What if you never had to eat again - here's how - Discussion
What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Timmy Davis, modified 9 Years ago at 8/5/15 1:32 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/5/15 1:06 PM
What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 28 Join Date: 3/4/15 Recent PostsNow that the bold fear mongering lettering caught your attention, let's discuss.
So, I'm not talking about ascetic practices - the buddha already tried, tested, and dismissed that.
I'm talking about switching to only powdered food, thereby foregoing cooking, shopping, eating regular food and worrying about getting the right nutrients etc for example:
Soylent (or similar companies that make basically the same thing) is a powder that contains all the nutrients your body needs (everything that is on the recommended daily allowance).
You mix this powder with water and eat it over about three meals to meet our calorie needs and recommended daily allowances.
The guy who invented this seems to be a borderline crazy futurist, in a cool way. He has this as 90% of his diet and the other 10% is normal food, or "muggle" as some people who made the switch call it.
Switching to soylent would free up a ridiculous amount of time each day (hours), most likely make you healthier, and would help eradicate sensual desire for taste. More time for practice!
So, who is going to join me and make the switch?
Lots of people's reservation for switching is because they like food too much. To me that isn't an issue. I'm more of an eat to live type of guy.
Very interesting idea and seems very pragmatic.
bernd the broter, modified 9 Years ago at 8/5/15 2:52 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/5/15 2:52 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 376 Join Date: 6/13/12 Recent PostsSwitching to soylent would free up a ridiculous amount of time each day (hours), most likely make you healthier, and would help eradicate sensual desire for taste. More time for practice!
Yeah, because, what could possibly go wrong o_O
After all, nutrition science is something like the best researched field ever, with the least amount of questionable contentions.
Timmy Davis, modified 9 Years ago at 8/5/15 2:56 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/5/15 2:56 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 28 Join Date: 3/4/15 Recent PostsMost people who do live off of it conclude by saying - it is definitely far better for me than my average normal diet before which just couldn't have been healthy (fast food, eating irregularly, overeating, snacking etc). So they don't really care if it isn't perfect because almost nobody has a perfect diet. This comes closer than most and has lots and lots of people attesting for it (including follow up blood tests).
Spent a long while researching and it definitely seems worth it - obviously I would still allow myself to eat solid food whenever I wanted but this should take off the pressure of *needing* to cook and eat healthily.
Eva Nie, modified 9 Years ago at 8/5/15 4:35 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/5/15 4:35 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 831 Join Date: 3/23/14 Recent PostsYeah, because, what could possibly go wrong o_O
After all, nutrition science is something like the best researched field ever, with the least amount of questionable contentions.
He also states that "canned vegetables are better than fresh ones because fresh ones are decaying." He completely neglects to mention that the high heat and pressure of canning kills a lot of vitamins, potential dangers of BPA and aluminum contamination, amount of chemicals added as preservatives, and the fact that canned foods are typically of the lowest possible quality, items that were not good enough to be sold fresh. Source of quotes here: http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/04/the-man-who-would-make-eating-obsolete/361058/ .
Yes, you can live off of burgers and fries, you can live off of white rice and beans, you can live off of all kinds of things, that does not mean I plan to experiment with my body by eating known garbage food long term. Although the name also makes me laugh, I would assume it is named Soylent due to the high content of heavily processed soy protein isolate in this stuff.
Soy protein isolate is about the cheapest protein source around, it has low digestability compared to other foods, men might want to consider that it contains exogenous estrogens (it's those exogenous estrogens that accound for the cholesterol lowering effect but they also promote body fat accumulation and a more girly appearance), and is not a complete protein. The algal oil is also a very cheap source of oil. Plus they add a sugar source and a bunch of vitamins.
If food science actually reliably knew everything about what humans needed to survive and how those things operated in the body, then it might be safer to trust such heavily processed chemical food sources, but we are far from understanding such things and heavily processed foods regularly come out on the losing side of the game when they are researched. Plus the make of Soylent is signficantly out of touch with even current research.
