much suffering in this life already. I don't need to make this processing a suffering too. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/28/20 12:02 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I think that makes a lot of sense. What is happening is just what is happening. Thanks

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4/28/20 12:06 PM as a reply to agnostic.
Thank you. And by the way, I'm happy for this mammal too. I think it will be taken care of in a better way from now on. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/28/20 12:26 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:

That's the happy hour special at the Bar of Last Resort this week! Eeerie, we haven't even put that on the board yet.

Funny thing: in writing it I was thinking that it would fit perfectly on the menu for the Bar of Last Resort.



my kind of non-binary neuro-alternative witchlock!

That’s a new one. I like that description. Witchlock - perfect!

Selfing noted. And that’s okay. I’m pretty sure this mammal and the experiences intersecting with it like to keep a personality.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/28/20 12:43 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Tim Farrington:

That's the happy hour special at the Bar of Last Resort this week! Eeerie, we haven't even put that on the board yet.

Funny thing: in writing it I was thinking that it would fit perfectly on the menu for the Bar of Last Resort.



my kind of non-binary neuro-alternative witchlock!

That’s a new one. I like that description. Witchlock - perfect!

Selfing noted. And that’s okay. I’m pretty sure this mammal and the experiences intersecting with it like to keep a personality.

oh yeah, try this latest concotion for the appetizer dishes at the Bar of Last Resort, courtesy of Steph. Just nibble at first, a little bit goes a long way---

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbieq_x7zuI

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/28/20 2:33 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Sounds like non-dual experiences. A long time ago Nick (Nikolai) and some others found that you can kind of ride the edge of the very beginning of sensations as they arise, and expand attention outwards, to slip more easily into a non-dual state (I say state because it's just a temporary state when the full permanent realization of non-duality hasn't been reached). I've found it's easiest to do this with sensations of the 5 physical sense doors. Like if you can catch the very beginning of a sensation and not try to stabilize it or do much of anything, the "self" will slip away. It almost feels like something is getting peeled backward and that a door or portal is being walked through.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/28/20 2:33 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:

oh yeah, try this latest concotion for the appetizer dishes at the Bar of Last Resort, courtesy of Steph. Just nibble at first, a little bit goes a long way---

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbieq_x7zuI

Detroit techno & electro are always welcome additions to any menu. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/28/20 2:38 PM as a reply to Steph S.
Yes, that's a great description. It seems like it's easiest for me to do it with feelings, though, maybe because that's what I started with long before I started any systematic meditation practice. It doesn't even have to be my feelings. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/28/20 2:44 PM as a reply to Steph S.
Steph S:
Tim Farrington:

oh yeah, try this latest concotion for the appetizer dishes at the Bar of Last Resort, courtesy of Steph. Just nibble at first, a little bit goes a long way---

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbieq_x7zuI

Detroit techno & electro are always welcome additions to any menu. 
Jefferson Ave!

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/28/20 2:52 PM as a reply to Jason Massie.
I'm more into Marillion (the early version with Fish as the singer) and Mission UK, and I have found that I tend to like basically everything that goes under the label of progressive rock. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/29/20 5:56 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Before I went to bed last night I did a short fire kasina sit. I was so tired that I could barely keep my eyes open, but I remember that the dot had long thin moving tentacles at some point.

I woke up with brain fog but as I let the fog be aware of itself, it was soon clear that it wasn't fog. It was just the enfolding of experience that my exhausted brain couldn't catch up with, and it didn't have to.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/29/20 6:38 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Before I went to bed last night I did a short fire kasina sit. I was so tired that I could barely keep my eyes open, but I remember that the dot had long thin moving tentacles at some point.

I woke up with brain fog but as I let the fog be aware of itself, it was soon clear that it wasn't fog. It was just the enfolding of experience that my exhausted brain couldn't catch up with, and it didn't have to.

physical exhaustion is its own very real bardo, in a lot of ways. My back has been so godawful, i've got my heat turned up to the setting "cozy and pampered," am moving at a snail's pace without sound (too much activity of late that involved using the growling siddhi just to get it done), and avoiding that meth-amphetamine-like vipassana shit like it would kill me, which apparently it could, in moments. I'm a member now of VA (Vipassanaholics Anonymous) and if i could move, would be attending my meetings religiously. I took so many drugs last night, just to get my body lying down with its eyes closed for a while, the last of my loving neighbor Dan's opiate stash that he bestowed upon me in Good Samaritan fashion, that a therapist friend marveled that i did not OD. I said, yeah, but it was my best shot, and now they're gone, gate gate gate, no more drugs, another opportunity missed.

Sleep, bubba, sleep. Rest, bubbakins, rest. Slow down, child, slow down. Pamper yourself NOW.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/29/20 6:48 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim, forgive me for introducing vipassana to you. Bad move, bad result. I'm really sorry.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/29/20 7:09 AM as a reply to Chris Marti.
Chris Marti:
Tim, forgive me for introducing vipassana to you. Bad move, bad result. I'm really sorry.

That's okay, bubba, i'm forever grateful. Vipassana and I will kiss and make up, and possibly just plain get it on, as soon as i fall off the wagon.

you had me at "dukha," honey.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/29/20 12:34 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
There is rapid cycling off cushion. I just came home from an Ashtanga yoga class. In the beginning of the class, while seated in a position where thumb and index finger were touching on each hand, the two fingers touching exercise did itself. Arisings and passings were equally clear. Body control was excellent. Then somewhere down the line, dissolution took over and I had to adjust and be more careful. That passed, and some energy returned (fear), and then there was another dip in energy (misery). There was a brief phase of edginess of the body (disgust), but there was space, and the body was self-aware and relaxed into stillness, and the mind was self-aware and relaxed into open spaciousness. Walking home, I made plans for a long sit (desire for deliverance). Tourette ticking impulses then indicated reobservation. However, they didn't feel like they were mine. They had nothing to do with anything else. Spaciousness opened up. The nada sound is loud (like many crickets chirping on a summer evening). I think I may be in low equanimity now, or on the threshold between reobservation and equanimity. Some irritation remains among the ticcing impulses. Here come the many subtle sweet nuances of silence. Irritation gone. Yeah, this is equanimity allright. I think I'll just savor the taste for a while.

I aced nonreactivity and skillful means in two critical situations today.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/30/20 8:13 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I still have the problem. Really weird.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/30/20 8:31 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Maybe I should just take the hint from the universe. I did sound manic in that post.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/30/20 8:43 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Interesting. Maybe later. I ruled out the characters, so a keyword could be it.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/30/20 8:45 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
First part:

Just to keep track (useless reading for others; sorry):

Yesterday evening I did some guru yoga and inner refuge practice and some mantra chanting and a short session of sziné without an object (still not sure how to spell that thing, but I know how to (not-)do it, and that's what matters). Given the significant amount of turbulence in my life right now, for good and for bad, I'd say it was a pretty good session. There were distractive thoughts, but there were also moments of some high quality tawa.

I also had the opportunity, eventually, to observe the process of falling asleep after some severe sleep deprivation, which was interesting. I'm too tired to find words for it, but I remember the tastes involved.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/30/20 8:46 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Second part:


As for losing my job after almost twenty years as a researcher (and being too autistic to want to start over at another department with new tasks), I feel surprisingly free. The thing that I have been fearing for such a long time has already happened now, and what do you know, the world actually didn't end. Also, there are some thinking outside the box things left to check out that I'm not going to miss out on. I have the ace up my sleeve that I really don't care about career or prestige or salary apart from the most basic level, and also I don't believe in boxes. If anyone is going to hack the impossible task of finding the hidden portals at the intersection between two helplessly rigid Swedish national authorities systems, it's going to be me. Thankfully, my life is full of people who actually appreciate and support that kind of craziness.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 8:48 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
None of the parts was the problem that made posting impossible. They just didn't fit together for some very strange reason.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 11:31 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Thing is busted for me, too...

If this even posts. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 12:11 PM as a reply to T.
T:
Thing is busted for me, too...

If this even posts. 
That widely reported sonic boom across the nation this morning has actually been me swearing at this piece of shit.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 12:48 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
There is something that was changed overnight and I'm having issues, too. The problems seem to be centered around posting but my subscriptions to all the threads are gone, too.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 12:59 PM as a reply to Chris Marti.
emoticon
I think it is God's punishment on me for posting so much. The Big Guy shut me down. So sorry abuut His collateral damage, but that Guy just doesn't seem to give a Shit about the innocent much.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/30/20 1:24 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
All the universe's big guys are like that.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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4/30/20 2:52 PM as a reply to Chris Marti.
I observed a limit of about 1010 characters on a post. Beyond that I would click preview and it would be empty. Being an occasional programmer, I was hoping it was exactly 1024 characters which would be a more logical bug (maybe there are some hidden characters?)

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 3:26 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:
emoticon
I think it is God's punishment on me for posting so much. The Big Guy shut me down. So sorry abuut His collateral damage, but that Guy just doesn't seem to give a Shit about the innocent much.


Oh no, are you the jinx now? I have contact mania and you have contaxt jinxness. This tapping into energies thing seems volatile. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 3:52 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
My guess is that the Wetpaint code has a MAX_POST_LEN variable which is set to some really big number, but there is some sequence of characters which should never occur in any natural language which can reset it to 2^10. However TFF somehow managed to trigger it with his uniquely creative use of the english language.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 3:59 PM as a reply to agnostic.
That's some sophisticated highly specific jinxness. It's a story too good not to be true. So the forum code has safe words? Really? Whose bad idea was that? 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 4:08 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Yeah, I don't think it was a bad idea though. I mean the existence of TFF is a theoretical impossibility. It might be  a heisenbug, in which case the only way it can be debugged is to place TFF in a state of quantum indeterminacy with a keyboard and wait to see what happens ...

