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A question regarding AF practice

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A question regarding AF practice
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1/26/12 7:58 AM
I have been reading some of the AF literature since it started showing up here and I have a question I hope someone can clear up. What is the practical difference between moment by moment mindfulness and working on HAIETMOBA? I find the AF page to be about as clear as mud regarding the actual techniques.

Many thanks.

RE: A question regarding AF practice
Answer
1/26/12 8:08 AM as a reply to Daniel F Gurzynski.
It depends on how you think of "mindfulness".

If you would practice it as "be alert, recognize your experience (non-analytically)", then it isn't so different.

If you would practice it as "actively attend to your experience, actively analyze & decompose your experience", then it's fairly different.

("Mindfulness" is a term that isn't always used the same way by everyone. HAIETMOBA is a good cue for the former type.)

RE: A question regarding AF practice
Answer
1/26/12 7:55 PM as a reply to End in Sight.
I meant mindfulness as in the thread "The Practical Aspects of Establishing Mindfulness" thread elsewhere on the board, as in a lot of meditation literature. The 'mindfulness' needed to keep on track while practicing Samatha for example.

Thanks.

End in Sight:
It depends on how you think of "mindfulness".

If you would practice it as "be alert, recognize your experience (non-analytically)", then it isn't so different.

If you would practice it as "actively attend to your experience, actively analyze & decompose your experience", then it's fairly different.

("Mindfulness" is a term that isn't always used the same way by everyone. HAIETMOBA is a good cue for the former type.)

RE: A question regarding AF practice
Answer
1/26/12 8:09 PM as a reply to Daniel F Gurzynski.
Daniel F Gurzynski:
I have been reading some of the AF literature since it started showing up here and I have a question I hope someone can clear up. What is the practical difference between moment by moment mindfulness and working on HAIETMOBA? I find the AF page to be about as clear as mud regarding the actual techniques.

I would put it as this: mindfulness is something required to be successful in any kind of meditation. HAIETMOBA is a particular kind of meditation, which requires mindfulness, and also helps develop it (much like any other kind of meditation).

RE: A question regarding AF practice
Answer
1/26/12 10:08 PM as a reply to Beoman Claudiu Dragon Emu Fire Golem.
Beoman Claudiu Dragon Emu Fire Golem:
Daniel F Gurzynski:
I have been reading some of the AF literature since it started showing up here and I have a question I hope someone can clear up. What is the practical difference between moment by moment mindfulness and working on HAIETMOBA? I find the AF page to be about as clear as mud regarding the actual techniques.

I would put it as this: mindfulness is something required to be successful in any kind of meditation. HAIETMOBA is a particular kind of meditation, which requires mindfulness, and also helps develop it (much like any other kind of meditation).


As this is a discussion about AF, best to refer back to the AF website:

http://www.actualfreedom.com.au/richard/selectedcorrespondence/sc-meditation.htm

It is clearly stated that actualism and meditation are diametrically opposed.

cheers

RE: A question regarding AF practice
Answer
1/27/12 4:24 AM as a reply to John Mitchell.
John Mitchell:


It is clearly stated that actualism and meditation are diametrically opposed.

cheers


That doesn't mean that they are.

RE: A question regarding AF practice
Answer
1/27/12 6:22 AM as a reply to John Mitchell.
John Mitchell:
It is clearly stated that actualism and meditation are diametrically opposed.

Thanks for bringing this up; I should have been clearer.

I was using 'meditation' in the broader sense of the term, as in, a way to cultivate your mind. Asking HAIETMOBA, deconstructing social identity, tuning into the senses, happy + harmless, etc, is certainly mind cultivation. Actualism is indeed quite different than many forms of meditation, but many kinds of meditation are also quite different from e.g. the one espoused by MCTB to get stream entry.

RE: A question regarding AF practice
Answer
1/27/12 8:24 AM as a reply to Beoman Claudiu Dragon Emu Fire Golem.
The way in which actualism differs from meditation is that in meditation generally one objectifies emotions as being a sense experience, which causes "you" to dis-imbed from them psychologically. In actualism one keeps emotions subjective but aims towards seeing clearly the root cause, pattern, and comparison to peak experience, thus allowing them to dissipate themselves.

In this way, I think contemplation is a much more appropriate term than meditation. That being said, once cultivating felicity becomes easier, that process in itself can become very much like a meditation, albeit an active one with a very particular goal.

RE: A question regarding AF practice
Answer
1/27/12 9:28 AM as a reply to #1 - 0.
#1 - 0:
The way in which actualism differs from meditation is that in meditation generally one objectifies emotions as being a sense experience, which causes "you" to dis-imbed from them psychologically. In actualism one keeps emotions subjective but aims towards seeing clearly the root cause, pattern, and comparison to peak experience, thus allowing them to dissipate themselves.

In this way, I think contemplation is a much more appropriate term than meditation. That being said, once cultivating felicity becomes easier, that process in itself can become very much like a meditation, albeit an active one with a very particular goal.

Ah yes, contemplation is a good word, and an AFT-site-approved one, at that. Thanks.

RE: A question regarding AF practice
Answer
1/27/12 11:03 AM as a reply to Thom W.
Thom W:
John Mitchell:


It is clearly stated that actualism and meditation are diametrically opposed.

cheers


That doesn't mean that they are.


LOL ;-) But Thom, it is *clearly stated* that they are... hahahaha ;-)

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