The Noble Eightfold Path, summed up, as practice points

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Psi, modified 10 Years ago at 6/24/14 8:35 AM
Created 10 Years ago at 6/24/14 8:18 AM

The Noble Eightfold Path, summed up, as practice points

Posts: 1099 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent Posts
The Noble Eightfold Path, when examined as a  whole and when used as practice points one  can better see the whole picture, see results from continued practice, and review the results periodically, to see if adjustments are neccassary.

One could view the Noble Eightfold path as a rope with eight strands, and for the rope to be strong each strand needs to be constructed and made to the best of one's abilities, and when a strand is frayed, one must repair the strand.  If one uses only one strand, then the rope is rather weak indeed, and one should add more strands, until all eight strands are made, intertwined and made strong each strand lending it's strength to the whole of the rope.

One could also view the Noble Eightfold path as an Eight Stringed Musical Instrument, of which each String must be tuned, and when all eight strings are tuned and played together , there is harmony.  But, likewise a missing, broken, or out of tune string, and the whole doen't sound so good.

Here is a good summary that Bhikku bodhi has assembled and a link to the original article.




 
I. Samma ditthi .... Right view
 
dukkhe ñana .... understanding suffering
dukkhasamudaye ñana .... understanding its origin
 
dukkhanirodhe ñana .... understanding its cessation
 
dukkhanirodhagaminipatipadaya ñana .... understanding the way leading to its cessation
 
II. Samma sankappa .... Right intention
 
nekkhamma-sankappa .... intention of renunciation
abyapada-sankappa .... intention of good will
 
avihimsa-sankappa .... intention of harmlessness
 
III. Samma vaca .... Right speech
 
musavada veramani .... abstaining from false speech
pisunaya vacaya veramani .... abstaining from slanderous speech
 
pharusaya vacaya veramani .... abstaining from harsh speech
 
samphappalapa veramani .... abstaining from idle chatter
 
IV. Samma kammanta .... Right action
 
panatipata veramani .... abstaining from taking life
adinnadana veramani .... abstaining from stealing
 
kamesu micchacara veramani .... abstaining from sexual misconduct
 
V. Samma ajiva .... Right livelihood
 
miccha ajivam pahaya .... giving up wrong livelihood,
samma ajivena jivitam kappeti .... one earns one's living by a right form of livelihood
 
VI. Samma vayama .... Right effort
 
samvarappadhana .... the effort to restrain defilements
pahanappadhana .... the effort to abandon defilements
 
bhavanappadhana .... the effort to develop wholesome states
 
anurakkhanappadhana .... the effort to maintain wholesome states
 
VII. Samma sati .... Right mindfulness
 
kayanupassana .... mindful contemplation of the body
vedananupassana .... mindful contemplation of feelings
 
cittanupassana .... mindful contemplation of the mind
 
dhammanupassana .... mindful contemplation of phenomena
 
VIII. Samma samadhi .... Right concentration
 
pathamajjhana .... the first jhana
dutiyajjhana .... the second jhana
 
tatiyajjhana .... the third jhana
 
catutthajjhana .... the fourth jhana
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Psi, modified 10 Years ago at 6/24/14 8:36 AM
Created 10 Years ago at 6/24/14 8:32 AM

RE: The Noble Eightfold Path, summed up, as practice points

Posts: 1099 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent Posts
Now, I have a question: If one is going to practice  Samma Sati  (Right Mindfulness), which is contemplation of the aspects below, How would one do this without some form of noting or (noticing), noting , being a method of noticing, or being aware, mindful, (Being aware of what the mind is doing in the present moment?  Now, that is to say one may indeed Note. or Notice, but not verbalise, i.e. bare attention, or pure mindfulness.  But, this isn't always posssible at all points along one's practice timeline.

 
kayanupassana .... mindful contemplation of the body
vedananupassana .... mindful contemplation of feelings
 
cittanupassana .... mindful contemplation of the mind
 
dhammanupassana .... mindful contemplation of phenomena

Next Question, How is one to practice this mindfulness correctly if one has not  first made the mind somewhat, tranquil and peaceful, i.e. Mind not jumping all over the place, Monkey Mind?  Samma Samadhi

Third Question, How is practice that does not use Samma Vayama (Right Effort) expect to bring about the most beneficial results?


This is not to say that the other folds of the Eightfold path are not as important, as hopefully were explained earlier, i.e.  One would have a hard time meditating on Meth, running from the cops, and cussing at the neighbors, etc.

Anywho....  Just thinking outloud and trying to make sure I am not missing something.

