In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

JohanJ, modified 8 Months ago.

In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 9 Join Date: 5/23/19 Recent Posts
Hello,

As the title implies, I am looking for a spiritual friend and what better place to look for than on DhO? If I may, I am searching for someone who is about the same age (since I haven't been able to convince any of my friends to go down this path with me *YET*. I am 25) and around the same insight stage (I believe my threshold is somwhere around equanimity on 1:st path) as me. Getting a bit annoyed that basically all the meditators in my community are 60 years old and that it seems like everyone is only meditating to become less stressed and happy-go-lucky... I dont want to only become less stressed and happy-go-lucky...I want the full on ñāṇa mindblasting, jhana mastering, power/magic accessing and the end of freaking suffering (I might have to work on my desiring hehe). Seems hard to find someone in my age that have this interest as well, so if you have, I invite you to inbox me here on DhO, and hopefully we can share, explore and support each other through the depths of the mind together for many years to come!

All the best,
Johan
agnostic, modified 8 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 1893 Join Date: 2/26/19 Recent Posts
I hope it doesn't take you 35 years to realize that stress and suffering are the same thing emoticon
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Jordi, modified 8 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 84 Join Date: 9/17/17 Recent Posts
Hi, 

If you really want to go serious and met people with the same interest I will recomand you going into retreats. 

The retreats I did in asia I met people around 20-35, that they going deep and serious on the practice! 

Anyways, age is just a number and have friendship with old and advanced practiconers can be a blessing! 
JohanJ, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 9 Join Date: 5/23/19 Recent Posts
Jordi:
Hi, 

If you really want to go serious and met people with the same interest I will recomand you going into retreats. 

The retreats I did in asia I met people around 20-35, that they going deep and serious on the practice! 

Anyways, age is just a number and have friendship with old and advanced practiconers can be a blessing! 


Yes, I agree. Retreats are probably to best way to come into contact with like-minded people. Thanks for replying emoticon
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Tommy M, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 116 Join Date: 12/1/20 Recent Posts
Hey Johan,

There's a lot to unpack here, so I'll offer whatever I can in the hope that it helps.
(...)since I haven't been able to convince any of my friends to go down this path with me *YET*(...)

It's both unhelpful and unwise to try to convince anyone to follow your path. It's a waste of your energy, and it's also really annoying when someone wants to drag you into their personal psychodrama so I would suggest dropping that immediately.

around the same insight stage (I believe my threshold is somwhere around equanimity on 1:st path) as me

On what do you base your self-diagnosed 'stage'? Also, what do you mean by "threshold"?

More importantly, why does it matter to you that you have someone of your own age and level of development? The Path unfolds differently for all of us. While there may be similarities, since we're ultimately covering the same 'territory', what works for one person may not necessarily work for you and to try to follow someone else's path will only lead to more suffering.

Getting a bit annoyed that basically all the meditators in my community are 60 years old and that it seems like everyone is only meditating to become less stressed and happy-go-lucky

That's incredibly disrespectful, lacking in compassion and also pure projection on your part. You don't know the mind of another, and you don't know the intentions behind their practice. What if one of those 60 year olds was an emanation of Samantabhadra, or a highly realized Bodhisattva who joined the group to plant the seeds of the Buddhadharma in the mindstream?

Examine your prejudices, and be honest with yourself. So far, you seem quite egotistical and desirous of attainment for nothing more than personal gain.

I dont want to only become less stressed and happy-go-lucky

Good, because that ain't what the Path entails. It's hard, painful and soaked in suffering.

Does that sound like something to make you "less stressed"?

I want the full on ñāṇa mindblasting, jhana mastering, power/magic accessing and the end of freaking suffering (I might have to work on my desiring hehe).

So, in other words you're looking for unusual experiences, personal power and seeking only personal liberation. Got it.

we can share, explore and support each other through the depths of the mind together for many years to come!

You don't need someone who is your age and at your level of development. A "spiritual friend" will appear when they're required.

You don't get them by asking on a forum like it's some sort of spiritual dating site.

I know my words may seem harsh, but I say this with nothing but love and compassion because I sincerely want to see you attain freedom from habitual rebirth. Some of the most important realizations along the way have come when people called me out for being full of shit, forced me to examine my intentions and desires, and shot me down in flames. It's painful and it's hard, but consider this:

Have your ever achieved anything worthwhile that was easy?

Start a practice thread, share your experiences and you'll find that "spiritual friends" are always around to help you when the time is right.

