Noting the noting?

Martin Mai, modified 14 Years ago at 4/2/08 11:07 PM
Created 14 Years ago at 4/2/08 11:07 PM

Noting the noting?

Posts: 0 Join Date: 8/22/09 Recent Posts
Forum: Practical Dharma

Hi everybody,
just got off the cushion and wanted to ask about this. So while noting with increasing speed I found that I can´t percieve sensations faster than a certain frequency because of the noting which seems like "Sensation-note of the sensation-next sensation". So the middle part where I normally would want to percieve a sensation there now is the note. Could this be considered not being with the object of meditation closely enough or is it no problem as long as one percieves the note as a sensation, too. Then, wouldn´t it be necessary to note the note as well and so on since there is a separation between awareness and the note? I´m sure I´m blowing this out of proportion and this doesn´t bother me so much untill I finish practising but isn´t it a weird thing in some way throughing more flickering sensations into the field than there already are? The funny thing is that it really helps to stay with the object and percieve vibrations. Could it be that it´s just because of the (wrong) notion that there is someone actively involved doing the noting?
I´m not sure if i expressed this clearly enough for anybody to understand. If not just ask.
Awaiting the posts, Martin
Mike L, modified 14 Years ago at 4/4/08 12:13 PM
Created 14 Years ago at 4/4/08 12:13 PM

RE: Noting the noting?

Posts: 75 Join Date: 5/13/09 Recent Posts
I'm no expert, but the way I figure it, it's like trying to talk yourself through the performance of a skill that's amenable to "flow", rather than just doing it. Somewhere along the line I figure I have to trust and dive into immersion. It's a bit like trying to read a book while thinking about how many pages are left in the chapter or how fast the pages are turning -- both of those can slow things down and/or distract from getting the full measure of the task at hand, which is just reading. On the other hand, sometimes a timer can be a useful motivator for reading that seems boring. The flip-side on the cushion is that if you don't have enough focus or discipline at the time, it's probably easier to get off track without the "rails" of explicit noting. Or maybe your noting is just too many syllables; iirc, someone mentioned the use of single syllables "notes" (grunts, chirps, squeaks, etc :-) elsewhere on this site. At some point, I suppose you know the steps and can just dance rather than count.
Martin Mai, modified 14 Years ago at 4/4/08 11:59 PM
Created 14 Years ago at 4/4/08 11:59 PM

RE: Noting the noting?

Posts: 0 Join Date: 8/22/09 Recent Posts
You´re totally right joriki. Noting after all is just an auxiliary practise for bare perception, and a very good one. While meditating I´m not thinking about these things since there is no room left if the noting is done quickly. My point was that up to now I saw it as a tool to percieve impermanence but recently I encountered more aspects of no-self as well which I could not do without the noting. I mean could anybody have known how powerful a simple method like this can be? It´s just amazing!
Thank you for your reply! I´m trying to quit the counting and start dancing :-)