Bry Phi

edited, my bad, too restless, and agian, guess I need sleep, Sorry
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Psi, modified 10 Years ago at 6/24/14 8:38 AM
Created 10 Years ago at 6/24/14 8:38 AM

RE: The Noble Eightfold Path, summed up, as practice points

Posts: 1099 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent Posts
The Noble Eightfold Path The Way to the End of Sufferingby Bhikkhu Bodhi


http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/authors/bodhi/waytoend.html
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Dream Walker, modified 10 Years ago at 6/24/14 11:32 AM
Created 10 Years ago at 6/24/14 11:31 AM

RE: The Noble Eightfold Path, summed up, as practice points

Posts: 1770 Join Date: 1/18/12 Recent Posts
This comes to mind about a practice of right concentration -
Anupada Sutta: One After Another
translated from the Pali by
Thanissaro Bhikkhu

See what you think
~D
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Psi, modified 10 Years ago at 6/24/14 11:55 AM
Created 10 Years ago at 6/24/14 11:55 AM

RE: The Noble Eightfold Path, summed up, as practice points

Posts: 1099 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent Posts
Dream Walker:
This comes to mind about a practice of right concentration -
Anupada Sutta: One After Another
translated from the Pali by
Thanissaro Bhikkhu

See what you think
~D

Yes, excellent, all wrapped up in one sutta, Below, same sutta with explanations from a Retreat talk:


Presented by Ven Bhante Vimalaraṁsi on 18th March 2012 
At Dhamma Dena Vipassanā Center, Joshua Tree, California 

http://talks.dhammasukha.org/mn-111-jt7-120318.html

Actually, this all astounds me, perhaps I should just direct the mind to contemplate and practice just this one sutta for the next week, to kind of "soak" into the teachings...

Thanks

Bryan
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Psi, modified 10 Years ago at 6/24/14 12:13 PM
Created 10 Years ago at 6/24/14 12:13 PM

RE: The Noble Eightfold Path, summed up, as practice points

Posts: 1099 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent Posts
And again, no "ditto" marks, full Sutta

Bhikku Bodhi's Translation

http://www.dhammatalks.net/Books9/Bhikkhu_Bodhi_Anupada_Sutta.htm

 I'm going to print this up, I just don't think it is wise to replace words like jhana with concentration, and replace dukkha with the word stress or unsatisfactoriness, or even vedana with feeling, cuz' it's not feeling as I would normally think of feeling (like an emotional state) but feeling as sensations...

Also, for instance one doen't normally equate Chocolate Cake with Dukkha, but when the very same Cake either turns into fat cells, or poop, well, yeah then it's dukkha, sure, but in reality it's the same cake, different form.  Puts a new light on "Have your cake and eat it too..."

Now, I am bordering on Schopenhauer's Everything is Pain, and Pleasure is just the temporary abscence of Pain, But then again Schopenhaeur was a genius.

To infinity and beyond!


emoticon
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tom moylan, modified 10 Years ago at 6/25/14 5:59 AM
Created 10 Years ago at 6/25/14 5:59 AM

RE: The Noble Eightfold Path, summed up, as practice points

Posts: 896 Join Date: 3/7/11 Recent Posts
Psi Phi:
Now, I have a question: If one is going to practice  Samma Sati  (Right Mindfulness), which is contemplation of the aspects below, How would one do this without some form of noting or (noticing

The "Knowing" in real time IS mindfulness. Noting is (just) a method that helps stop the proliferation.

Next Question, How is one to practice this mindfulness correctly if one has not  first made the mind somewhat, tranquil and peaceful, i.e. Mind not jumping all over the place, Monkey Mind?  Samma Samadhi

I see samma samadhi as the IDEAL.  But in each practice session the first stage, for me, is exactly that, to calm the mind down with concentration excercises.


Third Question, How is practice that does not use Samma Vayama (Right Effort) expect to bring about the most beneficial results?

I find the question strange.  Practice IS right effort as are many other things. 
Does this help at all?

tom
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Psi, modified 10 Years ago at 6/25/14 8:16 AM
Created 10 Years ago at 6/25/14 8:16 AM

RE: The Noble Eightfold Path, summed up, as practice points

Posts: 1099 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent Posts
tom moylan:
Psi Phi:
Now, I have a question: If one is going to practice  Samma Sati  (Right Mindfulness), which is contemplation of the aspects below, How would one do this without some form of noting or (noticing

The "Knowing" in real time IS mindfulness. Noting is (just) a method that helps stop the proliferation.

Next Question, How is one to practice this mindfulness correctly if one has not  first made the mind somewhat, tranquil and peaceful, i.e. Mind not jumping all over the place, Monkey Mind?  Samma Samadhi

I see samma samadhi as the IDEAL.  But in each practice session the first stage, for me, is exactly that, to calm the mind down with concentration excercises.


Third Question, How is practice that does not use Samma Vayama (Right Effort) expect to bring about the most beneficial results?

I find the question strange.  Practice IS right effort as are many other things. 
Does this help at all?

tom

Hey Tom , I think your answers to the first two questions are dead on , excellent.