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 4:08 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
It posted one in my log. It seems that there is not problem with short texts, but for that post, I had clicked reply to open the editor, and after clicking publish, it showed "Send new message" page, and I clicked the back button above its form, and it said the message could not be found. But the next time, instead of Reply, I used Quick Reply, and it got published with no problem.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 4:08 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
You're over-indulging your conceptual minds emoticon

What typically causes these occasional crap-fests is the non-act of not-doing general database maintenance - reindexing, etc. I've been told that has been done today, so please watch for better or worse conditions.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 4:14 PM as a reply to Chris Marti.
Chris Marti:
All the universe's big guys are like that.


emoticon

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 4:18 PM as a reply to agnostic.
agnostic:
I observed a limit of about 1010 characters on a post. Beyond that I would click preview and it would be empty. Being an occasional programmer, I was hoping it was exactly 1024 characters which would be a more logical bug (maybe there are some hidden characters?)
You fucking genius! 1010 is also deeply interesting, man: think coding, base 2. 1010=5, right?

so then we are on to: 5 what?

answer quick in less that 10101010 charcaters, before Chris calls us for over-intellectualizing and pseudo math.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 4:19 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Tim Farrington:
emoticon
I think it is God's punishment on me for posting so much. The Big Guy shut me down. So sorry abuut His collateral damage, but that Guy just doesn't seem to give a Shit about the innocent much.


Oh no, are you the jinx now? I have contact mania and you have contaxt jinxness. This tapping into energies thing seems volatile. 


Mama Kundalini is beautiful, but no one ever said the bitch was pretty.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 4:21 PM as a reply to agnostic.
agnostic:
My guess is that the Wetpaint code has a MAX_POST_LEN variable which is set to some really big number, but there is some sequence of characters which should never occur in any natural language which can reset it to 2^10. However TFF somehow managed to trigger it with his uniquely creative use of the english language.

oh a-knowing One, I was quite sure for several hours that Chris Marti had found a way to drive me insane and shut me down, without having to bother with yellow cards and banning.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 4:23 PM as a reply to Siavash.
Siavash:
It posted one in my log. It seems that there is not problem with short texts, but for that post, I had clicked reply to open the editor, and after clicking publish, it showed "Send new message" page, and I clicked the back button above its form, and it said the message could not be found. But the next time, instead of Reply, I used Quick Reply, and it got published with no problem.

That's a pretty good move, there you fucking idiot Azerbaijani Boddisattva drug fiend.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 4:24 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
That's some sophisticated highly specific jinxness. It's a story too good not to be true. So the forum code has safe words? Really? Whose bad idea was that? 


it just keeps coming back to God here, that Motherfucker.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 4:27 PM as a reply to agnostic.
agnostic:
Yeah, I don't think it was a bad idea though. I mean the existence of TFF is a theoretical impossibility. It might be  a heisenbug, in which case the only way it can be debugged is to place TFF in a state of quantum indeterminacy with a keyboard and wait to see what happens ...

well, aggie, that's just bringing the thing full circle. I WAS in a state of quantum indeterminacy with a keyboard, when God smote me, and damaged the homeland here as a side effect. The whole incident--- the Ineptitiude, the Arbitrariness, the Cruel Self-Indulgent Whimsy, the Lack of Attention to Details, and the Scorched Earth Policy Toward other Religions, the thing stinks with evidence of a Christian Source.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
4/30/20 4:29 PM as a reply to Chris Marti.
Chris Marti:
You're over-indulging your conceptual minds emoticon

I couldn't agree more Chris. Standards have slipped here since I first joined this forum TWO FUCKING YEARS BEFORE YOU.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/1/20 6:20 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
I first joined this forum TWO FUCKING YEARS BEFORE YOU.

So you were posting here in 2006? I can guarantee that I was here before you were. Care to post a wager? 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/1/20 6:22 AM as a reply to Chris Marti.
Chris Marti:
I first joined this forum TWO FUCKING YEARS BEFORE YOU.

So you were posting here in 2006? I can guarantee that I was here before you were. Care to post a wager? 

No, i was fully aware of the reality of the history. I was going all in on the technicality that your current name-tag thingie has you starting in 2011, after me. Call me a fuckin lawyer, anything to yank your chain, my beloved friend, brother, cherished advisor, and general sanity check.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/1/20 6:24 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
It was the ALL CAPS TYPING that got me.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/1/20 6:26 AM as a reply to Chris Marti.
Chris Marti:
It was the ALL CAPS TYPING that got me.

you like that, do you?

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/1/20 7:02 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
In my younger days, I was very competitive  emoticon

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/1/20 8:47 AM as a reply to Chris Marti.
Chris Marti:
In my younger days, I was very competitive  emoticon

I BET YOU I was more competitive.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/1/20 8:49 AM as a reply to agnostic.
agnostic:
Chris Marti:
In my younger days, I was very competitive  emoticon

I BET YOU I was more competitive.

CAN'T HEAR YOU GUYS! WHAT'S THAT YOU SAY?

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/1/20 9:16 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Sure.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/1/20 11:23 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Hey Linda, sorry to hear about losing your position but I just wanted to let you know, it's inspiring to me to see how positively you are looking at it, wonderful how meditation can help us transform these types of situations into the best possible light.

With Metta
John

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/1/20 4:05 PM as a reply to John W.
Thankyou, John! That makes me happy and warms my heart.

---

30 minutes of Dzogchen after a two hour dharma talk about the daka and dakini lovemaking. 

I'm working on integrating strong feelings into my practice. I believe it's fruitful. There's a movement of expansions and contractions there that can involve pain but doesn't have to because it's all just the dance of stillness with the dharmatta manifesting as the trikayas and the trikayas being the dharmatta. There is no separation in the lovemaking between emptiness and awareness that gives rise to the existence. Or rather, it both is and isn't. Similarly, in longing for someone I already am that someone and that someone is me. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/2/20 6:01 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Thankyou, John! That makes me happy and warms my heart.

---

30 minutes of Dzogchen after a two hour dharma talk about the daka and dakini lovemaking. 

I'm working on integrating strong feelings into my practice. I believe it's fruitful. There's a movement of expansions and contractions there that can involve pain but doesn't have to because it's all just the dance of stillness with the dharmatta manifesting as the trikayas and the trikayas being the dharmatta. There is no separation in the lovemaking between emptiness and awareness that gives rise to the existence. Or rather, it both is and isn't. Similarly, in longing for someone I already am that someone and that someone is me. 

you sort of raced right past that "daka and dakini lovemaking" part. Just saying. I'm asking for a friend.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/2/20 10:24 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
I'm going to listen to that talk again, maybe several times, because it obviously adresses exactly the kind of experience I have been having lately. What did you think of it?

---

I just did Michael Taft's latest guided meditation. Loved the meditation. Haven't been interested in listening to the theory behind it, presented by Michael Owens at SF Dharma Collective as the Vimilakirti experience. It's just too much information for me, too many names and details, but now that I'm hearing Michael Taft talking about it, it seems like I should. Apparently it's a pretty tough and humorous Mahayana criticism against Theravadan Buddhism, focusing on the Bodhisattva path. Maybe it would be a good idea to at least know what it's about. 

I'm not sure that I followed the instructions. I was mainly floating around among vibrations.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/3/20 5:46 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
First of all, I forgot to mention earlier that when I was out in the nature yesterday and the day before yesterday, I noticed that there was a huge widening of the awareness. I guess that could be referred to as centerlessness. It's basically the same experience that I have had out in the nature many times before, though. I have always thought of it as the woods communicating with me. It's normal for me to feel the ground not just under my feet but all around me as well, and to feel like waves in the air of information. A lot of it is smell, but not all of it. It's like there are tentacles and networks all over the place.

Last night I experimented with sort of a tandem-version of astral projection together with someone close to me. I haven't had much experiences like that before. I have been outside my body but the only time that lasted for more than a moment it was when my dad came to say goodbye after killing himself. I have just assumed that I don't have the drive and imagination required for that kind of exploration. The opportunity came up to get some guidance in getting started with it. In the very beginning there was a minor bump in the road as we discovered that I process things differently than what he was used to. I couldn't just leave my body behind that fast, and I felt that there was a barrier in my lack of visual imagination. My guide was very sensitive to my experiences, though. He asked some questions about it and took it from there. I could still feel my body but it was floating, so I was instructed to think of that as my astral body and go with the sensory experiences. I had said that I wanted to go into space but that upward movement just didn't happen. After some alternative suggestions, we settled for the ocean instead. I still couldn't visualize, but we focused on the tactile and kinesthetical sensations of movement in the water and the coolening of the water as we sank deeper. We sank deep deep into stillness and just remained there for a while. None of us had any drive to do anything. It felt safe there in the deep stillness.

Then there was a sense of movement. I think it was some synesthetic mix between tactile and visual imagery. I was instructed to just go with that, and from here I took the lead. I was swirling around there in the depth, spiraling, being swept by undercurrents, looping around... Then there was a loud outer sound that went all vibrational and sort of projected me upwards, and suddenly I was in space. Before that, I had been feeling the water around me, soft and smooth and cohesive, and the pressure from it. Now the pressure was gone and that cohesiveness was gone. Instead it was spacious and zero gravity. Then there was air, enabling me to move. I was moving fast. As I slowed down, there was a shift with gravity coming back and a feeling of increased density around me. Then I found that I was in a lake or sea, rising up to the surface. I could see the surface approaching and then the skye above me. When I moved my gaze I could see water around me and a beach and trees and a lawn. I don't remember if there were people on the beach. 

From here my memory is a bit vague. Maybe I sank down into the water again. Yeah, I think that was it. And I was drawn out by undercurrents, and then I was moving with the waves until I felt the sea bed. The tide waves were withdrawing, leaving me behind in the fluted sand, water splashing over me for a while until it was ebb. I lay there in the firm sand, my body heavy. Then after a while, I started to sink down in the sand. Soon I was covered by sand. I still felt completely safe. I just surrendered to sinking, descending. Then the firmness was gone. I was empty space. I asked my guide where he was. He replied "I'm here". Then there was that sense of being drawn into being again. It was overwhelming, in a pleasant way. I had to breathe heavily, almost like a newborn gasping for air.The intensity increased. Stars were exploding all around me for quite some time, and I was exploding with them. It was absolute euphoria. I don't know what happy chemicals were involved, but I was high as a kite. 

After a while the intensity calmed down, and I was completely serene, albeit still high. There were lights swirling around me. I was in the ocean again, appraching land. I stood on the seabed, watching the land. It was barren, with low conifer plants and little more. I could feel my body both there and in my bed. I think I got lost in some fantasy or dream, because when I suddenly heard the voice of my guide I was startled. 

In retrospect I realized that I had made a tour through all the elements.