Personally, I would not risk my health eating this kind of cheap chemical food, although granted it may be no worse or may even be slightly better than the burgers and fries, cereal, potato chips, ice cream, sugary drinks, cookies and so called (erroneously so) 'health' bars I see some people mostly eating through the day. If you are already eating total crap, then soylent might be better. Otherwise, I would stay well away from it, very far away! If you are pressed for time, you can always train yourself to eat fewer meals, that saves a lot of time. I too like the idea of something both healthy and convenient, but right now the options are healthy OR convenient, in which case I will be siding with 'healthy.' Yes eating real food is a bit of hassle, but it's way less hassle than getting sick or being tired all day.
-Eva
Jo Jo, modified 9 Years ago at 8/5/15 3:26 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/5/15 3:25 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 47 Join Date: 9/30/14 Recent PostsThere is a food company selling powdered food called Soylent?
Do yo know the 1973 movie Soylent Green? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HC5soDYcVo
Timmy Davis, modified 9 Years ago at 8/5/15 3:26 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/5/15 3:26 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 28 Join Date: 3/4/15 Recent PostsEva Nie, modified 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 12:01 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 12:01 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 831 Join Date: 3/23/14 Recent PostsThe first ingredient is canola and sunflower oil POWDER. They make oil into powder by mixing it with sugar and salt. Oil, sugar, and salt combined together of course taste quite good! And that fancy algal oil much touted on their front page? That is so far down the list, it is past all the vitamins and even past cellulose. Keep in mind that ingredients are listed in the order of most of least. So there is less algal oil (also in powdered for I might add) than cellulose. What is cellulose? It's wood pulp, a common super cheap filler/fiber source.
The vitamins in this stuff are low quality too. For instance, they use magnesium oxide as the magnesium source. Magnesium oxide is the cheapest source of magnesium and has been found hwen tested to have about 4% digestability on average, that makes their 23% of RDA magnesium per pouch claim to be in actuality more like 1% when digestability is considered. You could get the vitamins in pill form yourself of course, there are many balanced vitamin source systems out there, some with much better quality than in Soylent.
The Soylent marketing program may talk the talk, but they don't walk the walk, I'm actually surprised at how bad the ingredient listing is, definitely not the best science has to offer but probably a pretty good scheme for keeping ingredient costs as low as possible. And you have to get them points for superior marketing skills. Reminds of how Gatorade made a ton of $ by making a drink out of water, sugar and salt and marketing it as 'electrolytes.' ;-P
Mark, modified 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 5:42 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 5:42 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 554 Join Date: 7/24/14 Recent PostsPsi, modified 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 12:19 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 12:19 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 1099 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent PostsNow that the bold fear mongering lettering caught your attention, let's discuss.
So, I'm not talking about ascetic practices - the buddha already tried, tested, and dismissed that.
I'm talking about switching to only powdered food, thereby foregoing cooking, shopping, eating regular food and worrying about getting the right nutrients etc for example:
Soylent (or similar companies that make basically the same thing) is a powder that contains all the nutrients your body needs (everything that is on the recommended daily allowance).
You mix this powder with water and eat it over about three meals to meet our calorie needs and recommended daily allowances.
The guy who invented this seems to be a borderline crazy futurist, in a cool way. He has this as 90% of his diet and the other 10% is normal food, or "muggle" as some people who made the switch call it.
Switching to soylent would free up a ridiculous amount of time each day (hours), most likely make you healthier, and would help eradicate sensual desire for taste. More time for practice!
So, who is going to join me and make the switch?
Lots of people's reservation for switching is because they like food too much. To me that isn't an issue. I'm more of an eat to live type of guy.
Very interesting idea and seems very pragmatic.
Yesterday, I ate a bowl of grits with a little butter and a little salt, then after about an hour I ran 6.2 miles. It took five minutes in the microwave. Cost, maybe 20 cents, maybe less. Of course, I do crave and cling to grits, but now I am getting corny.
Psi
Eva Nie, modified 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 12:48 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 12:48 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 831 Join Date: 3/23/14 Recent PostsYesterday, I ate a bowl of grits with a little butter and a little salt, then after about an hour I ran 6.2 miles. It took five minutes in the microwave. Cost, maybe 20 cents, maybe less. Of course, I do crave and cling to grits, but now I am getting corny.
