What is arahant - Discussion
What is arahant
Evammesutam, modified 7 Years ago at 12/23/16 8:55 AM
Created 8 Years ago at 10/18/16 11:47 PM
What is arahant
Posts: 10 Join Date: 10/3/16 Recent PostsNoah D, modified 8 Years ago at 10/19/16 1:00 AM
Created 8 Years ago at 10/19/16 12:55 AM
RE: What is arahant
Posts: 1219 Join Date: 9/1/16 Recent Posts
At 44:20 of this video, Shinzen Young talks about meeting Taungpulu Sayadaw, a "reputed Arhat." He elaborates that stream enterers are common, but the distance from 1 to 4 is vastly longer than from 0 to 1. He calls Arhatship "full purification of consciousness," which would necessarily entail things like behavioral change, psycho-emotional healing, etc., and not just perceptual nonduality.
I tend to agree with this notion. I suspect that the 10 Fetter model of early Buddhsism was meant to measure the degree of integration between morality and wisdom, and not just the wisdom axis alone, which is what much confusion stems from. This jives with Shinzen's description of TS, in which he stresses integrative qualities such as body language ('like laffy taffy') and habit formation ('didn't go horizontal for 30 years'). Curious readers can observe Taungpulu Sayadaw at 6:30 in this video.
To answer the original question, what is an Arhat? My current theory is that an Arhat is someone who has drilled in tons and tons of wholesome, external habits, whose benefits synergize with the internal house of perceptual nonduality. This results in hugely weakening a finite set of mental ills, known as the 10 Fetters. I don't personally care whether complete uprooting of Fetters is even possible. Just to know that something in this ballpark is possible is hugely inspiring to me. So, I guess an Arhat would be one who is as close as humanly possible to being free of the 10 Fetters.
I tend to agree with this notion. I suspect that the 10 Fetter model of early Buddhsism was meant to measure the degree of integration between morality and wisdom, and not just the wisdom axis alone, which is what much confusion stems from. This jives with Shinzen's description of TS, in which he stresses integrative qualities such as body language ('like laffy taffy') and habit formation ('didn't go horizontal for 30 years'). Curious readers can observe Taungpulu Sayadaw at 6:30 in this video.
To answer the original question, what is an Arhat? My current theory is that an Arhat is someone who has drilled in tons and tons of wholesome, external habits, whose benefits synergize with the internal house of perceptual nonduality. This results in hugely weakening a finite set of mental ills, known as the 10 Fetters. I don't personally care whether complete uprooting of Fetters is even possible. Just to know that something in this ballpark is possible is hugely inspiring to me. So, I guess an Arhat would be one who is as close as humanly possible to being free of the 10 Fetters.
Supreme Maharishi Bhumi 1000, modified 7 Years ago at 1/10/17 8:02 AM
Created 8 Years ago at 10/19/16 7:48 AM
RE: What is arahant
Posts: 55 Join Date: 10/14/16 Recent PostsEvammesutam, modified 8 Years ago at 10/19/16 6:37 PM
Created 8 Years ago at 10/19/16 6:37 PM
RE: What is arahant
Posts: 10 Join Date: 10/3/16 Recent PostsSupreme Maharishi Bhumi 1000:
According to Wikipedia, Theravada Buddhism defines an Arhat as "one who is worthy, "having attained Nirvana". The definition varies between different traditions, but I like that one. Mr. Ingram claims this title, and in my opinion, deserves it, as he obviously has sacrificed a lot.
Please contemplate the full implications of:
- Dedicating huge amounts of time to practice what is an obscure eastern philosophy for most people
- Dealing with the side-effects of practice without the support of communities like this
- Facing the ridicule of certain circles by claiming Arhatship, but by doing so,providing countless people the actual opportunity to become liberated
- Working in ER
- Providing MCTB free of charge, just like this forum
- Tolerance of differing views, as proven by the dialog between him and Mr. Katami
- Deep insight into contemplative techniques and the nature of reality
- Being honest and open about his own deficincies
Aren't these things worthy of praise, regardless of having attained Nirvana or not? I personally think he has, and the list above contains the proof.