I was still flooded with happy chemicals of different sorts, so I barely slept. When I closed my eyes, brights lights were swirling around and my body felt light. I was still high as a kite when I woke up in the morning, throughout breakfast and walking to my yoga class, and in the beginning of the yoga class. The asanas were challenging and my body was tired so during the practice that I didn't feel high anymore. However, at the end of the class, in shavasana, I was floating among multicolored swirls. Walking from the class, I suddenly felt first really exhausted and then shaky. I thought I might end up in a fetal position due to withdrawal symptoms because my body had depleted its supply of happy chemicals (been there before). I decided to sit down in a park under a tree to write up this report and get grounded, and so I did. Now I feel almost normal, but I'm starving. I also think I may need to digest my experiences in silence for a while. It was all good (more than good, obviously), but I may need to integrate it.

Tonight I'm going into an online Dzogchen retreat (zoom) with Lama Lena. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/3/20 6:40 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Wow, great.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/3/20 7:51 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I did about 45-60 minutes of shiné without an object to regenerate and wait for everything to stop swirling. I went into a vibrational state with little distinction. Now it feels like I surfaced from that too early. The nada sound is freakishly loud and my body is full of champagne bubbles.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/3/20 9:42 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
After another hour of shiné without an object, I'm feeling more earthbound. I keep having some kind of clicks inside my head, possibly the kind that seems to mark shifts between mind states.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/3/20 2:56 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
The Dzogchen retreat has started. I'm going to sit in tawa for a while on my own now and then try to go to rest in the so called clear light. The sleep yoga was only for advanced practicioners, but since I already do this practice regularly, I'm not going to bail on it. Instead I'll take this retreat as an opportunity to be stricter with this than I have been for a while. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/3/20 4:38 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
and then try to go to rest in the so called clear light. 


emoticon

Careful, that Clear Light is the exit door.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/7/20 6:00 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
It refers to transparance, seeing through, but I am indeed training to do the same thing when I die.

---

This first online retreat has now ended, the Dzogchen retreat with Lama Lena. Another one starts tomorrow, with Catherine McGee and Yanai Postelnik. I have to take a break inbetween to attend to a family emergency of sorts tomorrow morning so I might as well write up my log today and attend to my research data and do my laundry and so on. And deal with all sorts of other emergencies coming up at an alarming speed. The universe doesn't seem to want me to be in retreat today. 

Dream yoga was part of this retreat and I had one of those dreams that was lucid in the sense that I knew it was a dream but I was still running along with its content. I dreamt that we were a bunch of people doing it together. We astral projected to Manhattan for some strange reason. I have been there once and I hated it because of sensory overload and food poisening. In the dream there were much less people outside and they weren't selling those stinking sausages in every corner. The air was cleaner. It was quite managable. I got a good look at the Chrysler building as we were flying along one of the avenues. Some young girl was upset about just being a character in a movie. I explained the Dharmatta to her. 

Tonight I woke up in some altered state again, like I was the clear light. 

Yesterday was the most challenging day. I was in reobservation and I doubted the uselfulness of being in retreat and couldn't sitt still and focus, and I broke the silence (which ironically brought back the sense of space, temporarily). So finally I took an ashtanga yoga class instead, which helped. Spaciousness arose. The concluding dharma talk was the best one on the whole retreat, even though the lama thought it might be too complicated for those of us who are new to Dzogchen. It's not like Dzogchen is so different from other practices. Most participants seem to have been doing the preliminaries for a decade or so, which is basically Theravadan basics. True Dzogchen begins with the kind of practice that is providing the necessary conditions for flipping that same switch that Theravadan paths are all about too. It just isn't accessible until somewhere around late second path or early third path, I think, and that's why people do the preliminaries, which are basically a combination of concentration, insight and morality work. Dzogchen is one name for the practice of first finding and then gradually flipping the switch.

The other days I have been connecting with tawa quite a lot. It feels more reliable now, like close to rigpa at times. One of the days it was just there effortlessly for hours. However, I have had phases like that before, and they faded. There is still all too much confusion and contractions for this to be third path. It's still flipping back and forth. The stress today grabs me too much for this to be it, so that's a reality check. I need to be patient and honest and acknowledge my limitations. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/8/20 6:03 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
It refers to transparence, seeing through, but I am indeed training to do the same thing when I die.



Yeah, that's what i was getting at. Practice makes perfect. Remember to Surrender On a Dime, that's the key, i'm told
Dream yoga was part of this retreat and I had one of those dreams that was lucid in the sense that I knew it was a dream but I was still running along with its content. I dreamt that we were a bunch of people doing it together. We astral projected to Manhattan for some strange reason. I have been there once and I hated it because of sensory overload and food poisening. In the dream there were much less people outside and they weren't selling those stinking sausages in every corner. The air was cleaner. It was quite managable. I got a good look at the Chrysler building as we were flying along one of the avenues. Some young girl was upset about just being a character in a movie. I explained the Dharmatta to her. 

and she ran away screaming. You explained it too frankly. A spoonful of sugar makes the medicine go down. Never lead with dukha.
Tonight I woke up in some altered state again, like I was the clear light. 

we talked about this, kid. You said you wouldn't say anything about this until all sentient beings are saved. Now, what's left? Your candle is fucking snuffed. Nice fucking job, you selfish, self-saved anatta yogini.

Clear Light indeed. I WARNED you.
Yesterday was the most challenging day. I was in reobservation and I doubted the uselfulness of being in retreat and couldn't sitt still and focus, and I broke the silence (which ironically brought back the sense of space, temporarily). So finally I took an ashtanga yoga class instead, which helped. Spaciousness arose. The concluding dharma talk was the best one on the whole retreat, even though the lama thought it might be too complicated for those of us who are new to Dzogchen. It's not like Dzogchen is so different from other practices. Most participants seem to have been doing the preliminaries for a decade or so, which is basically Theravadan basics. True Dzogchen begins with the kind of practice that is providing the necessary conditions for flipping that same switch that Theravadan paths are all about too. It just isn't accessible until somewhere around late second path or early third path, I think, and that's why people do the preliminaries, which are basically a combination of concentration, insight and morality work. Dzogchen is one name for the practice of first finding and then gradually flipping the switch.

This is good, just keep slogging through this shit and maybe nobody will notice that you've become the Clear Fucking Light Herself.

love, tim

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/9/20 1:52 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
The day started with a silent morning meditation over zoom. Then I continued on my own, reclining in my hammock out in the patio where I could see the clear skye before clouds ensembled. There is wide open spaciousness, lightness and bright clarity. When I close my eyes there is brightness after a while, starting with soft lights joining in the center, then brightening and filling up all that there is. When I was watching the clear blue skye, I could see both the tigles sparkling and the rekkas(?)/pixels that Lama Lena was talking about in my previous retreat. I can feel the connectedness with the sangha. It gives me piti. The silence with all its rich nuances is more exquisite than the piti. There are reoccurring clicks inside my head, like new synapses forming or something. It feels like every little click allows for more of a free flow. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/9/20 6:12 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Next scheduled session of the retreat included a talk by Catherine McGee in the midst of grieving for her closest friend Rob Burbea. I feel so much love for her. My tears were streaming. That was deep.

Yanai explained some more about the frameworks for the retreat, which have now been changed because of their great loss. What a warm person (and with the striking resemblence of the Emergency Medical Hologram in StarTrek Voyager I feel completely safe)! So far there hasn't been much of teaching, but it feels complete as it is. I feel at home with it. I don't need more information than this to feel confident that Gaia House is where I want to go for retreats when the world allows it. I feel trusted to draw the lines for my own practice in a way that feels true, and I feel the space to do it and a firm ground offered if needed. That's all I need. 

After some meditation together, there was some unscheduled time (still is). I prepared food while chanting, which allowed me to stay in connection with the spaciousness and the awareness. First I chanted the Avalokiteshvara heart dhurini mantra https://youtu.be/p-wCPV1aBU8, which I love. Then I chanted the Sa Le Ö mantra three times https://youtu.be/nZ4d0oOgaVo. After that I chanted the warrior seed syllables of Tibetan sound healing as taught by Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLay6yCfl1qk_hKxxbzxxvwPYrS1TWiF2A, sessions 1-5, before eating lunch. I feel that the warrior seed syllable practice symbolizes my entire path and serve as a map. It's not a linear map, as there will always be new terrain to work with. It isn't a strict insight map, but integrative with the growing up part of the work:

A: crown chakra, space. Clearing away anger, opening up space, relaxing contractions, purifying.
OM: throat chakra, awareness, completeness, light in the openness.
HUNG: heart chakra, love. In the open space, light shines upon the love. 
RAM: navel chakra, fire, ripening. The quality of love ripens so that it is there for us when we need it.
DZA: secret chakra, action, spontaneous manifestation of the love. To me this means the full integration of wisdom and compassion. 

At this precise moment, I felt that I could work with A, OM, HUNG and RAM without triggering defenses or guilt or shame. RAM was where I felt that I need to keep working. I can feel these things energetically. Therefore I did not move forward with DZA. I don't mean to say that I have in every sense cleared away everything with regard to those syllables. This is just where I am at with the current focus at this limited point in time and space and situation. 

Now I will do some reclining practice before the next session, which will be a guided meditation and Q&A. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/9/20 7:10 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Relaxing and unclenching in spaciousness until brightness was all that was there. Then there was the kind of little electrical surge that appears when electricity comes back to an electronic device, and so the world reappeared.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/9/20 9:07 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
The group meditation started with some very basic yoga movements standing up, in order for us to take care of our bodies. That adds credibility, the way I see it. Then we meditated silently standing up for a moment. Then I sat down for a silent meditation (sitting down was optional). It was blissful, smooth, silky. Then some questions. Soon there will be an optional group meeting which I plan to join. I'll see if there seems to be an opening to ask about advice for the practice of letting the switch be flipped. If others have more emergent questions, I will let them have priority.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/9/20 11:33 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
The centerlessness is there even when the mind contracts. It seems to be a matter of zooming in or out, not different states. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/9/20 2:44 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Intention: for my coming into being generally to be driven by joy rather than fear.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/9/20 2:59 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Intention: for my coming into being generally to be driven by joy rather than fear.


i thought that was effortless.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/9/20 4:14 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
The centerlessness is there even when the mind contracts. It seems to be a matter of zooming in or out, not different states. 

Don't know about you, but I found there's an emptiness to the centreless that I hadn't quite expected.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/9/20 11:32 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Intention: for my coming into being generally to be driven by joy rather than fear.


i thought that was effortless.