Psi
-Eva
bernd the broter, modified 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 5:33 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 5:33 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 376 Join Date: 6/13/12 Recent PostsRichard Zen, modified 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 8:43 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 8:43 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 1676 Join Date: 5/18/10 Recent PostsTimmy Davis, modified 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 8:57 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 8:57 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 28 Join Date: 3/4/15 Recent PostsConsidering you still eat for fun a few times a week or more, your teeth ans jaw will not erode either.
Considering the whole soy and estrogen problem, that is also incorrect as soy protein isolate removes the harmful phytoestrogens (unsure if this is the correct name), that cause the testosterone issues in men.
As for bioavailability, it seems all the people who have lived off of this mostly (80-90%) have near perfect blood work without and lack of vitamins. I would provide sources however I'm sitting in line waiting for the Eurotunnel at the moment and I'm on my phone.
For more information on whether this is actually healthy please refer to "discourse soylent" and look through the forums.
I think a lot of your information Eva is unfair and not very jjustified (mine probably isn't either considering lack of sources, but I'll try and get those together when I have a computer!).
Also there are other companies which do it better than soylent currently does in Europe. One of which seems to be Mana and another Jakeshake.
The potential benefits oofswitching food sources to this for somebody who doesn't have much free time are huge.
Eva Nie, modified 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 12:07 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 12:07 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 831 Join Date: 3/23/14 Recent PostsChecking ingredients for Mana here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3ZukUMavkkNOTk4R2NxX1lYRkE/view .
and oringal Jakeshake here: https://jakeshake.eu/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/Jake_Original_Nutrition_Facts.pdf
THey are rather similar, but Jakeshake uses more pea protein instead of Soy and used coconut oil which is more shelf stable, I'd probably go with Jakeshake if it was me. Really these are just cheap sources of oil, protein and sugars mixed with vitamins and minerals. Most likely better than donuts for breakfast but definitely inferior to real food IMO.
One of the big problems with nutrition is that although it was once assumed that the RDA was all that was needed, it has been found that elements in real food interact in complex ways when digested. For instance vitamin C (ascorbic acid) is digested much better in presence of bioflavinoids that are naturally present in fruit than if given as a stand alone isolated for the natural source vitamin http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3414575 . We are only just staring to piece together a few of those interactions. But research money is scarce these days because such things can't be patented and big pharma sees no money in it. Instead, if you get sick from some unknown deficiency, they are happy to sell you patented expensive pills for it so there is no reason for them to help you get healthy from something they can't make money from. But the current state of vitamin supplements is poor, most of the supplements are chosen for the cheapness of source, not the bioavailability and digestion of the product. For these replacement shakes, they are using the absolute cheapest source for all vitamins, some with very poor bioavailability.
Plus all things needed for human health are not yet understood. People had the dream in the 70s that we could just take pills for all our nutritional needs and become more healthy but that did not pan out in testing. In fact, much research has repeatedly shown that taking artificial vitamins leads to increased chance of disease, even when the studies are controlled instead of just correlational: http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2013/07/the-vitamin-myth-why-we-think-we-need-supplements/277947/ . Why is not understood but it could be that isolated artificial vitamins do not work as expected compared to natural sources. We just don't understand enough about our bodys' processes.
In fact recently, there has been much talk in recent years about how much vitamin production happens via gut bacteria (that would be the same gut bacteria that the founder of Soylent hopes to kill off with his product, as stated in his interview which I linked in a previous post): http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9167138 , http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22940212 . Humans are not able to synthesize many vitamins but gut bacteria are clearly able to do so. Recent research has shown that transfer of gut bacteria from healthy animals to sick animals can improve health of the sick animals. And proper gut bacteria is crucial to neonatal development of proper health and the immune system and probably continues to affect the immune system throughout life. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3937713/ . The balance of gut bacteria types has been strongly implicated in obesity issues: http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-gut-bacteria-help-make-us-fat-and-thin/ . Natural populations of humans have been found to have a more diverse gut bacteria and some that appear to ameliorate common American healthy problems like kidney stones: http://www.techtimes.com/articles/47066/20150419/gut-bacteria-amazonian-tribe-reveals-new-information-human-microbiome.htm . Personally, I don't think it's a good idea to attempt to kill off all gut bacteria via artificial food sources as the founder of Soylent says he wants to do.
