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Attachement to a person

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Attachement to a person
Answer
1/27/15 1:53 AM
I just wanted to write this down and tell a story. How I felt and learned something about myself.

Two weeks ago I met a woman. After talking to her I really felt a connection. When she talked it was almost as if I was listening to myself, and she had the same thing. She was interested in meditation and that really felt good, because my ex wasn't interested in meditation(not that it just felt good because my ex wasn't interested in meditation). She told me that she had a kid (she is 26 and I am 24). Well, I was open minded and was interested in her as a person, so I wanted to know her better. After a few days we decided to meet and during this meeting it was really relax and nice. I was really honest with her and she liked that. We kissed when saying goodbye. One day after the meeting we decided to meet again. So I noticed, the first and second day after this first meeting I could function fine, but on the day that we would meet (in the evening), I would have a great desire to meet her. The things I did on that day had less meaning to me, I just wanted to be with her. Then during the time in the train I was also a bit restless. Then we meet for the second time, it was all nice and really fun. I missed the train because I didn't noticed the time, and the next train went in the middle of the night. So I went to her house, we slept in one bed and kissed and touched. It wasn't as planned but that is how it went. Then in the morning I met her mother etc. So I noticed during the way home, I was happy, but a doubty feeling was present. Did I do the right thing? She couldn't be my girlfriend because she has a kid. That means much responsibilities. So I thought about it and meeting again would not be a good thing. I was getting attached to her and having the desire to see her. When with her I really felt good, but when not with her, I wasn't as content as before I met her. So I decided to be honest with her and told her how I felt. She understood and was a bit sad, so was I, but I still made the decision to delete her number, whatsapp and all the connections I had to her, because this was the right thing. So now there is a feeling of loss, a feeling of what could have been, a feeling like I just let someone special go, a little doubt although I now this was the right thing to do. I didn't know I could still get so fast attached to someone. I have been to meditation retreats and meditated at least 1000 hours, I have been in the DN and learned a lot, and still I got fast attached. Material things I can give up quite easily, but with certain relationships, I get much faster attached. Maybe it was also that she made me feel good, she made me feel I was special, that is a really nice feeling, but then again attachement and desire are on the corner. I quess I first have to gain more wisdom so that I don't become as attached to a person as in this case, but then again, how far will you go, how much wisdom is enough, and there is no garantee that you will gain this wisdom in this lifetime. Much questions and decisions, much doubt, uncertainty. I really experience the 3 C's right now.

Have you had experience with this? You probably have. What is your story? How did you deal with it? What are your thoughts about wisdom in relationships?

RE: Attachement to a person
Answer
1/27/15 3:20 AM as a reply to John Power.
It seems to me that going through life and avoiding things that cause craving and desire will lead to a very dull and dreary life. Why not instead take it as an opportunity to practice and watch craving and desire in action.

If you plan on avoiding relationships until you can manage them completely free from craving and aversion I imagine you will be waiting a while. The hormonal cocktail released into the body in such situations is pretty good at drumming up loads of desire and craving.

Anyway, good luck.
Simon

RE: Attachement to a person
Answer
1/27/15 4:50 AM as a reply to John Power.
o_O

This sort of thinking is what happens if you mix up the scopes, assumptions and goals of the Three Trainings.

You feel a connection. Humans are wired for that. Nothing wrong there.
You want that connection. Yeah, that's what humans do. Because it's something you value. This has about nothing to do with the craving that insight meditation finally eliminates.

If, after further reflection, you still insist that more meditation, DNs, experience of 3Cs and whatnot will eliminate 'attachment to persons', consider this: There are highly regarded senior meditation teachers who, after being a monk for >10 years, suddenly fall in love and decide to quit the whole business.

(Seriously, not trying to be overly harsh, but reading this shocked me somewhat.)

RE: Attachement to a person
Answer
1/27/15 6:48 AM as a reply to John Power.
My personal opinion is: unless you want to be a monk, you should not reject a partner because you are getting attached to him/her.

So if you are serious about it, I suggest you seek ways to become a monk.

If you are not, then I suggest you read the following:

The second piece of advice is to have a “no-bleedthrough” policy when you suspect you are in the Dark Night. Simply refuse to let your negativity bleed out onto everyone and everything around you. Failure to do so can be disastrous, as your profound lack of perspective, fixation on negativity and the suffering from your fundamental crisis of identity can easily get projected out onto things and people that simply did not cause that suffering! No one appreciates this at all and it does no good whatsoever.

Combining these two pieces of important advice, resolve thus, “I have recently crossed the A&P Event and I know this by the many obvious signs of that stage. Now I am feeling strangely reactive and negative about things that ordinarily I am able to handle with more balance and clarity, and I know that a good part of this is due to the inevitable Dark Night that follows the A&P. I realize that I am in a less than ideal position to skillfully deal with the personal issues that are driving me crazy, as I am likely to project the suffering from the illusion of duality and the odd side effects of the Dark Night onto these issues.