I mean in daily life, every time there is a contraction. That is also a coming into being. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/9/20 11:36 PM as a reply to Not two, not one.
Not two, not one:
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
The centerlessness is there even when the mind contracts. It seems to be a matter of zooming in or out, not different states. 

Don't know about you, but I found there's an emptiness to the centreless that I hadn't quite expected.
Yeah, I guess so. It doesn't seem like that big of a deal. I still kind of hope that there is more to it than this. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/9/20 11:39 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Not two, not one:
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
The centerlessness is there even when the mind contracts. It seems to be a matter of zooming in or out, not different states. 

Don't know about you, but I found there's an emptiness to the centreless that I hadn't quite expected.
Yeah, I guess so. It doesn't seem like that big of a deal. I still kind of hope that there is more to it than this. 
I think there's more. I've seen the face of it.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/10/20 12:57 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Intention: for my coming into being generally to be driven by joy rather than fear.

Related goal: for doing good to unfold on its own, relatively effortlessly, as the default spontaneous action. 

---

morning sit: effortlessly spacious and bright

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/10/20 1:04 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Intention: for my coming into being generally to be driven by joy rather than fear.

Related goal: for doing good to unfold on its own, relatively effortlessly, as the default spontaneous action. 

---

morning sit: effortlessly spacious and bright
Let it rip, Kho-Dez.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/10/20 1:48 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Not two, not one:
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
The centerlessness is there even when the mind contracts. It seems to be a matter of zooming in or out, not different states. 

Don't know about you, but I found there's an emptiness to the centreless that I hadn't quite expected.
Yeah, I guess so. It doesn't seem like that big of a deal. I still kind of hope that there is more to it than this. 

What are you hoping for?

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/10/20 2:20 AM as a reply to Not two, not one.
Less effort in life, I guess. And less separation.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/10/20 2:24 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Less effort in life, I guess. And less separation.

The only accomplishments and skills that you can truly be said to have “attained” or “mastered” are those you can do within a single breath.
 
Why? Because you always have one breath to work with, this breath. The next breath is not guaranteed, ever. If you don’t get it done on this breath, it won’t get done at all, ever. Every breath is a Hail Mary pass as the clock expires, win or lose, all or nothing (though nothing, truthfully, is not so bad, and relatively speaking is even best, and there are those who believe it superior to all).
 
[Buzzer sound.] Thanks for playing, game over.

love, tim

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/10/20 3:28 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Less effort in life, I guess. And less separation.

May your wish be granted.  I see no reason why not.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/10/20 4:43 AM as a reply to Not two, not one.
Thanks! Good! I'm hoping that this is not the final switch flipping. It might be third path, but I wouldn't mind if it isn't.

This may be just a retreat thing, but currently sensory experiences are self-evident, effortless and... complete? And flowy, in a simple matter of fact way. 

---

I did some lucid dreamless sleep inbetween sessions because I needed the sleep. Then there have been some dharma reflections, group meditation, and sharing in small groups. At the moment I'm skipping the optional group session with Yanai, because I got to talk yesterday and I think it is easier for people to talk if there are fewer listeners. After all, I get to share here at DhO as much as I like. Many haven't found their way to such resources.

In his reflections Yanai said something about freedom in the limitations that I think might be key to how I need to let go of some expectations. I mean, I do find such freedom often - having to live with poor executive function makes it very clear how draining every decision can be - but I think part of me still has hopes of some limitlessness in the awakening that is really just a fairy tale. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/10/20 7:19 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I suddenly started to feel weird, alienated, so I lay down under double blankets and next to one of my cats to just let things rewire and disentangle or whatever was needed. That was good. Now I feel even weirder but less alienated. This feels like I usually feel after a path moment, when there has been a perceptual shift. Skinless, sort of. Like I've been turned inside out and back again, ensambled again with slightly different wiring. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/10/20 8:59 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
The next session started with physical exercises, which brought out even more sensory overwhelm but also helped digesting it, I think. Then there was a metta session and then a silent meditation focusing on our hearts. I noticed that something had changed there, energetically. Something has loosened up around the heart chakra, and now a sense of being contained isn't there anymore. At the same time, there is one tiny spot at the core that stands out as dense and tense and sore, as if it takes it upon itself to carry everything that was previously contained by a whole complex of tensions. I asked Yanai about that, with a leading question. I sort of wanted him just to confirm that the dense spot doesn't really have to carry anything, that believing so is merely a delusion. He did something wiser. He reminded me to approch it more humbly, with curiosity about what function it fills, and with acceptance. That was very helpful. It immediately brought about the beginning of integration, or so it felt. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/11/20 4:25 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Sitting today has a simple beauty to it. I forget to close my eyes, because there is much less tugging of the senses. There is no need to shut anything out. The only reason I shut the door to my patio when they were mowing the lawn outside was for the sake of the group sharing on zoom. I wasn't disturbed by it. I can sense in my body that there is cycling going on, living its own life. Concentration lives its own life too, as does the zooming in and out. No effort is needed. Clarity is just there on its own. Relaxation is there on its own. Posture happens on its own. Everything is an ongoing flow and still at the same time. 

I was a bit shaky yesterday, but video chatting with a loved one helped me find ground again. Thank goodness for feelings! 

Other people's feelings are so beautiful too. Our humanity in all its limitations, our vulnerability. That's just wow. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/11/20 4:39 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Sitting today has a simple beauty to it. I forget to close my eyes, because there is much less tugging of the senses. There is no need to shut anything out. The only reason I shut the door to my patio when they were mowing the lawn outside was for the sake of the group sharing on zoom. I wasn't disturbed by it. I can sense in my body that there is cycling going on, living its own life. Concentration lives its own life too, as does the zooming in and out. No effort is needed. Clarity is just there on its own. Relaxation is there on its own. Posture happens on its own. Everything is an ongoing flow and still at the same time. 

I was a bit shaky yesterday, but video chatting with a loved one helped me find ground again. Thank goodness for feelings! 

Other people's feelings are so beautiful too. Our humanity in all its limitations, our vulnerability. That's just wow. 
as always, when i am out of my depth, as i am here with what strikes me as a clear entry upon the third path, i resort in all humility and the fear of God, to simply spreading the good news of the gospel of Shargrol, which in its wisom always seems to me to apply to every moment of the path, all paths:

Shargrol

"
A gentler approach is to have the intention to stay on the breath, allow for both success and failure to happen, and when failure eventually happens (which of course it will, that's built into the practice, no big deal) --- then the important part of practice happens: noting what was so seductive to the mind. The important thing isn't to get a A+ in class for staying on the breath, it's to learn about how your own mind works. It's learning directly what seduces the mind, and once we know, we can't be very confused anymore. Over time, with the gentler approach, the mind will follow the intention and stay on the breath and it will be a much more sustainable. It won't require effort because your practice didn't require effort with the gentler approach. The mind can hold breathing in awareness without a big struggle".

love, tim

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/11/20 4:58 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
That gentleness has been integrated in my practice from the start, with some frustrated exceptions. I never really understood what point there would be to turn the practice into a struggle. A mercy is what it is. 

Love right back at ya!

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/11/20 5:37 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
I could see both the tigles sparkling and the rekkas(?)/pixels that Lama Lena was talking about in my previous retreat.

Hi Linda! Read some of your posts today, it's great to see how much you did with dream and sleep yoga since I last visited here couple of months ago :-). I was practicing a lot with hypnagogic lucidity and learned to go into some crazy in-between formless and formed LSD-DMT-like visions. You kept writing about happy chemicals after LD adventures - I am also trying to establish what it is, let me know, when you know. Can you write more the tigles and pixels? I am using pixels/points and indra's net to willfully manifest other more complex geometric figures. Since I started doing it, it's like my so far "formless" experiences started to show up their inside coating full of some protoforms. I spend more time in geometric lucid hypnagogia now - and it's not that that's what I chose. More like a side-effect. That's just what happens. So the space occasionally bursts with spirals, funnels, fractals, textures, element - like textures, which seem like all-watery, earthy or airy screens. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/11/20 6:25 AM as a reply to hae1en.
I always appreciate your input. Sure, if I ever learn what those happy chemicals are, I'll share. I suspect it's a powerful blend of many different ones, and that being in love adds to what is available as a baseline (love as a resource rather than a hindrance - what a lovely finding!). I also think I may have increased my intake of oxygene right before the fireworksy stuff happened. 

Tigles, if I understand it correctly, are points of light that seem to move around intentionally, and I think they are manifestations of cognitive activity living its own life, sort of. They appear in the murk but also on any clear background that allows for just watching the movement of the mind. The pixels are just the points that appear one at a time in our visual field because attention is so narrow. The exercise was to observe that and realize that there was awareness of the skye despite those limitations. That's something that I have done before. This was just a new wording for it, for the sake of integrating the jargon in my active vocabulary. When I practice sleep yoga, I gently invite the tigles to conjoin in a sphere of light at the center of the visual field. That calms my mind and allows for peace to appear. 

I'm not currently having any elaborate visuals, but I have had such phases and I really enjoyed that. After these retreats I'm going to take up fire kasine again. That seems to add some juice to my visual field. In fact, I think I'll start adding some fire kasina practice to the retreat practice. It's online, after all. No need to stick strictly to the suggestions. These teachers are quite pragmatic, too, so I don't think they would mind at all. 