-Eva
Timmy Davis, modified 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 12:18 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/6/15 12:18 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 28 Join Date: 3/4/15 Recent PostsSo, I'm going to test out Jake shake for a while probably about 80% of my diet and see how that goes. Despite my comments, I am still very sceptical. However I have had stomach issues for a couple of years and know for a fact I don't chew my food enough, probably the cause, and I'm certain I don't meet all my requirements despite my veggie wholefood based diet.
I also think humans can and do survive off of pretty poor things and the body is more robust than we give it credit for. I think all the time and effort that is placed on optimising nutrition is just as ridiculous as soylent advocators considering are still poor knowledge of how nutrition works.
Although the RDA is, to my knowledge sufficient to keep diseases at bay..haha. I'll probably keep 20% of my diet as fresh fruit and veggies and see what happens.
If I start feeling bad or worse for wear than I do now (I eat a pretty healthy diet) than I'll make the switch back.
However as my time will become more and more cut back over the next few years I've got to find ways to prioritise my time. Hopefully this jakeshake 80% thing should help me out.
I shall report back in a few months!
Thanks again
Eva Nie, modified 9 Years ago at 8/7/15 2:23 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/7/15 2:23 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 831 Join Date: 3/23/14 Recent PostsCommon food intolerances come from dairy, wheat, nightshade family plants, soy, tree nuts, peanuts, eggs, etc. You can find lists on line along with lists of foods least likely to cause intolerances. Intolerances tend to show more gradually than actual allergies so you won't always feel ill right after eating the food, it can just be a feeling of tiredness, lingering malaise, stomach or intestinal probs, skin rash/psoriasis, etc that lingers for days or weeks. Dairy and wheat are two common ones that people tend to feel better not eating but differnet people have different tolerances so what works for one might not work for another. Most of the foods we currently eat have been developed just over the course of the last few hundred years or sometimes only in the last few decades. They contain novel proteins and enzymes that are sometimes bioactive even after passing through the stomach. Human evoluntionary adaption has been far slower than our forced evolution of our food sources. Long term studies of new food sources are simply not done. End result is that some people are dangerous maladapted to some of the food they are eating. In a cruel twist of fate, it seems often the food you are most addicted to and have an immediate negative reaction to the idea of skipping it tends to be the food that is causing the problems. Good news is the addiction usually passes after a few days of not eating it and then you wonder why it was such a big deal earler.
For meal replacement, I would do one good meal a day of real food. For other meals, my front runners for health drinks right now are Vega One and Shakeology.
-Eva
Psi, modified 9 Years ago at 8/9/15 12:16 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/9/15 12:14 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 1099 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent PostsAnd when you really think of it, wheat is a grass, I know we eat the seeds of it or whatever, but grass!
This stuff is so cheap, food for the masses, follow the dollar trail, and the price of different forms of wheat is way out of proportion to what it is worth, cakes . doughnuts crackers,cookies, pretzels,,///....... all grass clippings... Mulch. Sugar soaked Mulch!!!
If it tastes good spit it out!
Psi
Jeff Wright, modified 9 Years ago at 8/7/15 8:03 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/7/15 8:03 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 82 Join Date: 4/16/15 Recent PostsWell, as long as we're all comparing our successes w/ weight loss (which is not much different that a "whose is bigger" contest), I'll go on record as having lost 100 pounds a couple of years ago using the Take Shape For life program. The key for me was that its safety and efficacy are proven in independent clinical trials. It's not hyped up bullshit. It just works. And it's easy & convenient (yes, I have more time for meditation now). Top that off with its major focus on long term health instead of just a diet mentality of getting to a certain weight and then quitting. I've gone from 280 to 180 and have kept that weight off for 2+ years. I learned new habits of health, which slowly have replaced my old habits of disease.
It cost me $12.00 a day, compared w/ Soylent's $20.00 a day (quoted from above). The meal replacements were tasty, I got to eat 6x a day and I wasn't hungry.
That said, if you're already at a healthy weight, I advocate a proper dietary regimen based on mostly whole, natural foods. I still eat the occasional meal replacement when I'm on the go but I mostly eat whole foods at this point, and focus on vegetables and fruits, high quality proteins and healthy fats.