Practice well.
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Bardo, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 260 Join Date: 9/14/19 Recent Posts
Tommy M:
Getting a bit annoyed that basically all the meditators in my community are 60 years old and that it seems like everyone is only meditating to become less stressed and happy-go-lucky

That's incredibly disrespectful, lacking in compassion and also pure projection on your part. You don't know the mind of another, and you don't know the intentions behind their practice. What if one of those 60 year olds was an emanation of Samantabhadra, or a highly realized Bodhisattva who joined the group to plant the seeds of the Buddhadharma in the mindstream?

Examine your prejudices, and be honest with yourself. So far, you seem quite egotistical and desirous of attainment for nothing more than personal gain.

An advocate of moral perfection defining what is wrong in the context of spiritual striving. What would you be trying to shape him into? Your version of moral superiority? "Bollocks" is what I say to that!

My point here is that this kind of delivery is used far too often and in far too many traditions to beat, what is termed 'wrongness', out of the free mind, which, might I add, is brimming with boundless creativity. The free mind has complete disregard for societal constraints: the very same constraints you choose to fasten tightly around this expressive delivery. Annoyance is allowed my friend in whatever way it wants to express itself.

The vast majority of people harbour an adequate degree of moral inclination to allow them to move through this process. Perhaps your version of 'being a good person' needs further scrutiny.

I love you, but I don't like this approach. 

Best wishes.
JohanJ, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 9 Join Date: 5/23/19 Recent Posts
Tommy M:
Hey Johan,

There's a lot to unpack here, so I'll offer whatever I can in the hope that it helps.
(...)since I haven't been able to convince any of my friends to go down this path with me *YET*(...)

It's both unhelpful and unwise to try to convince anyone to follow your path. It's a waste of your energy, and it's also really annoying when someone wants to drag you into their personal psychodrama so I would suggest dropping that immediately.

around the same insight stage (I believe my threshold is somwhere around equanimity on 1:st path) as me

On what do you base your self-diagnosed 'stage'? Also, what do you mean by "threshold"?

More importantly, why does it matter to you that you have someone of your own age and level of development? The Path unfolds differently for all of us. While there may be similarities, since we're ultimately covering the same 'territory', what works for one person may not necessarily work for you and to try to follow someone else's path will only lead to more suffering.

Getting a bit annoyed that basically all the meditators in my community are 60 years old and that it seems like everyone is only meditating to become less stressed and happy-go-lucky

That's incredibly disrespectful, lacking in compassion and also pure projection on your part. You don't know the mind of another, and you don't know the intentions behind their practice. What if one of those 60 year olds was an emanation of Samantabhadra, or a highly realized Bodhisattva who joined the group to plant the seeds of the Buddhadharma in the mindstream?

Examine your prejudices, and be honest with yourself. So far, you seem quite egotistical and desirous of attainment for nothing more than personal gain.

I dont want to only become less stressed and happy-go-lucky

Good, because that ain't what the Path entails. It's hard, painful and soaked in suffering.

Does that sound like something to make you "less stressed"?

I want the full on ñāṇa mindblasting, jhana mastering, power/magic accessing and the end of freaking suffering (I might have to work on my desiring hehe).

So, in other words you're looking for unusual experiences, personal power and seeking only personal liberation. Got it.

we can share, explore and support each other through the depths of the mind together for many years to come!

You don't need someone who is your age and at your level of development. A "spiritual friend" will appear when they're required.

You don't get them by asking on a forum like it's some sort of spiritual dating site.

I know my words may seem harsh, but I say this with nothing but love and compassion because I sincerely want to see you attain freedom from habitual rebirth. Some of the most important realizations along the way have come when people called me out for being full of shit, forced me to examine my intentions and desires, and shot me down in flames. It's painful and it's hard, but consider this:

Have your ever achieved anything worthwhile that was easy?

Start a practice thread, share your experiences and you'll find that "spiritual friends" are always around to help you when the time is right.

Practice well.

Hello emoticon,

Thanks for a comprehensive answer but a bit too much reading between the lines of my initial post. I do agree that my statement about my 60 year old meditation peers was out of hand and not very friendly. I value them greatly and see many of them as my friends and inspiration. My annoyance is more targeted towards that I have barely heard anyone in my community speak about the insight stages. Furthermore, even though there is great value to have meditation friends of all kinds of ages I think there are obvious reasons to want to find peer meditators around the  same age as oneself.