I do have hypnagogic swirls going on in my meditation, though, even with my eyes open. Sometimes a nimitta, or something reminding of that, appears with my eyes open too.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/11/20 6:54 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Tigles, if I understand it correctly, are points of light that seem to move around intentionally, and I think they are manifestations of cognitive activity living its own life, sort of. They appear in the murk but also on any clear background that allows for just watching the movement of the mind. The pixels are just the points that appear one at a time in our visual field because attention is so narrow. 
When I practice sleep yoga, I gently invite the tigles to conjoin in a sphere of light at the center of the visual field. That calms my mind and allows for peace to appear. 
I do have hypnagogic swirls going on in my meditation, though, even with my eyes open. Sometimes a nimitta, or something reminding of that, appears with my eyes open too.
Do the "waking" lights resemble these: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3_pv6us8A0 ?
Recently after meditation I also got a regular "migrain aura":  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVFIcF9lyk8 ?
However, no migrain nor seizures ever happen after these phenomena. 
But we definitely do something with our brains, huh?
<3

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/11/20 7:09 AM as a reply to hae1en.
The hypnagogic swirls appearing in daily life and in formal meditation can sometimes look something like that. The tigles are something different, though. They are very concentrated points of bright light that seem to have continuity and move around (which is of course a construct). I had something resembling that migraine aura for a short while too. Not exactly like that, but it was an aura phenomenon that differed from the usual after image effect that can appear around phenomena in the visual field. Meditation definitely does some fascinating stuff to our brains. The visual changes are very tangible - the wide angle of the visual field has been revolutionary for my safety in traffic - but at the moment I'm amazed by how peaceful and happy I feel despite a lot of stressful things going on in my life. That's truly a miracle.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/11/20 7:40 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Any phenomena similar to these here?
Regarding tigle / similar to comets with tail, how about these: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_field_entoptic_phenomenon

S
ome of these phenomena are eye-generated, but some brain-generated and I am not thinking of reducing their mechanism to some neural circuitry, but simply like to know, what happens in the brain when "spiritual" events occur. Just as I am not reducing love to an outburst of oxitocine and endorphines, although neurochemicals "accompany" love.[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_snow#/media/File<img src=]

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/11/20 11:33 AM as a reply to hae1en.
None of those are what I refer to as rekkas (or whatever it was called) or pixels. I have seen all the others. I knew what floaters are and the after-images of the landscapes too. I don't think of any of these as distortions, but as "normal" vision when some of the brain's photoshopping is seen through. Those fastmoving dots in both links seem to be what is referred to as tigles in skyegazing, although I have sometimes seen them in the center of the visual field, where one of the articles said that they shouldn't appear, so I don't know. Anyway, that's not any important part of my practice. I just followed the instruction to tick that box. I don't necessarily buy into the more religious parts of the practice with regard to interpreting visual phenomena. It's good to have a scientific mindset with regard to such phenomena, I think, so thankyou! The bright dots and other small shapes of bright white light that I see dancing around in the murk and gradually conjoining as a sphere of light are more important in my practice, as that's part of my sleep yoga routine and I have noticed that it has the effect of more peaceful and clearer sleep, regardless of what they are. EDIT: to clarify, I see this pretty much as a magickal ritual rather than anything that bas any scientific base.

I wonder if the blood flow in the retina has any relationship to the movements of attention. What do you think? I mean, after all, even when we think that we hold our gaze still, there are often micro movements having to do with the movement of our cognitive processing. I suppose they might have some influence on the blood flow too? EDIT: on the other hand, maybe not, lol. That seems pretty far-fetched. This is a good example of how seductive and misleading both concepts and forms can be when we try to make sense of them. 

Yeah, it's interesting how the brain interacts with our mind and with the rest of our body.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/11/20 2:33 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Hope you don't mind me chipping in, but I have simliar experiences and this is what I see when I watch these lights.

1. A very fine hexagonal mesh in the background, like this but much much fainter.
2. Overlaid with small royal blue dots. If I am very still I can alternate these with a vivid purple, and I have the sense of forest green behind them too.
3. The dots tend to form circular pulses or twinkles (edit: sorry these are the wrong colour and shape, but all I could find), and the whole thing usually contracts. A bit like a cross between a kaleidoscope and a whirlpool (but slower than the link).

This is also quite a good representation of the elements of the vision, although much less exact.

Linda, is that similar to what you see?

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/11/20 2:50 PM as a reply to Not two, not one.
Pretty much so, yes. Thankyou!

---

Lots of spaciousness.

During the later part of the day there have been a couple of slightly annoying reobservations (itching, ticking, some tensions, thoughts buzzing), which I attribute at least partly to sleep deprivation.

I feel inclined to take up shamatha. Conditions seem to favor that.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/12/20 9:06 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Sitting is mainly spacious and harmonious right now, but staying aware while having a job seminar feels like it leads onward somehow. I'm not exactly sure how, but something happens. Something loosens up. I did some yoga at home today, squeezed it in between retreat sessions and cooking and eating and reading for the seminar and taking part in the seminar over zoom. It felt so good. Yoga is indeed an essential part of my practice. I couldn't do without it.

I really want and need to find time for a systematic shamatha practice at this time. Life circumstances are a bit tricky in that regard, but I will find a way. Part of that, I think, is clarifying the distinction between wanting (and different kinds of it) and needing, and building trust. I guess relationships are part of the practice too (part of it but not interchangeable with the formal practice). There is a small window now for cultivating concentration, and in my experience, that is necessary for what is to come. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/12/20 12:29 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
About an hour and a half of shamatha. Need to build the habit and momentum. The jhanic factors are there but I have gotten so used to widening and opening up my focus. I did get into jhanas, but I'm not entirely sure which ones. Probably first and second. It's like the piti has become more finegrained somehow, which changes the landmarks in a way that I'm not yet sure of. I'm very sure that I never reached fourth. That's not strange at all, because I had company, and it was of the kind that traditionally constitutes a hindrance. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/13/20 4:47 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
AI'm very sure that I never reached fourth. That's not strange at all, because I had company, and it was of the kind that traditionally constitutes a hindrance. 

TMFI, honey, way Too Much Fucking Information, traditionally speaking.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/13/20 5:10 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Did I make you blush, Tim? emoticon

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5/13/20 5:12 AM as a reply to hae1en.
Hector:
I am not sure if it's because I work in the field of computer vision, but the visual field for my hypnagogia looks a lot like the progression
from dots and edges (Sobel, Laplacian of Gaussian), wavy dots and lines (Gabor filter family), parts and circular waves,
then recognizable objects, then autonomous scenery and then the autonomous narrative kicks in.

Interesting. In one of my first fruitions, three images presented themselves rapidly: reality as vibrating strings, as waves, and as particles formed around a black hole. Then everything including myself vanished into the black hole. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/13/20 6:06 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Did I make you blush, Tim? emoticon

Of course not. It's not like i said "Howdy-howdy" or something.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/13/20 6:16 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Hector:
I am not sure if it's because I work in the field of computer vision, but the visual field for my hypnagogia looks a lot like the progression
from dots and edges (Sobel, Laplacian of Gaussian), wavy dots and lines (Gabor filter family), parts and circular waves,
then recognizable objects, then autonomous scenery and then the autonomous narrative kicks in.

Interesting. In one of my first fruitions, three images presented themselves rapidly: reality as vibrating strings, as waves, and as particles formed around a black hole. Then everything including myself vanished into the black hole. 

Hi Linda, Hector and Not two, Not one,

Since this is Linda's thread, how about we move the discussion on relationship between hypnagogia, nimittas, lucid dreaming, fire kasina and insight vs concentration work to the thread Hector set up? I couldn't find it though.... 

There are interesting parallels to be described with neuroscience of hallucination. Check out this video summary of Jack Cowan's papers on psychedelics and migraine auras. It basically shows how neural activation wave travels through our visual cortex, with columns coding protoforms (like dots, edges, angles, swings etc.) coming together in a caleidoscopic conscious fractal visions. This mechanism probably underlays all the phenomena we talked about. So it can reflect the movements (or nonmovements) of attention, I would say, Linda. We can activate this wave by willfull concentration whereas psychonauts drop magical substances on the surface of their visual cortex, which we do not need apparently.

Not two, Not one - the hexagonal grid (honeycomb) is called Indra's net in dzogchen and there is a sequence of steps to work with it.

If any of you is interested to exchange more, could you respond in a dedicated thread? Linda, thanks for the hospitality! :-) 

PS. Linda, I am happy to read you are walking your dreams now with someone dear to your heart <3 :-)

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/13/20 6:51 AM as a reply to hae1en.
emoticon

hae1en, would you mind dropping me an email? I have an off the record question for you. Optional, of course.
i'm at tim_farrington@msn.com
and https://www.facebook.com/tim.farrington.73

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/13/20 10:51 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Hector:
Sorry I deleted the thread since I got no responses and I had duplicated it on Tim's thread. I'll reboot it since it might be interesting to other people exploring the imagery side.

Hector, i'd love it if you put the thread, or its evolutionary descendant, up again. I would love to crash the party and argue that John of the Cross's position on all this light show stuff is that it's best ignored as an obvious temptation of the devil and leads only to sex, drugs, and rock and roll. (paraphrasing; he says it better in the Reformation-era Castilian Spanish)

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/13/20 8:36 PM as a reply to hae1en.
Thanks hae1en, I'm truly blessed when it comes to having people dear to my heart. 

I will gladly continue the discussions in Hector's fascinating thread (after I have had some sleep).

---

Am I the only one who finds retreats distracting from my practice? So many short chunks of stuff, so much talk... Today I had one online retreat ending and another one starting, and I ended up being so fed up with all the talk that I took the evening off and meditated on my own, completely silent and with no company whatsoever apart from my cats, for hours. Unfortunately, my cats (there are three of them) took turns in interrupting my shamatha. I don't know whether they have some fourth jhana detector built in them, but they consistently found ways to disrupt my practice every time I was about to enter it. Soooooo frustrating. 

I think I'll get back to work during the days and then do some cherrypicking with sessions in the evenings, and attend during the nights only if something seems especially appealing (and with so much dharma being available online already, outside retreats, quite frankly that doesn't seem very likely). 

I need to find more advanced retreats, or maybe design my own ones. 

I also need to find routines for separating my practice with regard to methods, because apparently I have wired my mind more towards open awareness and zhiné without an object than shamatha lately, which makes it hard to stay with an object. I guess fire kasina could take care of that pretty efficiently, but I also want to see if I can repeat the experience of getting into fourth jhana and formless realms by way of shifting from the breath to the nada sound and then distilling it into light. After all, this seems to be review, so that should be possible. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/13/20 9:17 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Thanks hae1en, I'm truly blessed when it comes to having people dear to my heart. 

I will gladly continue the discussions in Hector's fascinating thread (after I have had some sleep).

---

Am I the only one who finds retreats distracting from my practice? So many short chunks of stuff, so much talk... Today I had one online retreat ending and another one starting, and I ended up being so fed up with all the talk that I took the evening off and meditated on my own, completely silent and with no company whatsoever apart from my cats, for hours. Unfortunately, my cats (there are three of them) took turns in interrupting my shamatha. I don't know whether they have some fourth jhana detector built in them, but they consistently found ways to disrupt my practice every time I was about to enter it. Soooooo frustrating. 

I think I'll get back to work during the days and then do some cherrypicking with sessions in the evenings, and attend during the nights only if something seems especially appealing (and with so much dharma being available online already, outside retreats, quite frankly that doesn't seem very likely). 