I agree with Richard Zen that most people eat to satisfy cravings, deal with stress, or fill a perceived hole in their lives. That's a recipe for obesity. Hmmm, craving - doesn't that sound familiar?? Almost like it's the cause of suffering or something.
Richard Zen, modified 9 Years ago at 8/8/15 12:08 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/8/15 12:08 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 1676 Join Date: 5/18/10 Recent PostsThis is true of most addictions. They are to fill a space that could be filled by better desires. I would say that it wasn't letting go so much as enjoying food more because I noticed the increased pleasure when I ate when actually hungry. That pleasure will get you to eat less because you want to savour food instead of just getting more. Even Thanissaro's instructions to enjoy the breath to "get more allies on your side" is just another way of replacing a worse desire with a better one.
Oochdd, modified 9 Years ago at 8/7/15 8:47 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/7/15 8:47 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 101 Join Date: 12/16/14 Recent PostsThis probably very much depends on the person though: for me cooking involves a mental shift where I need to start doing and planning. For other the process of cooking might itself be very meditative. And ofcourse it could be argued that especially when it's harder to stay in the continuity that actually makes it a good practice.
Anyway, just some thoughts.
M C, modified 9 Years ago at 8/8/15 7:41 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/7/15 9:26 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 116 Join Date: 2/27/13 Recent PostsWe haven't figured out everything that the human body needs and we don't know the full composition of every food. So we can't make complete supplements. (I'm saying this as a scientist.)
So three is more time for practice?
Eating wholesome food IS practice.
Not Tao, modified 9 Years ago at 8/9/15 5:57 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/9/15 5:52 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 995 Join Date: 4/5/14 Recent Posts- The only soy product in Soylent is soy lecithin, and it's at the end of the list so there's likely very little in there. The protean source seems to be rice protean. (Note that there also aren't any lentils to be found, despite the name.)
- Whoever said Canola oil is bad for you is crazy, it's one of the healthiest cooking oils you can use.
- In spite of the long looking list of ingredients, Soylent is essentially the same as eating sweetened buttery oatmeal with a multivitamin.
- The algea oil is meant to be a vegan-friendly source of omega-3's. They were using fish oil before, so the website makes a big deal out of the algea oil since it's new.
- Eva needs to be less dramatic about vitamin absorption rates, haha.
Ok, I feel better now.
EDIT: One more thing - wheat is not bad, you all just believe in voodoo. Psi, by your logic eating almonds is eating trees, and eating lettuce is eating weeds. If it tastes good, that's natures way of telling you to eat more of it, so anything that tastes good in it's natural form (like whole wheat) is good for you. I'm off to eat a box of wheat thins and enjoy my healthy joints.
Psi, modified 9 Years ago at 8/9/15 7:09 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/9/15 7:09 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 1099 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent PostsEDIT: One more thing - wheat is not bad, you all just believe in voodoo. Psi, by your logic eating almonds is eating trees, and eating lettuce is eating weeds. If it tastes good, that's natures way of telling you to eat more of it, so anything that tastes good in it's natural form (like whole wheat) is good for you. I'm off to eat a box of wheat thins and enjoy my healthy joints.
And, you are right, wheat is not necessarily bad for anyone, but it is if person has celiac disease or gluten sensitivity.
And fruit is the ovaries of trees!!! The horror of living. Life feeds on Life. For the carrots , it is the holocaust.
Tool
"Disgustipated"
And the angel of the lord came unto me, snatching me up from my place of slumber.
And took me on high, and higher still until we moved to the spaces betwixt the air itself.
And he brought me into a vast farmlands of our own midwest.
And as we descended, cries of impending doom rose from the soil.
One thousand, nay a million voices full of fear.
And terror possesed me then.
And I begged,
"Angel of the Lord, what are these tortured screams?"
And the angel said unto me,
"These are the cries of the carrots, the cries of the carrots!
You see, Reverend Maynard, tomorrow is harvest day and to them it is the holocaust."
And I sprang from my slumber drenched in sweat like the tears of one million terrified brothers and roared,
"Hear me now, I have seen the light!
They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul!
Damn you!
Let the rabbits wear glasses!
Save our brothers!"
Can I get an amen?
Can I get a hallelujah?
Thank you Jesus.
Life feeds on life feeds on life feeds on life feeds on........
