What to call a website to support adverse events?

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Daniel M. Ingram, modified 10 Months ago.

What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 3180 Join Date: 4/20/09 Recent Posts
Bagpuss, a long-time DhO member, has some time and interest in creating a site to support those experiencing adverse spiritual events, hights, lows, weirds, whatever is causing difficulty, and the first question is what to call it?

As these events can arise in a number of contexts, meditation, psychedelics, other situations in daily life, etc., the name needs to be somewhat general and hopefully non-tradition-specific.

Any ideas welcome!

Also, if you have any interest in working on that project, do let him know.

May this project go well and help many!

Daniel
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Niels Lyngsø, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 321 Join Date: 11/15/19 Recent Posts
Spiritual Emergency Room: S.E.R.
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terry, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 1650 Join Date: 8/7/17 Recent Posts
Niels Lyngsø:
Spiritual Emergency Room: S.E.R.


dharma crash cart
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Ricky Lee Nuthman, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 92 Join Date: 4/22/18 Recent Posts
Dharma Dilemma

One Foot In The Void

Stuck in the Middle

Half Empty 

Yogi Bare / Bared Yogi

Blinded By The Light
shargrol, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 1537 Join Date: 2/8/16 Recent Posts
Probably equally important to figure out what keywords/search terms you are hoping to attract!
Grin Spickett, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 9 Join Date: 6/16/20 Recent Posts
There's a similar, unrecognized need for support within the remote viewing community.

That's a large part of why I am here, having witnessed two people in crisis within the last two months, one more severe than the other (and still unfolding).

Whatever the name, it would be nice to have something broad enough to speak to people from a variety of practices. If someone doesn't recognize themselves as having a Dharma issue, it would be a shame for them to miss the help because of the terminology used.

That's two dull pennies from an interested outsider, for whatever that's worth. 

I'm glad you are moving forward with the project, because I feel inadequate to cope with these issues on my own. 
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Jim Smith, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 962 Join Date: 1/17/15 Recent Posts
Grin Spickett:
There's a similar, unrecognized need for support within the remote viewing community.

That's a large part of why I am here, having witnessed two people in crisis within the last two months, one more severe than the other (and still unfolding).
...
Do these crises have to do with difficulties coping with psychic phenomenon? For example, not being able to turn off the phenomenon, not being accepted by people around you, doubting your own sanity?

I have some experience with psychic devleopment and providing support with these types of issues and might be able to help. 
Grin Spickett, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 9 Join Date: 6/16/20 Recent Posts
Jim Smith:
Grin Spickett:
There's a similar, unrecognized need for support within the remote viewing community.

That's a large part of why I am here, having witnessed two people in crisis within the last two months, one more severe than the other (and still unfolding).
...
Do these crises have to do with difficulties coping with psychic phenomenon? For example, not being able to turn off the phenomenon, not being accepted by people around you, doubting your own sanity?

I have some experience with psychic devleopment and providing support with these types of issues and might be able to help. 

Yes, they do have to do with that, but also I see remote viewing as a meditative or meditation-like activity, and quite aside from the issue of whether or not it is an objectively "true" phenomena, it clearly creates real experiences for its practitioners, in that it can affect them greatly. 

This week, around the time that I posted here, an acquaintance of mine had what might have been an arising and passing away. They made it very public, posting some long and very excited messages to our entire community on Reddit. They also indicated that they expected to die from it. 

Our community was very concerned. I tried to stay in contact without judgement. When a few days went by and they started deleting their posts while continuing to express to me personally that their death was imminent, I told them I'd keep checking in on them.  Then silence, and I had no response for several days.

I ended up finding out who they were and asking for a wellness check from local authorities. This put me in contact with someone who could confirm the person was in good hands. But I had no way to know, and didn't know what resources could have been helpful through the process. 

Reading Daniel's description of A&P, which can include manic behavior, hallucinations, decreased need for sleep, and etc, this person's experience easily fits. From the standpoint of conventional medicine, you could also say, they had a breakdown, although that doesn't explain anything. A diagnosis is often a label, not a reason, but many are happy to leave it at that and don't look deeper at what might be happening.

If it was an A&P, then a dark night is next for this person, and I'm worried that they may be too embarrassed to return to the community for support, if we even knew how to give it. 

So I would love to have materials to point to, people to steer to who have been there, done that. And it would be great if it was a place, a source, a repository, or a community of its own.

(I will definitely dig through your website. I'm interested in automatic writing from subconscious or higher self and have been seeking instructional materials. I've no interest in channeling anything external, but understand there may be similar principles.)
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Olivier, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 731 Join Date: 4/27/19 Recent Posts
Just bouncing ideas...