“I have been warned that this is an extremely bad idea from those who have successfully navigated in this territory, and I have faith that they know what they are talking about. Even if these issues are real and valid, I am likely to blow them way out of proportion and not be able to bring balance and kindness to them. By contracting into my own reactive darkness and confusion, I could easily hurt others and myself. Thus, I resolve to keep my darkness to myself, tell only those who are skilled in navigating in dark territory, or at least share it with others in a way that does not project it out on my world and them, and so will spare those around me needless suffering which they do not deserve. In short, I will use the meditation map theory to keep the reins on my dark stuff and to deal with it in ways that are known to help rather than harm.

“I will make time for insight practices and retreats during which time I will simply see the true nature of the sensations of whatever arises, however horrible or compelling, and not indulge in the content of my stuff for one skinny instant if this is within the limits of my strength and power. In this way, I will be able to navigate this territory skillfully and not damage my daily life. Should I fail, I will actively seek help from those who are skilled in helping people keep a healthy perspective in the face of dark issues until such time as I can face the Dark Night as recommended.

“When I have attained to the first stage of awakening, that will be a great time to see how much of my negativity was really valid and how much was just due to my own lack of clarity and the side effects of the Dark Night. From that place of clarity, I will be much more likely to fix those things in my life that really need fixing and attention and be able to dismiss easily those paper tigers that I have created for myself. By not trying to take on all of this at once, that is, by gaining deep insights before tackling the personal issues, I am more likely to lead the happy and wise life I wish for myself. I will attain to both liberating insights and insights into my issues, and this will be of great benefit to myself and all beings.”

-- from http://www.dharmaoverground.org/web/guest/dharma-wiki/-/wiki/Main/MCTB+5.+Dissolution%2C+Entrance+to+the+Dark+Night

RE: Attachement to a person
Answer
1/27/15 9:24 AM as a reply to John P.
Thank you for your reactions!

I did not meant to suggest that we should not have any attachment in a relationship. I just noticed that I can become very fast attached to someone with strong desire. This desire causes restlesness and can cause neglect of important matters. So to be less attached would be beneficial.
My apologize if I was not clear, my post was also a form of processing this experience. I am currently not in the DN, but I certainly experience some of the same symptoms.

RE: Attachement to a person
Answer
1/27/15 1:52 PM as a reply to John Power.
John Power:
I just noticed that I can become very fast attached to someone with strong desire. This desire causes restlesness and can cause neglect of important matters. So to be less attached would be beneficial.

You seem to be very attached to non-attachment. I can see how this could cause restlessness. Perhaps if you isolated yourself from more things you could achieve perfect non-attachment. It seems to be a popular option for some monks. Can you master your desires by not ever engaging them? I wonder...
Well, good luck with it,
~D

RE: Attachement to a person
Answer
1/27/15 11:49 PM as a reply to John Power.
It's amazing how easy it is to drop this kind of thing if you want to.  It sounds to me like the separation was the cause of the problem, not the relationship. The best way to live is to have but not to hold, so this is a great learning opportunity. I'd say you'd be better off staying in the relationship and exploring your aversion to separation. It seems better practice than avoiding the whole thing - especially considering you were aware of your feelings and studying them as they happened.

Go get her back. Don't be silly. emoticon

RE: Attachement to a person
Answer
1/28/15 3:42 AM as a reply to Not Tao.
@Dream Walker: Thank you for your analysis! Attached to non-attachment...hmm...I will reflect on this.

@Not Tao: I totally agree that the best way to live, is to have but not to hold, and this would be a great learning opportunity.
However I choose to end this relationship not  because of the attachment or desire, but because I saw that it was not beneficial for both of us.
She has a child and I don't want to have a child at this time. I am currently in my final year and am busy with papers. She was also doubting if this was a good thing to do and I wanted to be really honest with her. I didn't want to string her along.

RE: Attachement to a person
Answer
1/28/15 7:04 PM as a reply to John Power.
That's a bit different from breaking up because you thought you were clinging too much emotionally.  Haha, maybe we all had strong reactions because your first post makes it sound like you dumped your GF because you liked her too much. emoticon The way you explain it here, though, sound more logical and pragmatic.

RE: Attachement to a person
Answer
1/29/15 4:50 AM as a reply to John Power.
You made the right choice if the relationship would not benefit both parties involved.

I ended a relationship a while back as I knew it was no longer serving either of us, at the time we were already deeply attached and had very strong feelings for one another. The relationship had been ongoing for more than a year and I had only managed to 'move on' after my recent 10 day goenka retreat, it took me 6-7 months of torment, frustration and struggling to gain my composure back. I don't regret a single second of it though.