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Hibiscus Kid, modified 4 Months ago.

4

Posts: 18 Join Date: 5/3/18 Recent Posts
 
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SushiK, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 116 Join Date: 6/11/20 Recent Posts
Happy to have you back friend :-)
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1742 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Good to see you again HK! emoticon I like what I read! Nice development there with moving to your own place! Yeah! 
shargrol, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1537 Join Date: 2/8/16 Recent Posts
 Looking forward to Log #4!
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Siavash, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1237 Join Date: 5/5/19 Recent Posts
the good news is I am moved into my own place


Congratulations!
Enjoy emoticon
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1742 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Housewarming PARTY at HKs place tonight folks emoticon !!! Tim get that whiskey, Linda bring the coconut water! I will bring that old jukebox (I hope you have an elevator Kid) 

Ho ho let's go! emoticon 
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1742 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Im actually teaching my little 4 year old son the 6 Realms and how he can recognise where his and our mind is in any given situation and how he can come back to the human realm of loving-kindness by simply remembering to sense his breathing emoticon

I snapped at him today as he didnt listen to what I asked him to not do and he told me "Dad, you are now in the Hell realm and in there is fire and very hot, go back to breathing" emoticon emoticon emoticon  4 year old  emoticon 
Sam Gentile, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1072 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
I left you a message.
shargrol, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1537 Join Date: 2/8/16 Recent Posts
Nice!
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1742 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
+1 Nice!


"Mapping occurs as thoughts that bubble up, but I don't pursue them in the same way that I did when I was striving." 

Really nice! These "mapping thoughts" also arise just like any thughts and seeing them as such is objectifying them and disembedding from them and hence they seem to arise , do their little wiggle dance and pass away just to be replaced by another random "lottery number" emoticon  BTW, I get these thoughts all the time, mostly in form of latters like "EQ" or "3C" etc ... usually accompanied by Anticipation and slight Excitenment. I just keep noting these by slabbing labels on them, one by one they arise and pass away.

The most reassuring thing is that all whats happening right now is a product of your practice so far emoticon After "dont like this phaze" practice comes the "I like this phaze" then "dont like this phaze" then "I dont care anymore, let come what may" practice emoticon

Keep at it Kid! Best wishes!
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Zachary, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 197 Join Date: 3/16/18 Recent Posts

My practice is often mired by doubt about method, ability, comparison to other meditators, so today I just wanted to meditate through it all. I noticed doubt, and realized that I can just meditate through doubts and that's sorta the point, isn't it? I'm not some great meditation master, but I'm more and more aware of the hindrances that cause me to get off track. 


At no point did I feel like I was striving too hard. My goal was to be consistent and keep the noting going. Just kept everything simple. Nothing special happened, no insights were had, but I rode out the session and although it was a challenge, it was not some huge battle or struggle. Mind wandering would occur at points for 1-2 minutes here or there, but then I'd come back to the noting without fuss or feeling too bad about it.

Mapping happens, of course, but I have become map-averse in the last few months because I don't quite know how it applies to me and my quirks. An example: I might be impatient, but impatience isn't a big deal... is that equanimity (EQ) (because I'm okay with impatience and I am a highly impatient person?) or am I not in equanimity (EQ) because a practitioner in EQ shouldn't even be impatient (my former teacher often said that if I were truly in EQ, I'd want to meditate all the time - well shucks, I've never felt that way...). Mapping occurs as thoughts that bubble up, but I don't pursue them in the same way that I did when I was striving.   

I'm glad I did it. Not sure where the sudden energy and inspiration came from, but sometimes it's worth listening to. I'm not sure what I want out of practice anymore, but I guess this helps with self awareness and noticing reactivity which can only be a positive in this life.


This is great. Doubt arises, and it's just doubt. Impatience arises, and it's just impatience. Mapping happens and it's just mapping. Not knowing arises and it's just not knowing. These things aren't a big deal and don't have to be pushed away. The hindrances have their own lives and pass away causally on their own accord. By simply noticing them as they are, as they arise, we fulfill the practice and help things move along. In these moments we are awake. 
shargrol, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1537 Join Date: 2/8/16 Recent Posts
Just a little note: you can't really "maintain" mindfulness. That's an error.  If you are "maintaining" it, then there is some part of your mind that is willfully trying to crush some other part of the mind --- it's possible to have short term results that way, but it always fails in the end. It always leads to burnout. 

What you can do is encourage interest in direct experience. You can get excited about really having complete experiences of sensations, urges, emotions, and thoughts as they arise and pass. You can develop a sense of joy with devoting time to practicing that. It's endlessly interesting once you get into it. 