This is necessary
Not Tao, modified 9 Years ago at 8/9/15 11:11 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/9/15 11:11 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 995 Join Date: 4/5/14 Recent PostsYash C, modified 9 Years ago at 8/10/15 4:47 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/10/15 4:47 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 14 Join Date: 2/22/15 Recent Posts- The only soy product in Soylent is soy lecithin, and it's at the end of the list so there's likely very little in there. The protean source seems to be rice protean. (Note that there also aren't any lentils to be found, despite the name.)
- Whoever said Canola oil is bad for you is crazy, it's one of the healthiest cooking oils you can use.
- In spite of the long looking list of ingredients, Soylent is essentially the same as eating sweetened buttery oatmeal with a multivitamin.
- The algea oil is meant to be a vegan-friendly source of omega-3's. They were using fish oil before, so the website makes a big deal out of the algea oil since it's new.
- Eva needs to be less dramatic about vitamin absorption rates, haha.
Ok, I feel better now.
EDIT: One more thing - wheat is not bad, you all just believe in voodoo. Psi, by your logic eating almonds is eating trees, and eating lettuce is eating weeds. If it tastes good, that's natures way of telling you to eat more of it, so anything that tastes good in it's natural form (like whole wheat) is good for you. I'm off to eat a box of wheat thins and enjoy my healthy joints.
I'm not sure if you were just pulling their legs or not, but any of the refined, hydrogenated vegetable oils are really bad for you. Pure, unsalted butter, ghee, cold-pressed oils & animal lard are the way to go!
Tim, if you have started the experiment, we would love to know how it's going so far.
Keep us updated.
Love & metta,
Yash
Eva Nie, modified 9 Years ago at 8/11/15 4:03 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/11/15 4:03 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 831 Join Date: 3/23/14 Recent Posts- The only soy product in Soylent is soy lecithin, and it's at the end of the list so there's likely very little in there. The protean source seems to be rice protean. (Note that there also aren't any lentils to be found, despite the name.)
- Whoever said Canola oil is bad for you is crazy, it's one of the healthiest cooking oils you can use.
- The algea oil is meant to be a vegan-friendly source of omega-3's. They were using fish oil before, so the website makes a big deal out of the algea oil since it's new.
- Eva needs to be less dramatic about vitamin absorption rates, haha.
EDIT: One more thing - wheat is not bad, you all just believe in voodoo.
There is some good research behind it too. DPP4 enzyme is responsible for inactivating circulating wheat and diary peptides. Such peptides are scientifically proven to be bioactive, there is not debate on that one, the only debate is if the effect is powerful or not. These peptides like to bind to morphine receptors which are all over the body including in the gut. Binding at the morphine receptor changes functioning of the cell (just as binding with more powerful regular morphine does, but just a weaker version) DPP4 enzyme is variable depending on genetics of the person, but heavy metals like mercury are shown to strongly inactivate them as well. Chemical contamination is much higher in many populations in the industrial age. Plus wheat and diary consumption is much higher, its in almost everything now. PLus the type of cows we use in recent times have different peptides and potential more difficult to digest than the more hardy versions we once used. (see A1 vs A2 cows) End result is that DPP4 enzymes can be overwelmed in many people resulting and high levels of circulating exogenous bioactive peptides. It's not voodoo, it's science.
Can't stand the idea of giving up wheat and diary? Hate the idea and react viscerally to it? Remember that the bioactive peptides bind with MORPHINE receptors, ie they are addictive. Many people have found out by giving up wheat and dairy for a few weeks just to see what would happen. If nothing, one can always go back to eating it. But most won't even consider living without them for even one day, that's now addictive they are.
Psi, by your logic eating almonds is eating trees, and eating lettuce is eating weeds. If it tastes good, that's natures way of telling you to eat more of it, so anything that tastes good in it's natural form (like whole wheat) is good for you. I'm off to eat a box of wheat thins and enjoy my healthy joints.
-Eva
Darrell, modified 9 Years ago at 8/11/15 6:56 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/11/15 6:56 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 143 Join Date: 2/22/15 Recent PostsIt seems almost everything we can think is unhealthy for we humans to eat. So just what do we eat if we're going to cease consuming wheat, dairy, not to mention all the other things that have been demonstrated to be bad for our health?