The Third question I have about Right Effort, and it uses.  It seems that sometimes there is a misunderstanding about Right Effort, that right Effort means, "Go get 'em, "  or Right Effort is the Willpower and Energy behind the practice.

But Right Effort is more of a discernment and cultivation of what is beneficial towards Nibbana and the discernment and abandonment of what is a hinderance towards Nibbana.

Right Effort is not only part of the Meditative Path but also part of the Daily path, Enables one to cultivate the mind all day in every situation, greatly enhancing one's practice and infusing it into all aspects of life,  making practice a sun-up to sun-down endeavor, and what is best is that at a point in one's practice timeline, due to the impersonal nature of the mind, Right Effort will eventually seep into the mind , becoming essentially automatic.

First , to abandon an unwholesome state that has already arisen.

Second, to not let unwholesome state arise that has not yet arisen.

Third, to arouse a wholesome state that has not yet arisen.

Fourth, to maintain a wholesome state that has already arisen

Now, this can all be done in real-time and everytime, for instance when anger or greed might arise in one throughout the day.

For instance when something triggers the anger sensation/reaction/pattern/habit (say I spill a drink all over my shoes), Then  One abandons the Anger state, keeps it from arising, arouses a wholesome state , (say equanimity), then maintains thet equanimous state.

I feel that I am not doing justice to the practice of Right Effort, and should explain this all much more clearly, but for now, I have to get ready for my work day ! emoticon

So when displeasure arises within, from the idea of having to go to work, I dismiss it, not let it arise again, and replace those emotions with a sense of gratitude that , for today, I have a job that I can provide food, shelter, clothing and medicine for my family, and maintain that sense of gratitude. emoticon

Peace

Bryan
J C, modified 10 Years ago at 6/25/14 11:52 AM
Created 10 Years ago at 6/25/14 11:52 AM

RE: The Noble Eightfold Path, summed up, as practice points

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I'm kind of confused about this version of the Eightfold Path, because it seems to completely leave out wisdom, stages of insight, and levels of enlightenment. Where are they? I thought two of the eight threads were supposed to correspond to the third training of wisdom/vipassana?
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Psi, modified 10 Years ago at 6/26/14 12:21 AM
Created 10 Years ago at 6/26/14 12:21 AM

RE: The Noble Eightfold Path, summed up, as practice points

Posts: 1099 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent Posts
This is a really good Sutta, straight from the Buddha that sums up the Noble Eightfold Path:


Magga-vibhanga Sutta
(An Analysis of the Path)
Samyutta Nikaya 45.8

http://www.leighb.com/sn45-8.htm



"Yes, lord," the monks responded to him. 

The Blessed One said, "I will teach & analyze for you the Noble Eightfold Path. Listen & pay close attention. I will speak." 

"As you say, lord," the monks responded to him. 

The Blessed One said, "Now what, monks, is the Noble Eightfold Path? [It is] as follows: Right view, right intention, right speech, right action, right livelihood, right effort, right mindfulness, right concentration. 

And what, monks, is right view? Knowledge concerning dukkha, knowledge concerning the origination of dukkha, knowledge concerning the stopping of dukkha, knowledge concerning the way of practice leading to the stopping of dukkha: This, monks, is called right view. 

And what, monks, is right intention? Intentions of renunciation, intentions of freedom from ill will, intensions of harmlessness: This, monks, is called right intention. 

And what, monks, is right speech? Abstaining from lying, abstaining from divisive speech, abstaining from abusive speech, abstaining from idle chatter: This, monks, is called right speech. 

And what, monks, is right action? Abstaining from taking life, abstaining from stealing, abstaining from sexual misconduct. This, monks, is called right action. 

And what, monks, is right livelihood? There is the case where a well-instructed disciple of the noble ones, having abandoned dishonest livelihood, keeps his life going with right livelihood. This, monks, is called right livelihood. 