Gravitating towards the sensations of breathing is a great way to say it. By using less and less effort, yet also being willing to start again once we get lost in trance, we learn to prefer mindfulness naturally. If we force the mind to be mindful, it's a matter of will. If we learn to prefer mindfulness, then it becomes natural and easy. 

I know perhaps you were just talking loosely about "maintaining" and maybe didn't mean exactly this, but sometimes the language we use is a clue to the things that are not totally conscious. 
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Mike Hachey, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 16 Join Date: 10/14/20 Recent Posts
I've been following your log for a while and I just wanted to say that I I really appreciate the honesty you bring to your descriptions of the aversions you have to sitting and the impatience that can arise. Just now I was tempted to skip my evening sit but saw you updated. "Hibiscus Kid made it to his sit today," I thought to myself, "so you can do it, too."

I need to start a practice log of my own I think.

Keep it up!
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Brandon Dayton, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 474 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I'm guessing it wasn't an easy to decision to part with a teacher, but it looks like the right one. Your log reads much lighter and ejoyable than past logs and there is a sense of ownerhsip and confidence in your descriptions that seems new. It may be one of those things where having a teacher got in the way of nurturing faith in your own wisdom. In any case, it's a real joy to read your logs lately.

I'm grateful that you did decide to have a teacher for awhile, even if it was just for my own selfish benefit. The referral was exactly what I needed at exactly the right time. 

Metta.
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Zachary, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 197 Join Date: 3/16/18 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
10/19/2020 - Afternoon sit - 60 minutes

Noted with labels while intending to keep the breath in awareness.

I was very tired and sorta anxious when sitting down. I let myself sink into the dull, drowsiness. Relaxation and calm gradually predominated and soon the anxiety melted away. 

Mind wandering occured here and there, and I returned to the breath/noting without fuss. Although I was really drowsy, I never really dozed off so I could just sit in that state and just simply breathe and note.

Towards the end of the sit, impatience once again arose. I observed the cold 'disappointment' in the abdomen as it came on, as well as the hot 'agitation'. I experimented with staying plugged in to the breath and opened awareness so that I woulddn't fully contract into the impatience. The impatience became sorta slippery and dissolved and then came back - it would sorta fluctuate like that. I wondered what purpose this impatience was serving and what life would be like if I was less prone to this sort of reactivity as it really wants me to 'do something, anything but simply sitting.' 

Doubts also arose, but I have been setting the intention lately to ignore them as they only serve to distract. In this case, I could notice them, and then keep with the breath and see them pass away. It's useful to see how they are as solid or as true as I want to make them - which is to say that doubts don't have to be a problem at all. 

After the sit, I feel pretty refreshed. There is a Zoom call with the Zen group tonight and I'm considering sitting with them. We will see if I follow through with it. 

Good stuff!
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Noah D, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1143 Join Date: 9/1/16 Recent Posts
That's a wise dream character! 
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1742 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
"Last night I had a dream that I was meeting two members of this DhO community for lunch"

emoticon Ha! I wonder if there is a deeper meaning of that number 2 ! I have dreamt on 3 occasions members of this community and each time there were 2 of them emoticon 
First time Chris Marti and shargrol but the situation was unclear. Second time I had pizzas with a Ingram and Kenneth Folk in a restaurant with light cream interior and I was embarrassed for not having money to pay for those pizzas. Third time (this was a few nights ago) Ingram and shargrol were arguing about something in the Azura realm (shargrol never has a face or body, just a clear presence of sorts). 

Wonder if others had similar dreams and if number 2 has something to do with those? 
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Zachary, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 197 Join Date: 3/16/18 Recent Posts
Papa Che Dusko:

Second time I had pizzas with a Ingram and Kenneth Folk in a restaurant with light cream interior and I was embarrassed for not having money to pay for those pizzas.

Wonder if others had similar dreams and if number 2 has something to do with those? 

Haha, I actually had a similar dream about a year ago. I was having Kenneth Folk and Ingram over for dinner at my parent's house. I was there with my sister and a childhood friend. I was preparing dinner for everyone but it was taking forever. My friend was also acting annoying and I was embarassed at his behavior and the whole dinner situation. Kenneth and Daniel were polite about the situation but were clearly growing impatient as the hours ticked on and on. 
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1742 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Zachary:
Papa Che Dusko:

Second time I had pizzas with a Ingram and Kenneth Folk in a restaurant with light cream interior and I was embarrassed for not having money to pay for those pizzas.

Wonder if others had similar dreams and if number 2 has something to do with those? 