Also, unless I'm mistaken, dairy has been a part of the human diet for quite a long time now. Yet it doesn't seem to have been detrimental to the health of humans. Yet now we hear it is to be avoided. What am I missing?
Eva Nie, modified 9 Years ago at 8/11/15 8:52 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/11/15 8:52 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 831 Join Date: 3/23/14 Recent PostsIt seems almost everything we can think is unhealthy for we humans to eat. So just what do we eat if we're going to cease consuming wheat, dairy, not to mention all the other things that have been demonstrated to be bad for our health?
Also, unless I'm mistaken, dairy has been a part of the human diet for quite a long time now. Yet it doesn't seem to have been detrimental to the health of humans. Yet now we hear it is to be avoided. What am I missing?
For dairy being part of the diet 'for a long time now' that's only been true for select parts of the world and it also has likely not been long enough for full biological adaptation which takes at least 100s of thousands of generations or more, evolution is slow. As it is now, 75% of the world is lactose intolerant currently, so dairy adaptation for humans is weak at best. Used to be that people stayed in the same place generation after generation which helped with adaptation to a single environment and consistant food sources, but now with the mix of genetics from all over the world, how do you know your genetics are well adapted when 75% of the world is clearly not adapted? And those adaptations were for cows with different proteins, that did not take hormones nor antibiotics, and ate grass instead of garbage, all of which alters the proteins and contents of the milk produced.
Most people here are probably going by what they have been told on TV (mostly by the food manufacturers themselves who carefully select the research that is to be done) and seen since they are born, that seems normal to them and is what most people do, but those things are not science nor are they natural or healthy. They are only the current trend and what you are accustomed to.
As for 'everything' we eat being unhealthy, most things in the grocery store were developed just in the last 40 years or so, obviously there will be zero adaptation to GMOs and heavily modified plants grown in depleted soil, using pesticides and artificial fertilizers, and then separated with mechanical and chemicals means into constituent parts, often with high heat and pressure which actually denatures the amino acids themselves (research on animal feed shows high heat and pressure alters amino acid forms and reduces digestability quite a bit, yielding lower weights and production in animals but research is not done for humans), and sometimes the foods are further modified to make them last forever or have better 'mouth feel' or temperature tolerance (ex 'modified food starch') and also mixed with misc chemicals for the same reason. Most vitamins and all enzymes are also killed in this processing. Is it really any surprise that the body is not adapted for such substances?
Manufacturers want you to buy more and more stuff, that is how they make their money, plus they want high profit margins. The trick is to use cheap as possible food parts that never go bad (not even the mold with eat it), then they flavor it with state of the art chemical flavors designed to trigger the reward parts of the brain. They actually hook people up to MRIs and have them eat the food and see what happens! Certain scan results have been found to indicate the food will sell well and many top sellign junk food items were developed using this method. An insider has said that so far, this method has worked for all products. (sorry, can't find that article on that one but heres links to other similar info: http://www.theblot.com/what-bliss-point-besides-reason-addicted-doritos-7716219 and http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/07/18/brain-imaging-confirms-food-addiction.aspx )
A few hundred years ago, not long when it comes to evolution, humans ate fruits, vegetables, and meat and grain. The grain was very different grain processed and grown in very different ways from what we have today. Even the fruits and veggies and meats are different now but they are still the closest we have to natural. The further you get from natural, the more trouble you will tend to have. 70% of Americans take prescription drugs (1 or more), does that sound like natural health to you?
-Eva
Darrell, modified 9 Years ago at 8/14/15 3:26 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/14/15 3:26 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 143 Join Date: 2/22/15 Recent PostsI didn't mean to imply that I thought you were say wheat and dairy are bad for everyone. I re-read what I posted, and while I'm not sure how I accomplished this feat of simplification, I sincerely did not mean any offense.
It was meant as a sincere question
Eva Nie, modified 9 Years ago at 8/15/15 1:20 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/15/15 1:20 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 831 Join Date: 3/23/14 Recent PostsI didn't mean to imply that I thought you were say wheat and dairy are bad for everyone. I re-read what I posted, and while I'm not sure how I accomplished this feat of simplification, I sincerely did not mean any offense.