And what, monks, is right effort
1. There is the case where a monk generates desire, endeavors, activates persistence, upholds & exerts his intent for the sake of the non-arising of evil, unskillful qualities that have not yet arisen. 
2. He generates desire, endeavors, activates persistence, upholds & exerts his intent for the sake of the abandonment of evil, unskillful qualities that have arisen. 
3. He generates desire, endeavors, activates persistence, upholds & exerts his intent for the sake of the arising of skillful qualities that have not yet arisen. 
4. He generates desire, endeavors, activates persistence, upholds & exerts his intent for the maintenance, non-confusion, increase, plenitude, development, & culmination of skillful qualities that have arisen. 
This, monks, is called right effort. 
And what, monks, is right mindfulness
1. There is the case where a monk remains focused on the body in the body -- ardent, clearly aware, & mindful -- putting away greed & distress with reference to the world. 
2. He remains focused on feelings in the feelings -- ardent, clearly aware, & mindful -- putting away greed & distress with reference to the world. 
3. He remains focused on mind-states in mind-states -- ardent, clearly aware, & mindful -- putting away greed & distress with reference to the world. 
4. He remains focused on dhammas in dhammas -- ardent, clearly aware, & mindful -- putting away greed & distress with reference to the world. 
This, monks, is called right mindfulness. 
And what, monks, is right concentration
1. There is the case where a monk -- quite secluded from sensuality, secluded from unskillful (mental) qualities -- enters & remains in the first jhana: rapture & happiness born of seclusion, accompanied by initial & sustained thinking. 
2. With the stilling of initial & sustained thinking, he enters & remains in the second jhana: rapture & happiness born of concentration, unification of awareness free from initial thinking & sustained thinking -- internal serenity. 
3. With the fading of rapture, he remains in equanimity, mindful & clearly aware, and physically sensitive of pleasure. He enters & remains in the third jhana, of which the Noble Ones declare, 'Equanimous & mindful, he has a pleasurable abiding.' 
4. With the abandoning of pleasure & pain -- as with the earlier disappearance of elation & distress -- he enters & remains in the fourth jhana: purity of equanimity & mindfulness, neither pleasure nor pain. 
This, monks, is called right concentration." 
That is what the Blessed One said. Gratified, the monks delighted at his words. 

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Psi, modified 10 Years ago at 6/26/14 1:44 AM
Created 10 Years ago at 6/26/14 1:44 AM

RE: The Noble Eightfold Path, summed up, as practice points

Posts: 1099 Join Date: 11/22/13 Recent Posts
J C:
I'm kind of confused about this version of the Eightfold Path, because it seems to completely leave out wisdom, stages of insight, and levels of enlightenment. Where are they? I thought two of the eight threads were supposed to correspond to the third training of wisdom/vipassana?
You trying to get me into hot water JC?  lol  

I'll try to untangle your questions, AND stay out of the hot water... Towards the bottom the Wisdom group is Right View and Right Intention:

Vipassana can mean two things, at least this is my understanding:

1) Vipassana can mean in-sight, seeing inward, seeing deeply, 
    

Henepola Gunaratana defined Vipassanā as:
Looking into something with clarity and precision, seeing each component as distinct and separate, and piercing all the way through so as to perceive the most fundamental reality of that thing"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vipassan%C4%81

2)  Vipassana is a method of Meditation

Your other question, where are the stages of insight?  (Don't kill the messenger gang, but...)  Stages of Insight aren't from the Buddha.
And actually, I've never read the word Vipassana in any of the Suttas yet, though I haven't read all of them, and maybe the word is translated into english as something else.

Levels of Enlightenment: (I don't know what sutta this is in, but these guys seem to know, guess I need to check it out myself)

http://www.imsb.org/buddhalists/FourStagesOfEnlightenment.pdf


The Threefold Division of the Noble Eightfold Path: By Piyadassi Thera  (for a qualified explanation) see link:

http://www.bps.lk/olib/bl/bl032.pdf



WISDOM GROUP ---  (panna)
I. Samma ditthi .... Right view  (Aka Right Understanding)
 II. Samma sankappa .... Right intention  (Aka Right Thought)
 
VIRTUE GROUP --- (sila)
III. Samma vaca .... Right speech
IV. Samma kammanta .... Right action
V. Samma ajiva .... Right livelihood
 
CONCENTRATION GROUP --- (samadhi)
VI. Samma vayama .... Right effort
 VII. Samma sati .... Right mindfulness
 VIII. Samma samadhi .... Right concentration
 
Anyway, I just practice, and practice, and practice, and anger and greed is diminishing, they are replaced by irritations and preferences now, and instead of wanting a Pontiac Trans-am, I might rather wish for  a book, instead of a promotion and more money, I would rather have the freedom of time.

Stages and maps could help I suppose, but it's more in the doing, and I don't think anyone has ever said it wasn't.  My only advice to anyone, is to train and prepare the conscious mind very thoroughly through wisdom, sila and samadhi, BEFORE opening the gates to the sub-consciousness and un-consciousness, because some of that stuff has been passed along through millions and millions of years of evolution, and prying the mind open forcefully might be kinda scary to an untrained mind.  That's what happend to me , and I quit meditating for 20 years or so, things got kinda weird.  But, it was all just sensations, right....????  (Okay, so no-one has to ask, I was meditating, and a heard  ferocious feral growl/snarl, real as hell, and felt my "self" being yanked out of my body horizontally, I opened my eyes, and I was just sitting there, and I thought F#%@ this S#$%.  That and I had also had some other minor paranormal type occurances previously. Funny , huh? OOPs rambled on .

Bye Phi





 

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