RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

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Can Luis Özkan, modified 3 Months ago at 11/21/23 9:39 AM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/17/23 4:52 AM

Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 12 Join Date: 8/4/23 Recent Posts
I'm collecting data for a Research Paper on how long it takes to attain Stream Entry and would love to include your experience.
The research will be freely available and posted here, once it's completed. 
If you like please post filled out Questions here or send to me via dm. 


Questonaire for Stream Winners, Sotāpannas  


1. Name or Initials/Alias:
2. Method(s) with which Stream Entry  was attained: 
3. Intensity of practice [short description]:
4. Verified by Teacher [Yes/No/Explain]: 
5. Age at which Stream Entry was attained: 
6. Approx. Time since attainment: 
7. Retreats [kind, number and (total) duration]: 
8. Time it took from the first Retreat/Regular Practice period to attainment: 
9. Attained at Home/Retreat and if on or off-cussion: 
10. Additional Remarks and complementary Information: 
11. Your short Definition of Stream Entry:

Feel free to share the Questions with fellow Stream Winners ♡
Thank you for your participation! 

You can take a look at it here:
Stream Entry PDF
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1kkH12agsUDZ78F0TA6KDmw03CjTQRfNl/view?usp=drivesdk

Love
Can
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Bahiya Baby, modified 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 5:57 PM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/17/23 10:32 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 363 Join Date: 5/26/23 Recent Posts
 Hello

1. Bb
2. Investigation of the three characteristics of the six sense fields
3. 4-5hrs a day 
4. No
5. 28
6. 2 years
7. No retreats
8. I experimented with all kinds of meditation for most of a decade. Took about four weeks after I started the above mentioned practice. 
9. At home, on cushion
10. I've seen it stated that paths may only arise after one has grown into certain developmental stages. This seems to be true in my case.

11. I experienced a review cycle for a number of months, meaning I relatively quickly cycled through A&P to EQ without any meditative effort. I began to identify more with awareness itself. My attention seemed slightly more dispersed into the body. There was a freedom produced by some kind of tacit knowing. I knew something fundamental about my experience had changed and that insight persisted outside of states. There was a sense that I fundamentally understood something about the dharma that I had not previously. There was more of an obvious space around and between my thoughts. Sort of like I was 10% less bound by thinking and egoic activity. 

Love, 
​​​​​​​Bbbbbbbb 
Ed Evans, modified 3 Months ago at 11/18/23 3:25 PM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/18/23 3:25 PM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 6 Join Date: 1/28/22 Recent Posts
1. Ed Evans
2. Zen koan inquiry under tutelage of a roshi
3. Formal sitting practice daily, but also holding the inquiry throughout the day as much as possible. Occasional retreats
4. Yes
5. 26 or 27. I can't remember
6. 10 years approx
7. Several. Mostly zen sesshins but also solo retreats, as well as about 18 months of living in spiritual communities
8. About 2 or 3 years. 
9. Attained at retreat
10. I didn't want to believe there had been a shift when there hadn't, but as the weeks and months went by, the new reality became impossible to ignore. It was clear, and remains clear, that there had been an irreversible turning point and that my experience was corresponding to post-stream entry. The gradual and automatic weakening of the forces of attraction and aversion were palpably what life was then about.
Nick Chab Chab, modified 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 3:26 AM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 3:26 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 14 Join Date: 10/10/22 Recent Posts
This book could useful for your resarch papers : https://www.amazon.com/Entering-Stream-Enlightenment-Experiences-Contemporary/dp/1781792046

The author conducted a series of interviews of very strong medidators in Sri Lanka about your very subject. 
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Can Luis Özkan, modified 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 8:50 AM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 8:50 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 12 Join Date: 8/4/23 Recent Posts
Hey Nick,

Thank you for the recommendation! I immediately ordered it and will surely cite it in the paper.
Edward, modified 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 10:58 AM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 10:58 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 129 Join Date: 6/10/19 Recent Posts
Of course it's up to you but if this is for a research paper, I'd strongly advise you to ask respondents to define what they mean by SE as it's a very broadly used term. 
Martin, modified 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 1:57 PM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 1:57 PM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 725 Join Date: 4/25/20 Recent Posts
+1

I've been looking at reports of stream entry for the past four years, and the variety of experiences that are labeled as such, even within individual traditions, and even when using the same terms as descriptors, is a prominent characteristic of the use of the term. 
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Can Luis Özkan, modified 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 4:45 PM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 4:40 PM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 12 Join Date: 8/4/23 Recent Posts
Very valid point. I will add that Question.

Concerning the validity of the data:
​​​​​​​The diagnosing of SE from the outside seems to be limited, even for experienced Teachers (at least that's what many of them say). So knowing that I can't possibly evaluate someone's attainment with certainty via text, I decided to keep it simple.
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Bahiya Baby, modified 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 5:57 PM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/19/23 5:57 PM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 363 Join Date: 5/26/23 Recent Posts
Updated
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Can Luis Özkan, modified 3 Months ago at 11/20/23 6:44 AM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/20/23 6:44 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 12 Join Date: 8/4/23 Recent Posts
Hey Bahiya, Thank you for the update! 
Feel free to share the Questions with fellow Stream Winners ♡
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Chris M, modified 3 Months ago at 11/20/23 10:28 AM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/20/23 7:45 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 5084 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
Can Luis Özkan -
​​​​​​​