All the best,
Johan
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Tommy M, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 116 Join Date: 12/1/20 Recent Posts
No reading between the lines involved, my friend. I responded to your own words.

My annoyance is more targeted towards that I have barely heard anyone in my community speak about the insight stages.
It's highly unlikely that you'll hear much discussion of the insight stages in many communities. In fact, many teachers point-blank refuse to even bring up the subject, even if they're familiar with the states and stages involved. There are many, many reasons as to why this is, but it often boils down to the risk of turning practice into an intellectual exercise, instead of grounding awareness in the body and remaining attentive to what arises.

As has been recommended already, a retreat environment with a tradition like Goenka, or more specifically Theravadan group would likely help you. Discussion of the insight stages in the way it's done here is pretty unique, and it's thanks to Daniel bringing awareness to these maps and models that we're able to do so. It's proper high-level practice and, for most casual meditators like those in your group, is just too deep and complex to even begin to get into. 

Furthermore, even though there is great value to have meditation friends of all kinds of ages I think there are obvious reasons to want to find peer meditators around the  same age as oneself.
I have no doubt that having people of your own age to discuss practice with can be helpful. My concern is that you seem to place more importance on the age of the yogi and their having a similar level of practice to you, which may not actually be helpful in any meaningful way. I've learned more from people who are considerably younger than me, such "An Eternal Now" from this site, and also from those who are a lot older than me.

It sounds like you're looking for more of an actual friend to practice with, rather than a kalyāṇa-mitta per se. There's nothing wrong with that, and my apologies if it sounds like I'm saying otherwise, but it just seems to me that age is irrelevant when it comes to a "noble friend" in the sense the phrase is used. 
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Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 5769 Join Date: 12/8/18 Recent Posts
Feeling lonely on the path is a very human thing, regardless of what it's called. I hope you will find the support that you need. This forum can be great for that.

You have a Swedish-clinging name. Are you from Sweden too?
JohanJ, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 9 Join Date: 5/23/19 Recent Posts
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Feeling lonely on the path is a very human thing, regardless of what it's called. I hope you will find the support that you need. This forum can be great for that.

You have a Swedish-clinging name. Are you from Sweden too?
Jajamänsan! Kul att se lite svenskar på forumet! emoticon
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Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 5769 Join Date: 12/8/18 Recent Posts
JohanJ:
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Feeling lonely on the path is a very human thing, regardless of what it's called. I hope you will find the support that you need. This forum can be great for that.

You have a Swedish-clinging name. Are you from Sweden too?
Jajamänsan! Kul att se lite svenskar på forumet! emoticon

Norrköping här. Har mest internationella meditationsvänner. Det finns minst en till svensk här men han har inte varit aktiv på länge. 
JohanJ, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 9 Join Date: 5/23/19 Recent Posts
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
JohanJ:
Linda ”Polly Ester” Ö:
Feeling lonely on the path is a very human thing, regardless of what it's called. I hope you will find the support that you need. This forum can be great for that.

You have a Swedish-clinging name. Are you from Sweden too?
Jajamänsan! Kul att se lite svenskar på forumet! emoticon

Norrköping här. Har mest internationella meditationsvänner. Det finns minst en till svensk här men han har inte varit aktiv på länge. 

Okej, vad härligt. Jag själv bor i Stockholm emoticon
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Nicky2, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 51 Join Date: 4/18/20 Recent Posts
kalyāṇa-mitta give up wanting 
A. Dietrich Ringle, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 798 Join Date: 12/4/11 Recent Posts
I think we're all looking for that good spiritual friend. The question no one can stand is what to do once you meet that person.
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Nicky2, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 51 Join Date: 4/18/20 Recent Posts
kalyāṇa-mitta is the buddha. no need to search, unless the buddha cannot be understood. if so, a kalyāṇa-mitta will never be found 
agnostic, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 1893 Join Date: 2/26/19 Recent Posts
If only true kalyana-mitta is indeed the Buddha, then what role does DhO (or any spiritual community) play where people appear to be trying to help each other out in the spirit of spiritual friendship? Is it just a halfway house until we recognize that the Buddha really is our only true spiritual friend? Can one at least make a case that other people are able to see our spiritual faults better than ourselves?!
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Chris Marti, modified 7 Months ago.

RE: In search of kalyāṇa-mitta

Posts: 3997 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
If only true kalyana-mitta is indeed the Buddha, then what role does DhO (or any spiritual community) play where people appear to be trying to help each other out in the spirit of spiritual friendship?

Maybe it's the same thing, eh?