Haha, I actually had a similar dream about a year ago. I was having Kenneth Folk and Ingram over for dinner at my parent's house. I was there with my sister and a childhood friend. I was preparing dinner for everyone but it was taking forever. My friend was also acting annoying and I was embarassed at his behavior and the whole dinner situation. Kenneth and Daniel were polite about the situation but were clearly growing impatient as the hours ticked on and on. 

LOL emoticon That seems similar to my dream allright! In my dream Kenneth seemed slightly annoyed with me letting Ingram pay for the pizzas. Forgot to metnion that detail! 
Thanks for sharing emoticon made me laugh! 
shargrol, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1537 Join Date: 2/8/16 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
I want to be able to follow through with whatever I set my mind to.  

It could be worth pondering a few aspects of this whole life-planning and doing dynamic.

There is what you set your mind to

There is how you follow through on

And hidden before all of this is how you set the intention.

A lot of time we focus on the first what and how, but forget the original how of setting the intention.

In a certain sense, how you set the intention is how you follow through. Just to exaggerate it, if we think we're a piece of shit and we set our mind to fixing ourself, there might be a lot of internal battle around the very premise that "I'm a piece of shit". Even if we set our mind to do good things (exercise, diet, career, relationships), it could be motivated from a place of darkness and pain and we'll secretly sabotage ourself because we don't really want to create a world where the premise is "I'm a piece of shit". So in some sense, it looks like we're failing because we're not following through... but actually we're succeeding because we're not confirming a bad premise. Then of course we turn to entertainment and food and drink, because those actually make us feel good for while.

Conversely, if we think of ourself as a good seed that can grow to be a buddha mind under the right conditions, then it is much more natural to set our mind on good things and to follow through, even though there will be all the normal difficulties with actually growing and maturing. Because the intention was set from a place of honor and self-respect, we'll be more likely to endure and persist even in the face of difficulties. And we are less distracted by the easy things that make us feel good (entertainment, food, drink) because we can tell that it distracts us from the really really good things like exercise and meditation, because too much of those other things degrades our mind and body.

This is a very simple model, very black and white. What seems to happen is that bounce back and forth, fine tuning the how of following through, then fine tuning the how of setting an intention, back to the how of following through, etc.

So all of this is just to say that the original teachings emphasized renunciation so that there would be an ability to really see our motivation and intention. When we have one thing to wear, one place to be, no choice in food, but all of this is enough to survive... then we have a lot of space to consider "what am I really doing with my life? what am I really motivated by?"  When we finally connect with boddhicitta, real buddha mind, real worth and quest... well, the following though just takes on a life of it's own. It still sucks a lot of time, but we have a clearer view of what is valuable. It's the old saying "you don't have to like the work if you love the results".

I remember a trip to europe where I did the quinessential thing of trying to see all the art in the museum, and the next museum, and the next museum...  The only reason I was rushing around was because of a sense that I was inadequate and needed to see everything or I would be a failure. After a point you realize, the arts are endless and there is only so much that can be absorbed. Then the goal becomes "a full day" -- which is totally different from packing as much in as possible. A full day is based on the premise that I have an inner nature that can be inspired by the day, but also has limits. It's a much more respectful (and ultimately effective) way to live. 

So getting clear on what powers our motivation (self-hate or self-respect) and to make the goal of following through to be "having a full day" is my main point.  But that was sort of a babble, hopefully my point comes through.
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1742 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
"I'm trying to lay each brick perfectly and forget about the far off goal of building a wall. But sometimes I have trouble laying each brick perfectly. And then I question why I am even building a wall at all. And just because each brick is laid perfectly, that doesn't guarantee we build a successful wall and it still might tip over, etc."

Might not relate to you at all but this part inspired what I'm about to write;

I was just helping one neighbor with stapling heavy concrete tiles and remembered what you wrote here emoticon 

Bricks are too heavy and walls too scary emoticon and also seem to not to relate to mind reality that well. Such perception might only invite a feel of a heavy burden. 

As mind reality is closer to vast open space and with many white and dark clouds floating around and passing away, now they are here then they evaporate etc ... it might be better to not build anything but look at that post-it as just another fluffy white cloud with other fluffy white clouds on it. And these clouds are so light. As soon you pass by them, or move your hand, or breath towards them they move and even change shape emoticon 
They are so fragile and effected by all and anything really. 

Instead of building a heavy brick wall that might collapse as you say (it likely will) maybe have intention to be a vast open wonderus space and let those white and dark fluffy clouds to their coming and going away on their own. 

As I mentioned above, this might sound silly but I felt like sharing it anyway. 