Please contemplate the full implications of:
- Dedicating huge amounts of time to practice what is an obscure eastern philosophy for most people
- Dealing with the side-effects of practice without the support of communities like this
- Facing the ridicule of certain circles by claiming Arhatship, but by doing so,providing countless people the actual opportunity to become liberated
- Working in ER
- Providing MCTB free of charge, just like this forum
- Tolerance of differing views, as proven by the dialog between him and Mr. Katami
- Deep insight into contemplative techniques and the nature of reality
- Being honest and open about his own deficincies
Aren't these things worthy of praise, regardless of having attained Nirvana or not? I personally think he has, and the list above contains the proof.
maybe for one person he not need do any of those but yet still becomes one.
the question is not really what is arahant but more the question in the post. is it not more likely that the smaller number of people are wrong and the larger group is right?
Evammesutam, modified 8 Years ago at 10/19/16 6:44 PM
Created 8 Years ago at 10/19/16 6:44 PM
RE: What is arahant
Posts: 10 Join Date: 10/3/16 Recent PostsNoah D:
At 44:20 of this video, Shinzen Young talks about meeting Taungpulu Sayadaw, a "reputed Arhat." He elaborates that stream enterers are common, but the distance from 1 to 4 is vastly longer than from 0 to 1. He calls Arhatship "full purification of consciousness," which would necessarily entail things like behavioral change, psycho-emotional healing, etc., and not just perceptual nonduality.
I tend to agree with this notion. I suspect that the 10 Fetter model of early Buddhsism was meant to measure the degree of integration between morality and wisdom, and not just the wisdom axis alone, which is what much confusion stems from. This jives with Shinzen's description of TS, in which he stresses integrative qualities such as body language ('like laffy taffy') and habit formation ('didn't go horizontal for 30 years'). Curious readers can observe Taungpulu Sayadaw at 6:30 in this video.
To answer the original question, what is an Arhat? My current theory is that an Arhat is someone who has drilled in tons and tons of wholesome, external habits, whose benefits synergize with the internal house of perceptual nonduality. This results in hugely weakening a finite set of mental ills, known as the 10 Fetters. I don't personally care whether complete uprooting of Fetters is even possible. Just to know that something in this ballpark is possible is hugely inspiring to me. So, I guess an Arhat would be one who is as close as humanly possible to being free of the 10 Fetters.
I tend to agree with this notion. I suspect that the 10 Fetter model of early Buddhsism was meant to measure the degree of integration between morality and wisdom, and not just the wisdom axis alone, which is what much confusion stems from. This jives with Shinzen's description of TS, in which he stresses integrative qualities such as body language ('like laffy taffy') and habit formation ('didn't go horizontal for 30 years'). Curious readers can observe Taungpulu Sayadaw at 6:30 in this video.
To answer the original question, what is an Arhat? My current theory is that an Arhat is someone who has drilled in tons and tons of wholesome, external habits, whose benefits synergize with the internal house of perceptual nonduality. This results in hugely weakening a finite set of mental ills, known as the 10 Fetters. I don't personally care whether complete uprooting of Fetters is even possible. Just to know that something in this ballpark is possible is hugely inspiring to me. So, I guess an Arhat would be one who is as close as humanly possible to being free of the 10 Fetters.
thank you for this. the videos were good. Shizens young explaination made a lot of sense. So does that mean he thinks that stage 2 stage 3 and stage 4 here are still most likely stream enterers?
I was hoping somebody here who has reach the arahant level here would give their thoughts as I find it difficult to get past the part of thinking that how can so many previous arahants be wrong and the ones here be right. I do not think that it is impossible for it to be like that but it seems unlikely