I need to find more advanced retreats, or maybe design my own ones. 

I also need to find routines for separating my practice with regard to methods, because apparently I have wired my mind more towards open awareness and zhiné without an object than shamatha lately, which makes it hard to stay with an object. I guess fire kasina could take care of that pretty efficiently, but I also want to see if I can repeat the experience of getting into fourth jhana and formless realms by way of shifting from the breath to the nada sound and then distilling it into light. After all, this seems to be review, so that should be possible. 

sounds like a plan. It is ironic. I've always found residence in ashrams or monasteries is a genuine impediment to practice. They are work houses and sweat shops, basically, grinding out a product for the retreat masses, who in turn are consuming that product in the kind of processed wordy chunks that have been frustrating and tiring you here. There's a reason the real deal people head for the forest, the desert, the mountains, and the caves.
or maybe design my own ones. 

now you're talking.

love, tim



RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/14/20 1:57 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:

There's a reason the real deal people head for the forest, the desert, the mountains, and the caves.


That sure would be something. Every time I try to sit in silence outside, somebody approaches me and starts talking. Now that I officially have a formal meditation practice, maybe they would take no for an answer - haven't tried that one yet (I kind of gave up and took it inside) - but the wilderness where there are no people sounds like a safer bet. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/17/20 9:56 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Tim Farrington:

There's a reason the real deal people head for the forest, the desert, the mountains, and the caves.


That sure would be something. Every time I try to sit in silence outside, somebody approaches me and starts talking. Now that I officially have a formal meditation practice, maybe they would take no for an answer - haven't tried that one yet (I kind of gave up and took it inside) - but the wilderness where there are no people sounds like a safer bet. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6L38ee-WUU


The light came through the window

Straight from the sun above
And so inside my little room
There plunged the rays of love

In streams of light I clearly saw
The dust you seldom see

Out of which the nameless makes
A name for one like me


I'll try to say a little more
Love went on and on
Until it reached an open door
Then love itself, love itself was gone



All busy in the sunlight

The flecks did float and dance
And I was tumbled up with them
In formless circumstance



I'll try to say a little more

Love went on and on

Until it reached an open door

Then love itself, love itself was gone

Then I came back from where I'd been
My room, it looked the same
But there was nothing left between
The nameless and the name


All busy in the sunlight

The flecks did float and dance

And I was tumbled up with them

In formless circumstance


I'll try to say a little more

Oh love went on and on

Until it reached an open door

Then love itself, love itself was gone


Love itself, love itself was gone


love, tim

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/17/20 10:21 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I also find retreats disturbing in a way : it's like entering another world for a sec and then not being able to go back to yours immediatly, possibly creating a lot of confusion in the process. Sometimes, the next talk is exactly NOT what yo need to hear. Sometimes, it just derails your practice completely. Being in a receptive-sensitive mode, inappropriate instructions might seriously alter your energy. And after all, who's the authority on your experience ?

But then, it's great to have other people there, if they're diligent, and get all that practice in.

So I also came to the conclusion that self-designed retreats would be ideal !

Chose the texts you like ! Make your own program ! Perhaps with a few pals who are into that kind of stuff ! And dive in ! That sounds very good if you ask me. .

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/17/20 10:31 AM as a reply to Olivier.
Olivier:
I also find retreats disturbing in a way : it's like entering another world for a sec and then not being able to go back to yours immediatly, possibly creating a lot of confusion in the process. Sometimes, the next talk is exactly NOT what yo need to hear. Sometimes, it just derails your practice completely. Being in a receptive-sensitive mode, inappropriate instructions might seriously alter your energy. And after all, who's the authority on your experience ?

But then, it's great to have other people there, if they're diligent, and get all that practice in.

So I also came to the conclusion that self-designed retreats would be ideal !

Chose the texts you like ! Make your own program ! Perhaps with a few pals who are into that kind of stuff ! And dive in ! That sounds very good if you ask me. .

Olivier, Linda, we could do one.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/17/20 11:28 AM as a reply to Olivier.
Olivier:
I also find retreats disturbing in a way : it's like entering another world for a sec and then not being able to go back to yours immediatly, possibly creating a lot of confusion in the process. Sometimes, the next talk is exactly NOT what yo need to hear. Sometimes, it just derails your practice completely. Being in a receptive-sensitive mode, inappropriate instructions might seriously alter your energy. And after all, who's the authority on your experience ?

But then, it's great to have other people there, if they're diligent, and get all that practice in.

So I also came to the conclusion that self-designed retreats would be ideal !

Chose the texts you like ! Make your own program ! Perhaps with a few pals who are into that kind of stuff ! And dive in ! That sounds very good if you ask me. .
I think you are right about the possibility of harm in inappropriate instructions. I'm one of those abnoxious people who are less prone to being derailed because I can be cocky about finding my own way. I totally understand how annoying this can be, but in general it serves me well. I very often just refuse to take it in when somebody tries to teach me something that is totally out of tune with what I need, and I think that has spared me quite a lot of trouble and suffering and sped up the process. On the other hand, it can involve some very unskillful self-grasping and pride issues and the like, so that is something I really need to work with in the morality work and also to make sure that it doesn't constitute a veil of ignorance. That said - hell yeah! Nobody else is an authority on my experience. And hell yeah, exchanges with other diligent practicioners are worth so much! Sounds like a great plan. I guess the biggest challenge would be to find those other practicioners who are into the same kinds of practice and/or dharma texts and can approach it at the right level for all involved to benefit from it, and also function together as a group in the kind of setting that is needed. If it's an in person retreat, a bunch of challenges are added with regard to logistics, sleeping patterns, food, economic circumstances, needs for communication vs silence, boundaries... I'm loving the idea. I'm just realizing that making it come true might take quite some planning. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/17/20 11:30 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:

Olivier, Linda, we could do one.


What do you have in mind that would benefit all three of us? I’m not sure we would all want to do the same thing, but I’m willing to listen.

Also, that was a lovely text in your other post.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/17/20 11:31 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Olivier:
I also find retreats disturbing in a way : it's like entering another world for a sec and then not being able to go back to yours immediatly, possibly creating a lot of confusion in the process. Sometimes, the next talk is exactly NOT what yo need to hear. Sometimes, it just derails your practice completely. Being in a receptive-sensitive mode, inappropriate instructions might seriously alter your energy. And after all, who's the authority on your experience ?

But then, it's great to have other people there, if they're diligent, and get all that practice in.

So I also came to the conclusion that self-designed retreats would be ideal !

Chose the texts you like ! Make your own program ! Perhaps with a few pals who are into that kind of stuff ! And dive in ! That sounds very good if you ask me. .
I think you are right about the possibility of harm in inappropriate instructions. I'm one of those abnoxious people who are less prone to being derailed because I can be cocky about finding my own way. I totally understand how annoying this can be, but in general it serves me well. I very often just refuse to take it in when somebody tries to teach me something that is totally out of tune with what I need, and I think that has spared me quite a lot of trouble and suffering and sped up the process. On the other hand, it can involve some very unskillful self-grasping and pride issues and the like, so that is something I really need to work with in the morality work and also to make sure that it doesn't constitute a veil of ignorance. That said - hell yeah! Nobody else is an authority on my experience. And hell yeah, exchanges with other diligent practicioners are worth so much! Sounds like a great plan. I guess the biggest challenge would be to find those other practicioners who are into the same kinds of practice and/or dharma texts and can approach it at the right level for all involved to benefit from it, and also function together as a group in the kind of setting that is needed. If it's an in person retreat, a bunch of challenges are added with regard to logistics, sleeping patterns, food, economic circumstances, needs for communication vs silence, boundaries... I'm loving the idea. I'm just realizing that making it come true might take quite some planning. 

If we did it in the US east coast winter, we could probably rent up all five or six cabins/cottages here at my campground at a very good rate ($50/night is what the owners and i have been agreeing on so far). 

For everything else, there's the quality of the people. Get the right ones, and the thing does itself.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/18/20 7:03 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
I need to find more advanced retreats, or maybe design my own ones. 

I also need to find routines for separating my practice with regard to methods, because apparently I have wired my mind more towards open awareness and zhiné without an object than shamatha lately, which makes it hard to stay with an object.

This first part - it's hard to get into advanced retreats if you are not a long-term member of the local tribe. After two decades in the mainstream buddhist traditions, I think that middle people, I mean administrative stuff consisting of senior studens, will guard access to such events and it's hard for them to determine who is very skilled and who is in an altered and vulnerable psychological mind state. 

If I may recommend, I think your case is kind of special and if I were you I would consider rather looking for a teacher who will take you on an individual tutoring path. And I would avoid oversharing with administrative staff.

About zhine-samatha: honestly speaking I thought that zhine is samatha in tibetan :-). With support or without - how do you draw a line between the two? I mean zhine and jhanas?

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/18/20 8:50 AM as a reply to hae1en.
I think so too. And as I'm very eclectic in my practice and do not have a local sangha, that makes things complicated. And yeah, I believe telling people too much may be very sensitive. Apparently there are many long-term students that have never come across anything close to what started happening to me very early on, some of it even before I started my formal practice. I have no idea what the practice is for them. In fact, people in general are a riddle to me. I can't afford to pay a teacher, though, not much anyway. Nor can I afford travelling, and in addition, extremely complicated food intolerances make it difficult to stay in monastic settings, I'd guess. Thus I don't know how I would find a teacher. I was lucky enough to get a scholarship once, which gave me ten lessons with Michael Taft, and he said that if he ever got such resources again, he would contact me, so I guess that's my best hope. Meanwhile, I know of some teachers who respond to questions. If shit were to hit the fan, I'd contact Daniel. How would you recommend getting in touch with a teacher for an individual tutoring path? It would have to be the real deal. There are so many teachers out there that aren't sufficiently qualified. 

As for comparing zhine and shamatha, I'm still working on it, and I may be wrong, but I'm under the impression that the methods differ. The way I see it, shamatha is very strict with its narrow focus. Even when one lets go of the object, the focus is still extremely clearcut. It is based on attention rather than a more open awareness. I suspect that's what produces the typical jhanic arch. As for zhine, I have only tried zhine with a simple external object and zhine without and object, and as I understand it, the former is just preliminaries. It's simple and effective, and the goal is to make the mind malleable enough to let go of the object, as zhine without an object is the real deal. Zhine without an object is wide open awareness that doesn't grasp any object, so in some sense it's the opposite of shamatha. But then again, I know that there are also traditions in which you have more advanced visualizations and combinations of visualizations and mantras, and I suspect that reminds more of Theravadan kasina practice in its effects, so I guess that there is a wide variety. 