Best wishes to you mate! 
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1742 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
" I could be wrong, but there are plenty of hard core meditators who don't seem to get 4th path, so that makes me consider if it's worth all the work. "

I do trust Kenneth Folk when he told me  "you don't need to attain to these Paths to Awaken, but it's good to attain them if you want to teach this stuff". Now this is interesting don't you think emoticon 

Also, maybe it's not about being a hard core meditator. What if such meditators are too dense and just don't get it? emoticon What if that very drive to hard core anything is that Dancer we all have, the one that's creating Dukkha? What if it's no other but to let knowing of THIS be It? Moment after moment. What if that is all to it at the end? Would that be so disappointing? 
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Helen Pohl, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 84 Join Date: 8/10/20 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:


However, there are many people that we don't hear about who work really really hard and are never successful. That's what I fear: for every success story there are countless folks that work just as hard and never make it and we don't hear about them because luck is a huge factor. 

  


Isn't it sometimes the case that we cannot see the progress we've made until after the fact? Looking back?

I've often have this feeling regarding my work, thinking I don't know much until I compare with how I was a few years ago and see that I indeed know more/am able to do things I couldn't before. =) 

It creeps up on you.
Sam Gentile, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1072 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
Kid, Just checking in as its been weeks since I've been on here, Looks like you're making steady progress. Good job man!
shargrol, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1537 Join Date: 2/8/16 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:

For the short term, I think my goal is to just pick up where I left off without proliferating doubts and confusion.


Good plan.

It's a good long term goal, too. emoticon  Even advanced meditators encounter experiences where mindfulness wavers and all we can do is start again. The only difference is we sorta instinctually know that beating ourselves up is painful and just delays starting again. ;)
Sam Gentile, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1072 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
Getting caught up with things. Seems like you are keeping up a consistency in your practice and logs. Good job!
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1742 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
11/12/2020 - Night sit - 50 minutes

Noted wit labels. A sit that was filled with confusion and doubt about the technique, as well as drowsiness and impatience. 
I love you man emoticon you rock! emoticon 
You keep at it no matter what! emoticon Nice! 
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Papa Che Dusko, modified 6 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1742 Join Date: 3/1/20 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
Thank you Papa Che

11/13/2020 - Morning sit - 30 minutes

Noted with labels. Intended to sit for 60 minutes, but the doubts, confusion, impatience and general lack of mindfulness was discouraging so I quit. It no longer felt productive. My attitude towards practice as a whole at the moment reflects the content of this sit.  

Ken McLeod mentions The Edge. As in coming as close to the Edge of any experience. Going over the Edge is falling into it like being discouraged hence effect is quiting. And going away from the Edge of experience is escaping it/avoidance. 

Some sort of zeal is necessary to keep you curious and investigating and being intimate with that Edge of the Experience. 
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Original Mike, modified 5 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 16 Join Date: 10/14/20 Recent Posts
I'm definitely envious that you have a practice buddy. Everything's easier when you have that kind of support. My friends know I'm into meditation and Buddhism and think that's rad and all but no way would any of them commit to regular practice with me. I was hoping to meet likeminded people at the Cambridge Insight Meditation Center but the Covid really messed that plan up.
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Original Mike, modified 5 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 16 Join Date: 10/14/20 Recent Posts
Very kind offer. Check your DMs. emoticon
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Original Mike, modified 5 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 16 Join Date: 10/14/20 Recent Posts
Michael Taft's great. Do you listen to his podcast, "Deconstruction Yourself"?
Sam Gentile, modified 5 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1072 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
Hey! We're going to need to catch up soon. Sending you a PM.
Sam Gentile, modified 5 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 1072 Join Date: 5/4/20 Recent Posts
Hibiscus Kid:
I'll be taking a break from logging daily. It doesn't really feel productive to write something about every single sit so I'll just check in when I feel called to do so. I still intend to sit daily.  
May you practice well.
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Brandon Dayton, modified 4 Months ago.

RE: Hibiscus Kid's Log #4

Posts: 474 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
I've felt a competitive camrederie with you ever since I started posting regularly here. I like watching someone that seems to be in the same general territory as me. It makes practice feel a little less lonely and makes me feel a little more normal. It also lights a fire under my butt any time I see a post on your log. I love seeing your progress and being reminded that I'm not the only one hitting bumps along the way. You're very honest and open about that, and I appreciate that.

I totally relate to the sense of disbelief that sitting doing nothing is actually doing anything worthwhile. It's so weird, especially when I imagine trying to explain it to someone else. I find myself, at times, with my brow furrowed asking myself, "wait, why am I doing this again?" (lots of that lately, honestly) And yet clearly something is happenning. By small, indecernible increments most of the time, but something is happenning.