Yes, I think the notion that it should both be accessible to people who are meditators and will not find words like dharma, or worse, dukkha ñanas, totally alien, as well as people who have no clue about all that. 

I can imagine that for the first set of people, things like "meditation related difficulties", difficult meditation, these kinds of keyword families, could be explored.

But if you think about the other guys... That's a bit tougher isn't it. First of, wild dukkha ñanas, as we might call them, manifest generally, I would imagine, as existantial angst, basically. I doubt it gets identified by many, as the above poster said. Most don't even realize "something has happened", I'm sure, and perhaps would not even think to lok it up on the net, right ? They probably just think : everything is shitty, etc. That's one complicated thing. But then, those who might look for help, having recognized the whole thing as "a thing", and imagined there was something to do about it (which seems unlikely, I mean... doesn't it just seem like everything sucks when you're in there ? it's transcendantal suffering...) would probably talk about difficult emotions, existentially difficult stuff. I remember from the abidhamma that the dukkha ñanas were classified as "dukkha" combined with the mental factor of "prajña", so, wise suffering. 

Existential crisis ; existential dread ; anxiety ; nihilism ; feeling like life sucks ; darkness of the world ; ... 

But the tricky thing is that in the DN, you feel like it's the world that is like that, not you, right ?

Wouldn't someone who doesn't know anything about meditation look for clues about their current predicament in areas of their own culture first ? I know that that's what I did. Reading existentialist literature. Sartre's Nausea felt like "hey, this guy understands what I've seen !" You (1) look for people who talk about the things you are now seeing in the world, looking for company, right. Or (2) look for comfort.

(1) What does a wild DNer see/experience ?

Life is pointless/miserable/sucks/is absurd/a joke ??

How likely are they to think that this is a process happening to them and not just them becoming clearer about the shittiness that the world is ?

The thing is, when you "see" or know this stuff, you don't look in the way that you would look for a doctor if you have coronavirus, right ? Or even because you realize that there is a problem with your mood. The distinct thing, about the knowledges of suffering, is that they contain wisdom. That is the crucial difference with mood problems and such, correct ? So, you look for someone who can share in your knowledge, rather than someone who can cure you.

(2) Where will they find comfort and what kind of things would they be looking for ? Looking for meaning, reassurance, or what ? I feel like the characteristic of the DN is that it's extremely hard to find comfort. It's your whole world which starts crumbling. I personnaly started isolating myself quite radically. Again, I would say that what I was most looking for, is shared understanding. It's not like psychopathology, it's about the meaning of existence. 

So it seems very tricky indeed. No idea, except to make art which people can relate to. That is what helped me.

And so, two subsidiary questions for Bagpuss :

Imagining that you find a way to reach wild and tame DNers (how do you reach them ? doesn't there need to be something more... look out for it... proactive ? than a website ?) :

(A) What will be different about this site than Dharma Overground, for instance, or Willoughby Britton's stuff ? 

(emoticon <- haha, supposed to be a b in parentheses... (B ) What kind of support would there be, in what form ?

Slightly different perspective, just for fun : what would you think about the idea, assuming Daniel would be on board, of building on the notoriety of this very website, and working on ways to put more accent on raising awareness of the DN and bringing active support for DNers, etc., rather than starting from scratch ?
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Brandon Dayton, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 474 Join Date: 9/24/19 Recent Posts
Samwise
Derek2, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

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dharma.icu
Grin Spickett, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 9 Join Date: 6/16/20 Recent Posts
After the End

The Point Beyond

Pieced Together

Half-Awake

The Passing Crowd

Arising and Falling

This is tough (a statement, not a name)
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Jim Smith, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 962 Join Date: 1/17/15 Recent Posts
I suggest DAWN as a name or acronym because it implies the end of a dark night.

One possible name for the site that would have this acronym is:

Dark Night
Assistance
Web
Neighborhood

(There might be better names with that acronym. Or it could just be called "Dawn" and not be an acronym.)
Tim Farrington, modified 10 Months ago.

RE: What to call a website to support adverse events?

Posts: 2460 Join Date: 6/13/11 Recent Posts
Daniel M. Ingram:
Bagpuss, a long-time DhO member, has some time and interest in creating a site to support those experiencing adverse spiritual events, hights, lows, weirds, whatever is causing difficulty, and the first question is what to call it?

As these events can arise in a number of contexts, meditation, psychedelics, other situations in daily life, etc., the name needs to be somewhat general and hopefully non-tradition-specific.

Any ideas welcome!

Also, if you have any interest in working on that project, do let him know.

May this project go well and help many!

Daniel

how can we let Bagpuss know we are interested if he doesn't show up at his own idea's debut post, and lets you handle all the work? He has some time, you say. But maybe not time enough to do this right.

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