I know that one of Michael Taft's Deconstructing yourself podcasts is an interview with some skillful practicioner who came from a Mahayana background and then decided to learn TMI. They (a non-binary person) described the differences between jhana practice in shamatha and more open awareness zhine according to their impression, and if I remember correctly, they said something very similar to what I find now. This was some time ago, maybe a year or so. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/18/20 9:05 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
I've never been on a retreat longer than a weekend in all my years of practice. And I've also never had a formal teacher. I sincerely can't say whether doing more retreats or having a teacher would have sped up my progress because there's no way to predict that. I will say, that throughout my practice history I've basically relied on very good source material. And ALOT of hanging around friends who were either 3rd or 4th path - meaning lots of posting with them on DhO, instant message conversations, video calls, and some meeting in person with them. I have really loved this model of hanging out with people who have gotten very far or done it completely. I do sometimes wonder if at this point in my practice a teacher would be helpful, but there's also this pride there maybe about just doing it mostly myself. A very highly realized old friend of mine once told me, enlightenment is 95% you doing the work and about 5% a really good cheerleader to guide you when you need it. I've gotten very far doing things this way, so why change it? Friend-based retreats sound interesting considering the way I've practiced this whole time. It's something I might consider if you guys are looking for other practitioners and you'd be interested in having me. If we could find someone who is 4th path, or more advanced than all of us, join that'd be ideal. 4th pathers still practice and meditate so someone might be interested.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/18/20 8:58 AM as a reply to Steph S.
emoticon
oh hell yes, Steph.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/18/20 11:36 AM as a reply to Steph S.
Steph S:
I've never been on a retreat longer than a weekend in all my years of practice. And I've also never had a formal teacher. I sincerely can't say whether doing more retreats or having a teacher would have sped up my progress because there's no way to predict that. I will say, that throughout my practice history I've basically relied on very good source material. And ALOT of hanging around friends who were either 3rd or 4th path - meaning lots of posting with them on DhO, instant message conversations, video calls, and some meeting in person with them. I have really loved this model of hanging out with people who have gotten very far or done it completely. I do sometimes wonder if at this point in my practice a teacher would be helpful, but there's also this pride there maybe about just doing it mostly myself. A very highly realized old friend of mine once told me, enlightenment is 95% you doing the work and about 5% a really good cheerleader to guide you when you need it. I've gotten very far doing things this way, so why change it? Friend-based retreats sound interesting considering the way I've practiced this whole time. It's something I might consider if you guys are looking for other practitioners and you'd be interested in having me. If we could find someone who is 4th path, or more advanced than all of us, join that'd be ideal. 4th pathers still practice and meditate so someone might be interested.

I can relate very much to this, all of it. I would be happy to do a retreat with you. Well, all of you, if we can all find a common interest to form the retreat around. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/18/20 12:30 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I'd love to experiment with you, guys, but there is little chance I'll ever find myself in the US, as I've decided not to fly again if I can find a way.

Steph, honestly, I think the longest retreat I did probably offset my practice, making it unbalanced for a while and creating a lot of internal conflict. Possibly due to normal progress, but I don't think that was the only thing. So... I really reckon it's much more skillful the way you've been doing it.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/18/20 1:22 PM as a reply to Olivier.
Yea, it's sort of what hae1en said. Most of the retreat descriptions I see are for newer meditators and seem like I wouldn't get much out of them. There's probably all sorts of stuff happening where they post the more advanced retreats only to a select mailing list or some login site or something private like that. Or at an all levels retreat, they might give more advanced instruction during interviews to people they feel are at that level. I've also thought about potentially reaching out to do a solo self-guided retreat at a monestary at some point in the future when I think its safe to go out and about - something where there isn't a full official retreat surrounding it.. but you do have access to the nuns or monks who teach there once in a while.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/18/20 1:30 PM as a reply to Steph S.
Many advanced practicioners seem to be doing the solo thing, I've thought about it too. But having, at least one other person being committed there, perhaps just seeing them practice, sounds like it would be great to me, I mean, if one wanted to do a longer retreat, where discipline can be more of a challenge, like a few weeks. 

Yeah, the "public" retreats are usually quite frustrating, and there's the whole commercial stuff, teachers playing the role of the blissed-out-perfectly happy at all times yogi... which seems ungenuine and aimed at getting more beginning practicioners to keep coming and giving some more dana, and all that crap.... 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/19/20 3:06 AM as a reply to Steph S.
Steph S:
Yea, it's sort of what hae1en said. Most of the retreat descriptions I see are for newer meditators and seem like I wouldn't get much out of them. There's probably all sorts of stuff happening where they post the more advanced retreats only to a select mailing list or some login site or something private like that. Or at an all levels retreat, they might give more advanced instruction during interviews to people they feel are at that level. I've also thought about potentially reaching out to do a solo self-guided retreat at a monestary at some point in the future when I think its safe to go out and about - something where there isn't a full official retreat surrounding it.. but you do have access to the nuns or monks who teach there once in a while.
   tim_farrington@msn.com   , before this gets embarrassing.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/19/20 6:20 AM as a reply to Olivier.
Olivier:
I'd love to experiment with you, guys, but there is little chance I'll ever find myself in the US, as I've decided not to fly again if I can find a way.

Steph, honestly, I think the longest retreat I did probably offset my practice, making it unbalanced for a while and creating a lot of internal conflict. Possibly due to normal progress, but I don't think that was the only thing. So... I really reckon it's much more skillful the way you've been doing it.

There is always the option of doing an online retreat via zoom or something. I'm not convinced about going to the US for a retreat either, to be honest (sorry Tim, but I've got to be honest). Even if it weren't for the environment, the only way I could possibly afford it would be to use up my retirement savings, and since I'm soon out of employment and disabled, I may need those savings for survival. Besides, it's a long way to travel for something that might even offset one's practice. It would probably be wise to at least do a shorter retreat together online first, to see if the dynamics work. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/19/20 6:22 AM as a reply to Steph S.
Steph S:
Yea, it's sort of what hae1en said. Most of the retreat descriptions I see are for newer meditators and seem like I wouldn't get much out of them. There's probably all sorts of stuff happening where they post the more advanced retreats only to a select mailing list or some login site or something private like that. Or at an all levels retreat, they might give more advanced instruction during interviews to people they feel are at that level. I've also thought about potentially reaching out to do a solo self-guided retreat at a monestary at some point in the future when I think its safe to go out and about - something where there isn't a full official retreat surrounding it.. but you do have access to the nuns or monks who teach there once in a while.

I have been thinking about that too, but I'm not sure how to go about it. Anyway, my life is kind of a mess at the moment, so I don't think I'm in a position to plan anything right now.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/19/20 6:23 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:
Steph S:
Yea, it's sort of what hae1en said. Most of the retreat descriptions I see are for newer meditators and seem like I wouldn't get much out of them. There's probably all sorts of stuff happening where they post the more advanced retreats only to a select mailing list or some login site or something private like that. Or at an all levels retreat, they might give more advanced instruction during interviews to people they feel are at that level. I've also thought about potentially reaching out to do a solo self-guided retreat at a monestary at some point in the future when I think its safe to go out and about - something where there isn't a full official retreat surrounding it.. but you do have access to the nuns or monks who teach there once in a while.
   tim_farrington@msn.com   , before this gets embarrassing.

I don't see why it would get embarrassing. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/19/20 6:32 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Tim Farrington:
Steph S:
Yea, it's sort of what hae1en said. Most of the retreat descriptions I see are for newer meditators and seem like I wouldn't get much out of them. There's probably all sorts of stuff happening where they post the more advanced retreats only to a select mailing list or some login site or something private like that. Or at an all levels retreat, they might give more advanced instruction during interviews to people they feel are at that level. I've also thought about potentially reaching out to do a solo self-guided retreat at a monestary at some point in the future when I think its safe to go out and about - something where there isn't a full official retreat surrounding it.. but you do have access to the nuns or monks who teach there once in a while.
   tim_farrington@msn.com   , before this gets embarrassing.

I don't see why it would get embarrassing. 
that is so typical of your neuro-atypicality.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/19/20 8:33 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
I agree that an online retreat via Zoom or something might be better when we can manage to sync up. Realistically, I doubt we're going to be in the clear with this COVID stuff for a long time and I'm not flying anywhere (or even gathering in groups in person) until I feel very, very safe about it. I don't blame anyone for not wanting to come to the US. The way it's been handled here is a total dumpster fire.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/22/20 9:49 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I feel a bit weird, don't know how to describe it exactly. It feels like consciousness is seeping out from my ears. There are tensions from habitually trying to ensamble all the processes that go by my name into something that could pass as coherent, and it's like there's a very mild motion sickness. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
Answer
5/22/20 2:20 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
1 h 45 min choiceless awareness. I started to climb the jhanic arch but seemed to lack the inclination to climb all the way, so instead of entering fourth jhana, I dwelled in direct awareness.

I have been sloppy about writing reports lately. I have mainly been doing choiceless awareness and some fire kasina. I have been sleep deprived and had a histamine reaction from my allergy vaccination shots, so there has been something of a down period.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/23/20 12:00 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
So far today I have done vinyasa yoga, a number of short check-ins with tawa, a short noting session in the laundry room because I noticed some impatience (it helped), and an hour of do nothing practice. There is a lot of subtle energetic activity around my scalp and rhythmic ticking inside my head. The nada sound is loud. There is still a sense of consciousness seeping out through my ears, but today it doesn't feel weird. Cycling is rapid. It's fascinating how fast the scope of focus changes. My body is recovering from the allergy vaccination shots. The energy metabolism is getting better, and that makes my energy channels much less squeeky. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/23/20 12:39 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Then 30 minutes of fire kasina. The dot was longlasting and morphed with regard to color, shape, size, level of details, and flatness vs more 3D. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/23/20 1:23 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Then 40 minutes of murk-gazing, with a sense of it being alive.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/23/20 2:16 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I'm reading up on the fire kasina glossary now, as I lack the terminology to describe what I see. That's one fine glossary. Most of the phenomena are familiar to me, although I didn't know what to call them.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/23/20 7:13 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I have no idea either, I just made names up. Now I'm dumping the excess fire loops into black rocks my cousin suggested for me.
Makes me feel better. Where do you put your fire kasina fires after they form?