It was meant as a sincere question
-Eva
-Eva
Darrell, modified 9 Years ago at 8/10/15 2:53 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/10/15 2:53 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 143 Join Date: 2/22/15 Recent PostsCleve Backster's research would seem to indicate otherwise. The idea that something is good because it's natural is something that can be easily shown to not be true, but I know you meant that humorously, so I'll leave that alone.
I wish this sort of food tech were known to be reliable and safe, as I'm all for it. I'm tired of the tyranny of food. It's an ancient idea that is ripe for being turned on its head. Seeing as how I live on very simple foods, and have reduced my consumption by over half of what it had been a year ago, I really like the idea of being able to relegate food, eating, preparation, etc to a small corner of my life. I hope that either this Soylent is proven to be safe and effective, or someone comes up with something that is.
But I'll still have to go out on my birthday for Indian food, so here's to traditional food!
Not Tao, modified 9 Years ago at 8/11/15 5:59 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/11/15 5:59 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 995 Join Date: 4/5/14 Recent PostsTimmy Davis, modified 9 Years ago at 8/14/15 7:44 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/14/15 7:44 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 28 Join Date: 3/4/15 Recent PostsI currently have 39 meals sitting in my living room (I ate my first one yesterday, it was rather pleasant, not bad at all - tasted like unsweetened cake mix with some flaxseeds in it).
Jake Shake seem to be the most professional and ingredient-conscious out of the bunch and they recommend slowly transitioning (over 2-3 weeks) if you plan to eat all your meals as Jake.
This I shall try.
Most likely I'll end up eating 2 out of 3 meals per day as Jake and the rest social eating.
Will update in a couple of months to let you all know how it's going with my health and the extra free time this will give me for my practice.
PS
I think most people take nutrition too seriously. The buddha regarded food as sustenance for the body, nothing more. It is a tool to keep us running well so we can meditate well.
If this soylent/jakeshake stuff does that without me feeling worse than I do now (I feel fine), then I'm definitely going to continue.
Thanks everybody for taking part in this discussion, it's been very helpful.
Eva Nie, modified 9 Years ago at 8/15/15 1:51 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/15/15 1:51 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 831 Join Date: 3/23/14 Recent PostsPS
I think most people take nutrition too seriously. The buddha regarded food as sustenance for the body, nothing more. It is a tool to keep us running well so we can meditate well.
-Eva
Timmy Davis, modified 9 Years ago at 8/14/15 3:41 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/14/15 3:41 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 28 Join Date: 3/4/15 Recent PostsSoylent doesn't contain the harmful substances in soy that give you man titties.
Darrell, modified 9 Years ago at 8/14/15 6:29 PM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/14/15 6:29 PM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 143 Join Date: 2/22/15 Recent PostsUnfortunately, troll and trolling have become very loaded lanuage. I think we should give Pawel the benefit of the doubt for just having fun and playing around.
Besides, what's so bad about man mammaries? He could get more dates or feed a hungry child!
Eva Nie, modified 9 Years ago at 8/15/15 1:12 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/15/15 1:12 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 831 Join Date: 3/23/14 Recent PostsSoylent doesn't contain the harmful substances in soy that give you man titties.
-Eva
Eva Nie, modified 9 Years ago at 8/18/15 12:29 AM
Created 9 Years ago at 8/18/15 12:29 AM
RE: What if you never had to eat again - here's how
Posts: 831 Join Date: 3/23/14 Recent PostsThat's a potentially dangerous assumption. WHile some aspects of blood make up may change easily, like white blood cell count, many aspects of blood composition are carefully regulated by the body, even at the expense of specific tissues. Because blood is the lifeline of the body, it has priority, plus standard blood tests only measure simple to measure aspects of blood, not vitamin status etc. That means that standard blood tests often don't catch problems until they are well advanced. This is especially true of younger indivudals who can often eat all manner of crap foods for years and years while stil maintaining good blood work for long periods of time. There are people with all kinds of skin probs, weakness, digestion probs, etc who still have good bloodwork. Cancer often does not show at all in blood tests. Blood work is a very crude and insensitive indicator of health, you can be pretty sick, osteoporosis, ulcer, bad digestion, cancer, asthma, etc and still have good bloodwork. You can't just assume health from bloodwork.
-Eva