​​​​​​​I'm curious - what kind of research paper are you collecting this information for? What's the purpose of the paper? I think it's only fair to let folks know. I'm kind of surprised no one has asked this yet.
Tao Te Kat, modified 3 Months ago at 11/20/23 9:35 AM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/20/23 9:24 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 8 Join Date: 5/24/22 Recent Posts
1. Name or Initials/Alias: Oskar 2. Method(s) with which Stream Entry  was attained: Eigthfold path 3. Intensity of practice [short description]: Not that much 4. Verified by Teacher [Yes/No/Explain]: No teacher 5. Age at which Stream Entry was attained: 43 6. Approx. Time since attainment: 10 years 7. Retreats [kind, number and (total) duration]: zero 8. Time it took from the first Retreat/Regular Practice period to attainment: Being practicing seriously for about 3 or 5 years 9. Attained at Home/Retreat and if on or off-cussion: Home 10. Additional Remarks and complementary Information: Nothing comes now 11. Your short Definition of Stream Entry: Realizing the nature of mind (Anatta) Mahayana style. Or first Bhumi or path of seeing complete.


https://blogdetao.org
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Can Luis Özkan, modified 3 Months ago at 11/20/23 10:33 AM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/20/23 10:33 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 12 Join Date: 8/4/23 Recent Posts
Hey Chris, 

I initially started writing it just for myself to get a sense of how long it usually takes. Because I'll attend a mahasi Style Retreat soon. But some of my dharma brothers and sisters were interested and now I'm trying to get a little more data to get a somewhat more complete picture. 

It focuses on how long it takes by citing and analyzing popular and anonymous practicioners. 

I'll publish it soon here. 
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Bahiya Baby, modified 3 Months ago at 11/20/23 5:41 PM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/20/23 5:41 PM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 363 Join Date: 5/26/23 Recent Posts
From the data I've seen I reckon it usually takes aslong as it takes. 
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Dream Walker, modified 3 Months ago at 11/20/23 11:28 PM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/20/23 11:28 PM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 1643 Join Date: 1/18/12 Recent Posts
Can Luis Özkan
Hey Chris, 

I initially started writing it just for myself to get a sense of how long it usually takes. Because I'll attend a mahasi Style Retreat soon. But some of my dharma brothers and sisters were interested and now I'm trying to get a little more data to get a somewhat more complete picture. 

It focuses on how long it takes by citing and analyzing popular and anonymous practicioners. 

I'll publish it soon here. 

So, by research paper, you mean "whatever you write for personal use" without an association to any external institution.
By , "Publish" you mean posting here and sharing by email?
Where exactly are you publishing otherwise?
Have you "published" anything else?
If so where?
What mahasi retreat?
What "brothers and sisters"?
What does "analyzing" mean?

Everything so far that you have mentioned is extremely vague. Perhaps you could fill in the details a bit.
Thanks,
~D
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Chris M, modified 3 Months ago at 11/21/23 8:42 AM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/21/23 8:42 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 5084 Join Date: 1/26/13 Recent Posts
To restate Dreamwalker's points in my own words - the issue that concerns me is that this questionnaire was introduced as if it were research, implying this was an academic or professional effort. But it's a personal project. That's fine by me, but please be more forthcoming by describing exactly what the purpose is, and how the collected information will be used and shared. You need to give people the opportunity to participate or not participate by giving them accurate information.
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Can Luis Özkan, modified 3 Months ago at 11/21/23 9:49 AM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/21/23 9:08 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 12 Join Date: 8/4/23 Recent Posts
Hey, 

Of course I can. Personal Research Paper, which I will share here. You can take a look at it: 

Stream Entry PDF
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1kkH12agsUDZ78F0TA6KDmw03CjTQRfNl/view?usp=drivesdk

The Conclusion and some details are not correct anymore. 
I'm open for suggestions, ideas, criticism.

Love 
​​​​​​​Can 
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Bahiya Baby, modified 3 Months ago at 11/21/23 9:49 AM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/21/23 9:49 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 363 Join Date: 5/26/23 Recent Posts
Post it when it's finisihed and I'll be happy to read it. 

But please do bare in mind, I feel confident enough saying SE has a lot more to do with growth/development/maturity than time. 

No matter how long we sit for it, it takes a lifetime of preparation. 
Derek2, modified 3 Months ago at 11/22/23 10:41 AM
Created 3 Months ago at 11/22/23 10:41 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 229 Join Date: 9/21/16 Recent Posts
It's certainly a worthwhile project, and I wish you well with it.

The problem of defining SE has already been mentioned. In particular, you need to state whether you see the four-path model and the ten-fetter model as coincident, and if so why.

Question for you: What do you make of Eckhart Tolle's story in the introduction to The Power of Now? SE or not SE? And zero practice leading up to it!
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Can Luis Özkan, modified 2 Months ago at 12/16/23 10:40 AM
Created 2 Months ago at 12/16/23 10:39 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 12 Join Date: 8/4/23 Recent Posts
https://www.dharmaoverground.org/discussion/-/message_boards/message/26371900#_com_liferay_message_boards_web_portlet_MBPortlet_message_26371900

Hey Derek,  There are accounts of people who attained in their last incarnation and simply re-attained in this birth. Then such things as with Eckhart or Ramana Maharshi can occur. I published the finnished paper here and it also discusses that possibility. Love  ​​​​​​​Can
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Can Luis Özkan, modified 2 Months ago at 12/16/23 10:43 AM
Created 2 Months ago at 12/16/23 10:43 AM

RE: Questionnaire for Stream Enterers

Posts: 12 Join Date: 8/4/23 Recent Posts
Hello Thereee, 

the paper is finally finnished and can be viewed here.
Much Love 
Can

Link: https://www.dharmaoverground.org/discussion/-/message_boards/message/26371900

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