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/23/20 7:31 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I'm glad you were around and have the same kind of temperament as I do. I wasn't
entirely prepared, I mean who runs random programs on the internet with no firewall :/

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/23/20 9:46 PM as a reply to Hector.
Hector:
I have no idea either, I just made names up. Now I'm dumping the excess fire loops into black rocks my cousin suggested for me.
Makes me feel better. Where do you put your fire kasina fires after they form?

I usually just ground myself after intense experiences and let go to the best of my ability. My most intense experiences haven't come from fire kasina. They just tend to wake me up at night, or keep me from falling asleep in the first place, when the practice is ripe. I'm increasing my dosage of fire kasina now, though, so I may have to find new strategies. I still suspect that connecting to the other elements will be part of it. I have always found that connecting to the elements if nature is healing, and when it comes to fire kasina, I have heard that access to water is key. 

Hector
I'm glad you were around and have the same kind of temperament as I do. I wasn't

entirely prepared, I mean who runs random programs on the internet with no firewall :/

That’s a very striking metaphor. I’d say, the kind of people who end up here on DhO.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/23/20 11:24 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I think water started working for me but I got scared when I heard beautiful singing in the morning and didn't know what it was. I didn't want to hear voices. Now that I know how to blip I will it work again for countering the fire kasina.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/24/20 12:17 AM as a reply to Hector.
Hector:
I think water started working for me but I got scared when I heard beautiful singing in the morning and didn't know what it was. I didn't want to hear voices. Now that I know how to blip I will it work again for countering the fire kasina.


from the Love-Song of J. Alfred Prufrock, by T. S. Eliot


Shall I part my hair behind? Do I dare to eat a peach?
I shall wear white flannel trousers, and walk upon the beach.
I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each.
I do not think that they will sing to me.

I have seen them riding seaward on the waves
Combing the white hair of the waves blown back
When the wind blows the water white and black.

We have lingered in the chambers of the sea
By sea-girls wreathed with seaweed red and brown
Till human voices wake us, and we drown.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/24/20 1:07 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I have done a few sessions of just focusing on the visuals today, while also checking in with tawa, the Dharmakaya nature of mind. The small doses of fire kasina are starting to pay off. The murk is becoming alive. I didn't have a candle nearby today so I just went straight into the murk. There were color washes, flows, flares, mists, fogs, structures, black and grey stuff, grey stuff, white and gold stuff and a brief instance of molten gold. There were occasional grainy images of a loved one's face on the second screen, with quick partial glimpses of third screen. There were moving psychedelic spirals and flat greyish grainy spirals. I never got to the clearer black and white images or beyond that, but I recognized the pathway for getting there. I saw what could possibly have developed into creepy crawlies, but at this stage it was still very abstract. 

There were a bunch of head pops, whatever they are.

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/24/20 2:35 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
My best wishes for you and your family! Hope all goes your way!

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/25/20 2:17 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
I think you mentioned strings and black holes, so you might like this physics idea I used to play with the murk.
I just imagined it was some kind of low energy vacuum state and I oscillated it to bump it into higher energy states to make
dream matter from dream vaccuum

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_fluctuation

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/25/20 3:07 AM as a reply to Papa Che Dusko.
Papa Che Dusko:
My best wishes for you and your family! Hope all goes your way!

Thankyou!

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/25/20 3:13 AM as a reply to Hector.
Hector:
I think you mentioned strings and black holes, so you might like this physics idea I used to play with the murk.
I just imagined it was some kind of low energy vacuum state and I oscillated it to bump it into higher energy states to make
dream matter from dream vaccuum

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_fluctuation

Thanks! Yeah, I recognize the looks of that, or something similar, but I don't have as much imagination as you, and not the mathematical visualization skills to start out from, so I have mainly just waited for stuff like that to happen on its own. And it does. It's just not very reliable. I have realized that I could be more playful. This is helpful. Thanks!

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/25/20 6:26 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Hector:
I think you mentioned strings and black holes, so you might like this physics idea I used to play with the murk.
I just imagined it was some kind of low energy vacuum state and I oscillated it to bump it into higher energy states to make
dream matter from dream vaccuum

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_fluctuation

Thanks! Yeah, I recognize the looks of that, or something similar, but I don't have as much imagination as you, and not the mathematical visualization skills to start out from, so I have mainly just waited for stuff like that to happen on its own. And it does. It's just not very reliable. I have realized that I could be more playful. This is helpful. Thanks!


re: more playful. to hell with that, let's crunch some numbers!
The amplitude of quantum fluctuations is controlled by Planck's constant {\displaystyle \hbar }, just as the amplitude of thermal fluctuations is controlled by {\displaystyle k_{\mathrm {B} }T}, where {\displaystyle k_{\mathrm {B} }} is Boltzmann's constant. Note that the following three points are closely related:

  1. Planck's constant has units of [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Action_(physics)]action (joule-seconds) instead of units of energy (joules),
  2. the quantum kernel is {\displaystyle {\sqrt {|k|^{2}+m^{2}}}} instead of {\displaystyle {\scriptstyle {\frac {1}{2}}}(|k|^{2}+m^{2})} (the quantum kernel is nonlocal from a classical heat kernel viewpoint, but it is local in the sense that it does not allow signals to be transmitted),[citation needed]
  3. the quantum vacuum state is Lorentz invariant (although not manifestly in the above), whereas the classical thermal state is not (the classical dynamics is Lorentz invariant, but the Gibbs probability density is not a Lorentz invariant initial condition).
We can construct a [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_(physics)#Continuous_random_fields]classical continuous random field that has the same probability density as the quantum vacuum state, so that the principal difference from quantum field theory is the measurement theory (measurement in quantum theory is different from measurement for a classical continuous random field, in that classical measurements are always mutually compatible — in quantum mechanical terms they always commute). Quantum effects that are consequences only of quantum fluctuations, not of subtleties of measurement incompatibility, can alternatively be models of classical continuous random fields.

love, tim

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/26/20 4:34 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
I suspect there's a pun in there that I'm not getting. I'm too exhausted after a really challenging day. I won't go into the details of that on a public forum for integrity reasons (not my integrity).

Anyway, at least some things are too good not to be true. I was on the waiting list for a six months long weekly online course with Michael Taft, and today I found out that somebody had dropped out so there's an opening for me, with full scholarship. I'm getting my teacher back!

Since I last reported here in my log I have been doing some fire kasina and some focusing on the visual screen without the kasina, and some choiceless awareness. There was a setback because I seem to have eaten gluten contaminated food, but before that I was starting to see caleidoscopic images, still somewhat grainy. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/26/20 11:17 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
emoticon

hang in there, you marvel.

love, tim

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/27/20 3:42 PM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Thanks! Will do. Love right back at ya.

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After a stressful period I felt that I needed to get in touch with my faith in the dharma, and so I invested a few hours in the nine breathings of purification, the five tsa lung, the three doors practice (Ligmincha), guru yoga, chanting the Sa Le Ö mantra and the inner refuge prayer, singing dedications, reciting the entire Lojong seven point mind training, dedicating again, and then chanting the warrior seed syllables of Tibetan sound healing. Brahmaviharas practice was integrated in that. Wow, what a difference it makes! Before the practice I was swollen in my face, pale, and dark under my eyes, and I looked sick. The skin was hanging in my face, full of wrinkles. Now I have rosy cheeks and look invigorated, with a serene Buddha smile (silly, perhaps, but it feels good). Even my skin looks different, almost peachy. I'm no longer swollen. I feel peaceful and confident. The nada sound is loud. There is space and spaciousness. The tunnel vision is gone. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/28/20 5:16 PM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
This evening I did a combination of basic Ligmincha stuff, with nine breathings of purification and chanting and three doors practice; Lojong chanting; and fire kasina. In the latter, a very basic spiral-shaped structure was forming in the murk after the dot with intricate details had turned into something more bleak and then into a black disc. I was too tired to keep up the concentration, and I need to get some sleep before  I get up really early for a live online event with the Dalai Lama doing an Avalokiteshvara empowerment in just a few hours (https://www.dalailama.com/live).

Earlier I did Hatha yoga, which was exactly what I needed. I'm starting to build up my health again after the allergy vaccination shots and the gluten contamination. Clarity is coming back, together with spaciousness and calm. 

Today I made an Avalokiteshvara collage to hang up in front of my naked art so that I can sit in my most comfortable meditation spot during zoom classes without having to rearrange the art every time or risking to distract some renunciate guy. I mounted it on a hanger so I can just hook it on the frame. 

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/29/20 12:15 AM as a reply to Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö.
emoticon

Today I made an Avalokiteshvara collage to hang up in front of my naked art so that I can sit in my most comfortable meditation spot during zoom classes without having to rearrange the art every time or risking to distract some renunciate guy. I mounted it on a hanger so I can just hook it on the frame. 

photo, please.

also, the collage is easily removable, yes? One would hope so.

This renunciate guy, to tell the truth, is already distracted as fuck. Thank you for that!

love, tim

RE: Polly Ester’s practice log 8
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5/30/20 6:59 AM as a reply to Tim Farrington.
Tim Farrington:
emoticon

Today I made an Avalokiteshvara collage to hang up in front of my naked art so that I can sit in my most comfortable meditation spot during zoom classes without having to rearrange the art every time or risking to distract some renunciate guy. I mounted it on a hanger so I can just hook it on the frame. 

photo, please.

also, the collage is easily removable, yes? One would hope so.

This renunciate guy, to tell the truth, is already distracted as fuck. Thank you for that!

love, tim

Somehow I have a hard time picturing you as a renunciate guy, especially when you put it like that. emoticon I don't think copyright laws would allow me to post pictures of the pictures on the internet, but if you happen to visit Sweden you would be welcome to see for yourself. 

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Yesterday I was exhausted from sleep deprivation. I missed part of the preliminaries of the Dalai Lama's Avalokiteshvara empowerment because I dozed off, and I was afraid that I would miss the actual empowerment the next morning (much earlier than I usually wake up). I needed to rest, but I also needed to do lots of other stuff, such as preparing for Michael Taft's meditation course "Reversing the stack", and so I decided to listen to one of the preparatory guided meditations while reclining, this one: